one primitive takes another primitive to the woodshed over Obumblecare

[BattleHymn]

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1251390639


Two no-name primitives go at each other in this thread.  In one corner is the antigop primitive, and in the other is the smittynmo primitive.  Fight!!:

Tue Dec 16, 2014, 11:58 AM
SmittynMo (1,454 posts)

Obamacare (ACA) is working fine for us. What about you?

Last edited Wed Dec 24, 2014, 08:29 AM - Edit history (1)

How many of you out there are pleased with your ACA to date?

Background: Me: 60, wife 62. I am still unemployed, and continue to look for work and she retired in August this year. Our new annual income will be 35k, if I do not find a job.

Facts for us:
2014 information
Total income: 62K
ACA cost to us(after tax credits): 555 a month for a 1200 plan.

2015 information
Total income: 35K
ACA cost to us(after tax credits): 341 a month for a 1200 plan.

To date, we are very pleased with our plan. Our doctors are covered, our drugs are cheaper, and this year the price went down due to her retirement. I don't know what we would have done without the ACA. We still have to transfer money each month to cover the bills, and will continue to, until I retire in 20 months. Once I retire, that pain will go away. So, yes, considering the circumstances we are under right now, we are both quite pleased by the ACA. This move alone by Obama, was well worth the votes we gave him. And I'm sure millions of others will agree

Tue Dec 16, 2014, 01:32 PM
antigop (10,386 posts)
5. oh, how convenient! You stayed just under 400% FPL-- a little bit more income in 2014 and you

wouldn't have received ANY subsidy.

http://www.correntewire.com/obamacare_at_400_poverty_you_can_be_on_the_hook_for_10000_more

Tue Dec 16, 2014, 01:33 PM
antigop (10,386 posts)
6. and I notice you didn't mention what you deductible is, did you? nt

Tue Dec 16, 2014, 01:38 PM
antigop (10,386 posts)
7. and what is your out-of-pocket limit (if any) if you have to go out-of-network? nt

Tue Dec 16, 2014, 01:44 PM
antigop (10,386 posts)
9. and did you check to see that every possible doctor you would POSSIBLY need is in-network?

Do you know EXACTLY what illness/injuries you will get next year so you have in-network doctors and hospitals who can treat you for any possible type of illness/injury you get in 2015?

Tue Dec 16, 2014, 03:27 PM
SmittynMo (1,454 posts)
10. I pay gazillions for my deductible.

What deductibles do you have? Does it really matter? To some degree, yes. However, some insurance is better than NO insurance. Right now it's affordable for what we need. Working it until 65.

Tue Dec 16, 2014, 04:24 PM
antigop (10,386 posts)
11. Yes, it matters -- if people can't afford the deductibles, then they really can't afford to get sick

And if you have an UNLIMITED max out of pocket of out-of-network,then what's the point of having insurance?

It does you no good to have insurance you can't afford to use.

It may be "affordable" for what you need -- for now -- IF you don't get sick or IF you don't have a MAJOR illness or injury.

Tue Dec 16, 2014, 04:25 PM
antigop (10,386 posts)
12. so what's your deductible and your max out of pocket for out of network? HMMMMMM????nt

Wed Dec 17, 2014, 09:12 AM
SmittynMo (1,454 posts)
14. My real deductibles are

6k for major medical. The normal deductibles(PCP, ER, etc) are reasonable. However, you will see across the nation that deductibles going up. It's the only way the insurance companies can, in theory, still make money. No plan is perfect, including the ACA. When was the last time anyone actually paid 0 for insurance, 0 deductibles? 1980's? I will say this. If it weren't for the ACA, there is no way that I could afford 1250 a month for coverage that I may or may not use. It's at least nice to have some sort of safety net. Obama saved our bacon. If the GOP would have been in there, millions of people, including myself would be screwed. Why any nation, especially the richest nation in the world, would NOT want health care for it's people blows me away.

Wed Dec 17, 2014, 09:49 AM
antigop (10,386 posts)
15. you didn't mention your max out of pocket did you? And can you AFFORD $6,000 per year every year

if you get a chronic condition? Most people wouldn't.

If does you no good to have insurance that doesn't help you for a major accident, major illness, or chronic illness.


So big deal. You have insurance that really doesn't protect you.

Wed Dec 17, 2014, 02:00 PM
antigop (10,386 posts)
21. so why the silence, Smitty? Why not tell us your out-of-pocket for in network and out of network?

And can you afford a $6,000 deductible every year until Medicare?

Do you not know? That's pretty scary if you don't even know what your risk is.

Do you not want to admit that you couldn't afford the in and out of network out-of-pocket if something happened to you and/or your spouse?

Are you in denial?

Why the silence? Perhaps it's because your ACA plan really doesn't provide the protection you think it does?

Thu Dec 18, 2014, 09:03 AM
SmittynMo (1,454 posts)
23. You're starting to become a

thorn in my azz. I do not have to disclose any more information than I already have, and have no intention of doing so. The bottom line, is I'm happy with my coverage, considering the circumstances I'm in. So you're name is "AntiGOP", and sound/act like "ProGOP". WOW.
Please go troll elsewhere.

Thu Dec 18, 2014, 09:49 AM
antigop (10,386 posts)
24. I'm just asking a question you refuse to answer. How can you be "happy" with your coverage if...

1) You don't even know what your max out-of-pocket is for in-network or out-of-network?
If you don't know, then you don't even know your risk.

or

2) You DO know what your max out-of-pocket is, but are in denial because you wouldn't be able to handle it if something major happened to your or your spouse. (In which case, your coverage really doesn't protect you.)

Nice going, btw. When you won't answer the questions asked, call someone a "troll". Yep.

I find it really interesting that you tout your "affordable premiums" but refuse to share what your out-of-network maximums are and refuse to answer whether you can handle your deductibles for both you and your wife each year. Maybe because they're not affordable and it wouldn't fit your narrative?

Another primitive steps in to try to defend:

Tue Dec 23, 2014, 10:55 PM
Star Member csziggy (17,309 posts)
36. Maybe they don't want to answer because it's none of your business

Tue Dec 23, 2014, 11:19 PM
antigop (10,386 posts)
37. HA! He'll share his income but not his max out-of-pocket!

And he probably won't share it because it doesn't fit his narrative.

Thu Dec 18, 2014, 09:58 AM
antigop (10,386 posts)
25. I'd like to thank the OP for the opportunity to warn people that it's not just premiums

People need to look at their deductibles and max out-of-pocket for both in-network and out-of-network before they can call their coverage "affordable".

Having insurance you can't afford to use doesn't protect you.

Thu Dec 18, 2014, 11:33 AM
antigop (10,386 posts)
28. YOU HAVE TO LOOK AT THE MAX OUT-OF-POCKET NOT JUST THE DEDUCTIBLES

Yes, I am shouting because people don't seem to realize that it's not just the premiums, and not just deductibles.

What is your max out-of-pocket for both in-network and out-of-network?

Read and understand the following article: PLEASE! READ IT!
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/10/19/your-money/out-of-network-not-by-choice-and-facing-huge-health-bills.html

Thu Dec 18, 2014, 11:40 AM
Nay (7,363 posts)
29. No need to shout. They can cover their deductibles and out of pocket, but

a major illness would require us to help them with whatever their plan doesn't pay for, whether it's deductible or out of pocket. We can handle that.

Thu Dec 18, 2014, 11:50 AM
antigop (10,386 posts)
30. Did you read the article? Do you understand that their out-of-network costs could be unlimited?

Do you really understand this?

Do you really understand what you max in-network out-of-pocket and your max out-of-network out-of-pocket really are? Do you really understand your risk?

What is the max out-of-pocket (in and out of network) on their plan?

Thu Dec 18, 2014, 11:45 PM
SmittynMo (1,454 posts)
31. Unbelievable!!!!

You have persistently made your point, from many different views. So TY, now that all of us uneducated completely understand, that we're totally screwed.

So what's your answer on how to fix this critical issue? Trash the ACA? Scrap it? It's working for many families, including myself. And it was never intended to cover everyone. It's a start, and it works for me and my wife. We as a country need to get to the point of national healthcare, and we have to start somewhere.

Note: I also have very low deductibles for PCP, ER, drugs, etc.. No, I'm not telling you the deductibles, so don't ask.

Fri Dec 19, 2014, 11:50 AM
magical thyme (9,640 posts)
32. it doesn't work well for me.

My one p/t job offers health insurance at a cost that leaves me right at the border of qualifying for a subsidy. Too close for comfort, since my other p/t job is per diem so I can't reliably predict my income from that, and frankly I prefer it higher to lower. So that leaves me with a choice of insurance through the p/t job or penalty.

The insurance they offer is through Harvard Health. Some years ago when I had insurance through Harvard Health's HMO I became seriously -- and quite obviously -- ill. In all likelihood I was septic. They left me to die, refusing to even run a single test. I got all my care out of pocket and survived.

Last year I ended the year with just a few hundred dollars in the bank. This year, with just a couple thousand which, had I not chosen the penalty, would have all gone to paying for insurance and left me again with just a few hundred in the bank to pay for any health care I actually needed.

So for the 2nd year, I am choosing the penalty. Fortunately I am healthy and have some money available should I need some health care.

If I need a lot of health care, I'll be bankrupted or dead, but that's the case with or without insurance, in my experience.

Fri Dec 19, 2014, 07:05 PM
antigop (10,386 posts)
34. I doubt it's really "working" for the person who started the thread --- unless he stays healthy

It really doesn't provide protection, so it's rather interesting that he would claim it's "working".

Wed Dec 24, 2014, 08:28 AM
SmittynMo (1,454 posts)
45. Mr ANTIgop is a

troll for the GOP. His comments are irrational and ignorant to the subject matter. And he's apparently out there to try to stir it up. It amazes me how stupid and ignorant people can really be.

NEXT!!!!!

Wed Dec 24, 2014, 12:39 PM
antigop (10,386 posts)
49. Not classy, Smitty. When you won't answer the questions asked, call someone a "troll". Yep.

How does the smitty primitive finally solve his dilemma?  What all good leftists do when something doesn't fit their narrative:

Thu Dec 25, 2014, 09:46 AM
SmittynMo (1,454 posts)
56. Thanks for posting

I didn't realize the "iggy" option was available. Done deal. Thanks.

The entire thread is really worth seeing.  It's a hoot. 

[Delmar]

Response to csziggy (Reply #54)Fri Dec 26, 2014, 04:49 AM
Star Member Skittles (97,304 posts)
62. he's read that kind of stuff many times

DUers who say their insurance is great but seem to have never used it / lack awarenss of the actual details[/quote]

It's like the POS used car salesman put the cheerleading DUmmies in some kind of trance.

[DumbAss Tanker]

A bit over 10% of your income for an insurance policy that leaves you on the hook for six grand.  Such a deal.

[I_B_Perky]

So SmittynMo was one of the winners.  Whoop-dee-doo.

Hey dummie? Do you know that "subsidize" means money was taken from someone else, by force or threat of force, and given to you? Any other circumstance that would be considered robbery or theft and a crime.

I bet you are so damn proud!   

[98ZJUSMC]

Background: Me: 60, wife 62. I am still unemployed, and continue to look for work and she retired in August this year. Our new annual income will be 35k, if I do not find a job.

Facts for us:
2014 information
Total income: 62K
ACA cost to us(after tax credits): 555 a month for a 1200 plan.

2015 information
Total income: 35K
ACA cost to us(after tax credits): 341 a month for a 1200 plan.

To date, we are very pleased with our plan. Our doctors are covered, our drugs are cheaper, and this year the price went down due to her retirement. I don't know what we would have done without the ACA. We still have to transfer money each month to cover the bills, and will continue to, until I retire in 20 months.

Retiring from unemployment?

Tue Dec 23, 2014, 10:55 PM
Star Member csziggy (17,309 posts)
36. Maybe they don't want to answer because it's none of your business

Tue Dec 23, 2014, 11:19 PM
antigop (10,386 posts)
37. HA! He'll share his income but not his max out-of-pocket!

And he probably won't share it because it doesn't fit his narrative.

[tanstaafl]

I don't recall that there was any talk of deductibles before Obamacare.

[txradioguy]

SmitrynMo sounds like a commercial for the ACA.

A mole from the Ministry of Information who is there with all the pre approved Government answers to the harsh truths of this train wreck.

[obumazombie]

Under no circumstances will any lib in good standing admit that owebumacare is an abysmal failure.

[Texacon]

I love those threads. They put the failures of O'bamacare on full display for the rest if the DUmmies. They canNOT answer the tough questions and the ignore option becomes their friend rather quickly. Can't let the truth get out!  Oops.

KC

[Conservative Libertarian]

0bamacare is a train wreck for sure.

My niece works for a large grocery chain that has union employees. When they updated their insurance policies for 0bamacare compliance, there were many union members getting the shaft first hand.

First, They did keep the premium similar and it is subsidized by the employer. My niece only has to pay ~$20 month for herself. Not all that bad until you read the rest.

Second, their policy would cover children but no longer cover spouses. One of her coworkers mainly worked there so her family could have good  health insurance because her husband was self-employed. It is not uncommon for a spouse to do this. However, now, they have to get a separate policy for her husband or he will get hit with a fine.

Third, they increased the deductible from $500 per person to $6,000. Why even have insurance if it will only start to pay after $6,000?

Fourth, the catastrophic maximum was ~$8,000 and is now $12,000.

Fifth, do you have to do the math on this coverage. Most of the employees at this union place of employment start at minimum wage $7.25 per hour and most make under $15 per hour. This insurance is as bad as not having insurance. Of course, there is union dues ($5-10) taken out of every check and the first 10 paychecks have an extra $10 taken out to pay the initiation fee of becoming a union member.


Isn't 0bamacare a wonderful!

[zeitgeist]

0bamacare is a train wreck for sure.

My niece works for a large grocery chain that has union employees. When they updated their insurance policies for 0bamacare compliance, there were many union members getting the shaft first hand.

First, They did keep the premium similar and it is subsidized by the employer. My niece only has to pay ~$20 month for herself. Not all that bad until you read the rest.

Second, their policy would cover children but no longer cover spouses. One of her coworkers mainly worked there so her family could have good  health insurance because her husband was self-employed. It is not uncommon for a spouse to do this. However, now, they have to get a separate policy for her husband or he will get hit with a fine.

Third, they increased the deductible from $500 per person to $6,000. Why even have insurance if it will only start to pay after $6,000?

Fourth, the catastrophic maximum was ~$8,000 and is now $12,000.

Fifth, do you have to do the math on this coverage. Most of the employees at this union place of employment start at minimum wage $7.25 per hour and most make under $15 per hour. This insurance is as bad as not having insurance. Of course, there is union dues ($5-10) taken out of every check and the first 10 paychecks have an extra $10 taken out to pay the initiation fee of becoming a union member.


Isn't 0bamacare a wonderful!

Bingo.   I know several carpenters who's wives work as a 'lunch lady Doris' mostly for the insurance. Individual policies for contractors were very expensive from what I have been lead to believe. That was a great way to cover it.  Of course our berg is looking at running into the Cadillac tax which brings up a whole different kettle of fish.  And a number of doctors here are 'retiring'.  Seems things like Medicaid reimbursement being cut and electronic records requirements are winnowing out the medicos at a rapid rate. The traditional private practice of 'Marcus Wellby' is becoming a vanishing breed.  We now have hospitalists at the local HCA, forget about a house call, you won't even see your doctor at the hospital either anymore.  Thanks Obama Care. 

[DefiantSix]

Retiring from unemployment?



 

Gaming the system is a full time job, ya know... [/DUmbass]

[Chris_]

Redneck retirement.

[ROCKURWORLD]

0bamacare is a train wreck for sure.

My niece works for a large grocery chain that has union employees. When they updated their insurance policies for 0bamacare compliance, there were many union members getting the shaft first hand.

First, They did keep the premium similar and it is subsidized by the employer. My niece only has to pay ~$20 month for herself. Not all that bad until you read the rest.

Second, their policy would cover children but no longer cover spouses. One of her coworkers mainly worked there so her family could have good  health insurance because her husband was self-employed. It is not uncommon for a spouse to do this. However, now, they have to get a separate policy for her husband or he will get hit with a fine.

Third, they increased the deductible from $500 per person to $6,000. Why even have insurance if it will only start to pay after $6,000?

Fourth, the catastrophic maximum was ~$8,000 and is now $12,000.

Fifth, do you have to do the math on this coverage. Most of the employees at this union place of employment start at minimum wage $7.25 per hour and most make under $15 per hour. This insurance is as bad as not having insurance. Of course, there is union dues ($5-10) taken out of every check and the first 10 paychecks have an extra $10 taken out to pay the initiation fee of becoming a union member.


Isn't 0bamacare a wonderful!

$20.00 a month for catastrophic coverage isn't bad at all. You can run up 12K in a day for something major.

[Conservative Libertarian]

$20.00 a month for catastrophic coverage isn't bad at all. You can run up 12K in a day for something major.

If it weren't subsidized by her employer, it would cost 10 times that. Not bad. But the insurance itself has such a high deductible that it is unusable. How can someone cover such a bill when they make $10 per hour?

[FiddyBeowulf]

until I retire in 20 months.

Retiring from unemployment?



 

It will take that long for the SSDI paperwork to get approved.

[cmypay]

Retiring from unemployment?



 

He hits minimum age for social security