Freaking Cell Phones

[Lauri]

Nice emotionalism in the last sentence there, free. It's right up there with a hundred or two idiots laying down playing dead in front of Phillip Morris in the 'Truth' commercials. 

Yeah, it was a little over the top.  I guess I am very passionate on the subject since I have been almost run off the road and one time inches away from being hit in a crosswalk by cell phone users.

IMHO, people who talk and drive have complete disdain and contempt for the other drivers -- their silly-assed little conversation is more important than my life.  And that I don't think is over the top.

Free? Do you ever change the radio station while driving? Ever eat while driving? both of these things will cause you to become distracted and not have your complete attention to driving.

oh good Lord no, he never takes his hands off the 10 and 2 positions

[Lauri]

Nice emotionalism in the last sentence there, free. It's right up there with a hundred or two idiots laying down playing dead in front of Phillip Morris in the 'Truth' commercials. 

Yeah, it was a little over the top.  I guess I am very passionate on the subject since I have been almost run off the road and one time inches away from being hit in a crosswalk by cell phone users.

IMHO, people who talk and drive have complete disdain and contempt for the other drivers -- their silly-assed little conversation is more important than my life.  And that I don't think is over the top.

I still think you are over emotionalizing the topic. I'd like to know the driving records of everyone in that study. I think that matters. FWIW and hoping it does not jinx me, I have not been in an accident and I've been driving 20 years. SOME people should not talk and drive for the same reason some people should not drive 18 wheelers or fly planes. They simply do not have the capability for it, nor are they responsible enough drivers to understand when driving conditions warrant limited distractions. They are the same people that end up in ditches because they drive 50 mph in a blizzard. But, that is a personal responsibility issue and like ending up in a ditch before a blizzard, you get ticketed for it AFTER you have committed a driving offense caused by your inability to use judgment when driving, you don't ban everyone from driving in a blizzard.

At least tell me you aren't the type that has the misconception that people who use their phone with driving do it ALL the time and in ANY driving condition. That simply is not true.

Fair enough -- I am mostly ranting against people who get on the phone and talk nonstop before, during and after their driving trip (we all know the type). Although my hard and fast rule is to never accept cell phone calls while driving, I will allow myself to make a brief call if I know I am on a long, uninterrupted, straight stretch.  But I limit it to a minute or so.

I once saw John Travolta's wife tearfully relaying a story that happened in her home with her child. Apparently chemicals in carpet cleaning almost caused her son some serious health issues.

Therefore, she wanted those carpet cleaning chemicals banned from the planet.

Oh, and raisins too.. she considers those little "chemical pellets" as well cause her son had a reaction to them.

Can each of us get every little pesky issue legislated since it happened to us and made us mad?

[Chris_]

Nice emotionalism in the last sentence there, free. It's right up there with a hundred or two idiots laying down playing dead in front of Phillip Morris in the 'Truth' commercials.  :lmao:

Yeah, it was a little over the top.  I guess I am very passionate on the subject since I have been almost run off the road and one time inches away from being hit in a crosswalk by cell phone users.

IMHO, people who talk and drive have complete disdain and contempt for the other drivers -- their silly-assed little conversation is more important than my life.  And that I don't think is over the top.

Free? Do you ever change the radio station while driving? Ever eat while driving? both of these things will cause you to become distracted and not have your complete attention to driving.

You need to read my post for content.  If so, you have your answer. And, FWIIW, I *never* eat in the car, but that has nothing to do with the subject at hand.

[Chris_]

Nice emotionalism in the last sentence there, free. It's right up there with a hundred or two idiots laying down playing dead in front of Phillip Morris in the 'Truth' commercials.  :lmao:

Yeah, it was a little over the top.  I guess I am very passionate on the subject since I have been almost run off the road and one time inches away from being hit in a crosswalk by cell phone users.

IMHO, people who talk and drive have complete disdain and contempt for the other drivers -- their silly-assed little conversation is more important than my life.  And that I don't think is over the top.

I still think you are over emotionalizing the topic. I'd like to know the driving records of everyone in that study. I think that matters. FWIW and hoping it does not jinx me, I have not been in an accident and I've been driving 20 years. SOME people should not talk and drive for the same reason some people should not drive 18 wheelers or fly planes. They simply do not have the capability for it, nor are they responsible enough drivers to understand when driving conditions warrant limited distractions. They are the same people that end up in ditches because they drive 50 mph in a blizzard. But, that is a personal responsibility issue and like ending up in a ditch before a blizzard, you get ticketed for it AFTER you have committed a driving offense caused by your inability to use judgment when driving, you don't ban everyone from driving in a blizzard.

At least tell me you aren't the type that has the misconception that people who use their phone with driving do it ALL the time and in ANY driving condition. That simply is not true.

Fair enough -- I am mostly ranting against people who get on the phone and talk nonstop before, during and after their driving trip (we all know the type). Although my hard and fast rule is to never accept cell phone calls while driving, I will allow myself to make a brief call if I know I am on a long, uninterrupted, straight stretch.  But I limit it to a minute or so.

I once saw John Travolta's wife tearfully relaying a story that happened in her home with her child. Apparently chemicals in carpet cleaning almost caused her son some serious health issues.

Therefore, she wanted those carpet cleaning chemicals banned from the planet.

Oh, and raisins too.. she considers those little "chemical pellets" as well cause her son had a reaction to them.

Can each of us get every little pesky issue legislated since it happened to us and made us mad?

It isn't a question of mad, it is a question of dead. Like I said, studies show that using a cell phone while driving is the equivalent to driving drunk.  Are you advocating driving drunk?

[Lauri]

well tell ya what.. when you and your scientist buddies can prove to us that American citizens are dying on the highways in the same numbers as the drunk driving accidents, then possibly.

as of yet, i dont think you have anything more than, "i almost got hit by one, so they are ALL bad!"

ive almost been hit by older people than any other part of the population .. can we legislate that no one over 50 drives? Cause, since it happened to me, I can broadbrush that to the entire population.

[Chris_]

well tell ya what.. when you and your scientist buddies can prove to us that American citizens are dying on the highways in the same numbers as the drunk driving accidents, then possibly.

as of yet, i dont think you have anything more than, "i almost got hit by one, so they are ALL bad!"

ive almost been hit by older people than any other part of the population .. can we legislate that no one over 50 drives? Cause, since it happened to me, I can broadbrush that to the entire population.

No that is the reason for my vehemence.

There is legislation already in many places that have older people pass more stringent tests to prove they can drive well.  And it is younger people that are the worst drivers and there are also laws dealing with that specifically.  As I said, we have laws against drunk driving.  If, as the science says, using a cell phone is the same, then why is it NOT subject to similar laws?

And I see bad driving due to cell usage A LOT. At least every time I drive I have to deal with someone swerving, slowing, etc. and causing me to deal with them.

[Randy]

I don't use my phone in the car unless it's an emergency. 

Okay, I picked up the cheapy LG.  I'm so sad.   

I don't have any of my fun ring tones.  It just sucks.  But I am on the pay as you go right now.  Hmm, I'm thinking in a couple of months I'll sign on a contract again and get a better phone. 

I'm a bit late into this thread and I'm sorry for that Mia. As long as you have an AT&T sim card then you can use it in any AT&T sim card compatible phone. I did the Go Phone for several years and have a pile of phones I used. I'd pick them up at garage sales or for cheap on ebay. I started with a free starter Nokia and my last one was an eBay Razor.

Metro PCS came to my area with their unlimited voice/data/text no contract system and I switched. The 3 of us are on the family plan for <130 a month, outrageous taxes included.

[Lauri]

well tell ya what.. when you and your scientist buddies can prove to us that American citizens are dying on the highways in the same numbers as the drunk driving accidents, then possibly.

as of yet, i dont think you have anything more than, "i almost got hit by one, so they are ALL bad!"

ive almost been hit by older people than any other part of the population .. can we legislate that no one over 50 drives? Cause, since it happened to me, I can broadbrush that to the entire population.

No that is the reason for my vehemence.

There is legislation already in many places that have older people pass more stringent tests to prove they can drive well.  And it is younger people that are the worst drivers and there are also laws dealing with that specifically.  As I said, we have laws against drunk driving.  If, as the science says, using a cell phone is the same, then why is it NOT subject to similar laws?

And I see bad driving due to cell usage A LOT. At least every time I drive I have to deal with someone swerving, slowing, etc. and causing me to deal with them.

well, i dont. so who is right?

does science have actual statistics that back up their claims that its 'as bad' as driving drunk? cause if they dont, maybe that's why the public isnt on board with it yet.

although, the nanny state legislators arent even going to wait for the actual numbers, they will just listen to people like you and take them away from everyone and make it a law. watch out for those unintended consequences that turn into laws.

[jtyangel]

Lauri,
I thought of free this morning as I sat behind a driver going 10 mph less then the speed limit, swerving a bit, etc...what was she doing? brushing her friggin hair... I've seen plenty of people too using cells and they drive just fine. I've seen ones who don't drive great too. My neighborhood is small enough I've seen these individuals a few times and EVERYTIME they are distracted, they drive shitty. As I said earlier in the thread, one has to have a certain skill level to multi-task in that way, but currently we don't give driving tests to determine if someone can drink coffee and drive, talk to someone in the seat next to them and drive, or yell at their children and drive...cell phone usage falls in those categories imo.

As for the 'scientific study', I have already asked what was the driving records of these individuals prior to the study. I find that very curious as a driver for 20 years now with no accidents, 2 tickets(back in my early 20's--many years ago and not for driving distracted btw), and who uses the cell phone occasionally when driving. I'd like to know if all those participants have similar driving records and abilities.

Again, another microlegislative issue which a free society should not tolerate. If you screw up because you are on the phone, you face the consequences...period. It's no different then fighting with your spouse in the car and you are distracted and cause an accident...an accident is an accident is an accident. Lobbying a phone up there with booze is simply absurd.  What next? Kids are abused ala cigarette smoking if you use your cell phone in the house while they are around? 

I know I"m being ridiculous, but since we've already went in that direction...I figure I have license

[DixieBelle]

Well here's some food for thought -
http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/people/injury/research/wireless/

Read the summary for the highlights http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/people/injury/research/wireless/#rep

Hand held cell phone use while driving is banned in a lot of places. As of March 2008 four states -- Connecticut, New Jersey, New York and Utah -- plus the District of Columbia had laws on the books banning the use of hand-held cell phones while driving. Similar laws in California and Washington State go into effect in July 2008. Except for Utah and Washington State, the laws are all "primary enforcement," meaning a motorist may be ticketed for using a hand-held cell phone while driving without any other traffic offense taking place.

http://www.iii.org/media/hottopics/insurance/cellphones/

[jtyangel]

The available evidence is adequate to support the conclusion that the answer to this question is "Yes," at least in isolated cases. The conclusion appears reasonably plausible, particularly in light of the trends in the data, the growing complexity of the technology, and the inherent distraction potential of using such devices from a moving vehicle. What remains unknown is the relative contribution of cellular phone use, per se, and charactertistics of the involved drivers (e.g., less capacity to time-share attention between cellular telephone use and driving tasks, greater propensity for risk taking, fatigue).

Again, driving record factors in here under characteristics. How many people involved in crashes like this have been cited before for driving recklessly under other circumstances? I'm betting a few. Or have received tickets for running lights or something while on the phone(showing they have an inability to multi-task while driving?)?

And I'll reiterate, there are already penalties for accidents no matter what the distraction. If someone misjudges their ability or focus and gets in an accident they should face the same penalty as anyone else who misjudges ability and focus ie those who drive when they are tired and get in an accident, those who drive too fast in hazardous conditions, those who take turns too fast, etc. The reason for it only figures in when determining responsibility and cause, it should not be isolated for legislation as a whole. But I think at this point, none of us on either side are convincing the other. 

The drunk driving thing I'll put aside. The only, only condition I see that even comes close are certain medical conditions and when someone is tired and has their judgement impaired. Everything else I would not qualify under impaired judgment.

[Chris_]

well tell ya what.. when you and your scientist buddies can prove to us that American citizens are dying on the highways in the same numbers as the drunk driving accidents, then possibly.

as of yet, i dont think you have anything more than, "i almost got hit by one, so they are ALL bad!"

ive almost been hit by older people than any other part of the population .. can we legislate that no one over 50 drives? Cause, since it happened to me, I can broadbrush that to the entire population.

No that is the reason for my vehemence.

There is legislation already in many places that have older people pass more stringent tests to prove they can drive well.  And it is younger people that are the worst drivers and there are also laws dealing with that specifically.  As I said, we have laws against drunk driving.  If, as the science says, using a cell phone is the same, then why is it NOT subject to similar laws?

And I see bad driving due to cell usage A LOT. At least every time I drive I have to deal with someone swerving, slowing, etc. and causing me to deal with them.

well, i dont. so who is right?

does science have actual statistics that back up their claims that its 'as bad' as driving drunk? cause if they dont, maybe that's why the public isnt on board with it yet.

although, the nanny state legislators arent even going to wait for the actual numbers, they will just listen to people like you and take them away from everyone and make it a law. watch out for those unintended consequences that turn into laws.

I posted the article.  You have yet to post one that counters the information provided.

[Toastedturningtidelegs]

Nice emotionalism in the last sentence there, free. It's right up there with a hundred or two idiots laying down playing dead in front of Phillip Morris in the 'Truth' commercials. 

Yeah, it was a little over the top.  I guess I am very passionate on the subject since I have been almost run off the road and one time inches away from being hit in a crosswalk by cell phone users.

IMHO, people who talk and drive have complete disdain and contempt for the other drivers -- their silly-assed little conversation is more important than my life.  And that I don't think is over the top.

Free? Do you ever change the radio station while driving? Ever eat while driving? both of these things will cause you to become distracted and not have your complete attention to driving.

You need to read my post for content.  If so, you have your answer. And, FWIIW, I *never* eat in the car, but that has nothing to do with the subject at hand.

It has everyhting to do with the subject at hand distracted driving is distracted driving. When these "scientists" can prove that talking on a cell phone while driving raises your blood alcohol content then I will whole heartedly agree with you that it is tantamount to drunk driving.

[Chris_]

Nice emotionalism in the last sentence there, free. It's right up there with a hundred or two idiots laying down playing dead in front of Phillip Morris in the 'Truth' commercials.  :lmao:

Yeah, it was a little over the top.  I guess I am very passionate on the subject since I have been almost run off the road and one time inches away from being hit in a crosswalk by cell phone users.

IMHO, people who talk and drive have complete disdain and contempt for the other drivers -- their silly-assed little conversation is more important than my life.  And that I don't think is over the top.

Free? Do you ever change the radio station while driving? Ever eat while driving? both of these things will cause you to become distracted and not have your complete attention to driving.

You need to read my post for content.  If so, you have your answer. And, FWIIW, I *never* eat in the car, but that has nothing to do with the subject at hand.

It has everyhting to do with the subject at hand distracted driving is distracted driving. When these "scientists" can prove that talking on a cell phone while driving raises your blood alcohol content then I will whole heartedly agree with you that it is tantamount to drunk driving.

Again, please read for content.

[Toastedturningtidelegs]

Nice emotionalism in the last sentence there, free. It's right up there with a hundred or two idiots laying down playing dead in front of Phillip Morris in the 'Truth' commercials. 

Yeah, it was a little over the top.  I guess I am very passionate on the subject since I have been almost run off the road and one time inches away from being hit in a crosswalk by cell phone users.

IMHO, people who talk and drive have complete disdain and contempt for the other drivers -- their silly-assed little conversation is more important than my life.  And that I don't think is over the top.

Free? Do you ever change the radio station while driving? Ever eat while driving? both of these things will cause you to become distracted and not have your complete attention to driving.

You need to read my post for content.  If so, you have your answer. And, FWIIW, I *never* eat in the car, but that has nothing to do with the subject at hand.

It has everyhting to do with the subject at hand distracted driving is distracted driving. When these "scientists" can prove that talking on a cell phone while driving raises your blood alcohol content then I will whole heartedly agree with you that it is tantamount to drunk driving.

Again, please read for content.

I did and I don't buy it.I don't consider it impaired driving, a distraction at best. This kind of reeks of special interest to me.

[jtyangel]

Nice emotionalism in the last sentence there, free. It's right up there with a hundred or two idiots laying down playing dead in front of Phillip Morris in the 'Truth' commercials. 

Yeah, it was a little over the top.  I guess I am very passionate on the subject since I have been almost run off the road and one time inches away from being hit in a crosswalk by cell phone users.

IMHO, people who talk and drive have complete disdain and contempt for the other drivers -- their silly-assed little conversation is more important than my life.  And that I don't think is over the top.

Free? Do you ever change the radio station while driving? Ever eat while driving? both of these things will cause you to become distracted and not have your complete attention to driving.

You need to read my post for content.  If so, you have your answer. And, FWIIW, I *never* eat in the car, but that has nothing to do with the subject at hand.

It has everyhting to do with the subject at hand distracted driving is distracted driving. When these "scientists" can prove that talking on a cell phone while driving raises your blood alcohol content then I will whole heartedly agree with you that it is tantamount to drunk driving.

They won't. Cell phone usage is the cause du jour and save for free, apparently, nothing else gets picked on precisely because most people who have issue with cell phone usage in the car do other distracting things like put on makeup, eat, drink coffee, chat with friends in the car, flip radio stations, yell at their kids, put a new DVD in for the children, look at their gps system, etc. Not to mention those are much harder to prove. If you get in a crash and you have an open cell hone on the floor...cops can make assumptions about the reason. Much harder to prove that someone was distracted by arguing with their spouse or even eating when there isn't really any physical way to prove it. All crashes are caused by distractions or the more serious impairments so why ONE DISTRACTION (cell phone use) is legislated against but not others...not a very consistent opinion, it really isn't and that doesn't even begin to express the issues with MICRO legislating in a free society which ALL conservatives should concern themselves with. 

[Chris_]

I did and I don't buy it.I don't consider it impaired driving, a distraction at best. This kind of reeks of special interest to me.

Ah, well that is a devastating blow.  "I don't buy it."  Wow, that is a knife through the heart of my contention.

What special interest would this serve?  It isn't like they can get money from this, other than a few bucks for the research itself.  The biggest special interests are AGAINST this type of research.

[Lauri]

Lauri,
I thought of free this morning as I sat behind a driver going 10 mph less then the speed limit, swerving a bit, etc...what was she doing? brushing her friggin hair... I've seen plenty of people too using cells and they drive just fine. I've seen ones who don't drive great too. My neighborhood is small enough I've seen these individuals a few times and EVERYTIME they are distracted, they drive shitty. As I said earlier in the thread, one has to have a certain skill level to multi-task in that way, but currently we don't give driving tests to determine if someone can drink coffee and drive, talk to someone in the seat next to them and drive, or yell at their children and drive...cell phone usage falls in those categories imo.

As for the 'scientific study', I have already asked what was the driving records of these individuals prior to the study. I find that very curious as a driver for 20 years now with no accidents, 2 tickets(back in my early 20's--many years ago and not for driving distracted btw), and who uses the cell phone occasionally when driving. I'd like to know if all those participants have similar driving records and abilities.

Again, another microlegislative issue which a free society should not tolerate. If you screw up because you are on the phone, you face the consequences...period. It's no different then fighting with your spouse in the car and you are distracted and cause an accident...an accident is an accident is an accident. Lobbying a phone up there with booze is simply absurd.  What next? Kids are abused ala cigarette smoking if you use your cell phone in the house while they are around? 

I know I"m being ridiculous, but since we've already went in that direction...I figure I have license

actually, you arent being ridiculous at all! seat belt laws started out as a 'suggestion' from the govt... a 'this will protect you and your family more' kind of thing.

then we started getting tickets for not wearing them.

i agree that seat belts save lives, absolutely. but why does the state get to go from a suggestion to a law? and why do state busses carrying school children get exempt but we get ticketed??

our state is in the process of trying to figure out how to enforce no cell phones while driving.. so in addition to eveything else a cop has to look for, cell phones was just added to his list and for most of us, we do just fine and arent causing accidents but we'll get ticketed anyway because it "might' happen ...

[Lauri]

Well here's some food for thought -
http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/people/injury/research/wireless/

Read the summary for the highlights http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/people/injury/research/wireless/#rep

Hand held cell phone use while driving is banned in a lot of places. As of March 2008 four states -- Connecticut, New Jersey, New York and Utah -- plus the District of Columbia had laws on the books banning the use of hand-held cell phones while driving. Similar laws in California and Washington State go into effect in July 2008. Except for Utah and Washington State, the laws are all "primary enforcement," meaning a motorist may be ticketed for using a hand-held cell phone while driving without any other traffic offense taking place.

http://www.iii.org/media/hottopics/insurance/cellphones/

crud! didnt read the other responses before posting.... so yeah, we are in that process already.

the fire department has outlawed christmas trees and small grills on apartment balconies. i figure down the line, Wa. State will make it illegal to use chimenia's or grills at all.. 

[Lauri]

Nice emotionalism in the last sentence there, free. It's right up there with a hundred or two idiots laying down playing dead in front of Phillip Morris in the 'Truth' commercials. 

Yeah, it was a little over the top.  I guess I am very passionate on the subject since I have been almost run off the road and one time inches away from being hit in a crosswalk by cell phone users.

IMHO, people who talk and drive have complete disdain and contempt for the other drivers -- their silly-assed little conversation is more important than my life.  And that I don't think is over the top.

Free? Do you ever change the radio station while driving? Ever eat while driving? both of these things will cause you to become distracted and not have your complete attention to driving.

You need to read my post for content.  If so, you have your answer. And, FWIIW, I *never* eat in the car, but that has nothing to do with the subject at hand.

It has everyhting to do with the subject at hand distracted driving is distracted driving. When these "scientists" can prove that talking on a cell phone while driving raises your blood alcohol content then I will whole heartedly agree with you that it is tantamount to drunk driving.

Again, please read for content.

I did and I don't buy it.I don't consider it impaired driving, a distraction at best. This kind of reeks of special interest to me.

my screaming toddler made me want to drink... think the state will buy that?

[Chris_]

Lauri,
I thought of free this morning as I sat behind a driver going 10 mph less then the speed limit, swerving a bit, etc...what was she doing? brushing her friggin hair... :lmao: I've seen plenty of people too using cells and they drive just fine. I've seen ones who don't drive great too. My neighborhood is small enough I've seen these individuals a few times and EVERYTIME they are distracted, they drive shitty. As I said earlier in the thread, one has to have a certain skill level to multi-task in that way, but currently we don't give driving tests to determine if someone can drink coffee and drive, talk to someone in the seat next to them and drive, or yell at their children and drive...cell phone usage falls in those categories imo.

As for the 'scientific study', I have already asked what was the driving records of these individuals prior to the study. I find that very curious as a driver for 20 years now with no accidents, 2 tickets(back in my early 20's--many years ago and not for driving distracted btw), and who uses the cell phone occasionally when driving. I'd like to know if all those participants have similar driving records and abilities.

Again, another microlegislative issue which a free society should not tolerate. If you screw up because you are on the phone, you face the consequences...period. It's no different then fighting with your spouse in the car and you are distracted and cause an accident...an accident is an accident is an accident. Lobbying a phone up there with booze is simply absurd.  What next? Kids are abused ala cigarette smoking if you use your cell phone in the house while they are around?  :mental:

I know I"m being ridiculous, but since we've already went in that direction...I figure I have license :-) :hyper:

actually, you arent being ridiculous at all! seat belt laws started out as a 'suggestion' from the govt... a 'this will protect you and your family more' kind of thing.

then we started getting tickets for not wearing them.

i agree that seat belts save lives, absolutely. but why does the state get to go from a suggestion to a law? and why do state busses carrying school children get exempt but we get ticketed??

our state is in the process of trying to figure out how to enforce no cell phones while driving.. so in addition to eveything else a cop has to look for, cell phones was just added to his list and for most of us, we do just fine and arent causing accidents but we'll get ticketed anyway because it "might' happen ...

I think the problem is that it isn't "might" -- it is "more likely than not."

But if you are against mandated seat belts then at least I understand your vehemence on the subject.  You're just really libertarian, even when safety is at stake.  I suppose you are against mandated motorcycle helmets, too. 

Not an indictment, just an observation.

[Chris_]

Arghhh!  Wrong forum!  I thought I'd set it to GD, but it changed.   

[Chris_]

Arghhh!  Wrong forum!  I thought I'd set it to GD, but it changed.   :thatsright:

I am getting dizzy here.  Well, I have taken my seatbelt off and have cell phone on -- let's go!

[DixieBelle]

I moved it for you ACC.

[Chris_]

Thanks, Dixie.

I apologize, Free. 

It's Friday night, I'm pretty much brain-dead right now.   

Now, back to the debate.