the Die alte Sau describes a teacher quitting teaching

[franksolich]

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002203788

Oh my.

And no, unfortunately it's not her.

proud2BlibKansan (89,707 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore

A TEACHER STORY: WHY I’M LEAVING PUBLIC EDUCATION

I’ve had a radical change of heart recently. Those who worked with me in my previous position as an Instructional Coach (helping teachers to improve instruction and overcome difficulties with high-needs students) must be shocked by the links I am posting online. They might say that now that I’m back in the classroom, I don’t want to practice what I preached. They’d be at least partly right.

Wasn’t I the one reassuring other teachers that Colorado’s new teacher evaluations, based 50% on student test scores, was exactly what was needed to bring credibility and respect back into the teaching profession? Wasn’t I the one who said, “Merit pay? Bring it on! I’ll be makin’ the big bucks!” Yep, that was me. It was frustrating to work with some teachers who didn’t seem to care about their huge responsibility for educating our youth. Reforming tenure and paying teachers based on their efforts made sense to me, at least in theory.

I tried to reassure the teachers I worked with that they were great teachers who had nothing to worry about, and ignored the nagging voice in the back of my head that said it wasn’t so simple –like what about Special Education teachers? I’d worked with one who had a huge case-load of kids, including Jose, a boy with autism who struggled socially and academically but was a gifted artist. I had offered to help Jose’s teacher administer the CSAP (Colorado’s standardized test) because she had so many students that required special accommodations.

I was asked to read the questions aloud to Jose, and stop if he became agitated. The previous year, Jose had felt so bad about not knowing the answers that he had gouged his fingernails into his arm. This year, they felt he had made great academic progress, and his improved scores would make the school look good. After a few minutes, I could see that Jose was getting upset. I suggested we take a break. He vehemently shook his head, determined to “be good”. When his tears began to flow, I insisted that we stop. Why were we torturing this young man, when, as a student with an Individualized Education Plan, we knew exactly what his levels of proficiency were? Still, I reasoned that it was necessary to assess all students, because we wanted No Child Left Behind.

more . . . http://unitedoptout.com/uncategorized/a-teacher-story-why-im-leaving-public-education/

No Child Left Behind was Vast Teddy's baby, in case one's forgotten.

Slatternly Sarah, right out the gate:

Sarah Ibarruri (17,143 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore

1. What an excellent article. Thanks. Non-educators are destroying schools and teachers. Teachers have become the target of the disaster created by non-educators trying to turn schools into those nasty institutions called corporations.

I found these 2 paragraphs interesting:

After my formal evaluation, my principal noted that, while my pedagogy (he pronounced it “pegoggy”) was perfect, I had serious classroom management issues. Hadn’t I noticed that while the two students were debating in one group, the other group had already finished and were drawing a fish on the giant sticky note I’d provided for their brainstorming session? (Actually, I thought to myself, it was a dolphin, the subject of the short story they’d read.) “Chris would never do that in another class,” the principal told me. “He doesn’t respect you.”

“Wouldn’t do what?” I asked, “Draw a fish?” I was instructed, for the first time in more than a decade of teaching, to write a performance improvement plan, and observe another teacher. I resisted the urge to remind this man that I had taught successfully for four years in inner-city Pittsburgh while he was still in high school. Instead, I tried to see his point of view – shouldn’t all teachers strive for continual improvement? Still, I felt threatened. Teachers all over the country are being systematically intimidated by top-down, authoritarian rule designed to ensure compliance.

proud2BlibKansan (89,707 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore

10. That part struck me as well

Especially the fish part.

Principals never know the kids or understand why they do what they do as well as the teachers do.

Sarah Ibarruri (17,143 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore

14. You're right, but principals are also under the gun while non-educators adapt schools to a corporate model, which does not work.

boppers (15,239 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore

3. Another argument for charters, magnets, (etc.), in a way.

Standardized schools = standardized education.

Some folks want that. Some don't. Some can't handle the environment of one, or another, at all.

proud2BlibKansan (89,707 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore

5. Charters play the test game too

So do magnets.

As long as the school is funded by tax dollars, they have to test the kids.

jody (24,250 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore

8. "Standardized schools = standardized education" or teaching to the lowest standard so all can

get a diploma certifying attendance for 12 years but little else.

No wonder we are concerned about Tiger Moms, we should be because China was an advanced culture when Europeans and Africans foraged and hunted to survive.

liberalhistorian (18,087 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore

11. Many charters treat teachers even worse, and they can get away with it, too. They are not the magic pill.

Sarah Ibarruri (17,143 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore

17. Charter schools are a disaster on wheels. The latest stats reflect that

The destruction of public schools was a plan devised by GOPers, with precisely that intention, and charters are part of that plan. Too bad others have added themselves to the list of the 'let's just finish off public schools' group.

prairierose (1,534 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore

4. Thanks for bringing this here. And Sarah, every time I hear some idiot spouting off...

about how schools should be "run like a business", I want to punch them. Education is not a business and there are very good reasons that it can not be run like a business. Students are not "customers". This idea dramatically changes the relationship between teacher and student by itself.

But even more importantly are all of the people who have never set foot in a classroom who are given the authority to tell teachers, experienced teachers who to do their job. And all of the people at so many levels who are using teachers as scapegoats for the planned destruction of public schools. The 30 years of defunding has take a toll on physical plants of schools, as well as on teachers who have struggled to continue teaching with fewer materials every year.

liberalhistorian (18,087 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore

7. Yet more reasons why I'm so glad I didn't follow in the footsteps of my now-retired teacher parents, like everyone thought I'd do. No ****ing thank you. I grew up watching what they went through every day and night and the toll it took on them and our family, as well as the total lack of appreciation and monetary reward, and there was no ****ing way I was going to deal with that. And this was in the 70's and 80's!! They dedicated their lives wholeheartedly to their students and their profession and got shit for it in the end. Most of their pensions goes to pay my father's nursing home bill and his pension is less than it should be because he had to retire ten years earlier than normal due to the early onset of his dementia.

So all those decades of work and now my mother struggles to get by, while having to hear on a nearly daily basis the hateful scapegoating of teachers and the attempts to take away even basic rights and protections, including tenure, and to hear the ranting of the average joe against tenure and the like when he has no ****ing clue what he's even talking about or what it's like to be in the classroom, he's just parroting the RW talking points the media so gladly puts forth for them. And they both started teaching before unions and tenure and they know what it was like for teachers then, how bad it was. The thought of younger teachers having to go back to that makes her physically ill (my dad doesn't know anything anymore, which is probably a blessing at this point).

I've been told I have a "gift" for teaching, by principals and admins at the local school where I sub when needed (since I have a college degree, I can sub and am actually sought after to do so) and that I should consider trying to get a certificate. But there is NO WAY I will do any such thing, and certainly not nowadays. Not with this shit going on. It infuriates me beyond words to see this shit happening and every time some numbskull rants about teachers and unions and tenure and how they're living high off the hog on the taxpayer's dime and doing nothing for it, etc., etc., I think of all the decades my parents worked so hard and how now my mom is lucky to have enough money for food every ****ing month after the nursing home is paid, while those who did nothing of value for society, such as Wall Street and corporate ****s, rake in their ******* millions and rant about teachers and public workers. **** them all, especially for what they're doing to public education, and doing knowingly.

I'm particularly incensed that even too many Democrats are falling for the RW bullshit when it comes to public education and teachers. Unbelievably infuriated.

terip64 (1,489 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore

12. I just got my Masters in Teaching from Michigan State and I have no job in site.

I had a pretty decent job in MI as an ESL teacher but I moved to the Chicago area for my husband's job and am not having any luck finding anything here. I can't even get on any sub lists so far. I think I have to wake up and realize that I need to change professions. I am not feeling very smart right now. Sucks, because I am a good teacher.

HopeHoops (25,528 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore

13. Please don't leave. The future of the country depends on people like you - and my wife.

Teaching sucks. It's one of the roughest jobs on the planet. There are only a select few who can do it well. You have a gift and you need to use it. There's no such thing as an "easy" teaching position. My heart is with you.

ingac70 (7,768 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore

15. Merit pay=having to give blow jobs to get anywhere.

Just like the White House under William Clinton, heh?

Ishoutandscream2 (5,699 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore

18. June, 2014, and I have my years for retirement

I'm done. Unfortunately, my wife is not eligible for retirement until 2023.

[GOBUCKS]

DUmmy proud2bDUmb, with another C&P junk post, again reminds us how undeserved her 2010 DOTY award was.
She's no better than the nitwit racist DUmmy kpete, lunatic queen of the C&Ps.

[Ogre]

Dang, I held out a faint hope that she was the one quitting teaching.

[franksolich]

Dang, I held out a faint hope that she was the one quitting teaching.

So did I, when I first spotted this campfire.

She's got a couple years more than the minimum required to get that plush teaching pension, and then only six more years until she collects social security on top of that.

But when Kansas City, Missouri, had that massive lay-off of teachers because there weren't enough students, she used her seniority to keep her job because if on the pension, she'd have $10 co-payments at the doctor's office, and oh God no she doesn't think she should have to pay that.

The real tragedy of the whole bit is that, even though she's all set for the rest of her life, in comfortable circumstances, her keeping her job meant some younger teacher was laid off instead, and is probably working as a convenience store clerk.

The Die alte Sau thinks of no one but herself.  A typical Democrat, liberal, and primitive.

[Ogre]

So did I, when I first spotted this campfire.

She's got a couple years more than the minimum required to get that plush teaching pension, and then only six more years until she collects social security on top of that.

But when Kansas City, Missouri, had that massive lay-off of teachers because there weren't enough students, she used her seniority to keep her job because if on the pension, she'd have $10 co-payments at the doctor's office, and oh God no she doesn't think she should have to pay that.

The real tragedy of the whole bit is that, even though she's all set for the rest of her life, in comfortable circumstances, her keeping her job meant some younger teacher was laid off instead, and is probably working as a convenience store clerk.

The Die alte Sau thinks of no one but herself.  A typical Democrat, liberal, and primitive.

You're right, it could be worse, it could be decades before she departed the school system.

Thankfully the SS Ibestupid, isn't among the ranks of teachers in this country.

[delilahmused]

You know the last grade school teacher my son had before we yanked him out of the cesspool of public education was an absolutely lovely woman and an award winning teacher and she adored Jake. He was extremely well behaved, he just never saw the point in acting out even at home. But he'd come home everyday absolutely frustrated because the kids next to him were whacking him and everyone else with rulers, breaking his pencils, hiding his books, etc. It was so chaotic he'd beg me not to go to school and there were mornings when he'd actually throw up before school. When I went in to talk to his teacher she said (I've actually remembered this verbatim even to this day because it made my jaw drop) "I put the less well behaved students next to him hoping his calming influence will rub off on them." I told her it obviously wasn't working. I ended up going to the vice principle about it. I told her the poor kid was extremely stressed and would actually be physically sick before school. She had the gall to ask me if there was some problem at home that would cause him to be so upset. I told her well maybe it's because I insist on him pulling his head out of the toilet and go to school. That was my last straw. We never went back. There's too many DUmmie teachers to risk the mind of any child, IMO.

Cindie

[jukin]

We spend four times the amount per student adjusted for inflation since 1970. We have introduced computer technology to the class room at great expense. Test scores have remained flat. There are a lot more retired teachers but test scores have remained the same and by same I mean not good.

In kalifornia we spend on average $8,800 per kid K-12. Given that the average class size is 28 that means $246,400 per classroom or per teacher. Let's assume the teacher makes $90K with benefits for nine months of work. That leaves $156,400 per class for what? Where does that $150K go to? Sure there is some maintenance in that, some administration, general office expenses, union overhead, and district supervision. But if a roof needs to be replaced then we get a new bond to pay off. So nothing capital wise. Given that let's say $56,400 for general overhead (which I think is ludicrous), where does that $100K per classroom go to? That's more than what we pay the teacher. Where?

That's some hectic PROFIT but to what pockets does the profit flow? 

[formerlurker]

Long story short -- she doesn't want her evaluation based on student test scores.....   so what should it be based on, the write up she got in the newspaper for the project her class did?   

A HS guidance counselor knows how cut throat the competition is for colleges.   Pushing students to perform is their job.   Making students competitive for college applications is the superintendent/principals job.   You think it's too damn hard then by all means there is the door.

Teaching is no longer the job you go into so you can have the summer off.   You have to teach students to be competitive in the 21 Century workforce, so your fun projects aren't going to cut it anymore (by the way, they never did cut it).   Sucks to be you if that is what you signed up for.   

[formerlurker]

We spend four times the amount per student adjusted for inflation since 1970. We have introduced computer technology to the class room at great expense. Test scores have remained flat. There are a lot more retired teachers but test scores have remained the same and by same I mean not good.

In kalifornia we spend on average $8,800 per kid K-12. Given that the average class size is 28 that means $246,400 per classroom or per teacher. Let's assume the teacher makes $90K with benefits for nine months of work. That leaves $156,400 per class for what? Where does that $150K go to? Sure there is some maintenance in that, some administration, general office expenses, union overhead, and district supervision. But if a roof needs to be replaced then we get a new bond to pay off. So nothing capital wise. Given that let's say $56,400 for general overhead (which I think is ludicrous), where does that $100K per classroom go to? That's more than what we pay the teacher. Where?

That's some hectic PROFIT but to what pockets does the profit flow? 

Schools districts are woefully behind in getting technology into the classroom -- only the lucky have moved that direction so far, and that would be the urban districts that have the demographics to secure grants (all white middle class kids in your district?   no need to apply then).   

$8,800 per student is extremely low.   Wow.   Approximately 70-80% of the school budget is salary and benefits.    That leaves 20% for the kids.    But it's all about the kids according to NEA isn't it?

[formerlurker]

On the comment of where the money goes -- the bulk of it is health insurance (which is unsustainable).    It is expensive to run a school building.   Textbooks run about $100-150 each.   The money actually does go quickly.

[JohnnyReb]

You know the last grade school teacher my son had before we yanked him out of the cesspool of public education was an absolutely lovely woman and an award winning teacher and she adored Jake. He was extremely well behaved, he just never saw the point in acting out even at home. But he'd come home everyday absolutely frustrated because the kids next to him were (talking, misbehaving and otherwise disrupting class) whacking him and everyone else with rulers, breaking his pencils, hiding his books, etc. It was so chaotic he'd beg me not to go to school and there were mornings when he'd actually throw up before school. When I went in to talk to his teacher she said (I've actually remembered this verbatim even to this day because it made my jaw drop) "I put the less well behaved students next to him hoping his calming influence will rub off on them." I told her it obviously wasn't working. I ended up going to the vice principle about it. I told her the poor kid was extremely stressed and would actually be physically sick before school. She had the gall to ask me if there was some problem at home that would cause him to be so upset. I told her well maybe it's because I insist on him pulling his head out of the toilet and go to school. That was my last straw. We never went back. There's too many DUmmie teachers to risk the mind of any child, IMO.

Cindie

Sounds just like my son. He had two grammar school teachers and one high school teacher that knew how to control their classrooms and he loved it/them.

[vesta111]

We spend four times the amount per student adjusted for inflation since 1970. We have introduced computer technology to the class room at great expense. Test scores have remained flat. There are a lot more retired teachers but test scores have remained the same and by same I mean not good.

In kalifornia we spend on average $8,800 per kid K-12. Given that the average class size is 28 that means $246,400 per classroom or per teacher. Let's assume the teacher makes $90K with benefits for nine months of work. That leaves $156,400 per class for what? Where does that $150K go to? Sure there is some maintenance in that, some administration, general office expenses, union overhead, and district supervision. But if a roof needs to be replaced then we get a new bond to pay off. So nothing capital wise. Given that let's say $56,400 for general overhead (which I think is ludicrous), where does that $100K per classroom go to? That's more than what we pay the teacher. Where?

That's some hectic PROFIT but to what pockets does the profit flow? 

Problem as I  see it is the  idea that all kids must learn the same thing.  The 3 R's is basic, from there it is the individual student that needs to be tested on what subject interests them and what they are geared to mentally.

Subjects can be folded in with each other, EXAMPLE,   Music and Math, Geology and Anthropology, Biology and World History.   Language with politics and American history.  

I do not care how smart a kid is or how slow they are, one gets  the same results from both if they have no interest in a class.  Each kid is an individual, placing them with like minded class mates and a teacher that has a feel for the subject, is innovative with teaching those interested in the subject is a good teacher.

Placing a kid who has no interest in language, history or Art is a waste of time, find their interest and a subject to match their interest.   Surprising how one interest needs to be successful with the help, leap frogging onto other subjects.

Teachers are just like the kids, they also have their interests and may complain about teaching a subject they themselves are bored with or incompetent with.   Like sending a Home EC. teacher out to coach the football team.

 Teaching is not a profession, it is a work of art, look at how successful the kids do on tests that are home schooled.
How parents can do this is amazing, but then they know their kids and their interests so perhaps they bundle their interests in with all the other subjects.

 Got a kid that likes to hunt with father, if the kid is going to learn how to reload their Ammo, they need Math. Need to learn topography of the area they hunt in, learn what wind shear is, how to calibrate for a successful kill.  Learn about the  biology of the area, what the game likes to eat, Chemistry and Anatomy  if they wish to mount their kill.  

Baking as an interest takes chemistry, math, and knowledge of where the ingredients come from, how they interact with each other.

Any person can become a teacher as long as they have a passion for the subject and the student shares it with them.

Never surprised me when my boys came home from Scouts that had a new interest, something they never gave a thought to before.    It was the enthusiasm of the Scout Master that had us all in the back yard  after dark learning Morse code with flashlights for weeks on end.

[67 Rover]

Quote
Ishoutandscream2 (5,699 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore

18. June, 2014, and I have my years for retirement

I'm done. Unfortunately, my wife is not eligible for retirement until 2023.

Translation.  I am just putting in my time for a sweet pension, screw the kids and that learning crap.

[Carl]

Sarah Ibarruri (17,143 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore

17. Charter schools are a disaster on wheels. The latest stats reflect that

The destruction of public schools was a plan devised by GOPers, with precisely that intention, and charters are part of that plan. Too bad others have added themselves to the list of the 'let's just finish off public schools' group.

Bullshit,the left and unions have run public education for decades and used schools as nothing more then hiring dumps.
Liberal nonsense such as no discipline,no reward for acheivement lest someones self esteem has been damaged is what has reduced them to little more then zoos in some areas.

[NHSparky]

You want to see how socialism works?  Go to any public school.

Scoobie's daughter is busting her ass (with a little ass-busting from us) and doing well.  Her "friend" doesn't do shit and still pulls a C average.

It's getting harder and harder to motivate the girl child.  I see it every day.

[jukin]

$8,800 per student is extremely low.   Wow.   Approximately 70-80% of the school budget is salary and benefits.    That leaves 20% for the kids.    But it's all about the kids according to NEA isn't it?

Health insurance is included in the $90K (for nine months) salary and benefits. In kaliforna the district is paying $800/month for family plans and a $80 contribution from the teacher. I know this from investigations. So it is not that.

What is 20% for the kids? We are not paying them. We pay the teacher which should be for the kids. You give me percentages and I give you hard numbers. $56K per year for overhead that would include text books. Let's assume $150/book (an outrageous amount particularly considering bulk buying) 28x$150 =$4,200/class. per subject. Assume a useful life of 6 years (again very low) and that is a change of books per classroom per subject each year. Not bad. I would have to expense those over 12 years if I went over my 179 expenses that year.

Again I ask, WTF does at least $100k/classroom-year go to?

[vesta111]

You want to see how socialism works?  Go to any public school.

Scoobie's daughter is busting her ass (with a little ass-busting from us) and doing well.  Her "friend" doesn't do shit and still pulls a C average.

It's getting harder and harder to motivate the girl child.  I see it every day.

How to motivate a kid to have interest Sparky, depends on the kid really.

Perhaps taking them out of their every day existence to go somewhere they have never been before.

Kids are curious, fast learners unless kept in a box of classrooms each day. You are close to Boston, take the kids and their friends to places that are FUN, Harvard has amazing displays of stuff from around the world, Science Museum and the Art gallery is a fun trip------Never know when some thing will cause the old light bulb to go on in their head. Forget about the ultra expensive Amusement parks, what do they really remember from a 2 minute rollercoaster ride.

Kids today are at sea about their interests, ask a kid what they want to do as an adult is often beyond their reach, they may not have the same interest in 6 months.

Hint here, when I could not afford the at that time $25.00 per person attendance to a park, I took them to all the down town museums and art gallery's, the local colleges that had interesting displays.   My kids remember 30 years ago some if not all of the displayes-----the few times we could afford to go to an amusement park, totally forgotten.

Motivates is to interest and cause someone to check out things.   Kids cannot become motovated sitting in a classroom, they need to explore and investigate the unknown to them. 

You Sparky live a short distance from UNH----ever attend a Hockey game there, or take advantage of science shows, art shows or any number of 100's of other things going on to take the girls to ???   I really enjoy watching the males and females practicing the pre Olympic  gymnastics. amazing what these kids can do.

Please don't complain about unmotivated kids when there is a world out there for them if only someone will take them.

It is in your hands now Sparky, you cannot just sit back and complain, your family is now your job to motivate and find a way to do so--------UNH is just down the road, get a shedual of events and take the kids to them.

[formerlurker]

Health insurance is included in the $90K (for nine months) salary and benefits. In kaliforna the district is paying $800/month for family plans and a $80 contribution from the teacher. I know this from investigations. So it is not that.

What is 20% for the kids? We are not paying them. We pay the teacher which should be for the kids. You give me percentages and I give you hard numbers. $56K per year for overhead that would include text books. Let's assume $150/book (an outrageous amount particularly considering bulk buying) 28x$150 =$4,200/class. per subject. Assume a useful life of 6 years (again very low) and that is a change of books per classroom per subject each year. Not bad. I would have to expense those over 12 years if I went over my 179 expenses that year.

Again I ask, WTF does at least $100k/classroom-year go to?

The 20% is for materials, building and grounds, professional development, etc.    You are looking at that all wrong.    Cost per student is determined by costs for the entire district divided by number of students. 

Here is an appropriate accounting (Boston, which has a budget bigger than most third world countries):

http://profiles.doe.mass.edu/profiles/finance.aspx?orgcode=00350000&orgtypecode=5&

Capital expenses/debt exclusions are usually not calculated into per student expenditures.

[formerlurker]

Health insurance is included in the $90K (for nine months) salary and benefits. In kaliforna the district is paying $800/month for family plans and a $80 contribution from the teacher. I know this from investigations. So it is not that.

What is 20% for the kids? We are not paying them. We pay the teacher which should be for the kids. You give me percentages and I give you hard numbers. $56K per year for overhead that would include text books. Let's assume $150/book (an outrageous amount particularly considering bulk buying) 28x$150 =$4,200/class. per subject. Assume a useful life of 6 years (again very low) and that is a change of books per classroom per subject each year. Not bad. I would have to expense those over 12 years if I went over my 179 expenses that year.

Again I ask, WTF does at least $100k/classroom-year go to?

I have to laugh at the "outrageous amount" comment -- that is how much they cost.   If I were to replace the textbooks in my District's high school alone it would cost upwards of $1 million.    

There is no "bulk" discount for textbooks.  No one purchases just one or just ten.  

[formerlurker]

You want to see how socialism works?  Go to any public school.

Scoobie's daughter is busting her ass (with a little ass-busting from us) and doing well.  Her "friend" doesn't do shit and still pulls a C average.

It's getting harder and harder to motivate the girl child.  I see it every day.

Her friend made a decision not to fully apply herself.   Personal responsibility.    She is pulling a "C" with minimal effort, so she is obviously bright.  Shame, but that is what parenting is all about.   

I don't know how socialism comes into play here. 

[formerlurker]

Bullshit,the left and unions have run public education for decades and used schools as nothing more then hiring dumps.
Liberal nonsense such as no discipline,no reward for acheivement lest someones self esteem has been damaged is what has reduced them to little more then zoos in some areas.

Unions have destroyed public education -- 100% agreed.  However, charter schools are hit or miss.  There are a great deal of truly amazing charter schools that parents would sell their soul to get their children into, and there are just as many mediocre/bad ones.   

If I lived in a urban hell, I would go to charter as at least I know my kids are safer - regardless of the quality of education there.

[NHSparky]

Her friend made a decision not to fully apply herself.   Personal responsibility.    She is pulling a "C" with minimal effort, so she is obviously bright.  Shame, but that is what parenting is all about.   

I don't know how socialism comes into play here. 

No, that's how the grades work around here.  NOBODY fails.  Even if you don't do ANY work, it's still a C.

The HS here just eliminated failing grades, for Chrissakes.

You think any kid is going to be motivated to do well when they can sit on their ass and still get passed along?  That, dear FL, is the very definition of socialism, and one of the primary results of it.

[formerlurker]

No, that's how the grades work around here.  NOBODY fails.  Even if you don't do ANY work, it's still a C.

The HS here just eliminated failing grades, for Chrissakes.

You think any kid is going to be motivated to do well when they can sit on their ass and still get passed along?  That, dear FL, is the very definition of socialism, and one of the primary results of it.

I can assure you that is NOT the way it is here.   PM me your district.  I want to check out their policies.

[USA4ME]

Sarah Ibarruri

Non-educators are destroying schools and teachers. Teachers have become the target of the disaster created by non-educators trying to turn schools into those nasty institutions called corporations.

Trying to turn schools into corporations?  Never heard that before.  I have heard people, mainly parents, who are concerned that it's too difficult to rid the system of bad/uncaring/unqualified teachers because of tenure.  It's a legitimate concern.

But to kooks like Sarah, anyone who isn't on the public education payroll should just accept what the schools have to offer, because teachers know even better than the parents what the kids really need.  Unfortunately for the kooks, parents that care aren't going to let them have their way.

.

[formerlurker]

No, that's how the grades work around here.  NOBODY fails.  Even if you don't do ANY work, it's still a C.

The HS here just eliminated failing grades, for Chrissakes.

You think any kid is going to be motivated to do well when they can sit on their ass and still get passed along?  That, dear FL, is the very definition of socialism, and one of the primary results of it.

Ok, checked out policies.  Totally stand corrected.   That is messed up.