http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023841426Oh my.
Hepburn (19,060 posts) Sun Oct 13, 2013, 02:03 PM
I am handicapped -- this morning Spires Restaurant in Torrance , CA, discriminated against me.
I am hearing impaired. I wear hearing aids and have a service dog. I have some hearing due to the aids, but my service dog is an alert dog and is very necessary for me to get around and get around safely.
Today, a friend and I went to breakfast at Spires and were told the following:
They have a segregated area for anyone with a service dog because other patrons are offended by having a dog in the restaurant. -- per Assistant Manager at Spires, Torrance, CA
My gawd, these people live in the dark ages...they have a space reserved for people who have disabilities which offend other patrons.
Please kick and get the word out for those who live in SoCal and in the Torrance, CA, area -- this is no place to go unless you are perfect and do not offend others.
What a ****ing whiner.
Before I get started--and I'm pretty pissed at this whining--for those in the audience here who aren't aware, franksolich is deaf. I was born without ears; just a couple of little tabs or flaps where hearing people have ear-lobes. "Microtia," caused by what's medically-termed an "environmental accident," in this case exposure to the chemical Accutane while still in the womb. The grotesque deformity is covered up by a good head of thick, healthy hair.
Okay.
It's a very big campfire, taking a long time to scroll down.
Hepburn (19,060 posts) Sun Oct 13, 2013, 02:08 PM
4. My friends and I went to Dennys and the manager there was a real doll.
She even asked if my dog needed anything and joked with us. After we ate, I told her what had happened to us at Spires and her mouth dropped open and she said, "That is against the law." Told us that the dog and I are welcome at that Dennys anytime.
Whine, whine, whine.....
Hepburn (19,060 posts) Sun Oct 13, 2013, 02:06 PM
2. Thank you for the rec...
...the Assistant manager did this to me in front of at least 10 people and had made us wait for a table until she had time to explain that they had a "new policy" at Spires regarding service dogs. Then she told us we basically were not welcome there unless I agree to be segregated from other patrons.
Unbelievable!!!!!
Whine, whine, whine.....
Hepburn (19,060 posts) Sun Oct 13, 2013, 02:08 PM
5. No shit...
...they act like being disabled was something filthy and catching. It was awful.
Whine, whine, whine.....
Hepburn (19,060 posts) Sun Oct 13, 2013, 02:13 PM
14. I guess so...
....but their policy is that anyone with a service dog is segregated from other patrons. Those with walkers, crutches, etc., are OK...my guess.
I can tell you this: My service dog is better behaved than 90% of the children I see in restaurants. She sits and then lays down and does not move or get up unless I give a command for her to do so.
Whine, whine, whine.....
Hepburn (19,060 posts) Sun Oct 13, 2013, 02:17 PM
21. I could not go without the service dog...
...so IMO it is a discrimination of something I must have in order to be a part of society...and I am not referring to being segregated from others in order to have the rights to something others without disabilities can have.
Whine, whine, whine.....
"I'm handicapped. I'm 'special'."
Geezuz fudging Christ.
Hepburn (19,060 posts) Sun Oct 13, 2013, 02:29 PM
44. Have you ever seen someone being afraid of a person who looks different?
I have seen that with stroke victims, etc.
Soooooooo....where does the segregation end???
Whine, whine, whine.....
Hepburn (19,060 posts) Sun Oct 13, 2013, 02:16 PM
16. Under both Cal State and Fed law...
...a clear violation.
What the law says is that others who complain are given the option of moving...but the disabled patron cannot be moved or segregated due to his/her disability.
Whine, whine, whine.....
Hepburn (19,060 posts) Sun Oct 13, 2013, 02:21 PM
30. I have allergies -- severe ones -- to certain foods and perfumes.
I just ask that a restaurant not put certain things on my food.
If I was allergic to someone's perfume, I quietly explain to my waiter or waitress and have never had a problem being move.
No...ramps are accommodations and required by law...so are service dogs and access to all public areas -- a requirement in both Cal and Fed law. Only place a service dog may NOT go is where there is actual food preparation. Also the law states what a restaurant or public place must do if another patron complains about the service dog -- tell them that by law the dog must be given access. PERIOD. If the complainer can be moved, that is the ONLY solution which is allowed.
Whine, whine, whine.....
Hepburn (19,060 posts) Sun Oct 13, 2013, 03:22 PM
102. If someone has an allergy...then of course reasonable accommodations should be made.
But...segregating certain persons "just in case" is not a reasonable accommodation. JMHO
I have absolutely NO problem in moving with my service dog to accommodate a person with an allergy who is in discomfort or may become discomforted...but to be told that I am offensive to other patrons because of my dog? That is not acceptable on any level. The reason for the unacceptability was clearly spelled out: Dogs are filthy and do not belong in restaurants. That conversation took place with the idiot head manager the first time my dog and I went to that Spires...apparently the idiot has not learned what the ADA rules are and that they are strictly enforced.
Whine, whine, whine.....
Hepburn (19,060 posts) Sun Oct 13, 2013, 03:28 PM
110. I have and when this problem arose in the past with the same Spires, I went to the home office and..
...gave them all the rules. Federal and state and the state laws included the penal code on interference with a service dog and denying service, etc. It is considered a crime in California to do so.
It appears that the manager feels that having a "service dog ghetto" is allowed. And it's OK to discriminate against the handicapped in favor of other patrons.
This time, I can guarantee, I will not be so nice about it and treat it as a learning experience for those who feel free to discriminate. Those days are OVER!
Whine, whine, whine.....
Hepburn (19,060 posts) Sun Oct 13, 2013, 03:17 PM
93. I have the same response to cats...and cat owners.
Cat dander -- and I have severe asthma. My neighbor has cat allergies worst than mine. Either of us come near someone who owns a cat and we both become very, very ill
So.......should cat owners be segregated? Just asking...
Whine, whine, whine.....
Hepburn (19,060 posts) Sun Oct 13, 2013, 02:23 PM
32. How about a wheelchair only section of the restaurant...???
Where does the segregation end???
Whine, whine, whine.....
Hepburn (19,060 posts) Sun Oct 13, 2013, 02:36 PM
52. No..........any SEGREGATION of anyone disabled is against the law. PERIOD.
Asking to move is NOT a segregation. Having a "policy" which segregates the disabled IS discrimination.
Whine, whine, whine.....
Hepburn (19,060 posts) Sun Oct 13, 2013, 03:08 PM
80. You really don't get it, do you?
I cannot avoid my hearing loss...so don't try and tell me it's OK to segregate me to the "back of the restaurant" because someone has better rights than I do.
THAT IS DISCRIMINATION AND IT IS NOT ONLY WRONG, BUT AGAINST THE LAW. SPECIFICALLY AGAINST THE LAW RE SERVICE DOGS.
Whine, whine, whine.....
Hepburn (19,060 posts) Sun Oct 13, 2013, 02:26 PM
37. So.........all disabled people are segreated instead???
That works for you???
Where does it stop??? What if someone is afraid of wheelchairs...they get segregated, too???
Whine, whine, whine.....
Hepburn (19,060 posts) Sun Oct 13, 2013, 02:35 PM
49. No...NO ONE should be segregated because of ANY disability.
Reasonable accommodations such as moving a person with an allergy or phobia is a much better solution.
Duh...that is the entire point of the ADA.
Whine, whine, whine.....
Hepburn (19,060 posts) Sun Oct 13, 2013, 05:20 PM
171. Bingo!
Exactly and this is what I have been trying to express. Some people seem to think I want BETTER treatment. I just want EQUAL treatment. There are no segregated sections for others with disabilities where they HAVE to sit...so why should there be one for those with a service dog? If there is a problem...deal with it EQUALLY and accommodate both parties. Do not do it by discriminating against one handicap over others before the fact.
Whine, whine, whine.....
Hepburn (19,060 posts) Sun Oct 13, 2013, 05:09 PM
163. Wow...
...and from my fav prez, too.
If you would have read, you would have seen that I have said several times in this thread that if there was an allergy problem, I would have had NO problem moving.
How would YOU like it if the restaurant automatically put anyone with an allergy in a separate area and not allow them anywhere else in the restaurant. We were suppose to sit by the door that went to the garbage dumb. Does that work for you?
Whine, whine, whine.....
Hepburn (19,060 posts) Sun Oct 13, 2013, 02:33 PM
48. Hug back...
...I was so embarrassed...I went to the car and cried. It's bad enough to be cut out of most of anything audio and/or verbal going on around oneself, but to be told that the assistance device -- a service dog -- is offensive and so offensive that you MUST be segregated because others have more rights...I felt like I had been gut punched.
I was humiliated. Embarrassed. And wishing I was "normal" so I could just go outside my home without trouble or without being looked upon differently.
Oh geezuz God.
Whine, whine, whine.....
Hepburn (19,060 posts) Sun Oct 13, 2013, 02:58 PM
70. Thank you for the info...
...this is not the first time I have had trouble with Spires. One manager asked what my disability was -- against the law to do that -- and I said the dog is an "alert dog." Then he looked at me and made a guess I was hearing impaired and said that he thought I could hear just fine and that I did not need the dog. I guess this idiot had never hear of lip reading.
I am going to do something about it this time. First time, the owner of Spires was apologetic and told me that I would not have any further problems and was mortified at what happened.
SSDD -- I guess this manager simply is a total idiot with his "new" policy of segregating the handicapped.
Whine, whine, whine.....
Hepburn (19,060 posts) Sun Oct 13, 2013, 02:44 PM
60. Most people are pretty cool and ask if they can pet the dog...
...one restaurant sets her a special place and gives her treats to take home. It is rare that she is not loved and admired and basically blessed for the service she does.
She is an excellent dog...extremely well behaved and quiet. Minds every command either verbal or unspoken immediately.
Whine, whine, whine.....
Hepburn (19,060 posts) Sun Oct 13, 2013, 03:06 PM
78. I am allergic to perfume...
...soooo....people wearing perfume or after shave get segregated immediately to separate sections, too?
I don't understand you post. My dog is a NECESSITY, not a luxury. If someone has an allergy, I would have moved if they could not move. I understand the need to have certain accommodations made. My mother had COPD and heavy perfume, cigarette smoke (no smoke free areas or prohibitions when she was alive) and heavy scents of after shave shut down her ability to breath.
I have no problem with accommodating anyone with a problem. However, being told I am less valuable than someone with an allergy or a phobia...so I cannot sit where others sit just in case, that is wrong. And it is also against the ADA -- service dog users cannot be segregated from others.
Whine, whine, whine.....
Hepburn (19,060 posts) Sun Oct 13, 2013, 03:13 PM
84. Big time...and the fines for discrimination are HORRENDOUS!
My understanding as a retired lawyer:
The court will issue an injunction against the establishment and, further, will fine them and award attorneys fees and costs.
I am NOT interested in receiving one single cent from any lawsuit -- all I want is to be able to move around by having reasonable accommodations made for me.
Whine, whine, whine.....
Hepburn (19,060 posts) Sun Oct 13, 2013, 05:14 PM
167. If they are seated and eating and someone asks, I have NO problem of going to another area.
I have allergies...and I understand. It is the blanket policy of isolation and segregation that gets to me. If there is a problem that happens -- then do something, but do not discriminate before the fact.
Whine, whine, whine.....
Hepburn (19,060 posts) Sun Oct 13, 2013, 03:11 PM
81. If someone has an extreme allergy...
...all they have to do is say something and I would without hesitation not be seated anywhere near them. That is not the problem here -- my service dog was offensive because it bothered other patrons for aesthetic reasons and not health reasons. And...the segregation was a policy and not dependent on anyone having allergies, etc.
A dislike of animals is NOT a valid reason to deny rights to a handicapped person who MUST USE a service dog.
Whine, whine, whine.....
Hepburn (19,060 posts) Sun Oct 13, 2013, 05:02 PM
157. I have severe difficulties with hearing things which are behind me.
Such as crossing a parking lot to get to the restaurant entrance -- I cannot hear people, cars, etc., approaching me from the rear. Also: Inside, if I get up from the table for any reason, I cannot hear people behind me or servers with hot food trays, even if they call out to me. My dog when outside pulls me away from sounds behind me -- such as to the side of a parking lot, roadway or side walk, or stops to let me know I need to be aware of what is behind me both inside a building and outside. If I am alone in a restaurant and a waiter or waitress walks up to me, at times I do not realize he or she may be there and speaking to me and the dog alerts to them by bumping my arm. If an alarm goes off -- such as a smoke alarm, my dog lets me know.
The most important thing with the dog and being in public is usually in grocery stores -- people at times let their children run around without supervision and I have avoided being run over several times by electric carts and children. My dog rides on a blanket in the "child section" of the cart with her head pointing to my left and I stay to the right. If something fast approaches from the rear, she alerts me immediately.
Malls are often a circus -- especially during holidays and right after school lets out. Same thing there -- dog lets me know if someone or something is fast approaching from the rear or if an alarm bell is going off.
In addition to being hearing impaired, I have some problems keeping my balance due to a hereditary disease. So, the dog alerting is very important to my safety for this reason as well.
Whine, whine, whine.....
Hepburn (19,060 posts) Sun Oct 13, 2013, 05:34 PM
173. I can understand being offended...that is one thing.
But what did they have to do to get a restaurant manager to segregate me from everyone else? And why would anyone agree to discriminate against any handicapped person?
This thread is amazing to me -- it's not an argument about what handicap or disability is worse -- it's about discrimination. PERIOD. There are accommodations for all handicaps and disabilities...and then there is discrimination from the get-go against certain ones.
I cannot understand why people cannot see the difference.
Whine, whine, whine.....
There's a star-studded galaxy of PoP (primitives of prominence) at this campfire, a few of whom are even being reasonable; check it out.
Among the idiots, Skippy from New York City's condescendingly all over the campfire, as usual.
Eat shit and die, Audrey; you make the rest of we deaf look bad.
