Procedural Vote Stalls Defense Bill, Repeal of 'Don't Ask Don't Tell' (UPDATED)

[TVDOC]

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2010/sep/16/new-gay-army/

Next week, Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid is expected to begin floor debate on a defense authorization bill that would repeal the Clinton-era "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" policy and allow homosexuals to serve openly in the armed forces. Last month, a top military official offered a glimpse of how the military might look should the new policy take effect: Those serving who oppose the lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender (LGBT) agenda are no longer welcome.

Those were the views of Lt. Gen. Thomas P. Bostick, the Army's deputy chief of staff in charge of personnel matters who spoke about "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" before several hundred troops at the European Command headquarters in Stuttgart, Germany. "Unfortunately, we have a minority of service members who are still racists and bigoted and you will never be able to get rid of all of them," Lt. Gen. Bostick said. "But these people opposing this new policy will need to get with the program, and if they can't, they need to get out. No matter how much training and education of those in opposition, you're always going to have those that oppose this on moral and religious grounds just like you still have racists today."

The strong words take additional significance from Lt. Gen. Bostick's direct involvement with a Pentagon panel charged with shaping military policy on this issue. Although Lt. Gen. Bostick presented the question of homosexuals in the military as if it were about civil rights, it is nothing of the kind. The services must discriminate to function. Those who are too old, too weak or too overweight must be shown the door even when similar actions in the private sector might spark a lawsuit. The reason for the military's existence is to win battles and wars, not to ensure feelings aren't hurt or to serve as a playground for social experimentation.

The military's long-standing ban on homosexual conduct is rooted in the principles of the Uniform Code of Military Justice, which also criminalizes adulterous conduct among heterosexuals insofar as it undermines the good order and discipline of the armed forces. Lt. Gen. Bostick suggested he would employ the same strict disciplinary standards to provide "education and training" that would ensure soldiers, sailors and airmen embrace the new LGBT agenda.

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Balance at link.......

doc

[DumbAss Tanker]

Yeah, DCSPER, good luck filling the ranks with that plan and attitude.  The kids that enlist are not on the same sheet of music with the inside-the-Beltway thought process of Pentagon generals.  Plus there will be a surge of E5 and E6 departures on ETS as well, but not enough to match the destruction Carter wrought, I think.

[Boudicca]

Damn, **** him.
When I was active duty, I would have died of mortification had I been forced to shower with women who might be looking at me with lust.
I have no real beef with the LGBT community when they live and let live, but this constant comparison of them with the MLK movement is WRONG.
The only way I could see letting openly gays serve in the military without impacting morale would be to segregate people according to sexual preference.  And it's not the same thing as showering with a black female-we have the same lady parts.
Well, I guess this makes me a homophobe along with the racist I already am for not worshipping the big smelly feet of teh One.

[Chris_]

Well, I guess this makes me a homophobe along with the racist I already am for not worshipping the big smelly feet of teh One.

[5412]

Yeah, DCSPER, good luck filling the ranks with that plan and attitude.  The kids that enlist are not on the same sheet of music with the inside-the-Beltway thought process of Pentagon generals.  Plus there will be a surge of E5 and E6 departures on ETS as well, but not enough to match the destruction Carter wrought, I think.

Hi,

I wonder if this is the precursor to the portion of the bill to allow amnesty to illegals who wish to serve in our military.  I can see the day when they enlist, get amnesty, then get kicked out of the military or file for consciencious objector status.

This does not pass the smell test with me.

regards,
5412

[JohnnyReb]

 "education and training" that would ensure soldiers, sailors and airmen embrace the new LGBT agenda.

He skipped the Marines....I guess he knew they wouldn't listen to his wussy ass. Just like they don't mix sexs in basic training.

[SSG Snuggle Bunny]

I have served with several gay soldiers both male and female.

OK, fine. Whatevs.

But FFS I'm willing to hazard a guess that Christians outnumber the gays by a substantial margin.

[true_blood]

Something just doesn't sit right with this whole issue.
So, straights, Catholics and people that oppose gays/lesbians are to be shown the door and not fight for their Country because the "elitists" say so?! WOW! How much more ****ed up can these idiots in Washington make this Country?!?! Maybe I don't want to know.

[MrsSmith]

"Unfortunately, we have a minority of service members who are still racists and bigoted and you will never be able to get rid of all of them," Lt. Gen. Bostick said. "But these people opposing this new policy will need to get with the program, and if they can't, they need to get out. No matter how much training and education of those in opposition, you're always going to have those that oppose this on moral and religious grounds

Sounds to me like Bostick is a prejudiced bigot himself.  It takes a lot of hatred to object to free exercise of the First Amendment religous rights.

[NHSparky]

I'm just waiting for the lefties to start screaming and beating their chests as to how all the pickle puffers in the military are now proselytizing the straights, like when they scream and cry as to how Christians are trying to "convert" non-Christians (which is, of course, total crap.)

[Pat]

for take over by whom are we preparing?

[JohnnyReb]

for take over by whom are we preparing?

Whoever gets here first with the biggest.... "bats".

[DumbAss Tanker]

Imus was sniveling about the 'Bigotry' in DADT this morning.  I can't stand that burnt-out trainwreck of a man and his Liberal Manhattan buddy guests, but I do flip to it for the morning stock news and futures. 

[TheSarge]

He's trying to backtrack now.  He's issued a statement via the DoD website saying he was...get ready...misquoted.


 

[Eupher]

Bostick is simply toeing the Lord Zero line and putting forth "the word" about the demise of DADT and the continuation of social experimentation within the military.

This isn't the first time that the military was the focus group of social experimentation. When Truman forced desegregation of the military back in the late Forties, there was considerable opposition to that.

Fighting alongside a person with skin color that's different is one thing, but trying to make sense of a peter puffer's decisions is something else altogether.   

It looks to me like Bostick & Co. have forgotten all about "good order and discipline". I suppose now that the UCMJ will have to be rewritten to permit those same deviant sexual practices that it had once forbidden.

[Thor]

... It looks to me like Bostick & Co. have forgotten all about "good order and discipline". I suppose now that the UCMJ will have to be rewritten to permit those same deviant sexual practices that it had once forbidden.

I wonder if the military will eliminate the adultery clause in the UCMJ, too??

[Eupher]

I wonder if the military will eliminate the adultery clause in the UCMJ, too??

Hmmm. Don't know if the "adultery" charge applies to married military only, but sodomy will definitely have to be stricken.

Sodomy - it's what the peter puffers are all about. 

[SSG Snuggle Bunny]

I wonder if the military will eliminate the adultery clause in the UCMJ, too??

Wasn't it suspended from 1993 until 2001?

 

[TheSarge]

Hmmm. Don't know if the "adultery" charge applies to married military only, but sodomy will definitely have to be stricken.

Sodomy - it's what the peter puffers are all about. 

If they repeal DADT...you don't think that will be the next step.  Forcing the militray to recognize same sex marriages?

I sure as hell believe that will be next.

Repealing DADT is the proverbial camels nose under the tent flap for the military.

[Eupher]

If they repeal DADT...you don't think that will be the next step.  Forcing the militray to recognize same sex marriages?

I sure as hell believe that will be next.

Repealing DADT is the proverbial camels nose under the tent flap for the military.

Yep, I do think that's the next step, but dontcha think that the overall judicial battle over same-sex marriages would have to be waged first? And "won"?

Currently only Iowa, Connecticut, Masshole, Vermont, and Sparky's hangout, along with DC, perform them. It's a bit of a stretch for the military to "recognize" those same-sex marriages and not some dude's common law "husband" from, say, Wisconsin - not that it can't be done.

I see the battle waging first in the courtroom, then the moonbats can force that shit down DOD's throat (no pun intended).

The moonbats can be patient, just as they've been steadily eroding at the will of the people regarding DADT and same-sex marriages.

[NHSparky]

I wonder if the military will eliminate the adultery clause in the UCMJ, too??

Not a chance.  BTW--I saw a hell of a lot more people separated for adultery than homosexuality.

Then again, I wasn't an airedale, or it might well be the other way around.

[NHSparky]

Currently only Iowa, Connecticut, Masshole, Vermont, and Sparky's hangout, along with DC, perform them.

And in all of those cases, the will of the people was either circumvented, or never sought.  Judicial fiat in each case.

Oh, and don't think John Stephen isn't clubbing Governor Lynch over the head for pulling that little trick.

[Eupher]

Not a chance.  BTW--I saw a hell of a lot more people separated for adultery than homosexuality.

Then again, I wasn't an airedale, or it might well be the other way around.

Interesting. That wasn't my experience at all. Saw a few get separated for the gay thing, but most of them hid it well enough to stay in until they were separated for other reasons (HIV for one).

Never saw anybody get the axe for adultery. Ever.

[TheSarge]

Yep, I do think that's the next step, but dontcha think that the overall judicial battle over same-sex marriages would have to be waged first? And "won"?

Nope I foresee some kind of dual attack.  Or forcing the military to accept them along with the DADT repeal.  Then using that as the "justification" to make ALL states accept it.

 

It's a bit of a stretch for the military to "recognize" those same-sex marriages and not some dude's common law "husband" from, say, Wisconsin - not that it can't be done.

IMHO...given what I've seen this current batch of Liberals do in 22 months...NOTHING is  stretch anymore.

[NHSparky]

Interesting. That wasn't my experience at all. Saw a few get separated for the gay thing, but most of them hid it well enough to stay in until they were separated for other reasons (HIV for one).

Never saw anybody get the axe for adultery. Ever.

While I wasn't AF, I do remember the first female B-52 pilot was booted for it.

There were guys here and there doing WestPac/boomer widows crap, but the worst I personally saw was when I was in recruiting.  Admiral Watson (CNRC), the Area 8 CMC, and my Chief Recruiter ALL got the boot for nailing one a Zone Supervisor's wife.  Also turns out the ZS's wife was a smokin hawt 21-year old who walked into the NRS when she was like 19.  The Zone Sup, smart guy that he was, basically found a reason to permanently DQ her so he could nail her (can't be boffing applicants and DEPpers, that's a big no-no).