The Conservative Cave
Current Events => Archives => Politics => Election 2012 => Topic started by: Dune on July 21, 2011, 09:42:05 PM
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Hi, I'm hoping to keep this civil.
I don't consider myself to be conservative or liberal and I am definantely not in the middle. Middle to me means not-informed or indifferent. I'm just concerned with solving real problems with real solutions.
1. Social Security and Medicare. Do I want a voucher system for my grandmother who relies completely on medicare and social security like Paul Ryan wants. No.
2. Do I want to see Medicaid eliminated? Yes. It's a band aid system that doesn't really help anyone except illegal immigrants.
3. Do I want tax breaks for wealthy people and corporations when most corporations have reporting record profits? No.
4. Do I want a tax break for working class and poor Americans? Yes
5. Do I want a healthcare system based on private healthcare industry that makes so much profits off of screwing people over and makes the oil companies blush in terms of profits? No
6. Do I want a secure border? Yes. Do I want every illegal tossed out of this country? Yes.
7. Do I believe illegal immigrants do jobs Americans don't want to do? No. Americans will do any job, so long as the pay is decent.
8. Do I believe in cutting government? Oh yes.
9. Do I believe private contractors screw tax payers over? Yes. My father is a retired electrical engineer who had to fight tooth and nail with contractors trying to charge 1/4 million dollars for a train battery when it is only really worth 50k.
10. Do I believe that our war in Libya is illegal? Yes, no declaration of war was declared and congress was not consulted and did not approve of it.
11. Do I believe we should pull our troops home? Yes it is expensive and dangerous having our troops spread out all over the world. We have no business setting up Islamic democracies in Afghanistan and Iraq that are Sharia Law light.
12. Do I want to see an economy that seems to be based on speculation and consumer spending? No
13. Do I think companies outsourcing jobs to poor countries, paying them disgusting wages and working obscene hours should be illegal? yes. Americans can't compete with slavery. How do you compete with a product that costs .20 cents to make?
About the candidates:
Mitt Romney: I think he is intelligent and obviously understands economics from his experience and ability to raise money better than the other candidates. What I am afraid of is that he will use "economic expertise" to just give tax cuts to the obsenely wealthy. He is often too timid to take a strong stance against on any of the major issues and needs to grow a backbone.
I think all he needs is to be more bold.
Ron Paul: He wants to dismantle the CIA and their secret prisons. Smartest thing anyone has said, CIA is just a major foul-up organization that has caused more trouble than anyone can imagine. We wouldn't even have had this Bin Laden problem in the first place. Ron Paul wants to dismantle the federal reserve, another brilliant idea, just another F-up organization that tosses money wherever they please and dictates economic policies for our country with no oversight. He wants the country to obey the constitution...revolutionary. He is tired of seeing the United States going around the world nation building when we desperately need some nation building here...it's the economy stupid. He wants to secure our borders, privatize airport security, the guy has a lot of common sense.
Herman Cain: Smart guy, great leadership qualities, very take charge kind of guy...sort of what we need. Only problem with him is he goes around saying mosques shouldn't be built in the U.S., umm, ok we have this thing called the constitution. As much as I hate Islam as a religion, we can't be acting like the people in the Midwest and Northeast did to the Mormons, pretty much running them out of every state and murdering them until they got out of Chicago and seeked out Utah. And I've been to Turkey to see the Blue Mosque and Hagia Sophia which were gorgeous, I may not like Islam, but Islamic art is amazing.
Michelle Bachman: I wouldn't trust her with medicare and social security but neither would I with most Republicans or conservatives.
Gingrich: Slime
Santorum/ Pawlenty: Same face, different name.
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I feel like I am tired of seeing this country turned into a fascist state that tries to scare us at every turn. Scaring us to pour trillions into corporate crooks. Scaring us about non-existent nuclear weapons. Scaring us about not raising the debt limit as if the U.S. is really not going to pay its debts by not raising the limit....please, shame on you Obama and Ben Bernanke.
Just like to see a healthy population with a good economy and a government that protects us, not scares us.
And all the people that claim to be experts about the economy or "economists". If they are such experts, how did we end up in this mess and why haven't you fixed it. Cause they are in bed with the problems.
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Another ronbot.
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Jesus H. Tapdancin Christ, here they come again.
MAN THE GUNS, BOYS!
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Are Ronbots allowed here?
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Another ronbot.
One of many yet to come.
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One of many yet to come.
Shit, here we go again. Okay, I'm going to battle stations and warming up the Tomahawks.
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Well, Ronbot, I will say one thing on the taxes: When we have a multibillion dollar diverse megacorp like GE paying NO net income tax, our "Highest in the industrialized world" NOMINAL corporate tax rate obviously has nothing whatsoever to do with what corporations really pay as their EFFECTIVE tax rate, so I would be all for stripping that down to essentials and reforming it. However I also see no justification whatsoever for the Earned Income Credit, which should be renamed Free Unearned Income.
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Ronbots wouldn't have to be so long-winded if they'd just admit that it's all about the weed.
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ugh, not sure why people calling me a "Ronbot". I don't worship the guy, but the country could use a bit of
Ron Paul Jeffersonian policy.
So would conservatives that want to destroy social security and medicare be called "Ryan-bots?" Create a voucher system that benefits no one except the Healthcare insurance companies.
And I disagree with Ron Paul on his drug policy. So, no, it's not about the weed.
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There is no way he is a Paulbot -- unless he is a leftist who is liking the Dr. Ron isolationism. His medicaid statement is bizarre when compared to the health insurance commentary (actually is a total contradiction).
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ugh, not sure why people calling me a "Ronbot". I don't worship the guy, but the country could use a bit of Ron Paul Jeffersonian policy.
So would conservatives that want to destroy social security and medicare be called "Ryan-bots?" Create a voucher system that benefits no one except the Healthcare insurance companies.
And I disagree with Ron Paul on his drug policy. So, no, it's not about the weed.
Can you show us where the Congress had the Constitutional authority to implement SS and medicare?
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Can you show us where the Congress had the Constitutional authority to implement SS and medicare?
Well it isn't unconstitutional. If a person wants to opt out of SS/Medicare, I don't see any problem with that. But there are millions of senior citizens where that is there life line.
Medicaid is a different story. It doesn't do anything, it just gives very small and very temporary benefits to the very poor. The benefits being so small it's really useless and really only benefits illegal immigrants.
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Medicaid is a different story. It doesn't do anything, it just gives very small and very temporary benefits to the very poor. The benefits being so small it's really useless and really only benefits illegal immigrants.
Not even close to what Medicaid covers, but thanks for playing.
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Not even close to what Medicaid covers, but thanks for playing.
What does it do besides give a couple small checks, temporary food stamps, temporary basic healthcare? It's like a bandaid. I have a problem with Paul Ryan treating medicare and medicaid like they are the same thing.
Oh forgot to mention, not only senior citizens depend on medicare, but also the disabled. And frankly Medicare is broken in terms of mental health, they won't pay more than 30-50 bucks for a psychiatrist because they consider them "specialists", so no good psychiatrist accepts medicare unless they see you for like 5 minutes. And if you have a mental disorder preventing you from working or working full time...that doesn't really help.
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There is no way he is a Paulbot -- unless he is a leftist who is liking the Dr. Ron isolationism.
He said
Ron Paul: He wants to dismantle the CIA and their secret prisons. Ron Paul wants to dismantle the federal reserve, another brilliant idea, ... the guy has a lot of common sense.
No one but a ronbot thinks Dr. Nuts has either brilliant ideas, or common sense.
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Medicaid is a means-tested benefit program that provides health care coverage and medical services to
millions of low-income children, pregnant women, families, persons with disabilities, and elderly
citizens. Medicaid is financed jointly by the states and federal government, and is administered directly
by states. Under broad federal guidelines, each state establishes a state Medicaid plan that outlines
eligibility standards, provider requirements, payment methods, and benefit packages tailored to the
needs of its citizen.
^snip^
Schools can provide a wide range of health care and related services to their students, which may or may
not be reimbursable under the Medicaid program. The services can be categorized as follows:
• IDEA-related health services. The Individuals with Disabilities Education Act (IDEA) was passed
to “assure that all children with disabilities have available to them… a free appropriate public
education which emphasizes special education and related services designed to meet their individual
needs.†The IDEA authorizes federal funding to states for medical services provided to children
through a child’s Individualized Education Program (IEP), including children that are covered under
Medicaid. In 1988, section 1903(c) of the Act was amended to permit Medicaid payment for
medical services provided to Medicaid eligible children under IDEA and included in the child’s IEP.
• “Section 504â€-related health services. Section 504 of the Rehabilitation Act of 1973 requires local
school districts to provide or pay for certain services to make education accessible to handicapped
children. These services may include health care services similar to those covered by IDEA and
Medicaid. These services are typically described in a section 504 plan and are provided free of
charge to eligible individuals.
• General health care services. These services are typically mandated by the school district or state
and include health care screenings, vision exams, hearing tests, a scoliosis exam, etc., provided free
of charge to all students. Services provided by the school nurse (e.g., attending to a child’s sore
throat, dispensing medicine) may also fall into this category. These general health care services
often resemble EPSDT services.
Federal matching funds under Medicaid are available for the cost of administrative activities that
directly support efforts to identify and enroll potential eligibles into Medicaid and that directly support
the provision of medical services covered under the state Medicaid plan. To the extent that school
employees perform administrative activities that are in support of the state Medicaid plan, federal
reimbursement may be available. However, Medicaid third party liability rules and CMS’s free care
policy limit the ability of schools to bill Medicaid for some of these health services and associated
administrative costs.
http://www.cms.gov/MedicaidBudgetExpendSystem/Downloads/Schoolhealthsvcs.pdf
(Catalog of Federal Domestic Assistance Program Nos. 93.558: TANF Contingency Funds; 93.563: Child Support Enforcement;
93.596: Child Care Mandatory and Matching Funds of the Child Care and Development Fund; 93.658: Foster Care Title IV–E; 93.659: Adoption Assistance; 93.769: Ticket-to-Work and Work Incentives Improvement Act (TWWIIA) Demonstrations to Maintain Independence and Employment; 93.778: Medical Assistance Program; 93.767: Children’s Health Insurance Program)
http://aspe.hhs.gov/health/fmap11.htm
The disabled are covered by Medicaid, not Medicare (and for adult services for the significantly cognitively disabled/medically fragile that is everything -- their housing (be that home, community shared housing or residential setting), food, dayhabs, work programs, transportation, etc.).
States count heavily on medicaid reimbursements to balance their books -- a part of the bleeding out that we are seeing states experience now (which is in addition to the burden of public employee health insurance premium increases and pensions systems that are not sustainable, and in the latter case of pensions are just not being funded by states which is an extremely dangerous practice) is the loss of the enhanced FMAP that we saw from Congress during the stimulus fund grab.
You can say, hey get rid of Medicaid. However the effects that will have on the states will be absolutely staggering.
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He said
No one but a ronbot thinks Dr. Nuts has either brilliant ideas, or common sense.
Very true. Point taken.
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The disabled are covered by Medicaid, not Medicare
I'm sorry but this is a mistake. Medicare covers the disabled. Medicaid might provide some minor services like rehabilitation programs but that same person can probably seek out their own private physician under medicare instead of seeking out a day program. Maybe under certain types of disability someone can get medicare and medicaid permanently, but as I am aware, medicaid I believe to be strictly a temporary aid in terms of most services like receiving checks.
Scoliosis testing....not really a major necessity. Very rare, and can be detected by any basic primary care doctor.
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OK, why is not dismantling the CIA not a brilliant idea?
They are the biggest ****-Up organization ever.
1. Their decisions led to the present theocratic government of Iran
2. They support Afghans and Bin Laden to defeat the Soviets from Afghanistan
3. They refused to give clearance in the 90's that Bin Laden and Al Quaida were responsible for recent bombings hence halting a special forces operation to kill Bin Laden
4. They said that Iraq had WMD's
5. The French dragged us into Libya and then the CIA doesn't know what to do ending up investigating the rebels instead of helping end the war leading to a stalemate civil war
6. They operate secret prisons doing whatever the **** they want
7. They manipulate media overseas to their agenda, they operate above the U.S. government as their own government with their own agenda and policies
8. We have no idea how far their crimes reach because there is no oversight
And the department of Homeland Security?
What is it that they can do that the FBI can't? Seriously, what a waste of money.
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I'm sorry but this is a mistake. Medicare covers the disabled. Medicaid might provide some minor services like rehabilitation programs but that same person can probably seek out their own private physician under medicare instead of seeking out a day program. Maybe under certain types of disability someone can get medicare and medicaid permanently, but as I am aware, medicaid I believe to be strictly a temporary aid in terms of most services like receiving checks.
Scoliosis testing....not really a major necessity. Very rare, and can be detected by any basic primary care doctor.
Ok, let's be super clear who I am referring to. I am NOT referring to the drug addict, or the guy with the back disc problem who is a little depressed. Not referring to SSI, and SSDI.
I am referring to those with severe autism, downs syndrome, CP, and other debilitating disabilities. Those who CANNOT live on their own. Those with a functioning capability of a toddler. Those people.
Without Medicaid they would be forced into institutions:
http://www.thearc.org/page.aspx?pid=3232
I am a fiscal conservative who strongly believes that safety nets should be funded for these specific individuals -- our most fragile residents of our country.
Medicaid needs a major overhaul -- that is for certain. However it is the person with severe disabilities who seems to be the ones who suffers, while the deadbeat losers of society don't miss a check.
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OK, why is not dismantling the CIA not a brilliant idea?
They are the biggest ****-Up organization ever.
And the department of Homeland Security?
What is it that they can do that the FBI can't? Seriously, what a waste of money.
I'd put a priority on the Dept of Education before the CIA. Waste of money, waste of resources.
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I'd put a priority on the Dept of Education.
Me too. I'm a teacher in the private sector. Why? Because I want to teach my way and I am very effective at how I teach. I refuse to work in a school system where I am forced to teach things and methods I know are bullshit.
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Medicaid needs a major overhaul -- that is for certain. However it is the person with severe disabilities who seems to be the ones who suffers, while the deadbeat losers of society don't miss a check.
Social Security runs a pretty tight operation with giving disability. They reject most people. And even if someone gets disability they have a hard-cap limit of how much funds they can have.
Btw, someone with a severe mental disorder who lands in a psychiatric hospital several times can have a much harder disposition than someone in a wheelchair. So it's not a simple process.
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1. Their decisions led to the present theocratic government of Iran
2. They support Afghans and Bin Laden to defeat the Soviets from Afghanistan
3. They refused to give clearance in the 90's that Bin Laden and Al Quaida were responsible for recent bombings hence halting a special forces operation to kill Bin Laden
4. They said that Iraq had WMD's
5. The French dragged us into Libya and then the CIA doesn't know what to do ending up investigating the rebels instead of helping end the war leading to a stalemate civil war
6. They operate secret prisons doing whatever the **** they want
7. They manipulate media overseas to their agenda, they operate above the U.S. government as their own government with their own agenda and policies
8. We have no idea how far their crimes reach because there is no oversight
1. Jimmeh, whose incompetence matches Ron Paul's nuttiness, ushered in the theocracy in Iran by withdrawing U.S. support from the Shah.
2. Is it now ronbot gospel that defeating the Russians was a bad thing?
3. I have no idea what the ronbot is talking about.
4. Every intelligence agency in the world said Iraq had CBW capability. It had been demonstrated on the Kurds.
5. We are in Libya purely due to the jug-eared muslim, whose incompetence matches that of Jimmeh and the nuttiness of Ron Paul.
6. The CIA extracts information from, and kills, blood enemies of the United States. I guess that's criminal in ronbotistan.
7. I guess in ronbotistan it's bad to try to influence public opinion overseas.
8. Unfortunately, democrats are included in the committees that exercise oversight over the CIA. They then leak the information to our enemies.
The agencies that need to be abolished most are the Department of Education, the Department of Energy, the BATF.
I think ronbots are as incompetent as Jimmeh and the Kenyan combined, and nuttier than even their icon, Dr. Nuts.
I'm afraid our new paultard is one toke over the line.
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2. Is it now ronbot gospel that defeating the Russians was a bad thing?
We should have let the Soviets had their way and demolish Afghanistan. And if you want to keep calling me Ronbot, then I get to call you dickhead, lol ok? :hyper: j/k
Now we have a border tribal taliban/ Al Quaida and a Sharia Law Lite puppet Democracy all the while women are trapped in box-dresses in staggering heat.
Yeah, I'll take an Atheist, communist state over that.
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Social Security runs a pretty tight operation with giving disability. They reject most people. And even if someone gets disability they have a hard-cap limit of how much funds they can have.
Btw, someone with a severe mental disorder who lands in a psychiatric hospital several times can have a much harder disposition than someone in a wheelchair. So it's not a simple process.
You have no idea what cohort of the population I am referring to. I am not referring to someone who is simply in a wheelchair, and hmmm, you do seem to know quite a bit about the SSI process for misfits.
You are from the DU aren't you?
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We should have let the Soviets had their way and demolish Afghanistan.
Oh dear. You just can educate this kind of stupid... with you being a private school teacher and all, I have to say I am disappointed that you aren't smarter than a six grader.
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You have no idea what cohort of the population I am referring to. I am not referring to someone who is simply in a wheelchair, and hmmm, you do seem to know quite a bit about the SSI process for misfits.
You are from the DU aren't you?
I know what population I am referring to. I just didn't reply cause I wasn't sure if we are on the same page.
I'm not from anywhere. I'm just some dude surfing the net and interested in the 2012 election.
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Oh dear. You just can educate this kind of stupid... with you being a private school teacher and all, I have to say I am disappointed that you aren't smarter than a six grader.
Alright, so much for civility. Obviously the hostility is too tight here.
I'de suggest you watch the film the 9th platoon. It's in a foreign language, so I hope you can handle subtetitles, jerk. It will help you understand the war from the Soviet point of view.
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Alright, so much for civility. Obviously the hostility is too tight here.
No, just lack of patience for nonsense. Your comment that I quoted is testament that you aren't a serious debater, or rather hardly an informed one.
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No, just lack of patience for nonsense. Your comment that I quoted is testament that you aren't a serious debater, or rather hardly an informed one.
I'de suggest you watch the film the 9th platoon. It's in a foreign language, so I hope you can handle subtetitles, jerk. It will help you understand the war from the Soviet point of view.
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Quote from: Dune on Today at 10:00:16 pm
I'de suggest you watch the film the 9th platoon. It's in a foreign language, so I hope you can handle subtetitles, jerk. It will help you understand the war from the Soviet point of view.
Oh, help me understand the war from the Russian's point of view.
A movie will do that.
D'oh, why the hell do I read when there's a movie???? :whatever:
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Quote from: Dune on Today at 10:00:16 pm
Oh, help me understand the war from the Russian's point of view.
A movie will do that.
D'oh, why the hell do I read when there's a movie???? :whatever:
Oh, I know my history and love to read it. But in terms of convenience, it's a good start.
Let me ask you this: Do you think what we have now (taliban-Al Quaida and a weak puppet Sharia Law lite "democracy") is better than an Atheist communist state?
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Your history indeed.
It's your knowledge of actual history (information about which is not secured from a movie) that is in question here.
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Your history indeed.
It's your knowledge of actual history (information about which is not secured from a movie) that is in question here.
Great way to dodge the question. Some films are quite educational, this happens to be one of them.
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Oh, I know my history and love to read it. But in terms of convenience, it's a good start.
Let me ask you this: Do you think what we have now (taliban-Al Quaida and a weak puppet Sharia Law lite "democracy") is better than an Atheist communist state?
Well, I honestly could give a flying fig if the Soviets had expanded into Afghanistan and ended it there. It's the warm water ports they were heading for that I take issue with.
Mmmkay?
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Great way to dodge the question. Some films are quite educational, this happens to be one of them.
Sure, sure. This what you are showing your students?
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Great way to dodge the question.
You edited the post to add the question after I hit reply to respond... :mental:
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Sure, sure. This what you are showing your students?
Yeah I'm not gonna talk about my private life. But I can tell you I don't teach history. Although I could. I'm particularly knowledgeable in Baroque and Ancient History, but that's beside the point.
You edited the post to add the question after I hit reply to respond... :mental:
Yeah, maybe like 1 second after....
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Hold on, I see the problem here. Did they NOT mention The Soviet's quest for warm water ports in this movie.
Totally understand the confusion now.
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Yeah I'm not gonna talk about my private life. But I can tell you I don't teach history. Although I could. I'm particularly knowledgeable in Baroque and Ancient History, but that's beside the point.
I'm confused:
Me too. I'm a teacher in the private sector. Why? Because I want to teach my way and I am very effective at how I teach. I refuse to work in a school system where I am forced to teach things and methods I know are bullshit.
No one asked, you offered.
I have to head to bed, long day. Catch on the flip side. :yawn:
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Hold on, I see the problem here. Did they NOT mention The Soviet's quest for warm water ports in this movie.
Totally understand the confusion now.
I really could care less if they had more ports. They sailed warships on South America not too long ago...
In the scheme of things it sounds very trivial.
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Oh, I know my history and love to read it. But in terms of convenience, it's a good start.
Let me ask you this: Do you think what we have now (taliban-Al Quaida and a weak puppet Sharia Law lite "democracy") is better than an Atheist communist state?
Spoken like someone who never had the pleasure of playing tag with the commies in the Pacific nor has a clue about the very real need to stop the Soviet monster in its tracks.
You know very little, sir.
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Spoken like someone who never had the pleasure of playing tag with the commies in the Pacific nor has a clue about the very real need to stop the Soviet monster in its tracks.
You know very little, sir.
He's a teacher, a great one by his own standards.
They must watch movies a lot.
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Oh dear. You just can educate this kind of stupid... with you being a private school teacher and all, I have to say I am disappointed that you aren't smarter than a six grader.
You know this was a super bitchy response from me which I apologize for.
I think you are dead wrong on this, but I didn't have to insult you like that.
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1. Social Security and Medicare. Do I want a voucher system for my grandmother who relies completely on medicare and social security like Paul Ryan wants. No.
I have a 92 year old nana too and I do the Medicare dance with her every year. If you're truly concerned about yours then you should be really pissed about 0bamacare as it strips them of Medicare Advantage, which is generally cheaper and of better quality than gap programs with separate drug coverage. She would benefit greatly from a plan that would allow her to buy across straight lines as she lives in CA and she could get a much better policy for about a quarter of what she pays now if she were allowed to buy in my state. But the fact that you don't even understand those currently on SS won't be affected by ANY legislation EXCEPT 0bamacare shows you don't have a freaking clue what you're talking about. You should do more research.
2. Do I want to see Medicaid eliminated? Yes. It's a band aid system that doesn't really help anyone except illegal immigrants.
Granted but it beats 0bamacare by a mile. And one solution would be to NOT allow illegal aliens (they aren't immigrants) to use it and perhaps deporting them when they apply. What a concept.
3. Do I want tax breaks for wealthy people and corporations when most corporations have reporting record profits? No.
Class warfare talking point. There are many solutions to the current tax problems (a flat tax, for instance) that would eliminate "tax breaks" for all. But many of those "tax breaks" allow them to hire more of your precious working class.
4. Do I want a tax break for working class and poor Americans? Yes
Again, class warfare talking point. Most "working class" and ALL poor pay NO taxes at all. You're ignorance is showing. Once again.
5. Do I want a healthcare system based on private healthcare industry that makes so much profits off of screwing people over and makes the oil companies blush in terms of profits? No
Again, ignorant talking point. Oil company profits are fairly low compared to other industries. The government's "profits", however, are 100%. I don't give a flying rat's ass what company profits are (except as a person who has a retirement plan and mutual funds I prefer the companies I invest in make huge profits because that means my portfolio grows. As one of your "working class", that helps me a great deal and I get a helluva lot more from my investments (even with the current downturn) than SS will ever provide.
6. Do I want a secure border? Yes. Do I want every illegal tossed out of this country? Yes.
Agree.
7. Do I believe illegal immigrants do jobs Americans don't want to do? No. Americans will do any job, so long as the pay is decent.
Agree. But I don't believe pay should be artificially inflated by minimum wage. One of my first jobs was picking strawberries. It was hard work in the hot sun. We were paid "per flat" which wasn't much but I thought it was a fortune at the time. And I learned the value of hard work. It provided lessons about a good work ethic that prepared me for better jobs.
8. Do I believe in cutting government? Oh yes.
Don't we all. Ryan's plan would do that quite well.
9. Do I believe private contractors screw tax payers over? Yes. My father is a retired electrical engineer who had to fight tooth and nail with contractors trying to charge 1/4 million dollars for a train battery when it is only really worth 50k.
Market determines prices. Unless your dad owned the freaking train (in which case he's hardly poor and if it's Amtrak he gets government subsidies) why should it matter to him what the company pays for batteries?
10. Do I believe that our war in Libya is illegal? Yes, no declaration of war was declared and congress was not consulted and did not approve of it.
Agreed.
11. Do I believe we should pull our troops home? Yes it is expensive and dangerous having our troops spread out all over the world. We have no business setting up Islamic democracies in Afghanistan and Iraq that are Sharia Law light.
I have mixed feelings about this so won't get into it. But do believe we should give more weight to those who are over there than private citizens who don't really have a clue.
12. Do I want to see an economy that seems to be based on speculation and consumer spending? No
Bullshit. Another class warfare talking point. If people think something is worth the price, they'll buy it. If not, they won't.
13. Do I think companies outsourcing jobs to poor countries, paying them disgusting wages and working obscene hours should be illegal? yes. Americans can't compete with slavery. How do you compete with a product that costs .20 cents to make?
Again, class warfare talking point. Minimum wage laws and union wages artificially inflate product cost (and in the case of government workers they earn twice what those paying their salaries make). What would be dirt wages in this country are a fortune in poorer countries. Companies are in the business of making profits (again, their profits help those working class with mutual funds and other investments).
You're an idiot. That's about as civil as I can be given you're lack of understanding.
Cindie
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Alright, so much for civility. Obviously the hostility is too tight here.
I'de suggest you watch the film the 9th platoon. It's in a foreign language, so I hope you can handle subtetitles, jerk. It will help you understand the war from the Soviet point of view.
Learn to spell.
Also, 9th Company is not an accurate movie: http://fmso.leavenworth.army.mil/documents/battle-for-the-hill.pdf
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Market determines prices. Unless your dad owned the freaking train (in which case he's hardly poor and if it's Amtrak he gets government subsidies) why should it matter to him what the company pays for batteries?
Considering (retired) he was one of the top engineers for NY Transit Authority, he saved the city millions of dollars. Hence, saving tax payers millions of dollars. He'd tell me stories about how private contractors were always trying to rip the city off and he didn't allow them.
You're an idiot. That's about as civil as I can be given you're lack of understanding.
Yeah, yeah **** you too.
I think you should rename your website, "Conservative rabid asserholes".
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OK, why is not dismantling the CIA not a brilliant idea?
They are the biggest ****-Up organization ever.
1. Their decisions led to the present theocratic government of Iran
2. They support Afghans and Bin Laden to defeat the Soviets from Afghanistan
3. They refused to give clearance in the 90's that Bin Laden and Al Quaida were responsible for recent bombings hence halting a special forces operation to kill Bin Laden
4. They said that Iraq had WMD's
5. The French dragged us into Libya and then the CIA doesn't know what to do ending up investigating the rebels instead of helping end the war leading to a stalemate civil war
6. They operate secret prisons doing whatever the **** they want
7. They manipulate media overseas to their agenda, they operate above the U.S. government as their own government with their own agenda and policies
8. We have no idea how far their crimes reach because there is no oversight
And the department of Homeland Security?
What is it that they can do that the FBI can't? Seriously, what a waste of money.
What about the ATF? They have been smuggling guns to Mexico and Honduras, all to justify ever tighter restrictions on gun ownership. All facts (independently verified by multiple whistleblowers within the agency itself), unlike the stuff you allege about the CIA.
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1. Their decisions led to the present theocratic government of Iran
2. They support Afghans and Bin Laden to defeat the Soviets from Afghanistan
3. They refused to give clearance in the 90's that Bin Laden and Al Quaida were responsible for recent bombings hence halting a special forces operation to kill Bin Laden
4. They said that Iraq had WMD's
5. The French dragged us into Libya and then the CIA doesn't know what to do ending up investigating the rebels instead of helping end the war leading to a stalemate civil war
6. They operate secret prisons doing whatever the **** they want
7. They manipulate media overseas to their agenda, they operate above the U.S. government as their own government with their own agenda and policies
8. We have no idea how far their crimes reach because there is no oversight
Really? And you said you are a teacher?
1. Jimmy Carter at the time set foreign policy and his was rather disastrous. His intelligence from that part of the world was especially lacking because he had gutted the Middle Eastern department the year prior to Khomeni's return. There weren't even interpreters to read the local newspapers
2. Yes, yes they did. I'm sure there's a point here, but you forgot the object of the sentence.
3. The 90s didn't see a whole lot of terrorist bombings, certainly a few and by the late 1990s Bin Laden was on the watch list. The CIA does not, however, go killing people willy nilly just because it seems like a good idea at the time. It was Clinton who failed to give the order as proscribed under our laws.
4. So did everybody else. Oops. Can't get 'em all right. And by everybody else I mean British and French intelligence agencies, there were probably others, just can't remember off the top of my head.
5. Are you complaining here that the CIA wasn't ready for our ridiculous foray into the Libyan civil war? Again, I don't think anyone saw that coming and given the wishy-washy waffleicious leadership style of the current chief executive, I don't think anybody else foresaw our involvement either.
6. Yes they do operate secret prisons but they don't do whatever they want, if they are caught doing things they are not supposed to, the press gets to have a field day, careers are destroyed, and the courts decide if necessary.
7. Here's the real issue and there's no point arguing. If you believe the CIA is the right hand of God and that this is really just a real life version of Deus Ex, there's no discussion to be had.
8. There is oversight, it's the Congress.
Glad to have helped, have a nice day! O-)
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3. The 90s didn't see a whole lot of terrorist bombings, certainly a few and by the late 1990s Bin Laden was on the watch list. The CIA does not, however, go killing people willy nilly just because it seems like a good idea at the time. It was Clinton who failed to give the order as proscribed under our laws.
[youtube=425,350]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3L2513JFJsY[/youtube]
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Learn to spell.
Also, 9th Company is not an accurate movie: http://fmso.leavenworth.army.mil/documents/battle-for-the-hill.pdf
I agree, most historical movies that have been Hollywoodified are rarely accurate...
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Learn to spell.
Also, 9th Company is not an accurate movie: http://fmso.leavenworth.army.mil/documents/battle-for-the-hill.pdf
What did I do, misspell one word? Get a life.
I know about the accuracy and inaccuracies of the film. I think it's a good story through the point of view of some young Russian paratroopers and what kind of enemy they faced.
The vehicles, tactics, training, and some battle scenes are pretty accurate. If no one wants to watch then fine, I just threw it out there cause its a decent point of reference. But instead used it to attack my profession, my integrity. And then that guy on the other page asks me why I don't want to share any more information about myself.
As far as I am concerned I can say "hi" and I will get a big "Fuk you" from this group. So Fuk you all too.
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What did I do, misspell one word? Get a life.
I know about the accuracy and inaccuracies of the film. I think it's a good story through the point of view of some young Russian paratroopers and what kind of enemy they faced.
The vehicles, tactics, training, and some battle scenes are pretty accurate. If no one wants to watch then fine, I just threw it out there cause its a decent point of reference. But instead used it to attack my profession, my integrity. And then that guy on the other page asks me why I don't want to share any more information about myself.
As far as I am concerned I can say "hi" and I will get a big "Fuk you" from this group. So Fuk you all too.
I never asked you why you won't share info about yourself. I asked a snarky question do you show this movie to your students.
You offered info about yourself unsolicited, so it was fair game at that point.
Why you feel a movie supports your claim that the Soviets should have been allowed to take Afghanistan is not anything that can be defended with fact.
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Actually there were two misspelled words. You say you are a teacher, yet you got offended when we were pointing that out to you. If you are going to say **** you, you could spell the word **** right, while you were at it. Using a Hollywoodified historical movie as a point of reference??? bwahahaha!! :rotf:
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[youtube=425,350]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3L2513JFJsY[/youtube]
:bawl:
What could I do Chris.. the FBI and CIA wouldn't certify OBL was responsible for the Cole...... the military didn't want to go into Afghanistan.......
:bawl: :bawl: :bawl:
I tried...... I tried......
How presidential of you Mr. Clinton, you total POS liar. Those who served in Special Operations know you for the damn finger waving liar that you are. 9/11 is on your head and your head only.
ETA: Special Ops personnel can't write a book yet, yet. They will, and I hope you live long enough to read it.
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I never asked you why you won't share info about yourself. I asked a snarky question do you show this movie to your students.
You offered info about yourself unsolicited, so it was fair game at that point.
Why you feel a movie supports your claim that the Soviets should have been allowed to take Afghanistan is not anything that can be defended with fact.
No I don't show films like that to my students because it has nothing to do with what I am teaching. In fact the only films I show are clips of films by David Lynch because it helps teach the theories I try to express and I might show a scene or two from the movie Pollock. But that's about it.
Like, wtf, people telling me I'm a bad teacher and every student I've ever had has told me that I am the best teacher of my subject they have ever had.
Why the film? I think it brings into context what the hell those poor bastards had to endure because of our meddling. The Mujhadeen were absolutely ruthless and we let that kind of theocratic enemy take over Afghanistan which in turns leads to all those poor American soldiers, sailors, marines, and airmen we've lost over there.
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Actually there were two misspelled words. You say you are a teacher, yet you got offended when we were pointing that out to you. If you are going to say **** you, you could spell the word **** right, while you were at it. Using a Hollywoodified historical movie as a point of reference??? bwahahaha!! :rotf:
Right....teachers can't misspell words......
Some of the most brilliant professors I've ever had weren't that great spellers, shows just how much of a dumbass you are.
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No I don't show films like that to my students because it has nothing to do with what I am teaching. In fact the only films I show are clips of films by David Lynch because it helps teach the theories I try to express and I might show a scene or two from the movie Pollock. But that's about it.
Like, wtf, people telling me I'm a bad teacher and every student I've ever had has told me that I am the best teacher of my subject they have ever had.
Why the film? I think it brings into context what the hell those poor bastards had to endure because of our meddling. The Mujhadeen were absolutely ruthless and we let that kind of theocratic enemy take over Afghanistan which in turns leads to all those poor American soldiers, sailors, marines, and airmen we've lost over there.
You can't compare the two, and as the clip you posted demonstrates -- actions, or rather inactions, can change the world.
Stopping the Soviet Union from expanding and securing a warm water port was of critical importance to the interests of the United States and the world for that matter. Any military historian worth their salt will agree with that assertion.
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Stopping the Soviet Union from expanding and securing a warm water port was of critical importance to the interests of the United States and the world for that matter. Any military historian worth their salt will agree with that assertion.
I've never seen the Soviets as a serious threat, so long as there was M.A.D., Just a bogeyman that was never going to come into fruition.
I have no idea if the defeat in Afghanistan had a major role or not in the crumbling down of the Soviet Union, but even if it did, I still think we would have been better off without Afghanistan on our plate.
Some Vietnam Vets question the purpose of placing an emphasis on national building (with Obama it seems to be half/half for national building or counter-terrorism, even though he says his focus is counter-terrorism.) when there is an enemy that is mobile and can attack anywhere at any time. I.E. just let it be strictly Counter-terrorism and let the Afghans take care of their own. That way we can leave and just keep a handful of special forces there.
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Right....teachers can't misspell words......
Some of the most brilliant professors I've ever had weren't that great spellers, shows just how much of a dumbass you are.
Well dumbass, you are not much of a teacher, and neither are they, if they don't proofread what they write, and not setting a good example to their students....
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How presidential of you Mr. Clinton, you total POS liar. Those who served in Special Operations know you for the damn finger waving liar that you are. 9/11 is on your head and your head only.
ETA: Special Ops personnel can't write a book yet, yet. They will, and I hope you live long enough to read it.
How would the Spec Ops know if they were never deployed?
9/11 is on his head??? He's not the one who ignored memos about Al Quaida.
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Well dumbass, you are not much of a teacher, and neither are they, if they don't proofread what they write, and not setting a good example to their students....
Well I am not proofreading on here, because I don't feel that I care. This is just some random forum, not some thesis paper. Yeah and I'm pretty sure my professors proofread before they publish their books, dumbass.
Seriously, you hounding me this much over a misspelled word? Like I care.
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How would the Spec Ops know if they were never deployed?
9/11 is on his head??? He's not the one who ignored memos about Al Quaida.
You're kidding, right?
http://www.nationalreview.com/articles/218683/facts-about-clinton-and-terrorism/byron-york
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I've never seen the Soviets as a serious threat......
Didn't pay attention much in class when WWII was discussed did you?
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How would the Spec Ops know if they were never deployed?
9/11 is on his head??? He's not the one who ignored memos about Al Quaida.
Oh my.
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You're kidding, right?
http://www.nationalreview.com/articles/218683/facts-about-clinton-and-terrorism/byron-york
I just read that article. The author seems to feel that when Clinton was trying to broker a Israeli-Palestinian peace, it was counteractive to the issue. It kind of shows of how ignorant the author is since the Palestinian conflict is what inspires Jihadists the most to destroy American interests and people. Conservatives can say "wag the dog" when he shoots cruise missiles into Afghanistan, but then afterwards display him "ineffective" as the author describes.
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Didn't pay attention much in class when WWII was discussed did you?
I don't swallow everything I read or hear. When I was in 10th grade, the "history teacher" took a vote of how many people felt it was necessary to bomb Japan with Atomics.
I was only 1 of 2 that raised there hand in the entire class that said no. And then my teacher proceeded to tell me why I was wrong.
History is subjective. Except for a few facts, most of it is just interpretation.
And no I've never seen the Soviets as a serious threat so long as there was M.A.D.
Did you pay attention in the real world class called, "Critical Thinking"?
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Did you pay attention in the real world class called, "Critical Thinking"?
Excuse me, sir, but did you?
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I've never seen the Soviets as a serious threat, so long as there was M.A.D., Just a bogeyman that was never going to come into fruition.
I have no idea if the defeat in Afghanistan had a major role or not in the crumbling down of the Soviet Union, but even if it did, I still think we would have been better off without Afghanistan on our plate.
Some Vietnam Vets question the purpose of placing an emphasis on national building (with Obama it seems to be half/half for national building or counter-terrorism, even though he says his focus is counter-terrorism.) when there is an enemy that is mobile and can attack anywhere at any time. I.E. just let it be strictly Counter-terrorism and let the Afghans take care of their own. That way we can leave and just keep a handful of special forces there.
Let me guess, it was the House Committee on Un-American Activities, Sen. Joe McCarthy, Ronald Reagan, and their ilk that were the real threat?
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And no I've never seen the Soviets as a serious threat so long as there was M.A.D.
You're not using your critical thinking skills here, sir.
We believed that mutually-assured destruction would happen in case of a war with the Soviets.
The Soviets themselves believed no such thing.
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Let me guess, it was the House Committee on Un-American Activities, Sen. Joe McCarthy, Ronald Reagan, and their ilk that were the real threat?
Yes.
The Soviets themselves believed no such thing.
If they didn't give a flying hoot about M.A.D., then you and I wouldn't be having this discussion, would we?
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Yes.
How many atomic bomb and other secrets did Joe McCarthy give the Soviets?
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How many atomic bomb and other secrets did Joe McCarthy give the Soviets?
How many loyal Americans lost everything they had just because McCarthy was a paranoid, power hungry asshole ?
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How many loyal Americans lost everything they had just because McCarthy was a paranoid, power hungry asshole ?
I hardly consider the affluent livelihood of a few obscure Hollywood screen-writers anywhere near as important as the security of both the United States and the west.
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I hardly consider the affluent livelihood of a few obscure Hollywood screen-writers anywhere near as important as the security of both the United States and the west.
a few? And it wasn't just hollywood types. It was people from all sectors of life. McCarthy was an asshole, and he should of hung for his crimes.
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a few? And it wasn't just hollywood types. It was people from all sectors of life. McCarthy was an asshole, and he should of hung for his crimes.
McCarthy was a demagogue.
Demagoguery is no capital crime in the United States; if it were, Vast Teddy of Massachusetts wouldn't have been around any time past 1970.
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I have no idea why McCarthy was so crazy about communism.
There's actually some things that communism/ socialism can offer. Like cheap government produced steel, it will run at a net loss, but provides cheap steel throughout the country for cheaper manufacturing. Or universal healthcare.
Communism/Socialism doesn't automatically mean dictatorship or control over your life. I think it depends on the circumstances.
Capitalism really has nothing to do with our constitution. I'm actually convinced if the founding fathers saw how our markets and economy are today, they probably roll in their graves.
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I have no idea why McCarthy was so crazy about communism.
Because Joe McCarthy had some, uh, personal problems, which were exacerbated by alcoholism.
For the same reason Vast Teddy was so crazy about pro-lifers; wanted to drive them out, purge them.
Politicians are people too, and sometimes one or another of them shows the same mentally unhealthy obsessions as some ordinary people do.
This of course ignores that, as it turned out, Joe McCarthy was right, but it was more good luck on his part--blind squirrel, acorn, that sort of thing--than his investigative skills.
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There's actually some things that communism/ socialism can offer. Like cheap government produced steel, it will run at a net loss, but provides cheap steel throughout the country for cheaper manufacturing.
Uh oh.
You hit a nerve there, sir.
<<has seen, dealt with, socialist-made steel.
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Communism/Socialism doesn't automatically mean dictatorship or control over your life. I think it depends on the circumstances.
How does controlling the means of production and distribution NOT control one's life?
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Capitalism really has nothing to do with our constitution.
In the sense that capitalism is another form of free expression, I must disagree; there's the Bill of Rights.
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This of course ignores that, as it turned out, Joe McCarthy was right, but it was more good luck on his part--blind squirrel, acorn, that sort of thing--than his investigative skills.
And how many innocent people suffered from his wrath? And if he happens to capture someone who is a communist/socialist, so what? Unless there is real espionage, it means nothing.
This is America, you can be whatever you want to be, conservative, religious, atheist, communist, anarchist, homosexual Whatever. Let me be what I am and I let you be what you are and lets not try to kill each other in the process.
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And how many innocent people suffered from his wrath? And if he happens to capture someone who is a communist/socialist, so what? Unless there is real espionage, it means nothing.
Look, sir, we don't live in a perfect world.
It's unfortunate that life isn't fair, but it's a fact that life isn't fair.
Innocent people get victimized, guilty people get off scot-free, sometimes.
That's the way it is; it's never going to be a case where everyone gets what each one deserves.
All one can do is ensure that the fewest innocent people get victimized, and that the largest proportion of guilty people pay the penalties. That's the best we can do in this world, not 100%, but some lesser percentage.
And the record clearly shows who does the best.
Not perfect, but the best. Perfection is unattainable.
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I dislike being abrupt, especially since I'm a nice guy, one of the nicest guys one can ever hope to meet, but it's late, and I'll have to take part in this discussion later.
And then after you reach the minimum posts required for admittance into the "Fight Club" forum--it's either 50 or 100, I disremember which--I'd like to move this thread there, where there's no holds barred (for either side).
For the meantime, have a good night.
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Look, sir, we don't live in a perfect world.
It's unfortunate that life isn't fair, but it's a fact that life isn't fair.
Innocent people get victimized, guilty people get off scot-free, sometimes.
That's the way it is; it's never going to be a case where everyone gets what each one deserves.
All one can do is ensure that the fewest innocent people get victimized, and that the largest proportion of guilty people pay the penalties. That's the best we can do in this world, not 100%, but some lesser percentage.
And the record clearly shows who does the best.
Not perfect, but the best. Perfection is unattainable.
So going around screaming in congress and banishing people almost randomly like a lunatic is acceptable behavior for our government?
Do you also condone the Salem Witch Trials? :mental:
We are a nation of laws, not of shadow governments......oh wait.
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I've never seen the Soviets as a serious threat, so long as there was M.A.D., Just a bogeyman that was never going to come into fruition.
Ignorant, isolationist, smarmy prick. Yep, you're a ronbot with a heap of DUmbass thrown in for good measure.
I really don't need to read anything else you have to type to figure out how big of a moron you are.
BTW, if you don't like what you see here, get out.
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Ignorant, isolationist, smarmy prick. Yep, you're a ronbot with a heap of DUmbass thrown in for good measure.
I really don't need to read anything else you have to type to figure out how big of a moron you are.
BTW, if you don't like what you see here, get out.
Booga Booga Booga. The Soviets are coming. The Soviets are coming.
lol, tool. If staying under a rock thinking everyone is out to getcha is not being a "ronbot, DUmbass, moron", I reall don't know what to say.
You are clearly the dumbass, Sir. Not me. Oh and watch out for incoming Soviet invasion.
Oh and keep making insulting remarks about me being a teacher with your DU friends, while you have no idea what,where, or for who I teach. Forum seems to be full of Fukin' Fart Sniffers.
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Communism/Socialism doesn't automatically mean dictatorship or control over your life. I think it depends on the circumstances.
The dictatorship of the proletariat has absolute control of the means of production. While meant to be a transitional period between state socialism and stateless communism, it gives a government absolute power over the people. The dictatorship of the proletariat controls what products are produced, how they are produced, and who the products go to. Enemies of the revolution are simply denied food and suffer one of the most horrible deaths possible, as evidenced by the Holomodor, the Great Leap Forward and the Khmer Rouge.
Even if pure communism were ever achieved, it would resemble the mob rule of democracy. If the weak were a drain on the collective, then they would be sacrificed against their will. Collectivism dehumanizes people.
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The dictatorship of the proletariat has absolute control of the means of production. While meant to be a transitional period between state socialism and stateless communism, it gives a government absolute power over the people. The dictatorship of the proletariat controls what products are produced, how they are produced, and who the products go to. Enemies of the revolution are simply denied food and suffer one of the most horrible deaths possible, as evidenced by the Holomodor, the Great Leap Forward and the Khmer Rouge.
Even if pure communism were ever achieved, it would resemble the mob rule of democracy. If the weak were a drain on the collective, then they would be sacrificed against their will. Collectivism dehumanizes people.
Communism/Socialism can be formed in many ways. I'm not necessarily talking about their true orthodox form but hybrids and alterations and borrowed ideas.
Things can be experimented on, like net loss state production of materials, leading to cheaper manufacturing in the U.S. as an example. Because as it stands, it'd pretty hard to compete with overseas slave labor. How can you compete making a baseball cap when your competitor had it made for .20 cents in Indonesia?
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Booga Booga Booga. The Soviets are coming. The Soviets are coming.
lol, tool. If staying under a rock thinking everyone is out to getcha is not being a "ronbot, DUmbass, moron", I reall don't know what to say.
You are clearly the dumbass, Sir. Not me. Oh and watch out for incoming Soviet invasion.
Oh and keep making insulting remarks about me being a teacher with your DU friends, while you have no idea what,where, or for who I teach. Forum seems to be full of Fukin' Fart Sniffers.
Okay, "tool", tell me exactly how much experience you have had with the ex Soviet empire? Exactly what perspective do you have?
For the record, DUmbass, I have said nothing of you being a "teacher", insult or otherwise. If you are going to try and be cute, try to also be accurate.
Again, if you don't like what you see here, leave. Unless, that is, you are one of those that seeks attention no matter what kind.
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Okay, "tool", tell me exactly how much experience you have had with the ex Soviet empire? Exactly what perspective do you have?
For the record, DUmbass, I have said nothing of you being a "teacher", insult or otherwise. If you are going to try and be cute, try to also be accurate.
Again, if you don't like what you see here, leave. Unless, that is, you are one of those that seeks attention no matter what kind.
Oh, I don't plan on sticking around here, it's too hostile. At least I tried to behave like an adult, but I see that I have encountered too many know-it-all's that throw more insults than substance.
My experiences....hmmmm. I once bought a silver engraved Soviet snuff box from Turkey. Nice Antique.
My perspective....hmmmm. The simple fact that this scenario is ridiculous:
[youtube=425,350]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fnd0qg4I_MM[/youtube]
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Considering (retired) he was one of the top engineers for NY Transit Authority, he saved the city millions of dollars. Hence, saving tax payers millions of dollars. He'd tell me stories about how private contractors were always trying to rip the city off and he didn't allow them.
Yeah, yeah **** you too.
I think you should rename your website, "Conservative rabid asserholes".
And yet you didn't respond to any of my comments. And I didn't say "**** you". Why ARE we "conservative rabid asserholes" (whatever that is)? You put out your opinions. We put out ours. Yeah, I think you're pretty misinformed because much of what you wrote isn't based on even the most rudimentary understanding of economics.
As for your dad, taxpayers would've saved most if these transit companies were privately owned. Then they'd have to sink or swim without taxpayers propping them up. Daddy didn't ALLOW them? Please! Why in the name of Heaven to liberals always have to be so damn holier than thou? Sometimes the lowest bidder isn't always the best choice. My husband works for a private semiconductor company. He maintains the machines, fixes problems, designs experiments, etc. and one of the things he's learned after almost 30 years in the industry is that sometimes it's better to pay more for quality. It will last longer and require less maintenance, thus saving the company more money in the long run.
I seriously hope you don't teach Literature, History, or Economics.
Oh, and Clinton's little episode on Fox...he looked like an angry, hysterical, defensive jackass. It's quite possible if he'd had the balls to pull the trigger 9/11 would never have happened. He had more than one opportunity. Was even offered OBL on a silver platter. Hell, even the little jug-eared Marxist in the White House had the balls to do what Clinton didn't.
As for the WMD, Bush did a terrible job defending himself but they did find a lot of nasty stuff. I remember one large cache they found and the left was complaining about it being shipped over here. Even the report filed by the Iraq Survey Group said so. Oh, and here's a portion of a declassified report (http://www.foxnews.com/projects/pdf/Iraq_WMD_Declassified.pdf) given to the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence by the National Ground Intelligence Center. Note the date...AFTER we'd gone into Iraq...the things that make you go hmmmmm...not to mention there is a body of evidence that suggests quite a bit of it went to Syria.
Even IF he didn't have so much as a thimble full, he'd broken every single agreement he made with the UN and was unwilling to allow inspections. At some point you've got to say enough is enough. 9/11 happened because Clinton proved to the world we were nothing but a paper tiger. And btw, it was the CLINTON justice department, NOT GW who linked Saddam to Al Qaeda via a law suit. Evidence was pretty compelling, as I recall. The press and the left made sure that was buried by the time we went into Iraq to finally enforce decades of pussified capitulation by the UN. They were too busy trying to convince the American people the war was lost (Harry Reid), men and women serving in Iraq were too stupid to do anything else (John Kerry...who served in Vietnam), or were knocking down doors and slaughtering innocent people in the dead of night (Barak Hussein 0bama...mmm...mmm...mmm) or murdering civilians in cold blood (Jack Murtha, who betrayed his own Corp...or corpse if you're using the new and improved pronunciation) in Haditha, which turned out to be a complete lie.
You are entitled to your own opinion, but not your own facts.
As for your not sticking around, if you can't take the heat...or defend yourself and your positions using facts (readily available via a google search usually) then you are going to get harassed.
Cindie
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Oh, I don't plan on sticking around here, it's too hostile. At least I tried to behave like an adult, but I see that I have encountered too many know-it-all's that throw more insults than substance.
My experiences....hmmmm. I once bought a silver engraved Soviet snuff box from Turkey. Nice Antique.
My perspective....hmmmm. The simple fact that this scenario is ridiculous:
[youtube=425,350]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fnd0qg4I_MM[/youtube]
Pretty much what I thought.
Don't let the door hit you on the way out.
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As for your dad, taxpayers would've saved most if these transit companies were privately owned. Then they'd have to sink or swim without taxpayers propping them up. Daddy didn't ALLOW them? Please! Why in the name of Heaven to liberals always have to be so damn holier than thou? Sometimes the lowest bidder isn't always the best choice. My husband works for a private semiconductor company. He maintains the machines, fixes problems, designs experiments, etc. and one of the things he's learned after almost 30 years in the industry is that sometimes it's better to pay more for quality. It will last longer and require less maintenance, thus saving the company more money in the long run.
Ok first of all you stupid, bitch, my father was a model civil servant. And I never said he went for the lowest bidder. In fact, he got the best quality for the lowest price with never being a battery incident in over 30 years on his watch.
Good for your husband. He worked in the private sector, hoorah. My father did a ton of good work for the city and could have made double in the private sector but loved working for the public and benefits.
In fact people like your husband, my Dad is their boss. Don't talk shit about my Dad again, ****.
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Ok first of all you stupid, bitch, my father was a model civil servant. And I never said he went for the lowest bidder. In fact, he got the best quality for the lowest price with never being a battery incident in over 30 years on his watch.
Good for your husband. He worked in the private sector, hoorah. My father did a ton of good work for the city and could have made double in the private sector but loved working for the public and benefits.
In fact people like your husband, my Dad is their boss. Don't talk shit about my Dad again, ****.
See ya, ****head.
Clean up, aisle 5....
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No more posts by me. I'm out. And good riddance.
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I have no idea why McCarthy was so crazy about communism.
There's actually some things that communism/ socialism can offer. Like cheap government produced steel, it will run at a net loss, but provides cheap steel throughout the country for cheaper manufacturing. Or universal healthcare.
Communism/Socialism doesn't automatically mean dictatorship or control over your life. I think it depends on the circumstances.
Capitalism really has nothing to do with our constitution. I'm actually convinced if the founding fathers saw how our markets and economy are today, they probably roll in their graves.
There are plenty of countries "experimenting" with that kind of thing. America doesn't have to be one of them. People want to come here because of our freedoms. Government owning the means of production takes away freedom. Just check the 0bama administration's arbitrary closings of car dealerships based on political affiliation. The more government control there is, the closer to tyranny a government becomes. If that kind of thing is important to you then there are plenty of countries that will accommodate you. Socialism was one of the first things tried here. Damned pilgrims kept dying off because some of the little ****ers refused to pull their weight. It wasn't until they were each provided their own plot of land and allowed to sink or swim on their own that this country started to be successful and productive.
Cindie
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Ok first of all you stupid, bitch, my father was a model civil servant. And I never said he went for the lowest bidder. In fact, he got the best quality for the lowest price with never being a battery incident in over 30 years on his watch.
Good for your husband. He worked in the private sector, hoorah. My father did a ton of good work for the city and could have made double in the private sector but loved working for the public and benefits.
In fact people like your husband, my Dad is their boss. Don't talk shit about my Dad again, ****.
No more posts by me. I'm out. And good riddance.
Happy to oblige.
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Happy to oblige.
Thank you LC, that poster has a lot of nerve walking into our HOME and using insults to our Family and friends.
We did not walk into his Home and call his father a bald headed bastard.
Just a very slight criticism of view on his Daddy's work by a female caused him to attack her and as part of OUR family, this was akin to picking him up by the back of his pants and throwing him into the street.
Again, thank you LC, I can just imagine what he would have called ME had I chimed in-----
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Appears I went to bed just when the party was getting started. Sorry I missed it.
Paulbot? Oh my yes.
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It's fun to watch how liberals and ronbots come here with all the niceties, try to play nice, and when their "facts" are challenged, they turn into sniveling little crybabies who want to take all their marbles and go home.
Calling Cindie the "C" word reveals his true character.
:bird:
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I just read that article. The author seems to feel that when Clinton was trying to broker a Israeli-Palestinian peace, it was counteractive to the issue. It kind of shows of how ignorant the author is since the Palestinian conflict is what inspires Jihadists the most to destroy American interests and people. Conservatives can say "wag the dog" when he shoots cruise missiles into Afghanistan, but then afterwards display him "ineffective" as the author describes.
Well, they've pulled the trigger on you so you're no longer an issue here, but I have to comment that your ignorance is staggering.
The premise of the article is, Billy Jeff was so consumed with HIMSELF and his political LEGACY that he couldn't be bothered to deal with terrorism beyond utter a few strong words, followed up by maybe a cruise missile attack or two.
Being ignorant is one thing, but being willfully ignorant is another thing altogether.
You will slink off into your own little wormhole where you will undoubtedly infest others with your pseudo-sense of pontifical pointlessness.
That's probably a good place for you to be -- until you decide to climb out of mommy's basement.
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Wow, what a dick.
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Appears I went to bed just when the party was getting started. Sorry I missed it.
Paulbot? Oh my yes.
I think he might have just been full on retard, fwiw. I don't think even the ronbots are stupid enough to advocate socializing production as a means of price control.
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I think he might have just been full on retard, fwiw. I don't think even the ronbots are stupid enough to advocate socializing production as a means of price control.
He was touting the usual 'communism was just not done right' talking points. He is no ronbot. He is a full on leftist.
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He was touting the usual 'communism was just not done right' talking points. He is no ronbot. He is a full on leftist.
Yup, that.
:stoner:
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I think I hit a nerve...called a bitch & a **** in one post. For an insult I didn't even make! I'm better than I thought!
Cindie
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I think I hit a nerve...called a bitch & a **** in one post. For an insult I didn't even make! I'm better than I thought!
Cindie
He's one of those sensitive artist types. You hurt his feelings.
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Well, they've pulled the trigger on you so you're no longer an issue here, but I have to comment that your ignorance is staggering.
The premise of the article is, Billy Jeff was so consumed with HIMSELF and his political LEGACY that he couldn't be bothered to deal with terrorism beyond utter a few strong words, followed up by maybe a cruise missile attack or two.
Being ignorant is one thing, but being willfully ignorant is another thing altogether.
You will slink off into your own little wormhole where you will undoubtedly infest others with your pseudo-sense of pontifical pointlessness.
That's probably a good place for you to be -- until you decide to climb out of mommy's basement.
He's gone? Oh drat! I was following this the other night when dunetard was on but it was bumping 100 degrees and I just wanted to turn in. My oh my the self styled academic wizards get so verklempt when they feel their intellect has been challenged, don't they?
I had a vision of him sitting in his domicile, not his parent's basement though. For some reason I pictured him in the attic apartment of his political science professor's home, unwelcome even at his parent's house during the summer between semesters. We don't send our kids off to college hating America and waving Chairman Mao's little red book but an awful lot of them wind up that way. Methinks dunetard is one of them, no longer willing to approach his backward conservative folks back home.
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Wow, what a dick.
I think I found his picture.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v645/lowfreeboard/dickyv.gif)
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If Dune's dad was a civil servant, thank you for your service. You worked for the taxpayers of your fine city,
and were duly compensated. You did a great job. Your son, however, is a stain on your family name.
He could not debate in civil manner, much less in a Sybil manner.
You should sit your son down and tell him that he is a master of what he says and a slave to what he has said.
He owes an honest and forthright apology to women for the lack of manners and using language that I'm
very sure his mother would not approve of.
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If Dune's dad was a civil servant, thank you for your service. You worked for the taxpayers of your fine city,
and were duly compensated. You did a great job. Your son, however, is a stain on your family name.
He could not debate in civil manner, much less in a Sybil manner.
You should sit your son down and tell him that he is a master of what he says and a slave to what he has said.
He owes an honest and forthright apology to women for the lack of manners and using language that I'm
very sure his mother would not approve of."Sybil". :lmao: I beleive you are correct, Sir. His mother would rightly be offended and embarrassed. ^!
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I think he might have just been full on retard, fwiw. I don't think even the ronbots are stupid enough to advocate socializing production as a means of price control.
I find that most ronbots from the blue states are hard core leftists who embrace isolationism (which he clearly does).
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I find that most ronbots from the blue states are hard core leftists who embrace isolationism (which he clearly does).
Sounds a lot like a certain Ronulan from a former board we posted at, eh? Although thankfully, the little drooling moron of which I speak has been quiet thus far, but it's still early.
Damn, I take a couple of days off to spend working around the house and have some quality time with the family, and this loser comes in and shits on the carpet, AND scoots on it? And calling Cindie out like that?
Dearest, I think our ex-troll might have been a Julia Stiles fan, if not Julia herself.
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Ok first of all you stupid, bitch, my father was a model civil servant. And I never said he went for the lowest bidder. In fact, he got the best quality for the lowest price with never being a battery incident in over 30 years on his watch.
Good for your husband. He worked in the private sector, hoorah. My father did a ton of good work for the city and could have made double in the private sector but loved working for the public and benefits.
In fact people like your husband, my Dad is their boss. Don't talk shit about my Dad again, ****.
What's your problem? :mental:
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What's your problem? :mental:
Other than the fact he couldn't get laid in a women's prison with a carton of smokes and fistful of Roofies?
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Ok, let's be super clear who I am referring to. I am NOT referring to the drug addict, or the guy with the back disc problem who is a little depressed. Not referring to SSI, and SSDI.
I am referring to those with severe autism, downs syndrome, CP, and other debilitating disabilities. Those who CANNOT live on their own. Those with a functioning capability of a toddler. Those people.
Without Medicaid they would be forced into institutions:
http://www.thearc.org/page.aspx?pid=3232
I am a fiscal conservative who strongly believes that safety nets should be funded for these specific individuals -- our most fragile residents of our country.
Medicaid needs a major overhaul -- that is for certain. However it is the person with severe disabilities who seems to be the ones who suffers, while the deadbeat losers of society don't miss a check.
I'm on SSI. I don't consider myself to be a deadbeat loser after having my wealth confiscated every week from my paycheck for 25 years. Well that would be except for those months I was out on state disability due to a seizure disorder related to a cerebral AVM. A prenatal medical condition that wasn't discovered until I was 27 years old, although it had impacted my life quite a few times prior to that but I had no idea what was happening.
The impact on my personal finances between my 27th and 34th year was devastating. It was extremely detrimental to any career I began. How my marriage survived during the approximately 4 year bureaucratic process is beyond me.
All that for the princely sum of $1100/month.
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Other than the fact he couldn't get laid in a women's prison with a carton of smokes and fistful of Roofies?
That explains.
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Isn't it past time for this son of a bitch to be gone?
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Sounds a lot like a certain Ronulan from a former board we posted at, eh? Although thankfully, the little drooling moron of which I speak has been quiet thus far, but it's still early.
Damn, I take a couple of days off to spend working around the house and have some quality time with the family, and this loser comes in and shits on the carpet, AND scoots on it? And calling Cindie out like that?
Dearest, I think our ex-troll might have been a Julia Stiles fan, if not Julia herself.
Oh it doesn't bother me, I'm wearing my big girl panties. Some men are just sexist pigs and can't stand being shown up by a girl. I have to admit I was kinda surprised at the vitriol, especially since my comment was directed to him and not his father.
Cindie
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Ex-troll?
I think not. He's an all inclusive troll.
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I'm on SSI. I don't consider myself to be a deadbeat loser after having my wealth confiscated every week from my paycheck for 25 years. Well that would be except for those months I was out on state disability due to a seizure disorder related to a cerebral AVM. A prenatal medical condition that wasn't discovered until I was 27 years old, although it had impacted my life quite a few times prior to that but I had no idea what was happening.
The impact on my personal finances between my 27th and 34th year was devastating. It was extremely detrimental to any career I began. How my marriage survived during the approximately 4 year bureaucratic process is beyond me.
All that for the princely sum of $1100/month.
SSI is for indigent who have not worked, or have not worked long enough for SSDI.
SSDI is for those who have paid into SS and become disabled.
The safety net I refer to is for those who are severely impacted with a cognitive disability (either by IQ or functional IQ), and/or are medically fragile.
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Sounds a lot like a certain Ronulan from a former board we posted at, eh? Although thankfully, the little drooling moron of which I speak has been quiet thus far, but it's still early.
Damn, I take a couple of days off to spend working around the house and have some quality time with the family, and this loser comes in and shits on the carpet, AND scoots on it? And calling Cindie out like that?
Dearest, I think our ex-troll might have been a Julia Stiles fan, if not Julia herself.
They are coming around, you are right about that.
I think Scoobie brought the 100 degree weather with her, I hope she brought us an easy winter this year too (yeah I know, ain't happening).
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SSI is for indigent who have not worked, or have not worked long enough for SSDI.
SSDI is for those who have paid into SS and become disabled.
The safety net I refer to is for those who are severely impacted with a cognitive disability (either by IQ or functional IQ), and/or are medically fragile.
I worked a "real job" from age 16 to age 41. I'm almost positive all paperwork/payments are listed as SSI. Could it be SSDI? Possibly but it would surprise me.
There was a point I forgot to make in my comment to you. My response to you was based on a singular aspect of what you wrote. I, in no way, shape or form, have any intellectual, political or philosophical association or agreement with the original poster. Just wanted to make that absolutely clear.
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I worked a "real job" from age 16 to age 41. I'm almost positive all paperwork/payments are listed as SSI. Could it be SSDI? Possibly but it would surprise me.
There was a point I forgot to make in my comment to you. My response to you was based on a singular aspect of what you wrote. I, in no way, shape or form, have any intellectual, political or philosophical association or agreement with the original poster. Just wanted to make that absolutely clear.
You definitely qualify for SSDI and the amount you are getting probably indicates that is what you are getting (I don't think SSI is that much, but unsure).
I have a son with severe autism - so services for children/adults with severe disabilities I am well versed with, and I am highly involved in advocacy work in this field.
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You definitely qualify for SSDI and the amount you are getting probably indicates that is what you are getting (I don't think SSI is that much, but unsure).
I have a son with severe autism - so services for children/adults with severe disabilities I am well versed with, and I am highly involved in advocacy work in this field.
I've witnessed a bit of what you go through. I dated a woman with a severely autistic daughter and prior to my medical condition becoming symptomatic, I drove a school bus for autistic children. I understand the challenges that you and other parents of special needs children face every minute of the day.
That's why it pisses me off to no end this government will spend billions importing poverty from the Third World, while native born Americans struggle. I made contributions to the Great Ponzi scheme in the Capitol, so it's not an entitlement. I would have much preferred to have invested my money where I would have made a better return.