Author Topic: Should same-sex marriage be legal?  (Read 28494 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline vesta111

  • In Memoriam
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 9712
  • Reputation: +493/-1154
Re: Should same-sex marriage be legal?
« Reply #225 on: March 29, 2011, 05:00:40 AM »
Just one question here this time.

How many wives did David, Solomon, or Abraham have ???


Offline Thor

  • General Ne'er Do Well, Troublemaker & All Around Meanie!!
  • In Memoriam
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 13103
  • Reputation: +362/-297
  • Native Texan & US Navy (ret)
Re: Should same-sex marriage be legal?
« Reply #226 on: March 29, 2011, 05:25:23 AM »
Seriously Thor?  Aberrations?  Were talking about infants who were born with health issues.  Aberrations?  That's what the pro-death crowd would call them, right before they aborted the child.


ANY Human born with both sex organs, aka an hermaphrodite, is an aberration. Nowhere in my post did I suggest that the fœtus be aborted. I find it patently offensive that you would suggest that I even inferred that.

I suggest that you learn your vocabulary:

aberration  ab·er·ra·tion (āb'É™-rā'shÉ™n)
n.

     A departure from the normal or typical.
"The state must declare the child to be the most precious treasure of the people. As long as the government is perceived as working for the benefit of the children, the people will happily endure almost any curtailment of liberty and almost any deprivation."- IBID

I AM your General Ne'er Do Well, Troublemaker & All Around Meanie!!

"Congress has not unlimited powers to provide for the general welfare, but only those specifically enumerated."-Thomas Jefferson

Offline Ballygrl

  • Lipstick Renegade
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 14934
  • Reputation: +983/-120
Re: Should same-sex marriage be legal?
« Reply #227 on: March 29, 2011, 08:53:01 AM »
OK, so you want to leave it up to the States to decide? no problem, then if we're going to advocate State's rights in reference to marriage then let's revisit a whole list of other issues that the Government has stuck its nose in, let's start with abortion.
Quote
"The nation that couldn’t be conquered by foreign enemies has been conquered by its elected officials" odawg Free Republic in reference to the GOP Elites who are no difference than the Democrats

Offline Eupher

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 24894
  • Reputation: +2828/-1828
  • U.S. Army, Retired
Re: Should same-sex marriage be legal?
« Reply #228 on: March 29, 2011, 09:10:33 AM »
OK, so you want to leave it up to the States to decide? no problem, then if we're going to advocate State's rights in reference to marriage then let's revisit a whole list of other issues that the Government has stuck its nose in, let's start with abortion.

Might be worth another thread. This one seems kinda busy with another subject.  :whistling:
Adams E2 Euphonium, built in 2017
Boosey & Co. Imperial Euphonium, built in 1941
Edwards B454 bass trombone, built 2012
Bach Stradivarius 42OG tenor trombone, built 1992
Kanstul 33-T BBb tuba, built 2011
Fender Precision Bass Guitar, built ?
Mouthpiece data provided on request.

Offline seahorse513

  • I don't take shit from anyone!!
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5260
  • Reputation: +491/-247
  • British by birth, American thru naturalization
Re: Should same-sex marriage be legal?
« Reply #229 on: March 29, 2011, 09:59:12 AM »
Just one question here this time.

How many wives did David, Solomon, or Abraham have ???



I am not sure how many they had at one time, but that was another culture, time and place in history.
Because of the lack of medical technology and know how, men were expected to have many wives and children. People didn't live as long and cures for diseases were unknown
Whether it is fortunate for us or not, the rules have changed......
The sea is treacherous, but an even hand on the keel brings it safely to port.

Nothing is sexier than a man and his gun!!!

A man should prefer his own company to that of others, because no matter where he goes,he'll find himself there..

"The problem with socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money".  Lady Maggie Thatcher

Offline rubliw

  • Banned
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 304
  • Reputation: +17/-513
Re: Should same-sex marriage be legal?
« Reply #230 on: March 29, 2011, 10:06:56 AM »
aberration  ab·er·ra·tion (āb'É™-rā'shÉ™n)
n.

     A departure from the normal or typical.

By that definition, lefties (as in left handed) are aberrations.  So are people with red hair.  Should we disallow them from getting married or otherwise marginalize them because of their aberrations?

In fact, I'm pretty sure each of us could find *at least* one biological or personality feature in each of us that could also be called aberrations...    I guess we're all in trouble!
« Last Edit: March 29, 2011, 10:10:25 AM by rubliw »

Offline Eupher

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 24894
  • Reputation: +2828/-1828
  • U.S. Army, Retired
Re: Should same-sex marriage be legal?
« Reply #231 on: March 29, 2011, 10:23:50 AM »
By that definition, lefties (as in left handed) are aberrations.  So are people with red hair.  Should we disallow them from getting married or otherwise marginalize them because of their aberrations?

In fact, I'm pretty sure each of us could find *at least* one biological or personality feature in each of us that could also be called aberrations...    I guess we're all in trouble!

Do you ever look at a situation/problem/set of circumstances simplistically? Do you complicate everything you're confronted with?

Or are you simply stirring shit?
Adams E2 Euphonium, built in 2017
Boosey & Co. Imperial Euphonium, built in 1941
Edwards B454 bass trombone, built 2012
Bach Stradivarius 42OG tenor trombone, built 1992
Kanstul 33-T BBb tuba, built 2011
Fender Precision Bass Guitar, built ?
Mouthpiece data provided on request.

Offline Boudicca

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5162
  • Reputation: +413/-61
Re: Should same-sex marriage be legal?
« Reply #232 on: March 29, 2011, 10:42:42 AM »
Just one question here this time.

How many wives did David, Solomon, or Abraham have ???



IIRC Solomon was alleged to have had 300 wives and concubines.
Polygamy is prevalent in some countries now, and has a long historical basis in fact.  I'm not sure when marriage became defined as between one man and one woman in the Judeo-Christian tradition, since the Bible patriarchs were, for the most part, polygamists.
But, marriages has always been defined as between two or more members of the opposite sex in the same J-C tradition AFA?IK.
Sneaking into a country doesn't make you an immigrant any
more than breaking into someone's house makes you part of the family.
(Poster bolky from thehill.com blog discussion)

Offline seahorse513

  • I don't take shit from anyone!!
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5260
  • Reputation: +491/-247
  • British by birth, American thru naturalization
Re: Should same-sex marriage be legal?
« Reply #233 on: March 29, 2011, 10:54:12 AM »
Do you ever look at a situation/problem/set of circumstances simplistically? Do you complicate everything you're confronted with?

Or are you simply stirring shit?

This is one of the reasons, i am against same sex marrriages, if that we allow those, other people with varying and complicated relationships will want certain priveleges. I have heard that same sex people wanted to get married so they can collect the ss of their partner...to me that was like so you are marrying them for money??
Where do we draw the line?????
The sea is treacherous, but an even hand on the keel brings it safely to port.

Nothing is sexier than a man and his gun!!!

A man should prefer his own company to that of others, because no matter where he goes,he'll find himself there..

"The problem with socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money".  Lady Maggie Thatcher

Offline rubliw

  • Banned
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 304
  • Reputation: +17/-513
Re: Should same-sex marriage be legal?
« Reply #234 on: March 29, 2011, 11:45:30 AM »
Do you ever look at a situation/problem/set of circumstances simplistically? Do you complicate everything you're confronted with?

Or are you simply stirring shit?

Stirring shit or raising objections to a particularly bad line of argument?  I guess maybe in your book those are one and the same, I don't know.   I'm just trying to keep things honest here, because this whole "aberration" business is just silly, and is really only working by equivocation.  You guys are using one definition of the word aberration to classify homosexuality/transgenderism/etc, and then assuming another once they have been classified.

As if once you label something an aberration (for being a deviation from the norm), suddenly that proves your point about its moral character... I don't think so.   Its language abuse.  Aberration does also have a definition that means something like deviation from good morals... but you don't get to just smuggle that in, and declare victory.  

The fallacy goes something like this:

Homosexuality/transgenderism/etc are deviations from the norm...
       and deviations from the norm are aberrations...  
               therefore homosexuality/transgenderism/etc are aberrations...

Aberrations are deviations from moral goodness...
        and homosexuality/transgederism are aberrations
              therefore homosexuality/transgenderism are deviations from moral goodness.

Surely you must see the problem there...  its a classic switcheroo.... shifting definitions... hopefully its not too complex for you   :)
« Last Edit: March 29, 2011, 11:53:21 AM by rubliw »

Offline SSG Snuggle Bunny

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 23049
  • Reputation: +2234/-269
  • Voted Rookie-of-the-Year, 3 years running
Re: Should same-sex marriage be legal?
« Reply #235 on: March 29, 2011, 11:54:27 AM »
Don't you first have to establish the purpose of sex to determine whether or not a condition is an aberration?

Look at the purpose of a hand and then tell us if left-handedness is an aberration or the purpose of hair to determine if red-heads are an aberration.
« Last Edit: March 29, 2011, 12:18:00 PM by SGT Snuggle Bunny »
According to the Bible, "know" means "yes."

Offline TVDOC

  • General Malcontent and
  • Member
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5686
  • Reputation: +165/-3
  • Sic Transit Gloria Mundi
Re: Should same-sex marriage be legal?
« Reply #236 on: March 29, 2011, 12:08:53 PM »
Stirring shit or raising objections to a particularly bad line of argument?  I guess maybe in your book those are one and the same, I don't know.   I'm just trying to keep things honest here, because this whole "aberration" business is just silly, and is really only working by equivocation.  You guys are using one definition of the word aberration to classify homosexuality/transgenderism/etc, and then assuming another once they have been classified.

As if once you label something an aberration (for being a deviation from the norm), suddenly that proves your point about its moral character... I don't think so.   Its language abuse. Aberration does also have a definition that means something like deviation from good morals... but you don't get to just smuggle that in, and declare victory.  

The fallacy goes something like this:

Homosexuality/transgenderism/etc are deviations from the norm...
       and deviations from the norm are aberrations...  
               therefore homosexuality/transgenderism/etc are aberrations...

Aberrations are deviations from moral goodness...
        and homosexuality/transgederism are aberrations
             therefore homosexuality/transgenderism are deviations from moral goodness.

Surely you must see the problem there...  its a classic switcheroo.... shifting definitions... hopefully its not too complex for you   :)

Wilbur....you are being intentionally and dishonestly obtuse.......however, that appears to be normal for you.....

Let's keep it simple:  Marriage is between a "normal" male and a "normal" female, the limits of "normalcy" end there......they cannot honestly be extended to hair color or dominant hand usage.........you are obfuscating.

It's just silly on your part, and immediately takes you out of the debate .

doc
"Study the past if you wish to define the future"

Confucius

Offline rubliw

  • Banned
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 304
  • Reputation: +17/-513
Re: Should same-sex marriage be legal?
« Reply #237 on: March 29, 2011, 12:19:19 PM »
Wilbur....you are being intentionally and dishonestly obtuse.......however, that appears to be normal for you.....

Sorry, the obfuscation is coming from the other side here... obfuscations can hide easily in plain, simple language when one is shifting definitions.   Unfortunately, they are harder to explain and point out, then they are to make. 


Quote
Let's keep it simple:  Marriage is between a "normal" male and a "normal" female, the limits of "normalcy" end there......they cannot honestly be extended to hair color or dominant hand usage.........you are obfuscating.


Well, marriage - as presently defined, in law - is between a man and a woman - but the discussions is over changing this definition.  "Normal" is another morally useless adjective - there are plenty of things about every single individual that could be called "abnormal" -  some of those things we have moral obligations to tolerate - some of them we don't.   The "normal" or "abnormal" label does not tell us how to respond to them.


Offline Eupher

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 24894
  • Reputation: +2828/-1828
  • U.S. Army, Retired
Re: Should same-sex marriage be legal?
« Reply #238 on: March 29, 2011, 12:19:32 PM »
Stirring shit or raising objections to a particularly bad line of argument?  I guess maybe in your book those are one and the same, I don't know.   I'm just trying to keep things honest here, because this whole "aberration" business is just silly, and is really only working by equivocation.  You guys are using one definition of the word aberration to classify homosexuality/transgenderism/etc, and then assuming another once they have been classified.

As if once you label something an aberration (for being a deviation from the norm), suddenly that proves your point about its moral character... I don't think so.   Its language abuse.  Aberration does also have a definition that means something like deviation from good morals... but you don't get to just smuggle that in, and declare victory.  

The fallacy goes something like this:

Homosexuality/transgenderism/etc are deviations from the norm...
       and deviations from the norm are aberrations...  
               therefore homosexuality/transgenderism/etc are aberrations...

Aberrations are deviations from moral goodness...
        and homosexuality/transgederism are aberrations
              therefore homosexuality/transgenderism are deviations from moral goodness.

Surely you must see the problem there...  its a classic switcheroo.... shifting definitions... hopefully its not too complex for you   :)

You're getting hung up in yourself again, wilbur. It's a common thing with you. You post your eternal arguments and questions, never really solving anything, just to see how far you can take the thread.

As has been offered upthread, this issue has been hashed over in this forum repeatedly. Again and again. The only element that was brought into this particular discussion involves trannyism.

Tell you what, wilbur. I'll keep my "particularly bad line of argument" for the simple, real reason that it works for me. I'm rejecting your attempt "to keep things honest here" because, in the end, you're only satisfying your warped sense of reality. And what's so "honest" about your opinion? Other than it's yours and you own it?  :whatever:

Aberration is a term whose definition was posted earlier. You want to play word games and insist on beating that dead horse because the word doesn't suit your purpose. Fine, if that's what knocks you out, hey, I can loan you a hammer for increased pleasure if you like.

Fact is, and this you cannot dispute, homos, rugmunchers, and trannies lie outside the norm. That is a statistical fact. That makes those people aberrations -- and that has nothing whatsoever to do with "morals". They are aberrations from a biological point of view, notwithstanding that mental processes are also inherently biological.

Again, wilbur, your attempts to bring your own sense "right" in this very wrong scenario just doesn't square with me. You aren't going to change my mind, because you can't spin it any other way than what I've said. Abnormal, aberration, it's all essentially the same. You want to take the federal government and assign tasks that the Constitution does not permit.

That won't work for me. It'll work for you libs, of course, but it won't work for me.
Adams E2 Euphonium, built in 2017
Boosey & Co. Imperial Euphonium, built in 1941
Edwards B454 bass trombone, built 2012
Bach Stradivarius 42OG tenor trombone, built 1992
Kanstul 33-T BBb tuba, built 2011
Fender Precision Bass Guitar, built ?
Mouthpiece data provided on request.

Offline rubliw

  • Banned
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 304
  • Reputation: +17/-513
Re: Should same-sex marriage be legal?
« Reply #239 on: March 29, 2011, 12:23:41 PM »

Fact is, and this you cannot dispute, homos, rugmunchers, and trannies lie outside the norm. That is a statistical fact. That makes those people aberrations -- and that has nothing whatsoever to do with "morals". They are aberrations from a biological point of view, notwithstanding that mental processes are also inherently biological.


Hey, guess what?!  I agree!!  But then again, from a biological point of view, so are redheads, and left handers... Siamese twins - heck, identical twins, maternal twins, you name it.   All aberrations. 

Offline SSG Snuggle Bunny

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 23049
  • Reputation: +2234/-269
  • Voted Rookie-of-the-Year, 3 years running
Re: Should same-sex marriage be legal?
« Reply #240 on: March 29, 2011, 12:24:39 PM »
Well, marriage - as presently defined, in law - is between a man and a woman - but the discussions is over changing this definition.  "Normal" is another morally useless adjective - there are plenty of things about every single individual that could be called "abnormal" -  some of those things we have moral obligations to tolerate - some of them we don't.   The "normal" or "abnormal" label does not tell us how to respond to them.

Again, we need to speak to the purpose of a thing to determine what is or is not "normal."

Using a hammer to drive a screw is not normal and renaming the screw a "flanged nail" does nothing to mitigate the impropriety.

Quote
"Normal" is another morally useless adjective...

I'm just aching to hear the moral imperative for redefining marriage to include homosexuality.
According to the Bible, "know" means "yes."

Offline Eupher

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 24894
  • Reputation: +2828/-1828
  • U.S. Army, Retired
Re: Should same-sex marriage be legal?
« Reply #241 on: March 29, 2011, 12:26:04 PM »
Hey, guess what?!  I agree!!  But then again, from a biological point of view, so are redheads, and left handers... Siamese twins - heck, identical twins, maternal twins, you name it.   All aberrations. 


 :yourpoint:
Adams E2 Euphonium, built in 2017
Boosey & Co. Imperial Euphonium, built in 1941
Edwards B454 bass trombone, built 2012
Bach Stradivarius 42OG tenor trombone, built 1992
Kanstul 33-T BBb tuba, built 2011
Fender Precision Bass Guitar, built ?
Mouthpiece data provided on request.

Offline rubliw

  • Banned
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 304
  • Reputation: +17/-513
Re: Should same-sex marriage be legal?
« Reply #242 on: March 29, 2011, 12:39:00 PM »
Again, we need to speak to the purpose of a thing to determine what is or is not "normal."

When you find a purpose for our body parts, let me know!  As it is, I see only that there are tasks to which they are particularly well suited, but I see no purpose - no ideal blueprint to which they must conform (or be cast into the realm of moral unworthiness).    I have no problem with people using body parts for tasks which they are not particularly well suited, per se... and I'm not sure why I should.

If one wants to try to bring God, and his alleged purposes and designs, into the equation - then fine - one can do that... but those arguments shouldn't be couched in these psuedo-naturalistic terms that try to seem scientific, as happens all the time. 

Quote
Using a hammer to drive a screw is not normal and renaming the screw a "flanged nail" does nothing to mitigate the impropriety.

I'm just aching to hear the moral imperative for redefining marriage to include homosexuality.

If one values egalitarianism, human rights, those sorts of things - then I believe one has a moral imperative to redefine marriage to include homosexuality.   Its simple: its all about rights.
« Last Edit: March 29, 2011, 12:44:50 PM by rubliw »

Offline formerlurker

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 9692
  • Reputation: +801/-833
Re: Should same-sex marriage be legal?
« Reply #243 on: March 29, 2011, 12:41:30 PM »
You're alleging I don't love my son?
I didn't love the Country when I served in it combat?
I didn't love the men and women who served along with me?
I don't love my partner in the same way you love yours?
I don't love my dog?
I don't love dog training and the sport of Schutzhund?
I don't love the Mariners?
I don't love the Seahawks?
I don't love nacho cheese?
I don't love many of the same exact things that you love?



You don't love the Mariners as much as I love the Red Sox.   So there.   Why don't you think about THAT one for a while.   



Offline Rebel

  • Stick a fork in us. We're done.
  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 16802
  • Reputation: +1256/-215
Re: Should same-sex marriage be legal?
« Reply #244 on: March 29, 2011, 12:42:55 PM »
By that definition, lefties (as in left handed) are aberrations.

I agree.
NAMBLA is a left-wing organization.

Quote
There's a reason why patriotism is considered a conservative value. Watch a Tea Party rally and you'll see people proudly raising the American flag and showing pride in U.S. heroes such as Thomas Jefferson. Watch an OWS rally and you'll see people burning the American flag while showing pride in communist heroes such as Che Guevera. --Bob, from some news site

Offline debk

  • Topic Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12473
  • Reputation: +467/-58
Re: Should same-sex marriage be legal?
« Reply #245 on: March 29, 2011, 12:49:28 PM »
Let's keep it simple:  Marriage is between a "normal" male and a "normal" female, the limits of "normalcy" end there......


doc


I would just like to point out...

People who have total sex changes - man to woman, woman to man....do get married...into a heterosexual union. Difficult to do, because of having to show birth certificates, but it has happened.


Another thing to think about....

Just what is "normal" male and "normal" female with regards to a marital relationship?

Is a marriage consummated if one of the two individuals cannot consummate the marriage?

If a woman marries a man who is paralyzed from the mid-chest down, and is physically unable to have sex, the marriage is never consummated....is this a "normal" marriage? Is it a "real" marriage if not consummated?

What about a hetero couple, the woman is a soldier, severely wounded in the abdomen, has her ovaries and uterus removed in order to survive? Is she still a woman? In many cultures, she would not be. How is she now different from a transgender who has gone from man to woman? The plumbing is now the same, the boobs are probably better on the transgender, both have a vagina but no baby making parts. Essentially the injured woman and the transgender are the same by outward physical appearance, and similar internally...but the chromosomes are still different. They can both still have sexual relations.

It used to be grounds for annulment if a marriage wasn't consummated. It probably still is, though annulment has become more available under differing circumstances.

If one insists on using "normal" in describing marriage....it will only create more issues. What is defined as "normal" to one couple, may not be "normal" to another.

Using "normal" to describe marriage is not going to work.  
Just hand over the chocolate...back away slowly...far away....and you won't get hurt....

Save the Earth... it's the only planet with chocolate.

"My therapist told me the way to achieve true inner peace is to finish what I start. So far I've finished two bags of M&M's and a chocolate cake. I feel better already." – Dave Barry

A balanced diet is chocolate in both hands.

Offline TVDOC

  • General Malcontent and
  • Member
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5686
  • Reputation: +165/-3
  • Sic Transit Gloria Mundi
Re: Should same-sex marriage be legal?
« Reply #246 on: March 29, 2011, 12:51:42 PM »
If one values egalitarianism, human rights, those sorts of things - then I believe one has a moral imperative to redefine marriage to include homosexuality.   Its simple: its all about rights.

Err....there IS NO RIGHT to marriage.  It is a legal recognition granted to qualifying individuals (a privilege).

Homosexuals have the same "right" to marry someone of the opposite sex as do you or I.

If you veer into the old tired comparison of homosexual marriage vis-a-vis the civil rights movement brought by African Americans in the last century, you might find yourself the target of my  wrath (trust me that's a place you don't want to be)......I'm not in the mood to listen to that tripe all over again.

doc
"Study the past if you wish to define the future"

Confucius

Offline rubliw

  • Banned
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 304
  • Reputation: +17/-513
Re: Should same-sex marriage be legal?
« Reply #247 on: March 29, 2011, 12:58:55 PM »
Err....there IS NO RIGHT to marriage.  It is a legal recognition granted to qualifying individuals (a privilege).

A distinction without a difference - marriage is a right, driving is a right, to live and pursue happiness is a right.

Some are more fundamental than others, sure, but they are all rights, and in so far as we grant those rights to some and not others, for arbitrary, bad reasons (as we do regarding same-sex marriage) then I think we walk a dangerous line.

Quote
Homosexuals have the same "right" to marry someone of the opposite sex as do you or I.

C'mon, really?   This old canard has never, and will never deserve acknowledgement.

Quote
If you veer into the old tired comparison of homosexual marriage vis-a-vis the civil rights movement brought by African Americans in the last century, you might find yourself the target of my  wrath (trust me that's a place you don't want to be)......I'm not in the mood to listen to that tripe all over again.

Well, if you find the comparison so offensive, I can only surmise you must be completely ignorant of all the persecution that homosexuals have had to experience throughout history...  yea, sure - in the US, blacks take the prize for the being the most severe victims of sustained persecution - but fact is, gays havent had it easy either.  Hell, in the early US, you could be put to death for being gay.  And they sometimes were.  Our posture towards homosexuals used to be not entirely unlike that of the the Islamic fundamentalist nations.

Offline SSG Snuggle Bunny

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 23049
  • Reputation: +2234/-269
  • Voted Rookie-of-the-Year, 3 years running
Re: Should same-sex marriage be legal?
« Reply #248 on: March 29, 2011, 01:08:12 PM »
When you find a purpose for our body parts, let me know!... 


You are obviously ignorant of anatomy and physiology.

Quote
If one values egalitarianism, human rights, those sorts of things - then I believe one has a moral imperative to redefine marriage to include homosexuality.   Its simple: its all about rights.

You unilaterally declaring something a human right does not make it so. Again, please demonstrate the moral imperative.

Are you on record endorsing unqualified egalitarianism or are there limits to what a society should accept?

It seems to me if you claim the former you admit some rather noxious behaviors far and above mere homosexuality. If you claim the latter than you admit there are limits and maybe your claims aren't as sacrosanct after all.
According to the Bible, "know" means "yes."

Offline formerlurker

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 9692
  • Reputation: +801/-833
Re: Should same-sex marriage be legal?
« Reply #249 on: March 29, 2011, 01:11:43 PM »
Marriage in it's current conception hasn't existed for that long.


You have done a fine job debating your position in this thread.   Historically this topic usually turns to a heated and quite ugly one.   This thread was enjoyable to read on both sides of the issue. 

H5.