Molten Metals (9/11 truther madness)

[dutch508]

BeFree  (1000+ posts)        Fri Mar-12-10 11:08 AM
Original message http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=125x283720
Molten Metals
 We all agree that there were pools of molten metals found in the tower rubble.

So the questions are:

What was the composition of the pools of molten metals?

What could have kept the metals molten for so long? What heat source could have kept the metals from solidifying?

BeFree, the second most crazy DUmpmonkie in the dungeon, asking a leading question on 9/11...we all know the answer is mini-nukes.

BooBluePotion  (198 posts)     Fri Mar-12-10 01:28 PM
Response to Reply #4
5. Fitting how so many disasters arose underground
 Like cheney in his underground bunker controlling the show

A new loony-toon in the dungeon.

SDuderstadt  (1000+ posts)      Fri Mar-12-10 01:35 PM
Response to Reply #4
6. Are you seriously denying there were fires in the...
 Edited on Fri Mar-12-10 01:36 PM by SDuderstadt
basements of the towers under the debris? Seriously?

You do realize that "underground" does not necessarily mean "in the ground", right?

SD, who is not my mole, pown'd the newbee...

BooBluePotion  (198 posts)     Fri Mar-12-10 03:37 PM
Response to Reply #7
11. You both missed all the dirt being thrown on the campfire
 Remember that dark cloud of powdered concrete which covered people and buildings? The fire didn't survive this debris. So the basement must have been a source for preimpact explosions. 

Logic is not your friend, my friend...

BeFree  (1000+ posts)        Sat Mar-13-10 12:24 AM
Response to Original message
15. Another fact to consider
 The OCT has the towers burning only nearer the tops of the towers. One at 60 floors and the other at 75 floors high, IIRC - If I Remember Correctly. No fires down below.

So, the towers collapsed and there were between 60 to 75 floors of concrete between the fires and ground level.

It makes for an interesting question as to just how the fires burned all the way down through the 60 and 75 floors of concrete to end up in the basements and causing the molten metals found there.

  (for the pun)

BeFree  (1000+ posts)        Sun Mar-14-10 01:58 PM
Response to Reply #47
51. heh
 Why don't you attack bushco the way you attack me? Try it.

Bush lied and people died. I am nothing. Yet you're all over me and bush skates?

 
Obama lies and civilians dies...or something like that...

Bolo Boffin  (1000+ posts)        Sun Mar-14-10 01:35 PM
Response to Reply #32
34. You're asked a question, counter by trying to change the subject, get called on it
 And now you're throwing a fit in another attempt to avoid answering the first question.

"Clueless" is being kind.

BB is also not a mole of mine.

Bolo Boffin  (1000+ posts)        Sun Mar-14-10 02:30 PM
Response to Reply #55
61. "then it wouldn't have all turned to dust." What is "it" in this sentence?
 The reason the pancake theory of collapse initiation was discarded was that the mechanism by which it would have occurred proved not to have actually happened. The floor trusses were thought to have torn away, beginning a pancaking sequence that led to global collapse. But the floor truss structures proved quite hardy under the fire conditions present. So it was not the floor trusses ripping away that started the collapse.

Instead, this information in turn supported the actual reason the Towers started collapsing. The floors were sagging, pulling in on the perimeter columns. The perimeter columns along one side eventually buckled, precisely because the floor trusses would not fail. That initiated the global collapse.

As the building fell, of course, there was plenty of pancaking of floors. You can see large chunks of pancaked floors in what have been called "meteorites". Richard Gage thinks these are large pieces of molten metal. They are actually compressed floors broken off into large pieces.

So there was pancaking, but the pancake theory of collapse initiation proved to be incorrect, and the tests that showed this supported the actual reason discovered: the failure of the perimeter columns.

Now what's all this nonsense about it all turning to dust?

photo showing all the dust BeFree claims proves pancaked soties didn't happen...

[JohnnyReb]

Logic is not your friend, my friend...
 

 

Not even a passing acquaintance.

[debk]

Thought these DUmmies were all so highly educated....


Did they not take any basic science classes and retain anything they may have learned in at least 12 years of schooling? 

[JohnnyReb]

Interest subject really.....wonder how much gold, silver, copper etc. was in those building? You know, precious metals in computers, radios, TV's, etc.... and jewelry
...and diamonds. It would have been in such small amounts I bet very little of that kind of stuff was recovered.

[DumbAss Tanker]

Some, sure, but it would be so distributed you'd have to send the rubble through a refiner at a low-grade gold mine to get any of it out, there would be a great deal more of it from fillings, jewelry, accessories, and eyeglass frames of the victims really, rather than the electronics, so I doubt anybody but the most hardened tax collector or accountant would want to go there.
The primary easily-melted metal in the electronics would be the solder (Mainly tin, some alloyed with lead and some with a very small percentage of silver, which melts around 450-500 degrees; far and away the greatest amount of metal that would melt at the temps involved would be the alloys of aluminum, which melts at 1200 degrees.  Pure copper and gold both melt at around 2100-2150 degrees (All in Fahrenheit, by the way), so not all of it would have necessarily melted except in the hottest parts of the fire.

[zeitgeist]

Thought these DUmmies were all so highly educated....


Did they not take any basic science classes and retain anything they may have learned in at least 12 years of schooling? 

.
I spent about twenty years teaching metal trades at the post secondary level. For twenty years the students who entered the program level of knowledge declined.  Every year more and more basic math and science had to be taught. (This becomes problematic but that is another whole thread)  It is not that most of the kids weren't bright enough; they, for the most part, had never been exposed to, or, expected to learn difficult subjects. 

I guess the concept of the forge or blast furnace would lost on the folk at the dump.  Now where are those patio pictures of the chicken cooker.   I thought they were mandatory for a Troother thread.  Bueller??  Bueller???

[miskie]

Everybody is forgetting the most common low-temp metal of all..

Cadmium

It melts at about 600F. And it is in everything, especially electrical cabling and components. Cad clad copper is cheap, electrically conductive, and would have been heavily used at the time the towers were built.

Yes, it is toxic - and frequently kills people in house fires, as the greenish-yellow cloud that cadmium emits when melting quickly subdues victims.

(from my days as a precious metals inspector)

[debk]

Everybody is forgetting the most common low-temp metal of all..

Cadmium

It melts at about 600F. And it is in everything, especially electrical cabling and components. Cad clad copper is cheap, electrically conductive, and would have been heavily used at the time the towers were built.

Yes, it is toxic - and frequently kills people in house fires, as the greenish-yellow cloud that cadmium emits when melting quickly subdues victims.

(from my days as a precious metals inspector)

And of course the weight of a multi-ton jet aircraft sitting in the middle of several upper floors of a building had absolutely nothing to do with bringing down the buildings.

That reasoning is entirely too logical....

[miskie]

And of course the weight of a multi-ton jet aircraft sitting in the middle of several upper floors of a building had absolutely nothing to do with bringing down the buildings.

That reasoning is entirely too logical....

Indeed - I was just responding to what all the molten mystery metal may be - that has the troofers up in arms.

I'm sure Cadmium played a major role.

[debk]

Indeed - I was just responding to what all the molten mystery metal may be - that has the troofers up in arms.

I'm sure Cadmium played a major role.

I know...I understood what you were talking about.

I live with a mechanical engineer that spent 40 years in the metal stampings business. What I didn't learn in school, he explained.

It just amazes me that these people have either no knowledge or are just refusing to acknowledge the reality of the situation.

I have trouble comprehending their persistent stupidity....regarding something that is basic chemical reactions.

[miskie]

I know...I understood what you were talking about.

I live with a mechanical engineer that spent 40 years in the metal stampings business. What I didn't learn in school, he explained.

It just amazes me that these people have either no knowledge or are just refusing to acknowledge the reality of the situation.

I have trouble comprehending their persistent stupidity....regarding something that is basic chemical reactions.

I think its less stupidity and more an overwhelming urge to blame Bush et. al.

All of the metal trades are high school chemistry, only hotter.  The primitives know better - however their version of 'troof' is more sexy, so they stick with that instead of reality.