Male Columbia professor charged with incest, female parter is not

[Freeper]

Egalitariat  (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author  Click to view this author's profile  Click to add this author to your buddy list  Click to add this author to your Ignore list      Fri Dec-10-10 03:07 PM
Original message
Male Columbia professor charged with incest, female parter is not
   
I'd like a legal explanation for how this guy is charged with incest, but his female "partner", who was over 18 and apparently a consenting participant (I base that on the quote that "the two often exchanged twisted text messages") somehow avoids it.

http://www.nydailynews.com/ny_local/2010/12/09/2010-12-09_columbia_professor_is_charged_with_incest_accused_of_bedding_young_relative_for_.html

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x9745595

From the article,

Epstein, who specializes in American politics and voting rights, has taught at Harvard and Stanford and often is quoted by news organizations. He also has blogged on The Huffington Post.

Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/ny_local/2010/12/09/2010-12-09_columbia_professor_is_charged_with_incest_accused_of_bedding_young_relative_for_.html#ixzz17vZFzJoR

Suich  Donating Member  (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author  Click to view this author's profile  Click to add this author to your buddy list  Click to add this author to your Ignore list      Fri Dec-10-10 03:21 PM
Response to Original message
1. Hm-m-m-m-m.
   
That IS odd. The whole thing doesn't make any sense...is someone out to "get" him?

Interesting the outrage is over someone prosecuting him, not the fact he was having sex with a relative.

Odin2005  Donating Member  (1000+ posts)  Journal  Click to send private message to this author  Click to view this author's profile  Click to add this author to your buddy list  Click to add this author to your Ignore list      Sun Dec-12-10 02:19 PM
Response to Original message
10. If both are adults and it is consensual why is it anyone's businesss?

 

Looks like the DUmp has a new hero now.

[Freeper]

MineralMan  Donating Member  (1000+ posts)  Journal  Click to send private message to this author  Click to view this author's profile  Click to add this author to your buddy list  Click to add this author to your Ignore list      Sat Dec-11-10 02:43 PM
Response to Original message
1. Interestingly enough, he's also a blogger at HuffPo.
   
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/david-epstein

The woman was his daughter.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/12/10/david-epstein-...

It just goes to show, you never can tell...
   

From another thread, http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x9753677

bluedigger  Donating Member  (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author  Click to view this author's profile  Click to add this author to your buddy list  Click to add this author to your Ignore list      Sat Dec-11-10 03:07 PM
Response to Original message
2. Sick? Yes. Criminal? Yes. DU worthy? meh...
   
According to the link it was between two adults. Other than the fact he has blogged on Huffpo it should be a private matter of local interest at best. :boring:

UndertheOcean  Donating Member  (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author  Click to view this author's profile  Click to add this author to your buddy list  Click to add this author to your Ignore list      Sat Dec-11-10 08:19 PM
Response to Original message
16. Ok , why is sex between two consenting adults morally wrong ? However disgusting you find it ?

[mamacags]

He was banging his DAUGHTER!!!!!!!!  It wasn't like it was a 4th cousin once removed people!  No one is "out to get him".  HE. IS. HAVING. SEX. WITH. THE. CHILD. HE. BROUGHT. INTO. THIS. WORLD.!!!!!!!  The little girl who probably had her diapers changed by him.  Who thinks that this shit just started!??!  He was probably raping her since she was a tiny girl.  Sick pieces of shit pedophile apologists, I hope you all die.

[miskie]

Dear people who run the prisons,

Epstein is a good boy. He was only touching my granddaughter because I went on vacation to Boca and he was lonely. He is very sorry and won't do it again.

Signed

Epstein's Mom.

[BlueStateSaint]

Dear people who run the prisons,

Epstein is a good boy. He was only touching my granddaughter because I went on vacation to Boca and he was lonely. He is very sorry and won't do it again.

Signed

Epstein's Mom.

PS--make sure my good boy gets a big, cuddly-type roomcellmate, so he can feel protected from all of the meanies in prison.

[bijou]

He was banging his DAUGHTER!!!!!!!!  It wasn't like it was a 4th cousin once removed people!  No one is "out to get him".  HE. IS. HAVING. SEX. WITH. THE. CHILD. HE. BROUGHT. INTO. THIS. WORLD.!!!!!!!  The little girl who probably had her diapers changed by him.  Who thinks that this shit just started!??!  He was probably raping her since she was a tiny girl.  Sick pieces of shit pedophile apologists, I hope you all die.

Even if it started when she was 18, surely they must see that her upbringing was hugely dysfunctional. No normally brought child would ssuddenly wake up at the age of 18 and think it was OK to have sex with a parent.

[vesta111]

He was banging his DAUGHTER!!!!!!!!  It wasn't like it was a 4th cousin once removed people!  No one is "out to get him".  HE. IS. HAVING. SEX. WITH. THE. CHILD. HE. BROUGHT. INTO. THIS. WORLD.!!!!!!!  The little girl who probably had her diapers changed by him.  Who thinks that this shit just started!??!  He was probably raping her since she was a tiny girl.  Sick pieces of shit pedophile apologists, I hope you all die.

Mama, please calm down here.  The female was a relative of his, and 21 when she agreed to have sex with this teacher be it daughter--yuck or uncle another yuck.

This relative at her age had the choice to either stay or go.     This is not a helpless child, She at that age Consented to the sex, why, well perhaps we will find out soon.

There was a 3 year space from the time she reached 18 to 21, why did the male wait so long before either he or she made their move.??

What we do not know is if the woman is handicapped in some way, has mental problems that would lead to her being forced to sleep with this man.  Did she jump or was she pushed here.

Most child molesters would not even look twice at a 21 year old woman.  I have read that when a child boy or girl begins to mature, molesters become turned off, they need the kids under 14-15.   This may be a power thing for them and when the kids began to demand things from them, they want complete subservience from a young child that has no choice but to obey the adult.

This is a fascinating case as we have all the storeys of parents--mother does know-- that lock up their girls as sex slaves.  One can not tell me that some woman keep their mouths shut when their little girls get a visit at night from daddy.

Are child molesters insane would say yes, but those in the profession disagree with me.  The Professional head shrinks say that this is a sex choice as is being gay or only wanting to date people with blond hair.

Bull shit---most of those head shrinks get off hearing details of this sort.  False memory's are a great way to make a name for themselves.

Mama, these are 2 adults that for what ever reason decided to bed down together, they are related to each other and now the outcry.

I wonder what would happen if twin brothers both gay took up house keeping together at the age of 21.  Must ask Barney Frank how he feels about this.

[true_blood]

I wonder what would happen if twin brothers both gay took up house keeping together at the age of 21.  Must ask Barney Frank how he feels about this.

He would be so excited. :gay:He would want to move in.

[Celtic Rose]

Mama, please calm down here.  The female was a relative of his, and 21 when she agreed to have sex with this teacher be it daughter--yuck or uncle another yuck.

This relative at her age had the choice to either stay or go.     This is not a helpless child, She at that age Consented to the sex, why, well perhaps we will find out soon.

There was a 3 year space from the time she reached 18 to 21, why did the male wait so long before either he or she made their move.??

What we do not know is if the woman is handicapped in some way, has mental problems that would lead to her being forced to sleep with this man.  Did she jump or was she pushed here.

Most child molesters would not even look twice at a 21 year old woman.  I have read that when a child boy or girl begins to mature, molesters become turned off, they need the kids under 14-15.   This may be a power thing for them and when the kids began to demand things from them, they want complete subservience from a young child that has no choice but to obey the adult.

This is a fascinating case as we have all the storeys of parents--mother does know-- that lock up their girls as sex slaves.  One can not tell me that some woman keep their mouths shut when their little girls get a visit at night from daddy.

Are child molesters insane would say yes, but those in the profession disagree with me.  The Professional head shrinks say that this is a sex choice as is being gay or only wanting to date people with blond hair.

Bull shit---most of those head shrinks get off hearing details of this sort.  False memory's are a great way to make a name for themselves.

Mama, these are 2 adults that for what ever reason decided to bed down together, they are related to each other and now the outcry.

I wonder what would happen if twin brothers both gay took up house keeping together at the age of 21.  Must ask Barney Frank how he feels about this.

There is absolutely nothing that would make me want a "relationship" with my dad.  I'm with Bijou, even if he didn't abuse her as a child, something was messed up with their relationship to begin with for her to consent to an incestuous relationship.  Normal fathers do not want sex with their daughters, and normal daughters do not want sex with their fathers, no matter what Freud says. 

[BEG]

I wonder if they would be so "meh" is it was Todd Palin having sex with Bristol. 

[dandi]

I wonder if they would be so "meh" is it was Todd Palin having sex with Bristol. 

It would fill their GD forum for the next six months.

Of course, DUmmies make no claims of morality for themselves except for "helping the downtrodden" (which interestingly always seems to include them in some way), so they can't be attacked for moral hypocrisy no matter how vile their behavior. Conservatives, on the other hand, at least try to set some standards of decency which allows liberals to revel in even their slightest fall from grace.

[miskie]

It would fill their GD forum for the next six months.

Of course, DUmmies make no claims of morality for themselves except for "helping the downtrodden" (which interestingly always seems to include them in some way), so they can't be attacked for moral hypocrisy no matter how vile their behavior. Conservatives, on the other hand, at least try to set some standards of decency which allows liberals to revel in even their slightest fall from grace.

Actually, I expect that the primitive intelligentsia are searching right now for any 'conservative' who may have been involved in an incestuous relationship to knock this story off the headlines with.

And if they don't find one, they will fabricate one.

[Airwolf]

I hope that tool Odin never has children and this happens to the chid. His response to it would be frightening.

[DumbAss Tanker]

It would fill their GD forum for the next six months.

Of course, DUmmies make no claims of morality for themselves except for "helping the downtrodden" (which interestingly always seems to include them in some way), so they can't be attacked for moral hypocrisy no matter how vile their behavior. Conservatives, on the other hand, at least try to set some standards of decency which allows liberals to revel in even their slightest fall from grace.

Exactly, their response to any such reciprocal scandals boils down to 'Well, we never said we were anything but immoral scum in the first place, so it's no big deal that a Democrat did it.'

[debk]

Vesta has a point....

If in fact, this creepy-crawly "relationship" did not start until the daughter was 21....and if, the girl has not physical or mental disabilities (mental retardation)...and if, she or someone else she was close to, was not threatened by the father in any way....

Then the girl made this choice of her own volition.

Creepy, yes. Disgusting? Oh yeah. Morally wrong? It is to me, and to my Church.

Illegal? I guess that's up to the state they live in. I would think, though, that it's only going to be illegal because of the blood relationship of the two individuals. If the daughter was a voluntary participant...it isn't going to be rape. It isn't pedophilia due to her age at the time of acknowledged sexual behavior.

It does seem even weirder that at 21, the girl just decided to have sex ( )with her father. I'm sure all the nasty little details will come out eventually. Some shrink is going to have a field day with this one....and get a book deal. 

[VivisMom]

Then the girl made this choice of her own volition. 

Maybe not. People who suffer sexual abuse at the hands of a relative are usually groomed for it from a young age. There is no doubt in my mind that this girl has severe mental and emotional issues.

[DumbAss Tanker]

Maybe not. People who suffer sexual abuse at the hands of a relative are usually groomed for it from a young age. There is no doubt in my mind that this girl has severe mental and emotional issues.

I'm not a big fan of blaming every sexual (or other) decision of full-fledged adults on someone else, if you go far enough down that rabbit hole it absolves everyone of personal accountability for everything. 

[GOBUCKS]

I wonder if they would be so "meh" is it was Todd Palin having sex with Bristol. 

If that happened, the big controversy would be over how he got chopped into so many small pieces.

[AllosaursRus]

I'll never be convinced that this just started when she turned 21!

That's pure bullshit! The daughter is sexually attracted to her father???? Not without conditioning from a young age! You'll never convince me this puke is not one sick puppy!

[crockspot]

Dear people who run the prisons,

Epstein is a good boy. He was only touching my granddaughter because I went on vacation to Boca and he was lonely. He is very sorry and won't do it again.

Signed

Epstein's Mom.

I loved that show when it was on, but when I watched it on DVD last year, it sucked.

[Habsfan]

I'll never be convinced that this just started when she turned 21!

That's pure bullshit! The daughter is sexually attracted to her father???? Not without conditioning from a young age! You'll never convince me this puke is not one sick puppy!

I agree.

A father and his girlfriend will face a trial in a sordid case in which he is charged with kidnapping, incest, assault, forcible confinement, living off the avails of prostitution and trafficking, all involving his own daughter.

His spouse is charged with forcible confinement and assault, and both accused are charged with assaulting the child his daughter, whom we’re calling Nadine. (Her identity is protected by court order.)

The sobbing 25-year-old woman cried and had to interrupt her testimony several times, as she told the preliminary hearing how the horror story started at age 16 when she moved in to his ÃŽle Bizard home in 2001.

Her father began having sex with the her whenever his spouse left the house, she testified.

Nadine also cried when she recounted how only last month she learned that the father of her son, now six, is her own father.

She gave birth at 17 and thought the father was a boyfriend who had started paying child support.

DNA testing confirmed that the accused was the biological father of both Nadine and her child.

In 2005, he had her hired as a strip-club dancer in Val Morin, where her stepmother worked. Her dad forced her to wear a cellphone in her bra so he could keep track of her at all times, she told Quebec Court Judge Isabelle Rhéault. He pocketed all the money.

“I did what he wanted, I was his doll,” she said.

She often thought of leaving, but was “hysterical with fear” of her father.

“He told me if I ever get arrested, when I get out of jail, ‘I will find you and put a bullet in your head’,” she told the court.

In March 2005, she ran away for two weeks and stayed with her mom, but returned to her father because she was afraid, saying, “If I was free, he would find me and rape me.”

http://www.montrealgazette.com/news/Bizard%2Bincest%2Bcase%2Bsent%2Btrial/3960311/story.html

[Ptarmigan]

It doesn't matter what the circumstance. Incest is a crime and perverted.

[Freeper]

from another thread that says the relative is his daughter,

Poll_Blind Donating Member (1000+ posts)  Journal Click to send private message to this author Click to view this author's profile Click to add this author to your buddy list Click to add this author to your Ignore list    Mon Dec-13-10 02:38 AM
Response to Original message
3. I could see this law, when applied to two consenting and mentally competent adults, being...
   
...unConstitutional.

Seems like a case of two consenting adults.

PB

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x9763565

[Airwolf]

I agree.


http://www.montrealgazette.com/news/Bizard%2Bincest%2Bcase%2Bsent%2Btrial/3960311/story.html

Ok I'm lost here. I thought this case was in the US since he was a Professor at Columbia University? So why does this mention Quebec?

[vesta111]

I'll never be convinced that this just started when she turned 21!

That's pure bullshit! The daughter is sexually attracted to her father???? Not without conditioning from a young age! You'll never convince me this puke is not one sick puppy!

Running to the book case where is that damn book.--I can't find it but the title is LOLITA