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Offline franksolich

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primitive finds interview question discriminating
« on: March 10, 2012, 04:08:53 PM »
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1119113

Oh my.

How the woes pile up in this 0bamaconomy.

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Sabayon65 (18 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore

Is an employer allowed to ask if you're a U.S. citizen?

I know they can't ask questions about an applicant’s race or ethnic origin (like what country are you from). I know they can't ask if you're married or single, or about orientation. You also aren't supposed to ask about religion.

At a recent interview the interviewer asked if I was an American citizen not once but three times. The job posting didn't say anything about being required to be a US citizen. If I don't get the job do I have a recourse to file a discrimination complaint?

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earthside (3,662 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore

1. I hope so.

The other relevant question, if a person is not a citizen, would be if that person is here legally.

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dmallind (8,903 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore

2. Usually not quite is the answer

They not only can but must ask you to prove you are legally eligible to work here, but not at the interview stage.

Some jobs are citizen-only such as most police departments and those requiring access to sensitive information like government contractors. If the company sold things to the DoD. even if you did not require a security clearance, some relatively innocuous communication is citizen-only.

Here's a good link.

http://www.uscis.gov/portal/site/uscis/menuitem.eb1d4c2a3e5b9ac89243c6a7543f6d1a/?vgnextoid=439a7f5c13f2e210VgnVCM100000082ca60aRCRD&vgnextchannel=439a7f5c13f2e210VgnVCM100000082ca60aRCRD

BTW how did you respond?

In any event I suspect a lawsuit is a nonstarter without more overt bias. I've been asked that question myself in interviews and it's possible they asked everyone.

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Sabayon65 (18 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore

3. I told them I was a citizen.

I told them I was a citizen. I was born here and have never set for on the soil of any foreign country besides Canada. And that was on a school field trip, back in the day when you could basically walk across on foot.

I can understand them needing to make sure all people are here legally, and asking once would have been fine. Two times, might not have been that suspicious, but three times in the space of a 30 minute interview was kind of pushing it in my opinion.

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dmallind (8,903 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore

4. It's certainly weird yes. Would it be too personal to ask why they might have?

Do you look or sound unusual for where you live? If so and they obly DID ask you thet might make a claim more feasible, but still think it's a stretch. IANAL btw, but a many-times interviewer and -ee with relevant rules sedulously drilled into me by more scrupulous employers than your example may be.

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Sabayon65 (18 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore

5. I have a hyphenated/foreign sounding last name.

Then again, there are a lot of Latino people in my neighborhood as well. The company However, I am not Latino, and neither of my names is of Spanish origin (one is Central/East European, the other is East Asian).

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dmallind (8,903 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore

8. Hmm. If you could somehow find out if they asked others the same q

It would be very interesting and certainly make at least some avenues possible if they did not.

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EgaLitE (9 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore

6. It's not discrimination just because you didn't get the job

It sounds like you belong to two of the most privileged groups in the country, maybe more if you're a heterosexual male. Maybe you're just upset that you didn't get the job, but there's no reason for this to be called discrimination. Also, it wouldn't be right to assume that Latinos aren't citizens, or to not believe them if they said that they were.

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Sabayon65 (18 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore

7. I never said it was

So it's not right to assume that Latinos aren't citizens, but it's fine to ask anyone else not just once, but multiple times (implying disbelief), if he's a citizen?

Look, maybe I just rubbed the guy the wrong way, or he didn't like the looks of me, and he was trying to egg me on. This kind of thing can happen and it might not have necessarily been racism. But it's not out of the stretch to think that some people might still dislike "ethnic" white people like Poles or Italians, or that they might equally dislike people of East Asian descent.

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Bradical79 (64 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore

9. Thought that was on all applications

I was thinking all job applications have a section on your legal status in the U.S. Seems odd to ask that during a face to face interview. But there's nothing discriminatory about it (at least in a way that could lead to legal issues). They have to know at some point before they hire you. If you answered the question consistent with info you'd already given them, and they kept harrasing you over it, then I could see that possibly being a discrimination issue.
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Offline JohnnyReb

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Re: primitive finds interview question discriminating
« Reply #1 on: March 10, 2012, 04:14:04 PM »
Hey chicka...learner to speekka duh englick badder.
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Offline SSG Snuggle Bunny

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Re: primitive finds interview question discriminating
« Reply #2 on: March 10, 2012, 05:02:18 PM »
You have to prove eligibility to work in the US, jackass.

There's even a form for it and everything. (I-9)
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Offline AllosaursRus

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Re: primitive finds interview question discriminating
« Reply #3 on: March 10, 2012, 05:11:29 PM »
Quote from: SGT Snuggle Bunny on March 10, 2012, 05:02:18 PM
You have to prove eligibility to work in the US, jackass.

There's even a form for it and everything. (I-9)

They better ask! And 3 times is just coverin' their ass! Despite O'Bummer's desperate try at obstruction, they're crackin' down on companies that hire illegal aliens.

Perfectly acceptable questions in this day and age. Get used to it "Saba".
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Offline Aristotelian

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Re: primitive finds interview question discriminating
« Reply #4 on: March 10, 2012, 05:18:13 PM »
DUmmy wonders whether it is legal to ask. Aristotelian wonders whether it should be legal not to ask.
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Offline Chris_

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Re: primitive finds interview question discriminating
« Reply #5 on: March 10, 2012, 09:47:13 PM »
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Sabayon65 (18 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore

Is an employer allowed to ask if you're a U.S. citizen?
Woe!  Woe! :bawl:  Wait until you're asked to apply for a security clearance.  60 pages of forms and I still didn't get it.  Oh well.  The job I did get pays better with nicer working conditions and a lot more money.  BTW, if you live in one of those states that requires employers to run your Social Security number as part of an illegal immigration screening and something comes up, it's YOUR responsibility to carry your ass down to the SS office and get the problem resolved, not theirs.

Good luck, crybaby.
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Offline Rebel

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Re: primitive finds interview question discriminating
« Reply #6 on: March 10, 2012, 10:11:03 PM »
Wait, the DUmbass is offended about a question about citizenship, says he's a citizen, then wonders if he can file discrimination if he doesn't get the job. Just damn. Do you DUmbasses constantly look for shit to be offended by? Nevermind, rhetorical. No wonder conservatives are always happier in studies. We're not whinyass f'n morons.
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Offline NHSparky

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Re: primitive finds interview question discriminating
« Reply #7 on: March 10, 2012, 10:11:39 PM »
Please tell me the DUmmie noob was kidding about the legality of asking one's citizenship.
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Offline Big Dog

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Re: primitive finds interview question discriminating
« Reply #8 on: March 10, 2012, 10:28:03 PM »
Quote from: franksolich on March 10, 2012, 04:08:53 PM
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1119113

Oh my.

How the woes pile up in this 0bamaconomy.


Maybe Sybiannumbers should not have worn a keffiyeh and Che' t-shirt to the interview.
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Offline I_B_Perky

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Re: primitive finds interview question discriminating
« Reply #9 on: March 10, 2012, 10:30:57 PM »
Quote from: Rebel on March 10, 2012, 10:11:03 PM
Wait, the DUmbass is offended about a question about citizenship, says he's a citizen, then wonders if he can file discrimination if he doesn't get the job. Just damn. Do you DUmbasses constantly look for shit to be offended by? Nevermind, rhetorical. No wonder conservatives are always happier in studies. We're not whinyass f'n morons.

That's what I was thinking. Someone asks me in an interview if I am a citizen, I say yes and show them the passport to prove it. No problem.
Of course I ain't looking for the lawsuit gravy train either. Methinks the dummie was just trying to find a reason to sue cause they didn't get the job.

When I finally get off my lazy ass and take over the world people like that will be an endangered species.   :-)

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Offline AllosaursRus

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Re: primitive finds interview question discriminating
« Reply #10 on: March 10, 2012, 10:55:05 PM »
Quote from: chris_ on March 10, 2012, 09:47:13 PM
Woe!  Woe! :bawl:  Wait until you're asked to apply for a security clearance. 60 pages of forms and I still didn't get it.  Oh well.  The job I did get pays better with nicer working conditions and a lot more money.  BTW, if you live in one of those states that requires employers to run your Social Security number as part of an illegal immigration screening and something comes up, it's YOUR responsibility to carry your ass down to the SS office and get the problem resolved, not theirs.

Good luck, crybaby.

Geezus? What the hell were ya applyin' for, Chris? I've had a top level clearance for years as our company did all the remodels for Washington Trust Bank. FBI went thru my rectum in order to give me clearance for workin' after hours, which BTW is the only time ya can get things done, Even had the fire department show up once, but that's another story.

Oh, and , ya really don't wanna see those fat asses down at SS get up and do anything, do ya? I swear, there's not one under 300 pounds that works in my local office! You file for anything at SS, might as well figure on at least 6 months before ya even get a response!

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Offline Chris_

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Re: primitive finds interview question discriminating
« Reply #11 on: March 10, 2012, 10:58:44 PM »
I was given all the forms as .pdf files.  By the time I got done filling them out and printed, they were double what I originally started with.  As for the Social Security issues, I was born in a different town from the one my parents lived in and was never quite sure which one it was.  Damn Yankees.
« Last Edit: March 10, 2012, 11:02:00 PM by chris_ »
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Offline Rebel

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Re: primitive finds interview question discriminating
« Reply #12 on: March 10, 2012, 10:59:41 PM »
I've held either a secret or TS-SCI/SSBI for 17 years. There is nothing they don't know about me.
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There's a reason why patriotism is considered a conservative value. Watch a Tea Party rally and you'll see people proudly raising the American flag and showing pride in U.S. heroes such as Thomas Jefferson. Watch an OWS rally and you'll see people burning the American flag while showing pride in communist heroes such as Che Guevera. --Bob, from some news site

Offline Rebel

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Re: primitive finds interview question discriminating
« Reply #13 on: March 10, 2012, 11:01:10 PM »
I think the point is, DUmmies not only seek out shit to be offended by, they relish it because it gives them something to come back and talk about on lunatic island.
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There's a reason why patriotism is considered a conservative value. Watch a Tea Party rally and you'll see people proudly raising the American flag and showing pride in U.S. heroes such as Thomas Jefferson. Watch an OWS rally and you'll see people burning the American flag while showing pride in communist heroes such as Che Guevera. --Bob, from some news site

Offline AllosaursRus

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Re: primitive finds interview question discriminating
« Reply #14 on: March 10, 2012, 11:12:44 PM »
Quote from: I_B_Perky on March 10, 2012, 10:30:57 PM
That's what I was thinking. Someone asks me in an interview if I am a citizen, I say yes and show them the passport to prove it. No problem.
Of course I ain't looking for the lawsuit gravy train either. Methinks the dummie was just trying to find a reason to sue cause they didn't get the job.

When I finally get off my lazy ass and take over the world people like that will be an endangered species.   :-)

Now, now, ya been here long enough to realize all these primitives look for lawsuits in order to remove themselves from the job pool.

Maybe that's the reason O'Bummer can drop the unemployment rate when actually it goes up. His followers and the lawyers are in cahoots!

Makes sense, don't it/ According to the stats the amount of jobs available has decreased and people just give up, so they don't get counted as unemployed. To the tune of at least 2 mil!

Good trick, if ya have the media in yer pocket, 'ey?

Disgusting, ain't it? I swear to God, we're lookin' more and more like Nazi Germany and the the Soviet Socialist Republic, than we do free America! The only difference is, our media isn't bein' forced or censored, they're doin' it to help get us there!! Not even the left can deny the MSM is not biased! They've earned the handle, "the Drive By Media"!!!

Quote from: Rebel on March 10, 2012, 10:59:41 PM
I've held either a secret or TS-SCI/SSBI for 17 years. There is nothing they don't know about me.

Hell, I have no idea what mine is, I've had it so long, all they do is run me and say, "yeah, you're clear". I sure as hell never had to fill out 60 pages! 'Course that was before 9/11, I hear it's a "little" different now.
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Offline Rebel

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Re: primitive finds interview question discriminating
« Reply #15 on: March 10, 2012, 11:19:58 PM »
That's the initial. Getting your clearance renewed isn't that much of a process.
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There's a reason why patriotism is considered a conservative value. Watch a Tea Party rally and you'll see people proudly raising the American flag and showing pride in U.S. heroes such as Thomas Jefferson. Watch an OWS rally and you'll see people burning the American flag while showing pride in communist heroes such as Che Guevera. --Bob, from some news site

Offline Chris_

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Re: primitive finds interview question discriminating
« Reply #16 on: March 10, 2012, 11:24:35 PM »
I remember they asked for 7 years of residence, employment, criminal, credit history, personal and occupational references, and an I-9 form.  It also included the actual employment application... there may have been some other things, but I don't recall.  All that to answer the IT helpdesk for the National Guard.  And it's a lot less than what I'm making now to work for a private company.
« Last Edit: March 10, 2012, 11:36:56 PM by chris_ »
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Offline AllosaursRus

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Re: primitive finds interview question discriminating
« Reply #17 on: March 10, 2012, 11:47:09 PM »
Quote from: chris_ on March 10, 2012, 11:24:35 PM
I remember they asked for 7 years of residence, employment, criminal, credit history, personal and occupational references, and an I-9 form.  It also included the actual employment application... there may have been some other things, but I don't recall.  All that to answer the IT helpdesk for the National Guard.  And it's a lot less than what I'm making now to work for a private company.

Wholly shit! I've worked at Fairchild AFB, where they hide the B-52's, the fueling tankers for F-15's, and  a few "Puff the Magic Dragons, when they need serviced, but never had to go thru that BS!

Speakin' of which, ya never know how big them puppies are until ya stand next to one! WOW!!! Felt like I was an ant!!!
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Offline Rebel

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Re: primitive finds interview question discriminating
« Reply #18 on: March 10, 2012, 11:51:39 PM »
Don't know exactly how you hide a B-52, but there are a lot of'em at Barksdale in Skeezyport.
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There's a reason why patriotism is considered a conservative value. Watch a Tea Party rally and you'll see people proudly raising the American flag and showing pride in U.S. heroes such as Thomas Jefferson. Watch an OWS rally and you'll see people burning the American flag while showing pride in communist heroes such as Che Guevera. --Bob, from some news site

Offline Chris_

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Re: primitive finds interview question discriminating
« Reply #19 on: March 10, 2012, 11:54:10 PM »
That was two years ago.  Looking back, I'm glad I didn't get it.  I like what I'm doing now and considering the new equipment lease scheduled for next year, I should be busy for a while.

Not a big fan of Lenovo/IBM.  Maybe we'll get lucky and get some nice Dell Inspirons or Toshibas.
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Offline Rebel

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Re: primitive finds interview question discriminating
« Reply #20 on: March 10, 2012, 11:54:17 PM »
BTW, I don't mean to pick on you guys, Shadeaux, but I've been there for an Independence Bowl. That place, like the place I grew up in and am in right now, Jackson, is a shithole. SO ready to get back to Augusta.
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There's a reason why patriotism is considered a conservative value. Watch a Tea Party rally and you'll see people proudly raising the American flag and showing pride in U.S. heroes such as Thomas Jefferson. Watch an OWS rally and you'll see people burning the American flag while showing pride in communist heroes such as Che Guevera. --Bob, from some news site

Offline AllosaursRus

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Re: primitive finds interview question discriminating
« Reply #21 on: March 11, 2012, 12:14:46 AM »
Quote from: Rebel on March 10, 2012, 11:51:39 PM
Don't know exactly how you hide a B-52, but there are a lot of'em at Barksdale in Skeezyport.

Well, ya can't exactly hide the '52's themselves, I think what they  was tryin' to do was hide the numbers.

Back in '96, or '97, might even have been earlier than that, gettin' old and my memory ain't what it used to be, anyway, they had this Hot Dog showin' off durin' touch down and take offs, tried to make a banked turn and hooked the wing in a power line!

I was their the next day, I think ya coulda put what was left of that '52 in the back of yer pick up truck! Later, we had to hammer all the concrete out where it burned and replace it. And trust me it ain't just 6" thick! I think the thinnest piece was 12".

Oh joy!! Don't know if you've ever been behind a ninety pounder, but I can tell ya, by the end of the day, yer pud's in the mud!!
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Offline franksolich

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Re: primitive finds interview question discriminating
« Reply #22 on: March 11, 2012, 05:30:17 AM »
Quote from: AllosaursRus on March 10, 2012, 10:55:05 PM
Geezus? What the hell were ya applyin' for, Chris?

It's been 15 years now, but chris_'s suggestion of 60 pages sounds about right to me.

I recall about that many pages when I was the records supervisor for a private contractor to Immigration & Naturalization.  I don't know what "class" the clearance was, but out of 500 employees there, only two federal employees and I had that level.  It was necessary for me, so that I could get into records of other federal agencies (FBI, IRS, whatnot).

It was a lot of pages, that application, and I had to go back a lot more than just seven years.  Sixty sounds about right, and I had to append several pages of my own.

The Office of Personnel Management sent a little pit-bull of a guy from Kansas City to interview me; it was an interview under oath, and lasted from 4 p.m. until 2 a.m. (I worked second shift).  He personally interviewed most who had known me since I had first been in Lincoln more than 20 years before, which was a lot of people.

He was working out of an unoccupied office at Immigration & Naturalization, and had stacks of personnel files on the desk and table.  Most of them were 2-3" thick.  I got nervous when I saw mine was the biggest, easily more than 6" thick.

It wasn't that I had done anything wrong; it was only because I had done so many different things.

He even had copies of records of my visits to the U.S. embassy in Kiev (which wanted nothing more than for me to use my return airplane ticket.....from my sixth day in the socialist paradises).  I was not aware the embassy kept such records, and was illuminated greatly about what had happened (i.e., things that had been a mystery to me were revealed; it's always been my fate to learn what's going on long after it's happened).

Due to the nature of his job, the pit-bull had to be antagonistic and confrontational--he was probably otherwise a nice guy, one of the nicest guys one could ever hope to meet--but obviously I did okay, because I got that level of clearance, with no conditions, that only two other people there had.
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Offline AllosaursRus

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Re: primitive finds interview question discriminating
« Reply #23 on: March 11, 2012, 02:21:27 PM »
Ah, that explains it! I never had to access any documents, mine was more about gettin' in and out of government buildings, and banks.
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Offline jukin

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Re: primitive finds interview question discriminating
« Reply #24 on: March 11, 2012, 02:46:03 PM »
ZERO Bongs. DUchebag in an interview for a job?
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