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Author Topic: Question for the lurkers. Chavez was for the poor?  (Read 5111 times)

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Offline Maxiest

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Question for the lurkers. Chavez was for the poor?
« on: March 06, 2013, 01:01:09 AM »
Quote
Born into a working-class family in Sabaneta, Barinas, Chávez became a career military officer, and after becoming dissatisfied with the Venezuelan political system, he founded the secretive Revolutionary Bolivarian Movement-200 (MBR-200) in the early 1980s to work towards overthrowing it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hugo_Ch%C3%A1vez

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Analyst estimates Chávez’s family fortune at around $2 billion

Criminal Justice International Associates (CJIA), a risk assessment and global analysis firm in Miami, estimated in a recent report that the Chávez Frías family in Venezuela has “amassed a fortune” similar to that of the Castro brothers in Cuba.

According to Jerry Brewer, president of CJIA, “the personal fortune of the Castro brothers has been estimated at a combined value of around $2 billion.”

“The Chávez Frías family in Venezuela has amassed a fortune of a similar scale since the arrival of Chávez to the presidency in 1999,” said Brewer in an analysis published in their website.

Brewer said that Cuba is receiving about $5 billion per year from the Venezuelan treasury and in oil shipments and other resources.

“We believe that organized bolivarian criminal groups within the Chávez administration have subtracted around $100 billion out of the nearly $1 trillion in oil income made by PDVSA since 1999.”

http://newsfromvenezuela.tumblr.com/post/867542155/analyst-estimates-chavezs-family-fortune-at-around-2

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GDP - per capita (PPP): $12,700 (2011 est.)
$12,500 (2010 est.)
$12,900 (2009 est.)
''

http://www.indexmundi.com/venezuela/gdp_per_capita_(ppp).html

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Unemployment around 12.1%

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_Venezuela

For a career military man and just born into a working class family he seems to have done well for himself while his people are #88 on the list of GDP - per capita.

Of course you DUmmies wouldn't' believe anything that smears your beloved communist and socialist leaders would you?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022465191

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Bjorn Against (7,796 posts)
6. I suspect the author is actually citing money that Chavez was redistributing to the people

Chavez nationalized the oil industry and redistributed the wealth to the people, my guess is the author is pretending like Chavez is keeping all the money for himself and totally ignoring where the money actually goes.

Yes, because out of the Trillions of Dollars the PDVSA made in the years he didn't get any of it did he?  The people got it...

Fools, all of you!

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Offline 98ZJUSMC

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Re: Question for the lurkers. Chavez was for the poor?
« Reply #1 on: March 06, 2013, 03:07:56 AM »
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Bjorn Against (7,796 posts)
6. I suspect the author is actually citing money that Chavez was redistributing to the people

Oh, but of course.....  :banghead:

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Offline txradioguy

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Re: Question for the lurkers. Chavez was for the poor?
« Reply #2 on: March 06, 2013, 03:11:34 AM »
My guess is that if they believe that lie...they also believe that someone purposefully infected Hugo with cancer.

DUmmies will believe anything to keep the lie of Communism and it's promised Utopia alive.
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Offline WinOne4TheGipper

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Re: Question for the lurkers. Chavez was for the poor?
« Reply #3 on: March 06, 2013, 07:40:28 AM »
Quote
Bjorn Against (7,796 posts)
6. I suspect the author is actually citing money that Chavez was redistributing to the people

He redistributed it to the people all right.  The people named Hugo Chavez.
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Offline Rebel

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Re: Question for the lurkers. Chavez was for the poor?
« Reply #4 on: March 06, 2013, 07:46:49 AM »
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Bjorn Against (7,796 posts)

6. I suspect the author is actually citing money that Chavez was redistributing to the people

Of course he did. Look at these lavish dwellings:



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There's a reason why patriotism is considered a conservative value. Watch a Tea Party rally and you'll see people proudly raising the American flag and showing pride in U.S. heroes such as Thomas Jefferson. Watch an OWS rally and you'll see people burning the American flag while showing pride in communist heroes such as Che Guevera. --Bob, from some news site

Offline JohnnyReb

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Re: Question for the lurkers. Chavez was for the poor?
« Reply #5 on: March 06, 2013, 08:23:47 AM »
Quote from: Rebel on March 06, 2013, 07:46:49 AM
Of course he did. Look at these lavish dwellings:





MAN! Just look at all those lavish condos. Are the poor people fat too?
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Offline Wineslob

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Re: Question for the lurkers. Chavez was for the poor?
« Reply #6 on: March 06, 2013, 10:02:03 AM »
Quote
Bjorn Against (7,796 posts)
6. I suspect the author is actually citing money that Chavez was redistributing to the people

Chavez nationalized the oil industry and redistributed the wealth to the people, my guess is the author is pretending like Chavez is keeping all the money for himself and totally ignoring where the money actually goes



Sounds like what Obummer is trying to do, shit-stain.
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Offline Dori

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Re: Question for the lurkers. Chavez was for the poor?
« Reply #7 on: March 06, 2013, 10:14:45 AM »
Quote from: txradioguy on March 06, 2013, 03:11:34 AM
DUmmies will believe anything to keep the lie of Communism and it's promised Utopia alive.

Chavez confiscated large privately owned farms and what resulted was food shortages and rationing. 

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Offline Rebel

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Re: Question for the lurkers. Chavez was for the poor?
« Reply #8 on: March 06, 2013, 10:17:12 AM »
Quote from: Dori on March 06, 2013, 10:14:45 AM
Chavez confiscated large privately owned farms and what resulted was food shortages and rationing. 



Idiots like the Progs never learn from history. Mugabe did the same thing. Now they're starving.
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There's a reason why patriotism is considered a conservative value. Watch a Tea Party rally and you'll see people proudly raising the American flag and showing pride in U.S. heroes such as Thomas Jefferson. Watch an OWS rally and you'll see people burning the American flag while showing pride in communist heroes such as Che Guevera. --Bob, from some news site

Offline JohnnyReb

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Re: Question for the lurkers. Chavez was for the poor?
« Reply #9 on: March 06, 2013, 10:19:00 AM »
Chavez was for the poor.....that's why he made so many people poor and the poor poorer.
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“The American people will never knowingly adopt socialism. But, under the name of ‘liberalism’, they will adopt every fragment of the socialist program, until one day America will be a socialist nation, without knowing how it happened.” - Norman Thomas, U.S. Socialist Party presidential candidate 1940, 1944 and 1948

"America is like a healthy body and its resistance is threefold: its patriotism, its morality, and its spiritual life. If we can undermine these three areas, America will collapse from within."  Stalin

Offline Dori

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Re: Question for the lurkers. Chavez was for the poor?
« Reply #10 on: March 06, 2013, 10:25:09 AM »
Quote from: Rebel on March 06, 2013, 10:17:12 AM
Idiots like the Progs never learn from history. Mugabe did the same thing. Now they're starving.

Venezuela went from producing their own food to having to import 70% of it.

Why don't DUmmies ever read the news? 
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Offline Ptarmigan

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Re: Question for the lurkers. Chavez was for the poor?
« Reply #11 on: March 06, 2013, 10:30:37 AM »
Venezuela was one of the more prosperous and stable Latin American nations. Chavez ruined it.
« Last Edit: March 06, 2013, 10:33:15 AM by Ptarmigan »
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Offline Ballygrl

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Re: Question for the lurkers. Chavez was for the poor?
« Reply #12 on: March 06, 2013, 10:31:55 AM »
This comment was posted to a NY Times article on Chavez, I think it says it all:

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I suppose we should all cheer that Mr. Chavez has left his family an estate of over $2 billion dollars - you see the dirty little secret is Hugo understood capitalism very well when it came to building his own personal fortune. Not a bad run for a socialist dictator who has only been in power since 1999. It's one of the perks of running a socialist regime - check in on the Castro Bros. in Cuba; they too are well-healed.

In both instances, these regimes have exploited the common man to believe that less is more and that only the government can be your protector.
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Offline thundley4

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Re: Question for the lurkers. Chavez was for the poor?
« Reply #13 on: March 06, 2013, 10:33:05 AM »
Quote from: JohnnyReb on March 06, 2013, 10:19:00 AM
Chavez was for the poor.....that's why he made so many people poor and the poor poorer.

That is what Obama is doing, too.
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Offline Chris_

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Re: Question for the lurkers. Chavez was for the poor?
« Reply #14 on: March 06, 2013, 10:34:02 AM »
Chavez liked the poor so much, he made millions more of them.
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Offline Ballygrl

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Re: Question for the lurkers. Chavez was for the poor?
« Reply #15 on: March 06, 2013, 10:35:00 AM »
And another good comment:

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Chavez was not a well-read soldier, and he was not a very intelligent person. His understanding of socialism is pathetic, though his bluster made up for his misunderstandings. He led an ignorant people, for only the ignorant can follow the ignorant, or the demagogues, who want power, not understanding. The proof of all this is the condition of Caracas: it is the cime capital of the whole world, it is drowning in filth, its jails are repositories of all kinds of misuses of force, its understructure is in peril, and, worst of all, the people do not realize that this is going on. They do not have the perspective to see themselves as others see them, nor to correct what needs correcting.

It is not enought to correct what needed correcting in the past, like the neglect of the poor; the real thing is to come up with a plan for all Venezuelans to achieve security, justice, and freedom from demagoguery and misleading information --- like the expelling of US consulate personnel, that to all people the world over is seen as what it is, pure demagoguery. But the people have no way of knowing this, since they rely on the truth of those who have no compunction about misleading them.

I was born in Venezuela, in Caracas, which was a beautiful and safe city up till about twenty years ago. Surely, the poor people needed upgrading, but not at the expense of their minds and their freedom and their safety.
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Offline Ballygrl

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Re: Question for the lurkers. Chavez was for the poor?
« Reply #16 on: March 06, 2013, 10:35:53 AM »
Quote from: Chris_ on March 06, 2013, 10:34:02 AM
Chavez liked the poor so much, he made millions more of them.

The goal of socialists and regressives, misery for all!
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Offline Ballygrl

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Re: Question for the lurkers. Chavez was for the poor?
« Reply #17 on: March 06, 2013, 10:40:01 AM »
And another good comment, does this sound familiar?

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The incredible naiveté shown on this board by those Americans who have never lived in a communist/marxist/socialist dictatorship simply boggles the mind. Saying Chavez was the best thing that happened to Venezuelans is plain arrogant and always goes back to the "Yankee Imperialist we know what's good for you Latin Americans" mentality that Chavez and his minions railed against.

1). Chavez's "Oil-ialism" was a busted model from the start. While he may have made some poor people's lives a bit easier, the model was/is unsustainable in the long run. What will happen when the government is unable to continue to pay people not to work and people will not be able to insert themselves into an economy that is in shambles. Chavez's model of wealth redistribution has not worked and we saw the tragic end to that "experiment" 23 years ago.

2). Chavez was a democratically elected DICTATOR. When you change the constitution to suit your needs; when you use the same constitution to allow for your perpetual election; when you govern by decree; when you suppress a supposedly independent judiciary and throw judges in jail because they will not bow to your whims; when you confiscate property indiscriminately; when you close TV stations and newspapers simply because they irritate you and dare question you and think unlike your "revolutionary" ideals; when you label those that collaborated with you, but now differ from you and you label them "traitors"….what are you?
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Offline Dori

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Re: Question for the lurkers. Chavez was for the poor?
« Reply #18 on: March 06, 2013, 10:49:35 AM »
Quote from: Ballygrl on March 06, 2013, 10:40:01 AM
And another good comment, does this sound familiar?


Sadly yes....all those comments you posted sound all too familiar.  :(

If Obama is successful in flipping the House in 2014, what do you think he has planned for his last two years with both houses?


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Offline Rebel

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Re: Question for the lurkers. Chavez was for the poor?
« Reply #19 on: March 06, 2013, 10:55:49 AM »
Quote from: Dori on March 06, 2013, 10:25:09 AM
Venezuela went from producing their own food to having to import 70% of it.

Why don't DUmmies ever read the news?  

Because their ideology trumps all. They're so beholden to Marxism that they've spent a century trying to make it work, while destroying everything they touched. See Detroit. That's exactly what they want for the rest of us.
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There's a reason why patriotism is considered a conservative value. Watch a Tea Party rally and you'll see people proudly raising the American flag and showing pride in U.S. heroes such as Thomas Jefferson. Watch an OWS rally and you'll see people burning the American flag while showing pride in communist heroes such as Che Guevera. --Bob, from some news site

Offline Ballygrl

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Re: Question for the lurkers. Chavez was for the poor?
« Reply #20 on: March 06, 2013, 11:11:35 AM »
Per Rush, a comment made by a Venezuelan citizen

"who will take care of us now"?

And the left actually thinks dependence is better then self sufficiency?
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Offline GOBUCKS

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Re: Question for the lurkers. Chavez was for the poor?
« Reply #21 on: March 06, 2013, 11:17:11 AM »
Quote
I was born in Venezuela, in Caracas, which was a beautiful and safe city up till about twenty years ago.

I was last in Caracas two or three years before Yugo. My number one recollection is the thousands of huts clinging to the mountainside across the highway from the airport.

The mass of tar paper shacks was so steep and so jumbled up, there's no way they could have had electricity or running water.

Every square inch not taken by a shack was covered in trash and garbage.

The shacks at lower elevation had trash from their higher-up neighbors on their roofs.

I'm sure sewage was handled the same way.

In other words, it was a pretty typical Latin American neighborhood.
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Offline Rebel

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Re: Question for the lurkers. Chavez was for the poor?
« Reply #22 on: March 06, 2013, 12:29:21 PM »
Quote from: GOBUCKS on March 06, 2013, 11:17:11 AM
I was last in Caracas two or three years before Yugo. My number one recollection is the thousands of huts clinging to the mountainside across the highway from the airport.

The mass of tar paper shacks was so steep and so jumbled up, there's no way they could have had electricity or running water.

Every square inch not taken by a shack was covered in trash and garbage.

The shacks at lower elevation had trash from their higher-up neighbors on their roofs.

I'm sure sewage was handled the same way.

In other words, it was a pretty typical Latin American neighborhood.

...and it's still like that. Only Chavez's estate is now worth 2 billion. Have-not leftists are such ****ing idiots. DUmbasses would be in the same boat. ...oh....wait...they are. How has our national debt hurt Obama's vacations? Buffett's billions? Soros' billions? Yet we hear every day one of the DUmbasses complain about being laid off, etc.
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There's a reason why patriotism is considered a conservative value. Watch a Tea Party rally and you'll see people proudly raising the American flag and showing pride in U.S. heroes such as Thomas Jefferson. Watch an OWS rally and you'll see people burning the American flag while showing pride in communist heroes such as Che Guevera. --Bob, from some news site

Offline Maxiest

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Re: Question for the lurkers. Chavez was for the poor?
« Reply #23 on: March 06, 2013, 12:31:26 PM »
Quote from: Rebel on March 06, 2013, 12:29:21 PM
...and it's still like that. Only Chavez's estate is now worth 2 billion. Have-not leftists are such ****ing idiots. DUmbasses would be in the same boat. ...oh....wait...they are. How has our national debt hurt Obama's vacations? Buffett's billions? Soros' billions? Yet we hear every day one of the DUmbasses complain about being laid off, etc.

But that is all Bush's and the rethugs fault.  Gosh you are shallow.  [DUmode /off]
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Offline Karin

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Re: Question for the lurkers. Chavez was for the poor?
« Reply #24 on: March 06, 2013, 12:32:47 PM »
In the one thread that raised this billionaire question, all the DUmmies deny it, mock the source, or give it the relativism to Saudis treatment.

Quote
Response to Nye Bevan (Original post)
Wed Mar 6, 2013, 09:23 AM
 Robb (37,196 posts)
30. It's either not true, or he deserved it.

Take your pick, apparently.  

Then someone posted this photo of the house of one of Yugo's pals:



Killed the thread.

DUmbasses, wake the **** up.  
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