Ship Captain Rescued From Somali Pirates

[Eupher]

Yeah, those names are probably Muslim.

But this is standard Muzzie rhetoric, is it not?

[thundley4]

These bully tactics against people suffering from the after-effects of colonialism is just making more people hate the US.[/DUmmie]

From the same article:

Maybe I'm just a silly rabbit but aren't those names muslim?

Killing muslims in the name of American commercialism and corporate interests? tsk-tsk

Go ahead, let them start killing hostages.  Then maybe the ransom won't be paid and every country will start to do what the French did first. If it's a given that hostages will be killed, then there goes most of the leverage that the pirates have.

[Attero Dominatus]

Great news!

[5412]

Hi,

Having read this thread totally I would like to offer the following.

Fox news reports that the guy who was captured was a young pirate who supposedly went aboard the navy vessel to help the negotiations.  It became apparent to the navy the young man basically was surrendering and no way was he going back to the other boat.

Second, following is an excerpt from the Fox News website:

......"But sometime soon after the boats were hooked together, shots were fired from the lifeboat and the pirates were seen holding a gun to Captain Phillips back. Acting on a standing order from President Obama to move in when Phillips was in "imminent danger" snipers were ordered to fire......."

Now I am sure the mainstream press will make BO a hero for the way he handled it.  To me the order itself is terrible.  If all three pirates were in the clear for snipers, and the hostage was not in danger the snipers could not do their job because of the order.  When waiting until the hostage is in danger, they in effect put his life in danger because of the order.....

Doubt seriously if anyone will take him to task because this is not what the mainstream media does.  Reactive instead of pro active if you ask me.  We have another Mr. Wimp in the oval office.

regards,
5412

[thundley4]

Hi,

Having read this thread totally I would like to offer the following.

Fox news reports that the guy who was captured was a young pirate who supposedly went aboard the navy vessel to help the negotiations.  It became apparent to the navy the young man basically was surrendering and no way was he going back to the other boat.

Second, following is an excerpt from the Fox News website:

......"But sometime soon after the boats were hooked together, shots were fired from the lifeboat and the pirates were seen holding a gun to Captain Phillips back. Acting on a standing order from President Obama to move in when Phillips was in "imminent danger" snipers were ordered to fire......."

Now I am sure the mainstream press will make BO a hero for the way he handled it.  To me the order itself is terrible.  If all three pirates were in the clear for snipers, and the hostage was not in danger the snipers could not do their job because of the order.  When waiting until the hostage is in danger, they in effect put his life in danger because of the order.....

Doubt seriously if anyone will take him to task because this is not what the mainstream media does.  Reactive instead of pro active if you ask me.  We have another Mr. Wimp in the oval office.

regards,
5412

I too think the order should have been something like: "If you can take out the terrorists and save the hostage, then do it. "

[SSG Snuggle Bunny]

...

Now I am sure the mainstream press will make BO a hero for the way he handled it.  To me the order itself is terrible.  If all three pirates were in the clear for snipers, and the hostage was not in danger the snipers could not do their job because of the order.  When waiting until the hostage is in danger, they in effect put his life in danger because of the order.....

Doubt seriously if anyone will take him to task because this is not what the mainstream media does.  Reactive instead of pro active if you ask me.  We have another Mr. Wimp in the oval office.

regards,
5412

I'm going to go out on a limb here (risking the ire of my fellow conservatives no less) and say that while I'm confident the SEAL snipers train unceasingly for such things, that making a shot against targets on a small bobbing boat could in and of itself put the hostage in jeopardy. With Cpt. Phillips in the water the incidence of friendly fire--coupled with the urgency to save his life--made the moment taken the right moment.

[5412]

Hi,

I believe the Captain jumped into the water after he heard the sniper fire.

As a target shooter I can tell you a couple things.  While the boat was bobbing, those snipers are terrific.  I have a military rifle with a good scope and have put five rounds inside of 1/4" at 100 yards.  The proximity of the boat, tethered to the ship, likely they were less than 50 yards apart.  I have seen snipers shred the center inch of a target at 300+ yards so for them it was a pretty easy shot. 

Fifty yards for these folks is like child's play, and with their equipment and scopes they likely could see the individual hairs on the pirates eyebrows.  My best scope is 40 power and I can read the small print on the target at 100 yards with eyes that are nearly 70 years old and wear bifocals.

My suspicion was the captain let out just enough line so the small boat would bob rythmically with the stern of the ship so the movement would be predictible for the snipers.

They live for this type of thing.  It should have been proactive, long before an AR is pointed at the back of the hostage.

regards,
5412

[SSG Snuggle Bunny]

I wholly understand but being capable and taking a debatably unnecessary risk are two different matters. The French took chances and lost 1 hostage when no other option was present; we only had 1 hostage to lose and nobody wants to risk that on a stray tossing of the waves or other completely unforeseeable variable.

[thundley4]

I wholly understand but being capable and taking a debatably unnecessary risk are two different matters. The French took chances and lost 1 hostage when no other option was present; we only had 1 hostage to lose and nobody wants to risk that on a stray tossing of the waves or other completely unforeseeable variable.

Several reports have stated that the snipers only fired when a gun was pointed at the hostage, not that he was in the water.  I think the decision may have been that there was a chance of friendly fire, but that it was better than letting the pirate take a shot.

[5412]

Several reports have stated that the snipers only fired when a gun was pointed at the hostage, not that he was in the water.  I think the decision may have been that there was a chance of friendly fire, but that it was better than letting the pirate take a shot.

Hi thundley,

I think the issue here goes beyond the hostage.  The key to this situation is to strike swiftly and violently enough to make sure that no pirates dare attack another American vessel in the future.  You have to be proactive, not reactive in that situation. 

While it is hard to fathom, hostages have no value, nor can they have value.  As a matter of policy the US will not pay ransom for a hostage and every member of the US diplomatic corps knows that and it is a risk associated with the job.  I am not trying to be insensitive to the hostage and would want to do everything to pull off the operation and save his life.

What, in my opinion should have happened is this.  It should have been left up to the military, not the president.  They were accountable to pull off the operation.  If they felt they could get it done, then they should have been allowed to do so.  Most folks in the military I know would be super conservative in their estimates, they want to succeed and do not want to fail.

How much differently would folks have felt if the trigger was pulled and the hostage shot in the back just before the snipers fired?

regards,
5412

[Hawkgirl]

Go Navy!   

What a great EASTER gift courtesy of the US Military.  God Bless our servicemen and women.

[Eupher]

5412:

...snip...
As a matter of policy the US will not pay ransom for a hostage...snip...

I've stated my thoughts on the "sister" thread to this one on the same issue, so I won't go into that here.

Regarding 5412's comment, we don't know what The Messiah's new policy is going to be in the long haul. He may decidedly change the longstanding policy of many presidents before him and opt for "negotiation", ransom payment, or other sort of appeasement with terrorists, pirates, or serial rapists.

It wouldn't surprise me in the least for him to go that route. But then again, my sensibilities have been violated to the point where NOTHING surprises me about His Holiness anymore.

One outrage after another. 

[5412]

5412:
I've stated my thoughts on the "sister" thread to this one on the same issue, so I won't go into that here.

Regarding 5412's comment, we don't know what The Messiah's new policy is going to be in the long haul. He may decidedly change the longstanding policy of many presidents before him and opt for "negotiation", ransom payment, or other sort of appeasement with terrorists, pirates, or serial rapists.

It wouldn't surprise me in the least for him to go that route. But then again, my sensibilities have been violated to the point where NOTHING surprises me about His Holiness anymore.

One outrage after another. 

Hi,

Here is what the negotiations should have been.  If you release the hostage unharmed now, we will give you a five minute head start before we kill you.  If you do not, you will later wish you had accepted the offer.

End of negotiations,

5412

[Bluesuiter-Retired]

What raises a lot of questions is the FACT the the DOD had to ask permission in the first place, then there is the matter that they had to ask permission a second time.  What that hell is that all about?

In this day 'n age where you have a matter of minutes to respond to an imminent attack, we cannot afford to be as INDECISIVE as "the messiah" has been.  I mean, really it took him "5 days" to get around to authorizing the DOD to use force????????

I'm have absolutely no doubt that the skipper, and several others, will find their careers going down the toilet in the not too distant future because they had the AUDACITY to UPSTAGE "the messiah" by not asking PERMISSION before giving the order to fire.  The positive PR is on the U.S. Navy and the SEALS.

[thundley4]

What raises a lot of questions is the FACT the the DOD had to ask permission in the first place, then there is the matter that they had to ask permission a second time.  What that hell is that all about?

In this day 'n age where you have a matter of minutes to respond to an imminent attack, we cannot afford to be as INDECISIVE as "the messiah" has been.  I mean, really it took him "5 days" to get around to authorizing the DOD to use force????????

I'm have absolutely no doubt that the skipper, and several others, will find their careers going down the toilet in the not too distant future because they had the AUDACITY to UPSTAGE "the messiah" by not asking PERMISSION before giving the order to fire.  The positive PR is on the U.S. Navy and the SEALS.

Didn't some similar events also happen under Clinton?  IIRC, wasn't bin Laden lost because Clinton couldn't/wouldn't decide to take custody when we had the chance?

[5412]

Didn't some similar events also happen under Clinton?  IIRC, wasn't bin Laden lost because Clinton couldn't/wouldn't decide to take custody when we had the chance?

Good Morning,

In the book "Dereliction of Duty", the situation you refer to is spelled out clearly by the Air Force Colonel who was at Clinton's side carrying the nuclear codes.

Clinton had authorized an operation to take out Bin Laden.  They found him and had a thirty minute window to take him out.  Clinton was at a golf tournament and they said they had him in their gun sights, the planes were on the runway waiting to take off.  All Clinton had to do was say "go ahead with the mission".  He told them he was too busy enjoying the tournament.  The courier went back to the CIA guy in the SUV and he said that was not acceptable as they would lose him again and they went back to Clinton a second time and he refused to give the order.  When the tournament was over, Bin Laden had vanished once again.

I personally asked General Schwartzkof about this incident when I met him in Tampa and he told me that he knows the guy who wrote the book very well and everything in that book was totally factual.

regards,
5412

[TheSarge]

Didn't some similar events also happen under Clinton?  IIRC, wasn't bin Laden lost because Clinton couldn't/wouldn't decide to take custody when we had the chance?

Yes the Sudan was ready to hand him over...Clinton claimed he (bin Laden) hadn't done anything directly to the U.S. and declined to take him into custody because he didn't think we could hold him.

Never mind the fact that OBL and one of the pilots on 9/11 were helping Aideed in Somalia during the Blackhawk Down incident.


And we all know what happened after that.  A classic example of what happens when you treat terrorists like common street criminals.

[Bluesuiter-Retired]

Yes the Sudan was ready to hand him over...Clinton claimed he (bin Laden) hadn't done anything directly to the U.S. and declined to take him into custody because he didn't think we could hold him.

Never mind the fact that OBL and one of the pilots on 9/11 were helping Aideed in Somalia during the Blackhawk Down incident.


And we all know what happened after that.  A classic example of what happens when you treat terrorists like common street criminals.

Yep, the Sudanese government offered not once, not twice, but offered THREE times to hand over bin-laden.

The first two offers had the string attached to remove Sudan from the state department's list of nations whom support terrorists.  The third and final offer had ZERO strings attached

[TheSarge]

FNC reporting that three of the pirates were shot simultaneously by Navy snipers.  One of the pirates actually asked to come over to the Bainbridge to make a phone call.  The idiot was standing on the fantail drinking water...talking on the phone and waiving at his buddies when the takedown occurred.

Listening to the details now...these pirates were idiots...which makes how long it took for this to happen even more frustrating.

[SSG Snuggle Bunny]

FNC reporting that three of the pirates were shot simultaneously by Navy snipers.  One of the pirates actually asked to come over to the Bainbridge to make a phone call.  The idiot was standing on the fantail drinking water...talking on the phone and waiving at his buddies when the takedown occurred....

So much the better. It's not uncommon to try and get terrorists seperated but feeling secure at the go moment.

[TheSarge]

So much the better. It's not uncommon to try and get terrorists seperated but feeling secure at the go moment.

What's scary is that someone on that damn ship seems to read DU.  The Navy convinced the pirates that the lifeboat was drifting towards a part of the coastline where other pirates were waiting to kill them and that if they could attach a rope to their boat the Bainbridge could tow them away from the danger.

[thundley4]

What's scary is that someone on that damn ship seems to read DU.  The Navy convinced the pirates that the lifeboat was drifting towards a part of the coastline where other pirates were waiting to kill them and that if they could attach a rope to their boat the Bainbridge could tow them away from the danger.

More importantly, the pirate must have been DU members, if the "allowed" the rope to be attached.

[dutch508]

Washington Post
April 13, 2009
Pg. 9

How SEALs Carried Out Their Mission

By Ann Scott Tyson, Washington Post Staff Writer

The operation to rescue Capt. Richard Phillips involved dozens of Navy SEALs, who parachuted from an aircraft into the scene near dark Saturday, landing in the ocean. The SEALs were part of a group of Special Operations forces involved in the effort, according to military officials.

The SEALs set up operations on the USS Bainbridge, which had been communicating with the four pirates via radio and had used smaller boats to make deliveries of food and water to their lifeboat. Yet the pirates were growing increasingly agitated, the officials said. At one point Saturday, the pirates opened fire on one of the smaller U.S. Navy craft that approached.

As the seas grew rougher, the Bainbridge offered to tow the lifeboat to calmer waters, and the pirates agreed, linking up the lifeboat to the destroyer with a towing cable that left 75 to 80 feet between the two vessels. Phillips at the time was tied up in the lifeboat, having been bound -- and occasionally beaten -- by the pirates ever since he had attempted to escape by jumping into the water on Friday, the officials said.

Meanwhile, one of the pirates, estimated to be between 16 and 20 years old, asked to come aboard the Bainbridge to make a phone call. He had been stabbed in the hand during an altercation with the crew of the Maersk Alabama and needed medical care. "He effectively gave himself up," a senior military official said. The Navy then allowed that pirate to speak with the others in hopes that he could persuade them to give up.

The three other pirates, however, showed signs of growing irritation, as the Bainbridge, 18 miles from shore, towed the lifeboat further out to sea, the senior military official said. "They had no promise of money, clearly no passage. The one ticket they had was the captain," said the official, who spoke on the condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to discuss the matter on the record.

"In the last discussion, they said, 'If we don't get what we want, we will kill the captain,' " the official said.

Soon afterward, two pirates moved to one of the hatches of the lifeboat and stuck their heads out. The third pirate advanced toward the captain and pointed his AK-47 straight at Phillips's back, the rifle touching it or inches away, the official said.

U.S. military observers thought that Phillips was about to be shot. SEAL snipers, who were positioned on a deck at the stern of the Bainbridge, an area known as the fantail, had the three pirates in their sights. The on-scene commander gave the snipers authority to fire.

"As soon as the snipers had a clear shot at the guy who had the rifle, they shot him and the other two in the hatches," the senior military official said.

A member of the Special Operations team slid down the tow line into the water and climbed aboard the lifeboat. Phillips was then put in a small craft and taken to the Bainbridge.

hmmmmm...

[thundley4]

There are reports that the captured terrorist is only 16 years old.  How long before the libs start screaming that it wasn't his fault, that he was corrupted by the older ones?  They haven't even decided where if to put this terrorist on trial.  I say let him be tried by a military tribunal, since this was on the high seas, so to speak.

[Chris_]

Two questions:
1.  Has Oooobama taken credit for the rescue yet?
2.  Will he declare this a national holiday to commemorate his historic action in saving the planet?