What is the basis for the Creationist claim that the Earth is merely thousands o

[CactusCarlos]

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=214x175955

What is the basis for the Creationist claim that the Earth is merely thousands of years old?
Posted by The Night Owl on Tue Jun-17-08 12:20 PM

Is the Creationist estimate of Earth's age based on the Biblical account of who begat who? If it is based on that, then... well... LOL!

Why would anyone ask this question at DU? 

[Rebel]

Don't know. I was never taught that.

[Willow]

well did ya notice who asked the question?

[Chris_]

Don't know. I was never taught that.

In Numbers, if you follow the begats back to Adam you get in the 6,000 range.

[CactusCarlos]

well did ya notice who asked the question?

Sure did.  I was hoping he'd see my post about him and come by and enlighten us.

[Rebel]

Don't know. I was never taught that.

In Numbers, if you follow the begats back to Adam you get in the 6,000 range.

6,000 from the time Number was written?

[franksolich]

Well, I dunno.

I don't care if God created the "planet" or if it naturally evolved at random from the solar system, or if Martians made it.  It's not an important question anyway.

Just like with the origins of mankind.

I don't endorse any view, because we'll never know, and we all can die happily never knowing.

But anyway, it seems to me God is all-powerful, all-mighty.

What's to stop God from creating a "planet" with objects that to the fallible human eye seem millions and billions of years old?  You know, dinosaur bones and all that.  These remains seem like old stuff, but maybe they aren't; maybe God created them to seem old to us.

And remember that God--in all ways in which God is revealed, not just our Christian way--in all times and all places has said the first sin is that of pride, of arrogance that man knows all, or can know all.

As I said, I endorse nothing, but it seems to me that God, with a sense of humor, could very well have done this, instantaneously created things that look old, to befuddle man in his greed and arrogance.

[franksolich]

I checked the original poster.

It looks like the nocturnally foul one lied when he repeatedly insisted he doesn't hang around Skins's island.

And I believed him.

What a ****ing liar.

[WinOne4TheGipper]

It's based on the idea that you DUmmies have to be someone's fault.


Okay, just kidding.

[InfamousAndy]

I know it is hard to wrap your mind around, but what if God created history itself instead of just the evidence of history?  We humans can only perceive time in a linear fashion.  God is not bound by that limitation.

[EastFacingNorth]

I know it is hard to wrap your mind around, but what if God created history itself instead of just the evidence of history?  We humans can only perceive time in a linear fashion.  God is not bound by that limitation.

I've been arguing that for a while now.

Of course, the problem with such an argument is that it's just as likely that the universe began last Tuesday as it is that the universe began 6000 or however many years ago.  Such a line of argument can be used to dispute the beginning of time being located at some specific point, but not to locate where that point should be.

[Rebel]

I've been arguing that for a while now.

Of course, the problem with such an argument is that it's just as likely that the universe began last Tuesday as it is that the universe began 6000 or however many years ago.  Such a line of argument can be used to dispute the beginning of time being located at some specific point, but not to locate where that point should be.

With us? I don't paint any illusions about what I know about GOD, other than what I've read or learned in sermons....and researched myself. The Bible, itself, pretty much concludes that there is no concept of time in Heaven. GOD created the Heavens and the Earth in 6 days and rested on the 7th. There is no concept of what those days equated to in todays terms. Hell, Moses lived to, what, 900+ years?

[MrsSmith]

I've always wondered if Adam's life was counted from creation, or from the time when death entered the world.  It would seem useless to count the passing time when there was no end in sight...  so how long did Adam and Eve live in the Garden before they sinned?  What was going on in the rest of the world all that time...especially since the animals were not eating each other?

[jendf]

I've been arguing that for a while now.

Of course, the problem with such an argument is that it's just as likely that the universe began last Tuesday as it is that the universe began 6000 or however many years ago.  Such a line of argument can be used to dispute the beginning of time being located at some specific point, but not to locate where that point should be.

With us? I don't paint any illusions about what I know about GOD, other than what I've read or learned in sermons....and researched myself. The Bible, itself, pretty much concludes that there is no concept of time in Heaven. GOD created the Heavens and the Earth in 6 days and rested on the 7th. There is no concept of what those days equated to in todays terms. Hell, Moses lived to, what, 900+ years?

You're thinking of Methuselah, I believe.

[djones520]

I've been arguing that for a while now.

Of course, the problem with such an argument is that it's just as likely that the universe began last Tuesday as it is that the universe began 6000 or however many years ago.  Such a line of argument can be used to dispute the beginning of time being located at some specific point, but not to locate where that point should be.

With us? I don't paint any illusions about what I know about GOD, other than what I've read or learned in sermons....and researched myself. The Bible, itself, pretty much concludes that there is no concept of time in Heaven. GOD created the Heavens and the Earth in 6 days and rested on the 7th. There is no concept of what those days equated to in todays terms. Hell, Moses lived to, what, 900+ years?

You're thinking of Methuselah, I believe.

Yeah.  I believe Moses lived till he was 120.  Noah on the other hand lived till he was 950.  According to the story, the span of human life greatly diminished after Noah.  But prior to Noah, during the Antediluvian age, humans lived from 700-950 years if the Bible is accurate.

[Mary Ann]

This whole subject really just annoys me.

I am a Christian. I have a personal relationship with Jesus Christ. Because of that, I know that I have eternal life. Nothing will ever separate me from God.

I also believe that the creation account in Genesis is allegorical. Genesis isn't about what God did, but about who God is. It is NOT a "how to" book. The Bible was written in a way that could be understood by all people, regardless of how unsophisticated or uneducated they are. "Let there be light" is a statement that anyone can understand, without knowing anything about physics. "God created man in His image" can be understood without knowing anything about biology, DNA, or even (gasp!) evolution. I believe that we are to accept that God is responsible for everything on earth, then get on with the rest of the Bible.

Some "fundies" have instead turned belief in a literal interpretation of Genesis into a litmus test for Christianity. That is a sad, sad mistake. It turns non-believers off. It makes ALL Christians appear rigid, a bit crazy, and well,--stupid.

When my (certifiably brilliant) son was in 4th or 5th grade, he spent a week at a Baptist Bible camp. When he mentioned that he didn't necessarily believe that God created the universe within a week's time a mere few thousand years ago, he was double-teamed by a couple of counselors who spent quite a bit of time lecturing, arguing, and browbeating this kid (while the other kids went swimming or something.) Now, some 15 years later, can you guess what my biology PhD candidate son feels about Christianity?? He is turned off. Sad. And unnecessary.

The whole creationism debate is the 21st century equivalent of "How many angels can dance on the head of a pin?" The answer, of course, is "Who cares?"

[franksolich]

Yeah.  I believe Moses lived till he was 120.  Noah on the other hand lived till he was 950.  According to the story, the span of human life greatly diminished after Noah.  But prior to Noah, during the Antediluvian age, humans lived from 700-950 years if the Bible is accurate.

My "take" on this is that language is limited and fallible, whereas God is Eternal and Almighty.

There is no way human language can encompass what God means

The English language, with a vocabulary of 400,000+ words, has the largest vocabulary in the world.

But yet the English language is limited; there are words in other languages that can't be described accurately in English.....and not just those other languages far removed from English, such as Japanese or Korean, but even those close to English, such as German or French.

The Bible is man's attempt to make God comprehensible.

But that which is finite cannot possibly describe That which is Infinite.

This is one of those areas in which Protestants and Catholics diverge, substantially, and I know I'm going to catch Hell from some here, but here it is--

Roman Catholics are taught, and reasonably so, that the Bible has meanings indecipherable to mere mortal man.  It's good to read it and all that, and to gain inspiration and insight from it, but to "understand" it is impossible.

Roman Catholics are secretly amused at Protestant attempts to understand the Book of Revelations, for example--when the Book of Revelations itself at the beginning states that what it describes is indecipherable to the human mind.  Right there in the Book of Revelations, it says that; don't even try to understand this.

But then there's lots and lots of Protestants running around trying to understand it.

I've never lost any sleep, for example, over the meaning of the Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse.

I've always looked at the Bible as the main source of Eternal Wisdom, but what it really means, well, I guess one has to pass out of this time and place into the Eternal time and place, to "understand" it.

[Mary Ann]

Yeah.  I believe Moses lived till he was 120.  Noah on the other hand lived till he was 950.  According to the story, the span of human life greatly diminished after Noah.  But prior to Noah, during the Antediluvian age, humans lived from 700-950 years if the Bible is accurate.

My "take" on this is that language is limited and fallible, whereas God is Eternal and Almighty.

There is no way human language can encompass what God means

The English language, with a vocabulary of 400,000+ words, has the largest vocabulary in the world.

But yet the English language is limited; there are words in other languages that can't be described accurately in English.....and not just those other languages far removed from English, such as Japanese or Korean, but even those close to English, such as German or French.

The Bible is man's attempt to make God comprehensible.

But that which is finite cannot possibly describe That which is Infinite.

This is one of those areas in which Protestants and Catholics diverge, substantially, and I know I'm going to catch Hell from some here, but here it is--

Roman Catholics are taught, and reasonably so, that the Bible has meanings indecipherable to mere mortal man.  It's good to read it and all that, and to gain inspiration and insight from it, but to "understand" it is impossible.

Roman Catholics are secretly amused at Protestant attempts to understand the Book of Revelations, for example--when the Book of Revelations itself at the beginning states that what it describes is indecipherable to the human mind.  Right there in the Book of Revelations, it says that; don't even try to understand this.

But then there's lots and lots of Protestants running around trying to understand it.

I've never lost any sleep, for example, over the meaning of the Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse.

I've always looked at the Bible as the main source of Eternal Wisdom, but what it really means, well, I guess one has to pass out of this time and place into the Eternal time and place, to "understand" it.

I am a lifelong Protestant, but I agree with much of what you've said. OTOH, I believe that the crux of the Bible, the true meat and bones, the most important thing is utterly clear: "Jesus said, '_I_ am the way, the truth, and the life; no one comes to the father but by _ME_.'"

Who can argue with that?

[franksolich]

I am a lifelong Protestant, but I agree with much of what you've said. OTOH, I believe that the crux of the Bible, the true meat and bones, the most important thing is utterly clear: "Jesus said, '_I_ am the way, the truth, and the life; no one comes to the father but by _ME_.'"

Who can argue with that?

Nobody can argue with that, Madam.

The Bible is Eternal Wisdom, not a textbook on the history of the world.

The Bible is meant to inspire, to give hope, to redeem.

[BlueStateSaint]

I am a lifelong Protestant, but I agree with much of what you've said. OTOH, I believe that the crux of the Bible, the true meat and bones, the most important thing is utterly clear: "Jesus said, '_I_ am the way, the truth, and the life; no one comes to the father but by _ME_.'"

Who can argue with that?

The DUmmies . . .

[Wineslob]

I am a lifelong Protestant, but I agree with much of what you've said. OTOH, I believe that the crux of the Bible, the true meat and bones, the most important thing is utterly clear: "Jesus said, '_I_ am the way, the truth, and the life; no one comes to the father but by _ME_.'"

Who can argue with that?

Nobody can argue with that, Madam.

The Bible is Eternal Wisdom, not a textbook on the history of the world.

The Bible is meant to inspire, to give hope, to redeem.

 

My main problem with creationists, is they have had to fake "proof" of man and dinosaurs living together.

[franksolich]

My main problem with creationists, is they have had to fake "proof" of man and dinosaurs living together.

Well, but to be honest though, the "scientific" community is known to, uh, fake things to justify their conclusions.

Again, that's why, for me, the origins of the eart--er, planet--and the origins of mankind aren't important, most of all because we'll never know. 

"Truth" is an amorphous blob squiggling this way and that way, always changing, never the same.

The only Undeniable and Unchanging Truth is God; all the rest is fallible man groping around in Darkness.