DUmmie brings up the next logical step in government care.

[thundley4]

galileoreloaded (998 posts)           Mon Mar-22-10 10:02 PM
Original message
Please allow me to introduce myself.....
   
I generally stick to econ stuff, but I have posted before about the authoritarian ideals espoused so often here and on other boards I enjoy. A uniquely American value it seems.

My question is, since as a group we now have a vested interest in the health and the cost implications from individuals and their health decisions (both good and bad), shouldn't we be allowed to point this out, in public, to these individuals? Lets face it, in a society, peer pressure can work both ways, both to deride and to encourage.

Should I call out the 300 lb. chain-smoking male in the McDonald's drive through for not doing his fair share??

And while we are at these hard questions, why should we pay OTH (other than hospice) for people with serious illness that require massive resource interventions just to guarantee a stable prognosis', much less a better than say 50/50 chance of survival?

That's not mean, that is reality. Society can't remove all the risk of living, no matter how wealthy we are.

Any thoughts?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x7991323

Truth be told, the government has been doing this through punitive sin taxes and banning unhealthy foods in certain cities.

datasuspect   (1000+ posts)           Mon Mar-22-10 10:04 PM
Response to Original message
1. it depends on how much of a badass you are, i suppose
   
Edited on Mon Mar-22-10 10:05 PM by datasuspect
but then i routinely say what i want to people anyway.

just be careful you don't write checks with your mouth that your ass can't cash.

At least you do that online, right?

NavyDavy (1000+ posts)             Mon Mar-22-10 10:07 PM
Original message
I think you mean dumbass...and how much of a heartless pri*k u
   
want to be

flvegan   (1000+ posts)             Mon Mar-22-10 10:05 PM
Response to Original message
2. Oh, this will get really brilliant really fast.
   

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marmar   (1000+ posts)             Mon Mar-22-10 10:06 PM
Response to Reply #2
4. Butter in the middle and on top? Pass me some.....   
   

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leftstreet   (1000+ posts)           Mon Mar-22-10 10:08 PM
Response to Reply #4
9. Oh my word
   
This calls for strong drink

Some companies already charge their employees more for their insurance based on their health habits. Last year or so there was a company that fired people who smoked, even on their own time.  Most insurance companies take habits into the equation of setting premiums. No reason why the government won't at some point.

[GOBUCKS]

DUmmy galileoreloaded is a pretty good troll, who deserves an attaboy before his pizza.

[JohnnyReb]

Now that the DUmmies have brought it up......

You smoke dope...............................no coverage & no service.

You do drugs...................................no coverage. & no service.

You queer.......................................no coverage. & no service.

You have sex with multiple partners.....no coverage. & no service.

You have never worked.....................no coverage. & no service.

You have more than one bastard child..no coverage. & no service.

You just plain stupid..........................no coverage & no service.

You believe Obama is GOD..................no coverage. & no service.

You here illegally...............................no coverage. & no service.

Follow those rules and 10+ years from now healthcare will be cheap.

[Karin]

I bring him over, just because he's my pet.  Incomprehensible, as usual.

The Straight Story  (1000+ posts)        Mon Mar-22-10 10:08 PM
Response to Original message
8. Yeah, here are my thoughts:
 Should we invade nations weaker than us? Should we invade countries who might someday pose a threat to our economy and well being now instead of waiting until later?

Should we call out the guy driving with 4 people in his car (more weight on the roads we all pay for) and tax them more?

How about those who live in hoods with more crime (like mine) - should they be taxed more for police than other hoods?

Yo!  Mixmaster TSS!  Get yer pants off the ground! 

Or how about those states that border the Ocean? They are more likely to be attacked and need subs/ships to protect them then us folks in Ohio.

What is this, TSS, the War of 1812?  Oceans. Really?

Want a sliding scale on one issue? How about we spend some time on all issues?

I pay more for people in some areas and in some situations than I do for others (tax wise). Same applies to health care.

When you want that sliding scale across the board, get back to me.

You don't pay any taxes, and you know it.  You can't even afford fuel to go see your son.  Son is probably breathing a sigh of relief.   

[vlad335]

Ah, the DUmmies are all drunk with the power now! Imagine the possibilities of control in the new police state as a certified government informer!

Unfortunately the enormous power of the New State would be directed at them as well. Most likely more so. The leftwing revolution always devours it's first adherants. When it finally dawns on them that this is not what they expected it will be too late.

[JohnnyReb]

Ah, the DUmmies are all drunk with the power now! Imagine the possibilities of control in the new police state as a certified government informer!

Unfortunately the enormous power of the New State would be directed at them as well. Most likely more so. The leftwing revolution always devours it's first adherants. When it finally dawns on them that this is not what they expected it will be too late.

Russia, China, Korea, Cuba.....you'd think they'd realize that sooner or later. They're all slow learners I guess.

[USA4ME]

county worker

14. You are reducing people to some dollar value which is not what I am about.

I would rather not measure everything and everyone by some cost accounting method even though I am an accountant.

What you are talking about are temporal matters and I believe we are both temporal and spiritual. To do what you are talking about is to ignore the most lasting thing about a human being IMHO.

This world is harsh and cold enough, do we have to remove the humanness factor too?

frazzled

36. Don't kid yourself ... you didn't do a particularly stellar job at all

If you think your devil's-advocate propositions were in the least compelling, think again. It's the kind of hyperbolic fear-mongering meant to instill gasps about how the government will try to control our health outcomes through cost-benefit analyses: death panels, in another parlance. Very few here are dumb enough to fall for it.

His proposition is the foundation of liberalism, something that has been demonstrated on your site now for over 8 years.  To liberals, life is ultimately nothing but a "dollar value" that must be kept under control.  Helathcare, as run by gov't, will be no different.

As has been pointed out, the goal of liberals is single payer/universal healthcare.  What the galileoreloaded primitive suggested will take place might take 20 years, or 50 years, or 100 years before it is fully implemented, but it will come to pass.  Liberalism will see that it does.

Under single payer/universal healthcare run by liberals, there will come a time when John Smith, age 40, needs a heart transplant.  The bureaucratic panel overseeing healthcare will look at John Smith, note that males in his family has a history of dying by age 60, note that he works 3rd shift at the factory and has for 20 years, note that the amount of taxes he will likely pay over the expected remainder of his life is less than the cost of the gov't to pay to keep him alive, and it will be determined that it's not worth it and he will die.

If someone wanted to sum up liberalism in just nine words, that would be it:  "It costs too much, John Smith has to die."

And everyone of the primitives who don't understand this or who say it will never happen are either unwilling to admit it, or are too stupid to believe it won't happen, because it will, and it will be their future liberal comrades who will demand that it take place.

.
 

[GOBUCKS]

Want a sliding scale on one issue? How about we spend some time on all issues?

I pay more for people in some areas and in some situations than I do for others (tax wise). Same applies to health care.

When you want that sliding scale across the board, get back to me.

How would you like for your health, and the health of your family, to depend on the taxes paid by DUmp deadbeat The Straight Story? Under the democrat plan, that's exactly what will happen.

[vesta111]

How would you like for your health, and the health of your family, to depend on the taxes paid by DUmp deadbeat The Straight Story? Under the democrat plan, that's exactly what will happen.

How is this going to work for not just the adults but the children ?

GoBucks, I have in my life time watched fiction turned to reality.  The books of my father in the attic that he read in the 1930's Buck Rogers,and in my childhood the short storeys of Asimov and all of his ilk who became famous for their future what ifs full and later  scale novels.

Much way too much of the ideas of these authors have been taken and turned into reality.
[ note ] All mention of atoms in comic books to science fiction was removed from even text books in schools due to our Manhattan Project in the late 1930's to after WW2.

Today we have developed the Ultra Sound medical device. Unbelievable in my child birthing years, these devices can for the first time in the history of the world allow woman to and doctors  SEE the unborn child, tell the sex, look into the organs of the child and doctors can today can and do operate on the child while it is still within the womb.

What this has to do with health care is vital to the survival of our species.  What if.?

Scares the heck out of me that in the future we will move to the Nazi idea of the perfect person, healthy, blond, blue eyed and comes from good stock in intelligence.

I am an old lady, I have lived a long and fun life, if I need a new heart that is my problem, when a heart comes up for transplanting regardless if I have 4 million in the bank, the heart should go to someone 40 years younger then myself.

Drives me nuts to think this will have an impact on my Grand children. They will be at the Mercy of the government as to if their children are eligible to be be born in the first place. 

There is a good reason why the abortion law stays in force.  It will be used as a moral and just way to keep the people who may cost the government money and get no return for the money spent to keep them alive.

Few family's today have children that are perfect in health and baring accident will be perfect.
No need for glasses, braces, perfect teeth, or any kind of deformity. 

Say you have a child who exhibits problems at 8 months of age, someone may diagnose them as Autistic.  Who in the government and doctors will be calculating their usefullness to society in the future.?

Scares me to the bone that this health care is just another step in Eugenics.

[JohnnyReb]

DUmmie brings up the next logical step in government care. ...what ?...the graveyard ?

[The Village Idiot]

Ah, the DUmmies are all drunk with the power now! Imagine the possibilities of control in the new police state as a certified government informer!

The healthscare deform bill apparently also authorizes the President to create a 16,000-man "Ready Reserve" national police or army or something.

yay police state.