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Offline Ralph Wiggum

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ACA conversation with co-worker at lunch
« on: October 24, 2013, 01:36:03 PM »
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reflection (5,249 posts)

ACA conversation with co-worker at lunch:


Last edited Thu Oct 24, 2013, 02:29 PM USA/ET - Edit history (1)

This is almost verbatim, conversation with right-wing nutjob sparring partner just now at lunch:

RWNJ: "If you look on Rush Limbaugh's website today, he's got an article that says the IRS can only collect the Obamacare fine if you have a refund. They aren't allowed to seize it from your bank account."

Me: "I'll try to verify, what's the significance though?"

RWNJ: "Well if I have a refund of $3000 coming but the fine is $4000, I just won't cash my refund."

Me: "The maximum fine for non-participation in 2014 is $95/person, or 1% of your income, whichever is greater. If you have a $4000 fine, you're making $400,000 a year and you didn't buy health insurance. That sounds pretty stupid."

RWNJ: (silence)

Me: (I eat my sandwich and just stare at him impassively)

RWNJ: "Man it's just socialism."

Me: "I just knocked your ass to the mat and you used a right-wing talking point to cushion your fall. Admit it."

RWNJ: "It's always some liberal bullshit with you."

Me: "You should read more Democratic Underground and less Limbaugh. Rub some dirt on your bruised ego. Here, let me be a socialist and buy your lunch. You get the next one."

I picked up the check. He's young, I'll get him to come around.

 :bs: :bs: :bs:

 :bouncy: :bouncy: :bouncy: :bouncy: :bouncy: :diebouncy:
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Offline jukin

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Re: ACA conversation with co-worker at lunch
« Reply #1 on: October 24, 2013, 01:49:05 PM »
Never happened and that nice low fine goes exponentially up in 2015. IIRC 2015 it goes to 2.5% and then to 6% in 16.

Another thing for lurking DUchebags. If you had any self control or economic common sense (HAHAHAHAHA) you would end up owing less than 10% to the IRS on 4/15 instead of giving them an interest free loan every year.  Just remember they are smarter than you.
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Offline blitzkrieg_17

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Re: ACA conversation with co-worker at lunch
« Reply #2 on: October 24, 2013, 01:50:08 PM »
There are bad bouncies....and then there are those specifically made up to fit the DU storyline. This is one of those, and is not worthy of a rating, other than FAIL.
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Offline Wineslob

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Re: ACA conversation with co-worker at lunch
« Reply #3 on: October 24, 2013, 01:51:20 PM »
Damn, when they don't try, they really don't.

 :thatsright:
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Offline Gina

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Re: ACA conversation with co-worker at lunch
« Reply #4 on: October 24, 2013, 01:57:35 PM »
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"You should read more Democratic Underground and less Limbaugh.

Yes, send him our way.  We have plenty of posts for him :popcorn:
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Offline jukin

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Re: ACA conversation with co-worker at lunch
« Reply #5 on: October 24, 2013, 02:01:18 PM »
SO I got my cancellation notice from my health insurer. My plan for a 53 year old childless man did not have maternity care, female birth control, dental and vision for kids, breast care, and transgender operations is no longer legal. I went to 4O4 cACA care site for kalifornia. The Bronze policy would cost just a few dollars over twice as much as my plan that I liked. The deductible is exactly double. The co-pays are 250% more.

What Obama and the evil democrat party did for me is to actually pay for another person at my current plan and give us both far worse insurance. It would have been better if the evil democrat federal government had picked out 30 million people and made them pay double for their existing insurance for some moocher/looter/free-loader. I would have got a tax break and the moocher/looter/free-loader would have got better insurance.

Sadly, this is not a bouncy even with the requisite starting SO.  
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When you are the beneficiary of a policy that steals from someone and gives it to you in return for your vote, it produces a sense of entitlement and dependency.

Offline Bad Dog

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Re: ACA conversation with co-worker at lunch
« Reply #6 on: October 24, 2013, 02:11:03 PM »
Quote from: jukin on October 24, 2013, 02:01:18 PM
SO I got my cancellation notice from my health insurer. My plan for a 53 year old childless man did not have maternity care, female birth control, dental and vision for kids, breast care, and transgender operations is no longer legal. I went to 4O4 cACA care site for kalifornia. The Bronze policy would cost just a few dollars over twice as much as my plan that I liked. The deductible is exactly double. The co-pays are 250% more.

What Obama and the evil democrat party did for me is to actually pay for another person at my current plan and give us both far worse insurance. It would have been better if the evil democrat federal government had picked out 30 million people and made them pay double for their existing insurance for some moocher/looter/free-loader. I would have got a tax break and the moocher/looter/free-loader would have got better insurance.

Sadly, this is not a bouncy even with the requisite starting SO.  

There are going to be millions of folks who are going to have the same experience.  Unfortunately, there will be millions who will be heavily subsidized but, they were expecting "free" healthcare.  I don't see this going well for progressives in general.
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Offline Chris_

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Re: ACA conversation with co-worker at lunch
« Reply #7 on: October 24, 2013, 02:16:00 PM »
Quote from: Bad Dog on October 24, 2013, 02:11:03 PM
There are going to be millions of folks who are going to have the same experience.  Unfortunately, there will be millions who will be heavily subsidized but, they were expecting "free" healthcare.  I don't see this going well for progressives in general.
I'm curious how the subsidies are handled.  Does the "customer" pay the full amount up front and get reimbursed later?  I don't see that going over well, especially with some of the prices I'm seeing for those policies.
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Offline Bad Dog

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Re: ACA conversation with co-worker at lunch
« Reply #8 on: October 24, 2013, 02:24:03 PM »
Quote from: Chris_ on October 24, 2013, 02:16:00 PM
I'm curious how the subsidies are handled.  Does the "customer" pay the full amount up front and get reimbursed later?  I don't see that going over well, especially with some of the prices I'm seeing for those policies.

http://www.insureme.com/health-insurance/health-reform-subsidies

They will apparently be deducted from your tax liability.  So, you will pay full premiums and deductables for a year and get a credit on your taxes in April the next year.  If you don't make it on to Medicaid and you have significant medical expenses you are well ant truly screwen.
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Offline 98ZJUSMC

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Re: ACA conversation with co-worker at lunch
« Reply #9 on: October 24, 2013, 02:27:28 PM »
That was one of the most transparently bouncy bouncies, to date.

(D)Ummie owes us 50  :stoner:
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Offline Rebel

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Re: ACA conversation with co-worker at lunch
« Reply #10 on: October 24, 2013, 02:28:58 PM »
All these issues are coming to light, I mean, it's blowing up in the Kenyan's face BIG TIME. What did he he was focused on now? Immigration reform. This is what you get when you elect an inexperienced MORON who's never accomplished a ****ing thing in his life that didn't come through affirmative action. **** up one issue, move on to the next. **** up the next, move on to the next.
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Offline Chris_

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Re: ACA conversation with co-worker at lunch
« Reply #11 on: October 24, 2013, 02:30:01 PM »
From your link:

Quote
Usually, you would get a tax credit when you file your taxes. However, health insurance premiums can be expensive -- they're predicted to hit $12,000 for a family of four in 2014, according to the Kaiser Family Foundation. And some families may not be able to wait until tax time to get reimbursed. Therefore, the health care reform law allows for advance payments of subsidies that help families pay health insurance premiums as they come due.
They'll get that turd polished eventually.
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Offline Gina

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Re: ACA conversation with co-worker at lunch
« Reply #12 on: October 24, 2013, 02:30:27 PM »
Quote from: jukin on October 24, 2013, 02:01:18 PM
SO I got my cancellation notice from my health insurer. My plan for a 53 year old childless man did not have maternity care, female birth control, dental and vision for kids, breast care, and transgender operations is no longer legal. I went to 4O4 cACA care site for kalifornia. The Bronze policy would cost just a few dollars over twice as much as my plan that I liked. The deductible is exactly double. The co-pays are 250% more.

What Obama and the evil democrat party did for me is to actually pay for another person at my current plan and give us both far worse insurance. It would have been better if the evil democrat federal government had picked out 30 million people and made them pay double for their existing insurance for some moocher/looter/free-loader. I would have got a tax break and the moocher/looter/free-loader would have got better insurance.

Sadly, this is not a bouncy even with the requisite starting SO.  

Might as well go get a wife now  :naughty:
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Offline Bad Dog

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Re: ACA conversation with co-worker at lunch
« Reply #13 on: October 24, 2013, 02:33:36 PM »
Quote from: Chris_ on October 24, 2013, 02:30:01 PM
From your link:
They'll get that turd polished eventually.

And the advanced subsidies will be available through .........wait for it.........The O'bummacare website!!!!!!!!
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Offline Maxiest

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Re: ACA conversation with co-worker at lunch
« Reply #14 on: October 24, 2013, 02:40:22 PM »
Quote from: jukin on October 24, 2013, 01:49:05 PM
Never happened and that nice low fine goes exponentially up in 2015. IIRC 2015 it goes to 2.5% and then to 6% in 16.

Another thing for lurking DUchebags. If you had any self control or economic common sense (HAHAHAHAHA) you would end up owing less than 10% to the IRS on 4/15 instead of giving them an interest free loan every year.  Just remember they are smarter than you.

Yep

Quote
(ii) Applicable dollar amount. Except as provided in paragraphs (b)(2)(iii) and
(b)(2)(iv) of this section, the applicable dollar amount is--
(A) $95 in 2014;
(B) $325 in 2015; or
(C) $695 in 2016.
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Online Carl

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Re: ACA conversation with co-worker at lunch
« Reply #15 on: October 24, 2013, 02:55:36 PM »
Quote from: Chris_ on October 24, 2013, 02:30:01 PM
From your link:
They'll get that turd polished eventually.

This basically allows them to misidentify a handout as a tax credit.
The subsidy (if I understand correctly) is not tied to a persons actual tax liability.
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Offline jukin

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Re: ACA conversation with co-worker at lunch
« Reply #16 on: October 24, 2013, 03:12:22 PM »
Quote from: Carl on October 24, 2013, 02:55:36 PM
This basically allows them to misidentify a handout as a tax credit.
The subsidy (if I understand correctly) is not tied to a persons actual tax liability.

The way I understand it is that the medicaid level is going way up to include more people 140% of poverty level. Then you need to get over that to start to qualify for subsidizes but I don't believe that it will be like the EITC. You won't get a check from them only a lowering of your tax liability. If the liability is not there for the difference in your increase in insurance costs you are shit out of luck. I could be wrong about that as I don't think anybody knows how that will work but the preponderance of what info I can find says this.
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When you are the beneficiary of someone’s kindness and generosity, it produces a sense of gratitude and community.

When you are the beneficiary of a policy that steals from someone and gives it to you in return for your vote, it produces a sense of entitlement and dependency.

Online Carl

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Re: ACA conversation with co-worker at lunch
« Reply #17 on: October 24, 2013, 03:36:29 PM »
Quote from: jukin on October 24, 2013, 03:12:22 PM
The way I understand it is that the medicaid level is going way up to include more people 140% of poverty level. Then you need to get over that to start to qualify for subsidizes but I don't believe that it will be like the EITC. You won't get a check from them only a lowering of your tax liability. If the liability is not there for the difference in your increase in insurance costs you are shit out of luck. I could be wrong about that as I don't think anybody knows how that will work but the preponderance of what info I can find says this.

I found this...

Quote
If you qualify for Advance Premium Tax Credits, you use them immediately to lower your monthly premium expense. You pick how much advance tax credits that will apply each month towards your premium payment up to a maximum amount. If you choose an amount that is less than your total Advance Premium Tax Credit, you get the difference when you file your income taxes as a tax refund. But, if the total of your advance premium payments is greater than the amount of your credit, you must pay it back with your tax filing.

http://obamacarefacts.com/obamacare-subsidies.php


It sounds to me as if the "tax credits" are not in any way linked to an individuals tax liability but conjured out of thin air.

For example,a person may withhold as single,no dependent and then file entirely different such as head of household with a dependent.
They give the gov an interest free loan (although putting it in the bank is virtually the same) and get a large refund.
If they file as they withhold they may very well owe.
How in that case could they get a "credit" since they are in a net negative with their tax burden?
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Offline Tess Anderson

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Re: ACA conversation with co-worker at lunch
« Reply #18 on: October 24, 2013, 07:47:43 PM »
How does this nitwit figure it's "socialism" to buy a co-worker lunch? Since he's "young", maybe, just maybe, he resents having to pay for an expensive healthcare plan he won't even have to use.
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Offline Freeper

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Re: ACA conversation with co-worker at lunch
« Reply #19 on: October 24, 2013, 07:55:42 PM »
Quote from: Tess Anderson on October 24, 2013, 07:47:43 PM
How does this nitwit figure it's "socialism" to buy a co-worker lunch? Since he's "young", maybe, just maybe, he resents having to pay for an expensive healthcare plan he won't even have to use.

It would be socialism if the government forced him to buy lunch for the other guy.
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