Author Topic: Obama Care Alternatives - Conservatives Drop the Ball  (Read 2216 times)

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Offline FiddlingAnt

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Obama Care Alternatives - Conservatives Drop the Ball
« on: August 08, 2013, 05:20:10 PM »
Why is health insurance so expensive?

There isn’t one thing that causes this, but the following all contribute:

* The U.S. population is growing older. Older people need more medical attention.
* The U.S. population is growing more obese. Obesity requires more medical attention.
* Special interest lobbying by the pharmaceutical industry creates artificially higher prices for prescription medicines not present in other first world countries.
* Special interest lobbying by trial lawyers creates higher malpractice insurance costs and extra medical testing costs not present in other first world countries.
* The United States leads the world in medical advances. New procedures create higher costs.
* The payment system is based on the number of procedures provided and not on keeping people healthy.
* Eliminating pre-existing conditions and lifetime coverage caps is great for people affected, but the increased costs needs to be covered by all health insurance payers.
* Consumers don’t price shop for major medical procedures so the normal market forces that keep prices down do not work.

Obama Care does a terrible job at addressing just about all these problems, but the pre-Obama care system did a terrible job too, which is why the Dems were able to get enough support to push their trainwreck of a law through. The fact is we pay more for medical care than any other country without better health results.

Republicans who promote a return to the status quo provide no solution worth supporting.

Offline thundley4

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Re: Obama Care Alternatives - Conservatives Drop the Ball
« Reply #1 on: August 08, 2013, 05:26:52 PM »
Quote
Obama Care does a terrible job at addressing just about all these problems, but the pre-Obama care system did a terrible job too, which is why the Dems were able to get enough support to push their trainwreck of a law through. The fact is we pay more for medical care than any other country without better health results.

Bribery and lies were used to get enough votes to ram ObamaCrap through.  A turd would have passed the same way.  Oh wait, it did.

The results may not be better here, but a large part of that is because of people's choices. 

Online zeitgeist

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Re: Obama Care Alternatives - Conservatives Drop the Ball
« Reply #2 on: August 08, 2013, 06:02:15 PM »
I hear Obama Care was actually something called Romney Care rebranded.  Anyone else here this?  Of course when questioned about it,  Romney swore on a stack of Nuclear Power Manuals that after Romney Care left his hand it had been bastardized by the usual crazed Taxa2ushits liberals into an unworkable amorphous blob.  Thus it would appear Obama care is actually a very cleverly conceived Rethuglican plot to make Obumbler [praise be upon him] look bad. Those white Rovian Devils, first they sucked him in then they sucked him off. :rotf:  Poor Obumber. 
< watch this space for coming distractions >

Offline J P Sousa

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Re: Obama Care Alternatives - Conservatives Drop the Ball
« Reply #3 on: August 08, 2013, 06:12:10 PM »
The list names only one MANDATE, but there are thousands.


Mandated Benefits
http://healthinsurance.about.com/od/reform/a/mandated_benefits_overview.htm


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Offline Dori

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Re: Obama Care Alternatives - Conservatives Drop the Ball
« Reply #4 on: August 08, 2013, 06:32:22 PM »
I predict more people will be uninsured after the law goes into effect, than were before the law was written.






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Offline txradioguy

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Re: Obama Care Alternatives - Conservatives Drop the Ball
« Reply #5 on: August 09, 2013, 03:38:03 AM »
Quote
Why is health insurance so expensive?

Illegals

Medicare

Medicaid

HMO's

Lack of tort reform to stop malicious malpractice cases based on junk science...like John Edwards channeling the spirit of a dead girl to win a huge fee/payout.


Every time the Republicans/Conservatives try to reform these areas...every time they try to close some of the loopholes they are blocked by...the Democrats.

Sorry...you don't get to blame us for this mess.
The libs/dems of today are the Quislings of former years. The cowards who would vote a fraud into office in exchange for handouts from the devil.

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Offline Eupher

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Re: Obama Care Alternatives - Conservatives Drop the Ball
« Reply #6 on: August 09, 2013, 09:16:26 AM »
the list of reasons in the OP contains one item that I'd contest.

Pharmaceuticals and their expense.

You hear all kinds of caterwauling and screaming from the liberal press that the drug companies are greedy, heartless, yadda, yadda, yadda.

Sound familiar? We hear this all the time from the proglodytes about all kinds of corporations, but especially about the drug and oil companies.

Here's the truth, at least a summary of the real deal. This is accurate information from a relatively high level. I worked in the pharma industry and if I could, I'd return there in a heartbeat. Great working conditions, good work, detailed work, excellent pay.

It's a little lengthy, but factual. Forget the bullshit that the proglodytes want to jam down your throat. The drug companies are no more the big, bad boogie-man than any other company. Yes, they want to make a profit for their shareholders, and yes they want maximum return on their investment. This is not greedy or illegal.

Quote
The first step in the development of drugs is the discovery of a new compound (natural or synthetic) that affects a medical condition. The first phase of development involves research into the biological and chemical properties of this compound to determine its effects--how it is absorbed, distributed, and eliminated in the body--as well as its safety. These early studies occur in the laboratory using cells on plates (tissue cultures) and animals. If the new compound is safe and effective in animals, the next phase is testing in a small number of healthy human volunteers to confirm the information from the animal studies and to gain further information on the effects of the compound. Finally, the new compound is tested in humans who have the condition for which it will be used. Once the compound is proven to be safe and effective for the condition, the company applies to the Food and Drug Administration (FDA) for a license to manufacture and sell this drug. The FDA tightly regulates the testing of new compounds in humans and has strict criteria for the approval of drugs.

Drug companies are like other companies in that they manufacture products that must be sold for a profit in order for the company to survive and grow. They are different from some companies because the drug business is very risky. For instance, only one out of every ten thousand discovered compounds actually becomes an approved drug for sale. Much expense is incurred in the early phases of development of compounds that will not become approved drugs. In addition, it takes about 7 to 10 years and an average cost of 500 million dollars to develop each new drug. This money is spent before the FDA approves the drug, and if the drug is not approved, the company loses the money. These expenses must be covered by the revenue from compounds that successfully become approved drugs. Moreover, only 3 out of every 20 approved drugs bring in sufficient revenue to cover their developmental costs, and only 1 out of every 3 approved drugs generates enough money to cover the development costs of previous failures. This means that for a drug company to survive, it needs to discover a blockbuster (billion-dollar drug) every few years. After a drug is approved, millions of dollars are spent on marketing in educating healthcare providers and conducting post-marketing studies. Drug companies spend a lot of money on marketing because of the stiff competition they face from other drug companies for their drugs, and in order to develop each drug's highest revenue-generating potential. Given the poor odds of discovering another successful drug, it is more efficient to maximize the returns on a drug that is already on the market through advertising. In this sense, drug companies are no different than any other type of company. In addition to maximizing returns on their investment through advertising, drug companies also spend money to find new uses for drugs or better ways of using them. These efforts increase the use of the approved drugs and also benefit patients. Additionally, drug companies donate millions of dollars to charities and provide free drugs to individuals or countries that cannot afford medications.

In a nutshell, the price paid by a patient for a medication must cover the costs of developing new compounds that become approved drugs and compounds that fail to become drugs, as well as marketing, post-marketing studies, and a profit. The profit ensures that the company provides a return to investors. Profit is the incentive for the risk that the company takes. Without the promise of a reasonable profit, there is very little incentive for any company to develop new drugs. There is no denying that drugs are expensive. However, the price of drugs should be weighed against their benefits....

http://www.medicinenet.com/script/main/art.asp?articlekey=18892
« Last Edit: August 09, 2013, 09:19:06 AM by Eupher »
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Offline JohnnyReb

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Re: Obama Care Alternatives - Conservatives Drop the Ball
« Reply #7 on: August 09, 2013, 09:28:29 AM »
If you're going to drop the ball......drop it on Obama's foot.
“The American people will never knowingly adopt socialism. But, under the name of ‘liberalism’, they will adopt every fragment of the socialist program, until one day America will be a socialist nation, without knowing how it happened.” - Norman Thomas, U.S. Socialist Party presidential candidate 1940, 1944 and 1948

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Offline mrclose

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Re: Obama Care Alternatives - Conservatives Drop the Ball
« Reply #8 on: August 14, 2013, 07:24:33 AM »
I hear Obama Care was actually something called Romney Care rebranded.  Anyone else here this?  Of course when questioned about it,  Romney swore on a stack of Nuclear Power Manuals that after Romney Care left his hand it had been bastardized by the usual crazed Taxa2ushits liberals into an unworkable amorphous blob.  Thus it would appear Obama care is actually a very cleverly conceived Rethuglican plot to make Obumbler [praise be upon him] look bad. Those white Rovian Devils, first they sucked him in then they sucked him off. :rotf:  Poor Obumber.  
And it Could Have been explained to the Morons .. that there is a difference between a State voting for their own destruction and the Feds doing it to everyone!

That is why we have a Constitution .. You know, those pesky things known as ... Enumerated Powers!
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Offline FiddlingAnt

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Re: Obama Care Alternatives - Conservatives Drop the Ball
« Reply #9 on: August 14, 2013, 01:36:47 PM »
the list of reasons in the OP contains one item that I'd contest.

Pharmaceuticals and their expense.

You hear all kinds of caterwauling and screaming from the liberal press that the drug companies are greedy, heartless, yadda, yadda, yadda.

Sound familiar? We hear this all the time from the proglodytes about all kinds of corporations, but especially about the drug and oil companies.

Here's the truth, at least a summary of the real deal. This is accurate information from a relatively high level. I worked in the pharma industry and if I could, I'd return there in a heartbeat. Great working conditions, good work, detailed work, excellent pay.

It's a little lengthy, but factual. Forget the bullshit that the proglodytes want to jam down your throat. The drug companies are no more the big, bad boogie-man than any other company. Yes, they want to make a profit for their shareholders, and yes they want maximum return on their investment. This is not greedy or illegal.

http://www.medicinenet.com/script/main/art.asp?articlekey=18892

The fact remains that the same drug can be purchased for less in Canada, Latin America, Asia, and Europe. Big Pharma's hold on Republicans means American consumers pay a higher share of the costs. We are subsidizing the cost of pharmaceuticals in other countries.

Offline Eupher

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Re: Obama Care Alternatives - Conservatives Drop the Ball
« Reply #10 on: August 14, 2013, 04:31:33 PM »
The fact remains that the same drug can be purchased for less in Canada, Latin America, Asia, and Europe. Big Pharma's hold on Republicans means American consumers pay a higher share of the costs. We are subsidizing the cost of pharmaceuticals in other countries.

Are they really the same drugs? Or mutant generics? I'm not taking the chance of buying a drug - regardless of the name on it - sold in Canada or any other place. I'll get my drugs here.

YMMV.

 
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Offline J P Sousa

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Re: Obama Care Alternatives - Conservatives Drop the Ball
« Reply #11 on: August 14, 2013, 05:14:33 PM »
The fact remains that the same drug can be purchased for less in Canada, Latin America, Asia, and Europe. Big Pharma's hold on Republicans means American consumers pay a higher share of the costs. We are subsidizing the cost of pharmaceuticals in other countries.

Is it really the same drug ???

At your own risk.

Quote
 Drug ingredients made in China entering market with little oversight  


Interviews with more than a dozen API producers and brokers indicate drug ingredients are entering the global supply chain after being made with no oversight from China's State Food and Drug Administration (SFDA), and with no Good Manufacturing Practice (GMP) certification, an internationally recognized standard of quality assurance.


http://www.nbcnews.com/health/drug-ingredients-made-china-entering-market-little-oversight-968328

(Yes, it's a year old but still relevant.)
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Obama Wiretapped The Trump Tower...FACT

The reason there are so many stupid people is because it's illegal to kill them.
~John Wayne