primitives discuss price differences

[franksolich]

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=310x1327

Oh my.

Kali  (1000+ posts)      Sat May-15-10 10:22 PM
NOT TO BE CONFUSED WITH THE BITTER OLD VERMONTESE CALI PRIMITIVE
Original message

how can there be that much of a price difference?

looking for an electric radiator fan motor. Rock Auto has one for $20.89 and one for $108.79 

and why does a whole fan/shroud/motor cost less than just a motor at some other places?

Gold Metal Flake  (1000+ posts)      Mon May-17-10 03:50 PM
Response to Original message
 
1. What do you want? Stock replacement or custom installation?

All electric cooling fans are not created equal. Help me help you.

And then some several weeks later:

Kali  (1000+ posts)      Fri Jul-02-10 12:21 AM
NOT TO BE CONFUSED WITH THE BITTER OLD VERMONTESE CALI PRIMITIVE
Response to Reply #1

2. oh man, I'm sorry

I forgot to come back and look at this! I took the damn thing out and it is actually fine! Found a discussion on-line about the crappy relays (3 of them!) connected to this system and my electrophobia kicked in.

Been thinking about just wiring it up to a switch for when it needs to go on. Any advice for that? Just two wires from battery to fan with a switch or does it need to be "reduced" somehow (I only understand water, not electricity) what other kind of "fittings" would I need?

Gold Metal Flake  (1000+ posts)      Mon Jul-05-10 09:56 PM
Response to Reply #2
 
3. You should be able to wire up some high current aftermarket relays.

Might require some wire probing or a proper model=specific schematic, but relays generally work the same. You have a supply voltage for the relay trigger coil, the other end goes to ground. Then battery voltage goes to the contacts and from the contact it goes to the fan. So aftermarket relays could be used to replace the faulty factory ones.

I do not recommend a manual switch. The time you forget to look at the temp gauge and turn on the fan could be the time you blow a head gasket.

Kali  (1000+ posts)      Sun Jul-11-10 11:46 PM
NOT TO BE CONFUSED WITH THE BITTER OLD VERMONTESE CALI PRIMITIVE
Response to Reply #3

4. thanks for the reply, my eyes glaze over when electric vocabulary starts being used - I have such a mental block about electricity it just won't compute in my brain. Update on the car is I think it lost the timing belt so if THAT breakdown is repairable without a major expense (like if valves are ok) I will take the fan down and have him trouble shoot it.

I saw some strange comment on one of the repair forums that the radiator fan won't run if the air conditioning isn't charged? Could that even be possible? Makes NO sense to me but maybe it has to do with some of the sensors or something - and right around the time the fan quit the air stopped being cold so...???

edit to add in case it might matter: 95 Escort, AT, 1.9l (hence not really worrying too much about manual switches or other strange ranch-rigged type alterations - been driving it without the fan since at least January)

Gold Metal Flake  (1000+ posts)      Mon Jul-12-10 03:53 PM
Response to Reply #4
 
5. Some cars have two fans. 

One runs to cool engine only and another is used when the AC compressor is running and may also turn on to cool engine. If there is a single fan then it will run to cool the engine (only when needed) and it will also run when the AC compressor is running.

I suppose a technician could wire in a new circuit. An aftermarket fan switch with temp sensor is used to trigger the fan when the engine temp exceeds 200 degrees. It would trigger a relay to power the fan. If you have AC, the wire to the compressor clutch could also trigger the same relay. Diodes in the two trigger wires would prevent crosstalk.

Anyways, the timing belt is muy importante. Have your mechanic check the fan then.

Kali  (1000+ posts)      Mon Jul-12-10 08:10 PM
NOT TO BE CONFUSED WITH THE BITTER OLD VERMONTESE CALI PRIMITIVE
Response to Reply #5

6. its a two speed fan, that I do know and he just called to discuss the timing belt - thinks it IS (was?) an interference POS so we aren't going to know if it's even toast until he does the belt.

I think I'm throwing good money away but I told hem to check. If the valves are shot I will probably dump the car.

[PatriotGame]

Kali  (1000+ posts)      Sun Jul-11-10 11:46 PM
NOT TO BE CONFUSED WITH THE BITTER OLD VERMONTESE CALI PRIMITIVE
Response to Reply #3

4. thanks for the reply, my eyes glaze over when electric vocabulary starts being used - I have such a mental block about electricity it just won't compute in my brain.

Voltage
Current
Resistance


BAM! Your brain was just destroyed...
Ohm's law is a wonderful thing.

Next week DUmmy, we'll talk Kirchhoff's laws and REALLY  throw your 72 IQ into disarray.

[Chris_]

  I hate electrical theory too.  Just tell me how to fix it... I can read a multimeter, dammit.

[DumbAss Tanker]

Kali, you idiot, pay to have a competent mechanic replace the relays or you'll be buying an engine.

[NHSparky]

Wait until I start talking about phasors, turn-to-turn ratios, CT and PT's, pilot wire systems, meggering and PI's, differentials, distance relaying, and carrier relaying systems.

I bet I can get your head to explode by the count of, "Wuh..."

[thundley4]

Wait until I start talking about phasors, turn-to-turn ratios, CT and PT's, pilot wire systems, meggering and PI's, differentials, distance relaying, and carrier relaying systems.

I bet I can get your head to explode by the count of, "Wuh..."

You'd have me lost on some of that even though my job is rewinding motors.

[Karin]

You would definitely get my head to explode at the count of Wuh.  That's what competent professionals are for.  I can change a lightbulb, but I draw the line there.  My dad was an electrical engineer, but I didn't inherit those genes. 

[Carl]

If you ever lurk here DUmmy two things.

First...there is a fan switch either in the top radiator tank or the thermostat elbow (could be in the head too but they want it where the coolant will always be the hottest).
It has one wire running to it and is in the ground side of the circuit.
Unplug the wire and with a paper clip or something inserted ground it against the engine.
If the fan comes on then replace the switch.
That is the most common failure.

Second,your 95 Escort is well beyond the interference engine days of the early to mid eighties models.
What a genius move that was by Ford and another reason our auto makers lost ground to Japanese ones.

[JohnnyReb]

Why couldn't they have just left the damn fan mounted on the damn waterpump? Oh yeah, government demanding they squeeze every ounce of MPG out of gas....even if it took more oil to manufacture and maintain than leaving it on the damn waterpump. At least with the fan on the waterpump you could grab the fan and shake it to see if the waterpump was about shot.

...and don't start on the sideways mounted engines/radiator on the front. They could put a squirrel cage fan on the flywheel like a 1917 MACK truck.

[PatriotGame]

Wait until I start talking about phasors, turn-to-turn ratios, CT and PT's, pilot wire systems, meggering and PI's, differentials, distance relaying, and carrier relaying systems.

I bet I can get your head to explode by the count of, "Wuh..."

Megger a DUmmy's head - that would be fun. Of course, meggering across infinite resistance yields...nothing....