DUmmy Taverner And Assorted DUmp Experts Discuss Firearms

[GOBUCKS]

DUmmy Taverner demonstrates that a nodding, semi-comatose heroin addict is not what you'd call a firearms expert:

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 02:01 PM
Taverner (51,200 posts)

A shotgun is all you really need for home defense

Seriously - it sprays shot so you shouldn't need a semi auto

It's easy to use, powerful enough, but needs to be reloaded after 2 shots

Statistics show whomever gets the first two shots in usually wins the gun battle

Just sayin

Nobody needs all of this military grade weaponry

Nobody needs a personal armory

 http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022060645

DUmmy Taverner is joined on the thread with a series of other DUmp firearms experts.

DUmp expert number one:

Response to Taverner (Reply #9)
Sun Dec 23, 2012, 02:12 PM
ElbarDee (43 posts)
11. Don't they make automatic shotguns too?

 
DUmp expert number two:

Response to ElbarDee (Reply #11)
Sun Dec 23, 2012, 02:33 PM
rhett o rick (23,698 posts)
27. Semi-automatics. But the recoil prevents one from shooting very quickly.

And the magazine only carries approx 6 to 8 shells.

 


DUmp expert number three:

Response to Taverner (Reply #9)
Sun Dec 23, 2012, 02:18 PM
JaneyVee (1,768 posts)
16. Especially in your own home where you know all the best hiding spots.

The sound of a shotgun cocking may actually result in no violence. If you caught burglar off guard you could literally hold him/her in place until cops arrive. It's hard to miss with a shotgun at somewhat close range so the burglar may rationalize that its better to get arrested than shot with a (legally registered) shotgun.

DUmp expert number four:

Response to Jackpine Radical (Reply #26)
Sun Dec 23, 2012, 03:15 PM
Travis_0004 (686 posts)
You can't take a shotgun, and cut off the barrel, and stock, but if you made a new shotgun, you could make it without a buttstock and with a short grip.

Below is a gun available for sale:

Uhhhm, DUmmy, that's not a shotgun.

Response to Taverner (Original post)
Sun Dec 23, 2012, 02:04 PM
 Sherman A1 (10,026 posts)
3. Well,

I would think a can of wasp & hornet spray would suffice. It has a range of about 20 feet which would cover most rooms or hallways and costs about $5.00.

 

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 04:17 PM
OneTenthofOnePercent (5,708 posts)
Here's something to think about the line of reasoning that "shotguns" are OK but semi-auto "paramilitary" rifles aren't...

I have semi-auto ARs. I have a semiauto AKs. I even have REAL Full Auto submachine guns. Of all the guns in my collection from benign to scary, you know what I keep readied for home defense if something goes bump in the night? A shotgun. And not because ot's somehow socially more appealing... because shotguns destroy the shit out of pretty much everything.

I'm not sure how the OP can rationalize that shotguns are somehow more socially safer/better... they aren't.
If you want to put and end to whatever situation inside of 30 yards, nothing beats a shotgun.

It's because the OP is a junkie.


DUmmy Taverner has chased away burglars, but not for several hours of nod-time after a fix:

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 03:31 PM
Taverner (51,200 posts)
48. Keep in mind I am not advocating everyone run out and buy a shotgun

I don't want a gun, and if you don't want one don't get one

Guns aren't the best for home defense - I have chased burglars away twice just by pulling a Han Solo and running and screaming at them

[Jasonw560]

I'm just.......I can't.......I mean........

Just. Wow.

[FiddyBeowulf]

Response to Jackpine Radical (Reply #26)
Sun Dec 23, 2012, 03:15 PM
Travis_0004 (686 posts)
You can't take a shotgun, and cut off the barrel, and stock, but if you made a new shotgun, you could make it without a buttstock and with a short grip.

Below is a gun available for sale:
*pic of mares leg style firearm*

Uhhhm, DUmmy, that's not a shotgun.

They do make .410 shotguns in that style.

As far as racking the slide of a shotgun to scare a criminal away, that is just stupid. Not "use bug spray" stupid but close. 

[Airwolf]

Taverner and Gnads both need to have their computers taken away. They don't need them and they sure as Hell can't post one single thing on-line of any consequence so they should give them up.  That much stupid in one thread should cause a lot of pain but like the dinosaurs they take forever to feel it. Another thing, Yes you can miss with a shotgun I have seen it myself when standing next to the guy on a military range after we heard him bragged about how good he was with a shotgun. At 25 meters his first shot left three pellets in the lower right corner of the man sized target. We all were shooting 00 buck rounds and if you cant hit with that at that range your sucking buttermilk.

[Skul]

It hurts to read such ignorant BS as that. 
I wish the DUmmies wouldn't post crap that they know nothing about.
SOP on the island.

[Tucker]

Response to ElbarDee (Reply #11)
Sun Dec 23, 2012, 02:33 PM
rhett o rick (23,698 posts)
27. Semi-automatics. But the recoil prevents one from shooting very quickly.

And the magazine only carries approx 6 to 8 shells.

My Remington 1100 is set up for 3 gun. It has a 10 round extension tube, making it 10+1.

Response to Jackpine Radical (Reply #26)
Sun Dec 23, 2012, 03:15 PM
Travis_0004 (686 posts)
You can't take a shotgun, and cut off the barrel, and stock, but if you made a new shotgun, you could make it without a buttstock and with a short grip.

Below is a gun available for sale:

You go ahead and do that. I'm sure that the ATFe would love to visit you and set you up with new living arrangements. 10 years sounds about right.

This was released earlier this year. It's a 12 gauge.



http://www.raacfirearms.com/index.php3?pageid=AkdalProducts.htm

[youtube=425,350]/atMEE_HDQnA[/youtube]

[WinOne4TheGipper]

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 03:31 PM
Taverner (51,200 posts)
48. Keep in mind I am not advocating everyone run out and buy a shotgun

I don't want a gun, and if you don't want one don't get one

Guns aren't the best for home defense - I have chased burglars away twice just by pulling a Han Solo and running and screaming at them

Now that would be funny if the next burglar turns out to be armed.

[WinOne4TheGipper]

They do make .410 shotguns in that style.

As far as racking the slide of a shotgun to scare a criminal away, that is just stupid. Not "use bug spray" stupid but close. 

Come on.  "Use bug spray" is genius compared to "run and scream at them".

[NHSparky]

Taverner--that's only because you were more doped up than they were.

And no, racking the slide is for idiots, until you put the SECOND round in the chamber.  BTW--what do you do if more than two people break into your house, dipshits?  And finally, shotguns, while nice, aren't infinite.  9-10 00-buck slugs per round ain't as many as you might think, especially if you miss or only hit your target with 1-2 of them.

Finally, wasp spray?  Yeah, I'd love to see you hit someone 20 feet away right out of the gate before they plug your ass.  You keep your Raid.  I'll keep my Remington.

[Mr Mannn]

Before I let liberals limit what I can use to defend myself...
maybe they could start by limiting what the criminals will use against me.

Criminals who rape and murder never seem to bother liberals as much as the law abiding man who dares to defend himself.

[zeitgeist]

It is Christmas and in the spirit of the season I am posting what may in fact be one of the year's few rational gun posts at the DUmp.

Bear in mind the post is fair and balanced, the responses?  You will have to go look for yourself I will not derail this thread with their nonsense.

http://upload.democraticunderground.com/10022067188

Deep13 (36,036 posts)

keeping our gun terms straight, list of definitions
Last edited Mon Dec 24, 2012, 05:33 PM USA/ET - Edit history (1)

We are finally having a serious national debate on gun control, so it is important that we get our terms straight. This is not an argument one way or another, just a list of terms.

automatic, "full auto"
This is a firearm that shoots continuously when the trigger is depressed, one round after another, until the trigger is released or it runs out of ammunition. These are considered "machine guns" under Federal law and highly regulated and almost nonexistent in the civilian market. "Rounds per minute" ratings refer to full auto only. Examples include mounted machine guns, military grade M16s, M4s, AK47s, and submachine guns like the Thompson and Uzi.

semi-automatic, "auto-loading"
This is a firearm that shoots ONCE when the trigger is depressed and then loads the next round automatically. One must depress the trigger for each round fired--no continuous shooting. Examples include most handguns, civilian AR-15s, and AK variants, but also many sporting rifles and pistols. There are a few semi-auto shotguns out there too. "Automatic" in the context of a handgun means "semi-automatic." Many of the lowest cost and most common .22s are semi-auto because their construction is less expensive than bolt or lever actions.

bolt, lever, or pump action
“Action” refers to the way spent cases are ejected and new rounds are loaded. Bolt has a handle at the breech, where the cartridges are loaded near back of the barrel. When moved back by hand, the empty case is ejected. A new case is loaded when one pushes the bolt forward again. With a lever or cowboy style action one uses a lever, usually in the shape of a loop, located behind the trigger for the same purpose. Lever action rifles and shotguns are mechanically complex and expensive. With a pump, it is the same thing except the hand grip is the fore end of the shotgun (usually) or rifle (rarely). It slides forward and backward to change rounds.

handgun or pistol
Any hand-held (no shoulder stock) firearm with a barrel less than 16". Automatic pistols use the recoil of the previous shot to load the next round into the chamber for firing. They feed from a detachable magazine. Revolvers are an older design that includes a chamber for each round in a rotating, metal cylinder. Finger pressure on the trigger advances the next round into firing position. Handguns use pistol ammunition, which is short and blunt, especially for automatics where they must fit in the handle. Example, .38 Sp., .357 mag., .44 mag. for revolvers and .45acp, 9mm para., .40 S&W for auto-loaders.

rifle
Technically it is any firearm with grooved channels cut into the inside of the barrel in a spiral pattern to make the bullet spin in flight, including pistols, muskets, cannons, and shotguns. In common parlance, however, and under Federal law, it is a shoulder-mounted firearm that shoots single bullets (not a shotgun) with a barrel greater than 16". Includes military and civilian guns. Proper rifles shoot rifle bullets, which tend to be long and often pointed. Examples include .30-06, .22-250, and .30-30.

carbine
A short rifle, some of which shoot pistol ammunition.

barrel
The metal tube where bullets are accelerated from expanding gas. Federal classification often depends on the length of the barrel.

chamber
The space for the unfired round behind the barrel, ready for shooting.

machine gun
Under Federal law, it is any firearm capable of automatic fire. Historically, it refers to a mounted firearm capable of automatically shooting rifle bullets or special, large caliber machine gun bullets like .50 BMG. Machine guns are strictly regulated by Federal law and almost no civilians have them.

submachine gun
A hand or shoulder mounted automatic firearm that shoots pistol ammunition. Examples include Thompson (Tommy gun), UZI, and MP5.

shotgun
A firearm capable of shooting a number of small pellets at once. Pellet size differs among game animals ranging from very small raven pellets to relatively large 0-0 buck pellets or a single slug projectile. Generally, the larger and more dangerous the intended target, the larger and fewer the projectiles will be. Shotguns can be single shot, double shot (2 barrels), pump, lever, or semiautomatic. Shotguns and their ammunition are described in terms of gauge rather than caliber, with the large 12-gauge being the most typical.

assault rifle
A lightweight, high-capacity, short rifle capable of firing either full or semi-auto (select fire) and using shortened rifle ammunition such as 5.56mm, 7.62 Russian, or 7.62 NATO. Examples include the M16, M4, and AK47. Civilian grade (i.e., not as tough as military specifications) semi-auto only versions are NOT assault rifles, even if they look just like their military counterparts.

battle rifle
These are full sized, long rifles that take full-length rifle ammunition. They are rugged for military use and can be bolt action, semi-auto or full auto depending on when they were first issued. The USA’s main battle rifle in W.W.I was the 1903 bolt-action Springfield in .30-06. In W.W.II, it was the semi-auto M-1 Garand Springfield also in .30-06.

assault weapon
This is a term created by legislators and the news media to refer to high-capacity, military-style firearms. As it has no historic meaning, the definition is whatever the legislative authority says it is. Under the 1994 Federal Assault Weapons Ban, any semiautomatic firearm with a detachable magazine holding more than 10 rounds of ammunition was an “assault weapon.” It also greatly restricted certain accessories that Members of Congress felt were of military rather than sporting purposes. These included flash-hiders, folding stocks, and bayonets. These rules applied to any firearm regardless of caliber or basic configuration. So a high-capacity AR-15 was not allowed and neither were pistols or .22s with detachable magazines holding more than 10 rounds.

high capacity magazine
This refers to the number of rounds that a detachable magazine can hold. Be aware that not all guns use detachable magazines. There are two ways of defining this term.
The first is to apply an across the board capacity, say ten rounds, to all magazines regardless of model or caliber. Anything in excess of that is high capacity. The 1994 Federal AWB defined any magazine capable of holding more than ten rounds as high capacity and illegal for civilians. So, all auto-pistols, sporting .22s, and Ar15s were limited to 10 rounds.
The other method is to define it from the manufacturer’s perspective. Firearms are designed to hold a certain number of rounds. Those are normal capacity. Magazines that exceed those amounts are high capacity, because they exceed what is normal for that gun. The Ruger 10/22 rimfire rifle comes with a 10-round magazine that fits flush with the stock. The rifle was designed around that magazine, which is, therefore, normal for that gun. Ruger also makes a 25-round banana clip for it that sticks out of the stock several inches. It works fine, but it completely changes the ergonomics of the rifle. The 25-rounder is, therefore, high capacity.
Since many pistols are designed to hold in excess of 15 rounds and AR15s typically use 30-round magazines, gun control proponents tend to prefer the across-the-board limit rather than allowing “assault weapons” to continue using their “normal” magazines.

caliber
The diameter of either the bullet or the gun barrel expressed as decimal fractions of an inch, .38 sp, .223 Rem, .45 ACP. The letters that follow the number indicate inventing company (.308 Win for Winchester) or some specific characteristic (.357 magnum, meaning large). By convention, .36 caliber bullets are referred to as .38 as in the cases of .38 Special, .38 Super Automatic, or .380acp. If the caliber has a pair of numbers, it refers to year of first production (.30-06 from 1906) or case capacity (.45-70 for 70 grains of black gunpowder). Caliber can also be expressed in millimeters such as 7mm Mauser. If the millimeter caliber has two numbers, the second one is the length of the case. For example 9x19, a.k.a. 9mm parabellum, a.k.a. 9mm Lugar should not be confused with 9x17. Sometimes the same cartridge has inch sizes in the USA and millimeter sizes in Europe, for example .380acp and 9x17, a.k.a. 9mm Kurtz are the same round.

cartridge
In modern parlance “cartridge” implicitly means “metallic cartridge” and refers to the shell case, primer, smokeless gunpowder, and bullet all as a single unit. Sometimes they are generically called “rounds” as are plain bullets. Primers are either center fire with a priming cap in the center of the base of the casing. Otherwise they are rimfire with the priming material (mercury fulminate) around the rim of the case. Center fire is highly reliable. Rimfire is less so, but inexpensive and is reserved for very small calibers.

bullet
The projectile part of the cartridge. They are usually made of lead, though other materials are available, and covered with a copper coating. They come in a variety of shapes for various purposes.

.22LR or just “twenty-two”
0.22 Long Rifle, for rifles and handguns, is the single most common and least expensive cartridge in the world. They consist of a quarter inch wide lead slug, sometimes with a copper coating (not an actual copper jacket) at the end of a ½” copper case. To reduce costs, they are rimfire. They are slow, not powerful, and have limited accuracy. They also have very limited lethality making them unsuitable for most crimes or self defense. One can kill with a .22, but not easily. Due to their low cost, low recoil, and low noise, however, they are a favorite for recreational shooters, Olympic target shooters (the biathalon is .22), juvenile training, and very small game. The vast majority of rimfire ammunition is .22LR (there are some others) and it is its own category of ammunition (handgun, rifle, shotgun, rimfire).

 

[dutch508]

Now that would be funny if the next burglar turns out to be armed.

Han Solo had a gun.



Bitch, Please. Make my day.

[Tucker]

Han Solo had a gun.



Bitch, Please. Make my day.

Solo had a blaster.  He would scrootch aliens and storm troopers.

[BlueStateSaint]

It is Christmas and in the spirit of the season I am posting what may in fact be one of the year's few rational gun posts at the DUmp.

Bear in mind the post is fair and balanced, the responses?  You will have to go look for yourself I will not derail this thread with their nonsense.

http://upload.democraticunderground.com/10022067188

What a bunch of whiny pussies . . . I sincerely apologize to all female genitalia everywhere for that comparison . . . in that thread.  Though, I know that there's a couple of C. cristata examples in that thread.

[Mr Mannn]

Han Solo had a gun.

And he shot FIRST!

[Texacon]

No one NEEDS a computer. No one NEEDS high speed Internet. No one NEEDS a cell phone yet ... All these things are freely given by extorting money from the tax payers of this country.

Following DUmmie logic of "you can get any gun you want with no restrictions..."

We GIVE disability to any who simply ask and they can even get fully automatic disability with no problems. IE direct deposit so you don't even need to leave home. Honestly I don't know why I work.

KC

[Texacon]

Taverner--that's only because you were more doped up than they were.

And no, racking the slide is for idiots, until you put the SECOND round in the chamber.  BTW--what do you do if more than two people break into your house, dipshits?  And finally, shotguns, while nice, aren't infinite.  9-10 00-buck slugs per round ain't as many as you might think, especially if you miss or only hit your target with 1-2 of them.

Finally, wasp spray?  Yeah, I'd love to see you hit someone 20 feet away right out of the gate before they plug your ass.  You keep your Raid.  I'll keep my Remington.

Sparky you forget that ALL the DUmp monkeys are expert marksmen. Even those who only went to the range once were superb their first time out therefore never needed to return.

KC

[jukin]

I even have REAL Full Auto submachine guns

Surrrrrrrrrrrrrrre you do. I doubt any DUmmy has the money to get the license much less the full-auto weapon itself. Maybe it modified the sear which is quite illegal. So I will go with the tried and true, DUmmy lie. They lie all the time.

As to all of the wrong things DUches think they know....well it could fill all of the Smithsonian museums.

[GOBUCKS]

Deep13 (36,036 posts)

keeping our gun terms straight, list of definitions

We are finally having a serious national debate on gun control, so it is important that we get our terms straight. This is not an argument one way or another, just a list of terms.

bolt, lever, or pump action
“Action” refers to the way spent cases are ejected and new rounds are loaded. Bolt has a handle at the breech, where the cartridges are loaded near back of the barrel. When moved back by hand, the empty case is ejected. A new case is loaded when one pushes the bolt forward again. With a lever or
 cowboy ...blah, blah, blah, wikipedia copy-and-paste blah...
 
Any hand-held (no shoulder stock) firearm with a barrel less than 16". Automatic pistols use the recoil of the previous shot to load the next round into the chamber for firing. They feed from a detachable magazine. Revolvers are an older design that includes a chamber for each round in a rotating, metal cylinder. Finger pressure on the trigger advances the next round into firing position. Handguns use pistol ammunition, which is short and blunt, especially for automatics where they must fit in the handle. Example, .38 Sp., .357 mag., .44 mag. for revolvers and .45acp, 9mm para., .40 S&W for auto-loaders.

rifle
Technically it is any firearm with grooved channels cut into the inside of the barrel in a spiral pattern to make the bullet spin in flight, including pistols,

...blah, blah, blah, wikipedia

high capacity magazine
This refers to the number of rounds that a detachable magazine can hold. Be aware that not all guns use detachable magazines. There are two ways of defining this term.
The first is to apply an across the board capacity, say ten rounds, to all magazines regardless of model or caliber. Anything in excess of that is high capacity. The 1994 Federal AWB defined any magazine capable of holding more than ten rounds as high capacity and illegal for civilians. So, all auto-pistols, sporting .22s, and Ar15s were limited to 10 rounds.

blah, blah, blah.....

The .22LR or just “twenty-two”
0.22 Long Rifle, for rifles and handguns, is the single most common and least expensive cartridge in the world. They consist of a quarter inch wide lead slug, sometimes with a copper coating (not an actual copper jacket) at the end of a ½” copper case. To reduce costs, they are rimfire. They are slow, not powerful, and have limited accuracy. They also have very limited lethality making them unsuitable for most crimes or self defense. One can kill with a .22, but not easily. Due to their low cost, low recoil, and low noise, however, they are a favorite for recreational shooters, Olympic target shooters (the biathalon is .22), juvenile training, and very small game. The vast majority of rimfire ammunition is .22LR (there are some others) and it is its own category of ammunition (handgun, rifle, shotgun, rimfire).

It is so funny to think that a DUmpmonkey with over thirty-six thousand DUmp posts would know anything whatever about firearms!

In his copy and paste marathon he demonstrated that he cannot even spell "riffle". He wrote it several times, leaving out the second "f".

I expect the crazy bald dyslexic dwarf to show up and correct that error.

[Airwolf]

Before I let liberals limit what I can use to defend myself...
maybe they could start by limiting what the criminals will use against me.

Criminals who rape and murder never seem to bother liberals as much as the law abiding man who dares to defend himself.

Its funny how they stick up for rapist,child molesters and murderers of cops but let one law abiding gun owner have something more then an old muzzleloader if anything at all and they freak like they have seen a spider in the house.