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Author Topic: I can't wait for the first red state to opt out!  (Read 1861 times)

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Offline CC27

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I can't wait for the first red state to opt out!
« on: October 26, 2009, 05:29:59 PM »
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Yes We Did  Donating Member  (1000+ posts)  Journal  Click to send private message to this author  Click to view this author's profile  Click to add this author to your buddy list  Click to add this author to your Ignore list      Mon Oct-26-09 05:22 PM
Original message
I can't wait for the first red state to opt out!
   
I just can't wait.

Why?

Because, assuming the PO works, in the following election cycle you are going to see the biggest state by state shift in the history of this country.

I want to see the republican party explain to their constituents why they decided that they are not worthy of affordable health coverage when all the "blue states" have it and are getting the coverage they deserve and need.

One Cycle.

That's it.

One election cycle and you will see every red state that opts out turn bright bright blue.

I can't wait.

 :whatever:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x8716861
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Offline franksolich

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Re: I can't wait for the first red state to opt out!
« Reply #1 on: October 26, 2009, 05:31:38 PM »
Myself, I can't wait either.

If Nebraska opts out, maybe the few primitives--and yes, we have them, even in the Sandhills--will just pack up and move to a blue state, making life here much more tolerable.
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Offline diesel driver

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Re: I can't wait for the first red state to opt out!
« Reply #2 on: October 26, 2009, 05:32:43 PM »
They don't call them DUmmies for nothing....  :hammer:

They can't seem to figure anything out past their next bong hit....  :mental:

They can't see the forest for the trees, but they don't care, they like trees.... :thatsright:
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Offline Tantal

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Re: I can't wait for the first red state to opt out!
« Reply #3 on: October 26, 2009, 05:33:42 PM »
People are kidding themselves if they actually think that there's going to be an opt-out provision. Oh, I'm sure you'll be able to opt out of the services, but you WILL NOT be able to opt out of the taxation necessary to support our government's latest, greatest pyramid scheme.
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Re: I can't wait for the first red state to opt out!
« Reply #4 on: October 26, 2009, 05:34:09 PM »
Quote from: franksolich on October 26, 2009, 05:31:38 PM
Myself, I can't wait either.

If Nebraska opts out, maybe the few primitives--and yes, we have them, even in the Sandhills--will just pack up and move to a blue state, making life here much more tolerable.

I hope Virginia does too....

The libs would flee the cities and east coast faster than the rats fled the Titanic....
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Murphy's 3rd Law:  "You can't make anything 'idiot DUmmie proof'.  The world will just create a better idiot DUmmie."

Liberals are like Slinkys.  Basically useless, but they do bring a smile to your face when you push them down a flight of stairs...
 
Global warming supporters believe that a few hundred million tons of CO2 has more control over our climate than a million mile in diameter, unshielded thermo-nuclear fusion reactor at the middle of the solar system.

"A dead enemy is a peaceful enemy.  Blessed be the peacemakers". - U.S. Marine Corp

You can't fix stupid, but you can vote it out of office.

Offline diesel driver

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Re: I can't wait for the first red state to opt out!
« Reply #5 on: October 26, 2009, 05:36:28 PM »
Quote from: Tantal on October 26, 2009, 05:33:42 PM
People are kidding themselves if they actually think that there's going to be an opt-out provision. Oh, I'm sure you'll be able to opt out of the services, but you WILL NOT be able to opt out of the taxation necessary to support our government's latest, greatest pyramid scheme.

They COULD, on a state by state basis, but it would require a governor with the cahones to intercept the taxes going to DC, and back it up with the force of the National Guard, if necessary....
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Murphy's 3rd Law:  "You can't make anything 'idiot DUmmie proof'.  The world will just create a better idiot DUmmie."

Liberals are like Slinkys.  Basically useless, but they do bring a smile to your face when you push them down a flight of stairs...
 
Global warming supporters believe that a few hundred million tons of CO2 has more control over our climate than a million mile in diameter, unshielded thermo-nuclear fusion reactor at the middle of the solar system.

"A dead enemy is a peaceful enemy.  Blessed be the peacemakers". - U.S. Marine Corp

You can't fix stupid, but you can vote it out of office.

Offline franksolich

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Re: I can't wait for the first red state to opt out!
« Reply #6 on: October 26, 2009, 05:39:14 PM »
Quote from: Tantal on October 26, 2009, 05:33:42 PM
People are kidding themselves if they actually think that there's going to be an opt-out provision. Oh, I'm sure you'll be able to opt out of the services, but you WILL NOT be able to opt out of the taxation necessary to support our government's latest, greatest pyramid scheme.

Now, that's what worries me.

No opting out unless one also gets to opt out of paying for the thing.

It's sort of like with Bo's now-failed stimulus plan, in which Republicans and conservatives got raked for their "hypocrisy," because they were against the unstimulating plan, but at the same time hankered to get as much of it as they could.

Of course, this was nothing more than accepting political reality.  We didn't want Bo's "largesse," but on the other hand even if we didn't take it, we were going to have to pay for it.  And since we were going to have to pay for it, we might as well grab our share of it.

I'm all in favor of opting out of things.....provided one doesn't have to pay for them too.
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Offline Tantal

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Re: I can't wait for the first red state to opt out!
« Reply #7 on: October 26, 2009, 05:40:36 PM »
Quote from: diesel driver on October 26, 2009, 05:36:28 PM
They COULD, on a state by state basis, but it would require a governor with the cahones to intercept the taxes going to DC, and back it up with the force of the National Guard, if necessary....
I'm quite aware of that. The government will grease all of the necessary palms to ensure our complete enslavement.
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Offline thundley4

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Re: I can't wait for the first red state to opt out!
« Reply #8 on: October 26, 2009, 05:44:52 PM »
Quote from: Tantal on October 26, 2009, 05:33:42 PM
People are kidding themselves if they actually think that there's going to be an opt-out provision. Oh, I'm sure you'll be able to opt out of the services, but you WILL NOT be able to opt out of the taxation necessary to support our government's latest, greatest pyramid scheme.

But, but Dear Leader has promised this to be revenue neutral and to not lead to increased taxes.  Did he lie mislead us?
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Offline ReardenSteel

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Re: I can't wait for the first red state to opt out!
« Reply #9 on: October 26, 2009, 06:05:08 PM »
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moondust  (1000+ posts)      Mon Oct-26-09 06:08 PM
Response to Original message
10. Not so sure.
 Reform/PO/single payer is a no-brainer as most anyone in all the other western democracies will tell you. Opposition to it is therefore not based in reality but is rather almost entirely political/ideological. The blind supporters of the "Party of No" may just keep blindly saying NO.

What I'm waiting for is to see how many of that first state's poor and uninsured/uninsurable pack up and leave that state for greener pastures where the public option is offered.


Yeah, State's hate to lose their non-tax paying residents/burdens. What's funny is they don't seem to get that some people would be moving out of "blue States" to get into the "red States" with equal speed. Which people? Well, doctors for one.

But will shall never see the above occur. I agree with the posters who wisely note there will likely be no "opt out" of paying the bills.
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Offline TheSarge

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Re: I can't wait for the first red state to opt out!
« Reply #10 on: October 26, 2009, 06:26:13 PM »
The opt out clause is a trap.

There's no way that the Feds will support something that wouldn't force people and states to swallow the public option.

Any states that opt out will still have to fund the states that do...and get none of the benefits.  Not to mention that the government has the "ball" so they make the rules...they will set their premiums so low that there will be no one left who actually wants private insurance.
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Offline thundley4

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Re: I can't wait for the first red state to opt out!
« Reply #11 on: October 26, 2009, 06:30:10 PM »
Quote from: TxRadioguy on October 26, 2009, 06:26:13 PM
The opt out clause is a trap.

There's no way that the Feds will support something that wouldn't force people and states to swallow the public option.

Any states that opt out will still have to fund the states that do...and get none of the benefits.  Not to mention that the government has the "ball" so they make the rules...they will set their premiums so low that there will be no one left who actually wants private insurance.

Of course. Single payer with appropriate tax increases to gain more control of the citizenry is the desired goal.  That is also why the penalties for businesses not providing insurance are lower than providing insurance.
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Offline BlueStateSaint

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Re: I can't wait for the first red state to opt out!
« Reply #12 on: October 26, 2009, 06:31:26 PM »
Quote from: TxRadioguy on October 26, 2009, 06:26:13 PM
The opt out clause is a trap.

There's no way that the Feds will support something that wouldn't force people and states to swallow the public option.

Any states that opt out will still have to fund the states that do...and get none of the benefits.  Not to mention that the government has the "ball" so they make the rules...they will set their premiums so low that there will be no one left who actually wants private insurance.

Thing is, when the Republicans take back the House in 2010, the 2011 budget will have no monies for it.  All spending legislation, according to the Constitution, has to originate in the House.  Then, when the Republicans retake the Senate with 60+ Republican Senators in 2012, and the White House, the remnant of the Obamination can go away.

That is, if the public option, and the other elements of the "reform," pass SCOTUS muster.  My money is on the whole thing being declared unconstitutional.
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Offline The Village Idiot

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Re: I can't wait for the first red state to opt out!
« Reply #13 on: October 26, 2009, 10:52:54 PM »
There is no opt out....

of paying for it.
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Offline Lacarnut

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Re: I can't wait for the first red state to opt out!
« Reply #14 on: October 27, 2009, 12:06:35 AM »
Quote from: TxRadioguy on October 26, 2009, 06:26:13 PM
The opt out clause is a trap.

There's no way that the Feds will support something that wouldn't force people and states to swallow the public option.

Any states that opt out will still have to fund the states that do...and get none of the benefits.  Not to mention that the government has the "ball" so they make the rules...they will set their premiums so low that there will be no one left who actually wants private insurance.

Opt out is a gimmick. Even if the Feds would allow it, a Governor that opts out would cut his constituents throats by having to fund their health care not once but twice. That plan is just smoke and mirrors to confuse the issue.   
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Offline debk

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Re: I can't wait for the first red state to opt out!
« Reply #15 on: October 27, 2009, 12:09:29 AM »
Somehow I would think Tn will opt out....we've already got a state health plan that keeps the state bordering on bankruptcy...
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Offline AllosaursRus

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Re: I can't wait for the first red state to opt out!
« Reply #16 on: October 27, 2009, 12:45:55 AM »
Quote from: franksolich on October 26, 2009, 05:31:38 PM
Myself, I can't wait either.

If Nebraska opts out, maybe the few primitives--and yes, we have them, even in the Sandhills--will just pack up and move to a blue state, making life here much more tolerable.

Idaho will opt out I GuaranDamnTeeYa!!!!!!! We don't have enough "hippees" here to roll a joint! Course we have plenty of RedNecks that can!

My healthcare won't change. You DUmbasses can stand in line all you want!

Canadians come down here to get our healthcare, and these DImwhits still think healthcare will be plentiful if they pull this off. Where the **** are you goin' to get the frikkin' doctors, idiots?

Doctors will flock to the states that opt out! You DUmmies are goin' to DIE for lack of POOR healthcare! ESAD!!!

I'm goin' to luv every minute when you start cryin' and try to move to my state. I double dog dare ya to move into Idaho! We'll see how "Bad" ya all are! Bwahahahahahahahahaha!!!!!!!!11111!!!!!!!! my best evil laugh!

ETA: just take a look at a red/blue map of counties in Idaho, if ya don't think I know what ahm talkin' 'bout!
« Last Edit: October 27, 2009, 12:49:41 AM by AllosaursRus »
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Offline Ralph Wiggum

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Re: I can't wait for the first red state to opt out!
« Reply #17 on: October 27, 2009, 12:56:09 AM »
Quote from: Tantal on October 26, 2009, 05:33:42 PM
People are kidding themselves if they actually think that there's going to be an opt-out provision. Oh, I'm sure you'll be able to opt out of the services, but you WILL NOT be able to opt out of the taxation necessary to support our government's latest, greatest pyramid scheme.

Wait, what?  We can't opt out of paying more taxes?
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Offline AllosaursRus

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Re: I can't wait for the first red state to opt out!
« Reply #18 on: October 27, 2009, 01:00:12 AM »
Quote from: TxRadioguy on October 26, 2009, 06:26:13 PM
The opt out clause is a trap.

There's no way that the Feds will support something that wouldn't force people and states to swallow the public option.

Any states that opt out will still have to fund the states that do...and get none of the benefits.  Not to mention that the government has the "ball" so they make the rules...they will set their premiums so low that there will be no one left who actually wants private insurance.

This actually depemnds on how many states and their populations for it to work. If enough states stand up against it, citing the constituition, I believe we could pull it off!

Kinda like askin' Bella Pelosi, "Where is your Constitutional power to force Americans to buy anything?"! So far, the Sup[remes could sure as hell throw a wrench in the works. I want one, just one of these asshats to show me where they have this kind of power.

I'll certainly opt out, even if my state doesn't. Then I will barricade myself and wait for the Feds to come "see" me! Ever heard of Randy Weaver? That whole cluster **** happened about 15 miles from my house! There are plenty of us here that they're going to have to take by force.
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Offline BlueStateSaint

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Re: I can't wait for the first red state to opt out!
« Reply #19 on: October 27, 2009, 04:20:20 AM »
I've heard that 45% of all doctors today would "opt out" . . . and stop practicing medicine.
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Offline Tantal

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Re: I can't wait for the first red state to opt out!
« Reply #20 on: October 27, 2009, 07:50:01 AM »
Quote from: AllosaursRus on October 27, 2009, 01:00:12 AM
This actually depemnds on how many states and their populations for it to work. If enough states stand up against it, citing the constituition, I believe we could pull it off!

Which will only give them the excuse they need to just tax us through the nose and go straight single-payer. If the Supreme Court will uphold Social Security, a retirement plan, as being Constitutional, why not a health care plan? We are slowly becoming economic slaves. The DUmmies don't mind because they can't wipe their own asses without 'assistance' and/or a toilet paper subsidy.
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Offline Chump

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Re: I can't wait for the first red state to opt out!
« Reply #21 on: October 27, 2009, 08:46:16 AM »
Eenteresting.  This DUmmie ostensibly believes the citizens of these red states, liberal and conservative alike, will suffer if said state "opts out."  And yet, he firmly encourages this suffering if it leads to a favorable political outcome for his party.  Odd, too, to see a DUmmie arguing for state sovereignty if it also leads to a favorable political outcome for his party.  A DUmmie compromising on his "principles" for the sake of an ideology.  Knock me over with a feather.   :whatever:
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Offline thundley4

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Re: I can't wait for the first red state to opt out!
« Reply #22 on: October 27, 2009, 09:03:59 AM »
Quote
The Divided States of Health Care
Where do those without health insurance live?

The Census Bureau sought to find that out, for the first time, in a survey taken last year and released in September. Over all, it found that 9.9 percent of children lack any health insurance, half the rate for adults under 65.

But there was widespread variation in coverage. Children in Texas, the state with the least health insurance, are more than eight times as likely not to have it than children in Massachusetts, the state with the broadest coverage.

Those who lack health insurance now are far more likely to live in states that usually vote Republican — the states whose senators and representatives are least likely to support a law to extend coverage.

*snip*
That would seem to indicate that Republican constituents are the ones who would most benefit from passage of universal health insurance coverage. But an analysis of Congressional districts within those states indicates that those without health insurance are much more likely to live in strongly Democratic Congressional districts. Many of those contain large minority populations with relatively low incomes.

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Offline The Village Idiot

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Re: I can't wait for the first red state to opt out!
« Reply #23 on: October 27, 2009, 09:06:48 AM »
Quote from: BlueStateSaint on October 27, 2009, 04:20:20 AM
I've heard that 45% of all doctors today would "opt out" . . . and stop practicing medicine.

Thats how many said they would consider it
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Offline The Village Idiot

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Re: I can't wait for the first red state to opt out!
« Reply #24 on: October 27, 2009, 09:08:04 AM »
Quote from: debk on October 27, 2009, 12:09:29 AM
Somehow I would think Tn will opt out....we've already got a state health plan that keeps the state bordering on bankruptcy...

Unfortunately, your thinking like a logical well-adjusted person. In truth the state-like many large corporations, cannot wait to dump their liabilities on the federal taxpayers.
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