primitives discuss bread machines

[franksolich]

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=236x70308

Oh my.

Dorothy, the snobbish primitive:

uppityperson  (1000+ posts)        Tue Oct-27-09 08:45 PM
Original message

Bread and breadmachine help. It won't rise much

Hi all. I used to make bread by hand, couple months back came across a $5 bread machine so thought I'd give it a try. My problem is that the bread doesn't seem to want to raise much.

I am trying new yeast, thinking of cutting the salt back, but wondering if there are other ideas of how to change recipes to make them work in a machine.

franksolich has a solution.  Buy bread at the grocery store.  Cheaper, faster, cleaner.

housewolf  (1000+ posts)        Tue Oct-27-09 09:09 PM
Response to Original message
 
1. Could you post the recipe you've been using?

There are many reasons why you may be having problems. Knowing what recipe you're using will give us a good starting point. You don't need to post all the directions, just the ingredients list.

uppityperson  (1000+ posts)        Tue Oct-27-09 09:50 PM
Response to Reply #1
 
3. actually I had a thought. Will make the dough, then cook it in oven and see. Here's recipe

I am used to doing it all by hand, and have learned how to modify as flour/etc change.

It is an Oster machine, and the recipe came with it in the book

1 1/4 cup warm H2O
1 Tbsp butter (sometimes use 2 Tbsp)
3 cups bread flour (to which I change 1 Tbsp in each cup to gluten since can't get good flour)
2 Tbsp sugar (Changed to 3 per my dad's recommendation)
1 Tbsp dry milk
1 1/2 tspn salt
2 1/2 Tbsp yeast

Put it in in order (mixing gluten with flour before adding), do White, Large, on.
3 1/2 hrs later, take it out. It ends up about 5+ by 5+ by 5+, almost square just a titch over 5 inches each way.

Maybe this is how it should be and I'm just used to doing it by hand in more rectangular pans? Thinking I'll try mixing up a batch tomorrow and bake in rectangular pan in oven and see how it turns out.

MagickMuffin  (1000+ posts)        Tue Oct-27-09 11:54 PM
Response to Reply #3

7. I have a Breadman machine 

My recipes suggest this order

Water, Olive Oil, Salt, Sugar, Flour, then make small hole in flour and add Yeast. They suggest keeping the yeast away from the salt and sugar.

Perhaps you could try this method and see if there are any improvements. I usually make the dough and then bake in the oven.

The defrocked warped primitive:

Warpy  (1000+ posts)        Tue Oct-27-09 09:22 PM
Response to Original message
 
2. Two things make bread rise

active yeast and time. Either your water temperature is too warm and you're killing off some or all of the yeast or it's too cool and you're not giving it enough time to work. The amount of salt in a loaf of bread generally doesn't retard the yeast enough to make much of a difference, mixed with dry ingredients. If you salt the proofing water, that makes a big difference. Don't do it.

You could buy a bread machine mix just to get it right once, make sure it's nothing the machine is doing. There might be a reason it was five bucks beyond no storage or counter space.

On edit: poorly risen bread "cookies" make killer melba toast, sliced thinly and toasted in the oven.

eleny  (1000+ posts)      Tue Oct-27-09 09:57 PM
Response to Original message
 
4. The ingredients need to go into the machine in a certain order

I'm on my second machine and noted that the order of when I put the ingredients in is different for my new one. Did you get the manual with this machine?

uppityperson  (1000+ posts)        Tue Oct-27-09 10:03 PM
Response to Reply #4
 
5. Yes, I listed ingredients in post 3, put them in in order. That is the recipe came w/machine

It may be that I am used to normal bread loaves and this gives a square one? I'll experiment more.

eleny  (1000+ posts)      Tue Oct-27-09 10:06 PM
Response to Reply #5
 
6. 5" square does seem to be a pretty small loaf

What is the brand of your machine?

uppityperson  (1000+ posts)        Wed Oct-28-09 01:23 AM
Response to Reply #6
 
9. Oster. The bread tastes ok, will try mixing then oven baking tomorrow.

wildflower  (1000+ posts)      Wed Oct-28-09 12:14 AM
Response to Original message
 
8. I've always found bread machines more temperamental than baking by hand

For me, what worked is not to pay attention to the order of ingredients it says. What I do is (1) always proof the yeast in warm water and add it last, and (2) make sure the dough is wet enough.* Ensuring warm and wet enough is what works for me every time.

But that is me, others may have different experiences.

*For me, I've found "wet enough" to mean that as the machine kneads, there is a ball in the center, with a little dough around the edges. If all the dough is in just one big ball, that's not wet enough, and I add a little more warm water.

ON EDIT: I should also add that don't use much white flour; I use either white whole wheat or whole wheat pastry with added gluten. So that may make a difference in the way I need to do things.

Tesha  (1000+ posts)      Wed Oct-28-09 07:53 AM
Response to Original message

10. I could never count on how it would turn out..
 
Using a machine was like rolling the dice for me.

Making bread by hand lets you balance the ingredients for the humidity or temperature of the kitchen.

You touch it, feel it - and you learn what it needs.

I found a perfect compromise. I can't kneed as long or well as most breads need - so I use a food processor.

Flour in, salt on one side, yeast on the other, a little warm water over the yeast for 5 minutes, turn on the machine to mix and pour in water until you have a ball of dough but still soft. Count to 30, turn off the machine and feel the dough - not right, fix it - right? place it in a rising bowl and keep it warm.

Since I found this process, it hasn't failed once (knock on wood)

And finally, Grandma:

hippywife  (1000+ posts)        Wed Oct-28-09 09:41 AM
Response to Original message
 
11. My husband was the only one who used our bread machine we got as a wedding gift, and then only about a dozen times. With all the wonderful no-knead recipes, the machine has become the boat anchor of the early 21st century.

after which Grandma uses one of those smileys to wave at franksolich

[crockspot]

This reminds me I need to dig my bread machine out of storage. They are a wonderful thing, nice fresh baked bread at a fraction of the price of the store bought cardboard bread product. And really, only one pan, one measuring cup, and one measuring spoon to clean. Literally only a couple of minutes of prep time, push the button, and come back later for your bread.

[franksolich]

This reminds me I need to dig my bread machine out of storage. They are a wonderful thing, nice fresh baked bread at a fraction of the price of the store bought cardboard bread product. And really, only one pan, one measuring cup, and one measuring spoon to clean. Literally only a couple of minutes of prep time, push the button, and come back later for your bread.

Spoilsport.

Sir.

[Chris]

Never been a fan of bread machines.  All the bread mixes that came with the one I tried had the same funny taste, like a crappy microbrew.

[crockspot]

Never been a fan of bread machines.  All the bread mixes that came with the one I tried had the same funny taste, like a crappy microbrew.

That was your problem, you used "bread mixes". My machine came with a few basic recipes, the best of which was simply flour, water, a bit of salt, and a bit of sugar i think, and a teaspoon of active dry yeast.

[IassaFTots]

That was your problem, you used "bread mixes". My machine came with a few basic recipes, the best of which was simply flour, water, a bit of salt, and a bit of sugar i think, and a teaspoon of active dry yeast.

Yup.  Very effective, and it is nice to come home from work and smell the fresh bread.

[Karin]

The only thing I didn't like about mine (aside from taking up too much counter space), was that you can only get one shape of bread, a loaf.  I like French bread shapes and so forth.  They are great for kneading, which can be a real pain in the ass.  I think the OP's problem is with her $5 machine.  The temp is not right during the rising phase. 

[The Village Idiot]

In olden days, days of the pirates and all that, they would carry in their hold something called Breadfruit. Is this extinct now? Does Breadfruit still exist?

[Wineslob]

Those stupid blades left in the bread are a real bitch on the teeth.....

[Chris_]

Back when I was single and a menace to society at large, I would make my own bread by hand.  It was cheaper, tasted better, and it earned me brownie points with the ladies.  (The fact that I nearly starved to death on typical bachelor food before I applied myself to the taks of learning to properly prepare the delicacies I liked so much, encouraged a lot of this "make it yourself" mentality) 

My wife and I were the recipient of a super-duper deluxe breadmaker when we got married, and that was the final nail in the coffin, so to speak.  We haven't had a store-bought loaf of bread in our house since we married, and using the "dough" function of the bread maker, we do everything from french bread/garlic bread, to bread bowls, to cinnamon rolls to dinner rolls to tortillas. 

Nowadays, we don't even buy store bought flour, preferring instead to buy 25lb. sacks of wheat berries, and grind them ourselves (or the 50lb. sack of popcorn that we run through our mill for corn meal.)  It takes more and more fine tuning of the recipe each time we decide we'll take another ingredient into the "let's do it ourselves", but the difference in flavor between our homemade goodness, and the bland, pasty, over-processed, store-bought crap, is usually worth it.

The fact that 80% of DUmmies aren't smart enough to know how to fine tune a bread recipe for a particular machine doesn't surprise me in the least.  The fact that their first instinct is to whine for help from others rather than try to solve it themselves is also illustrative.

[Karin]

DefiantSix, you take DIY to a new level! 

FGL, breadfruit is still around, but more common to the south of us, as it's a tropical fruit.  It's a staple in places like Jamaica and Hawaii.  Pirates & sailors stocked it to ward off scurvy, probably.   

[Ralph Wiggum]

uppityperson  (1000+ posts)        Tue Oct-27-09 08:45 PM
Original message

Bread and breadmachine help. It won't rise much

Gee, what a shocker that a DUmmy can't get something to rise.

Hey Frank, you could change the thread title to encourage more views...something along the lines of "Primitive can't get it to rise".

[franksolich]

Gee, what a shocker that a DUmmy can't get something to rise.

Hey Frank, you could change the thread title to encourage more views...something along the lines of "Primitive can't get it to rise".

I gave that a brief thought--thirty seconds after I had posted this--but then decided no, because sometimes I get flak for my headlines, some criticism of which is wholly deserved.

[debk]

We got a breadmaker several years ago as a Christmas present....it's never been out of the box.

If I make bread, they are usually quick breads. If I'm using yeast, it's for rolls or coffee cakes.

Part of making yeast bread is the whole experience...the kneading, the smells, the eating...

[crockspot]

Back when I was single and a menace to society at large, I would make my own bread by hand.  It was cheaper, tasted better, and it earned me brownie points with the ladies.  (The fact that I nearly starved to death on typical bachelor food before I applied myself to the taks of learning to properly prepare the delicacies I liked so much, encouraged a lot of this "make it yourself" mentality) 

My wife and I were the recipient of a super-duper deluxe breadmaker when we got married, and that was the final nail in the coffin, so to speak.  We haven't had a store-bought loaf of bread in our house since we married, and using the "dough" function of the bread maker, we do everything from french bread/garlic bread, to bread bowls, to cinnamon rolls to dinner rolls to tortillas. 

Nowadays, we don't even buy store bought flour, preferring instead to buy 25lb. sacks of wheat berries, and grind them ourselves (or the 50lb. sack of popcorn that we run through our mill for corn meal.)  It takes more and more fine tuning of the recipe each time we decide we'll take another ingredient into the "let's do it ourselves", but the difference in flavor between our homemade goodness, and the bland, pasty, over-processed, store-bought crap, is usually worth it.

The fact that 80% of DUmmies aren't smart enough to know how to fine tune a bread recipe for a particular machine doesn't surprise me in the least.  The fact that their first instinct is to whine for help from others rather than try to solve it themselves is also illustrative.

What? You don't gin your own cotton? Posers!

 

[The Village Idiot]

FGL, breadfruit is still around, but more common to the south of us, as it's a tropical fruit.  It's a staple in places like Jamaica and Hawaii.  Pirates & sailors stocked it to ward off scurvy, probably.   

does it actually taste anything like bread?

[GOBUCKS]

What? You don't gin your own cotton? Posers!

I don't think I could choke down my bread if I ground my flour from store-bought wheat, used store-bought yeast, and powered my oven with electricity from the grid.  To say nothing of store-bought salt and fluoridated, chlorinated water. The main reason our food tastes so bad is that most of us are at the mercy of Big Water. Gross!

[The Village Idiot]

I don't think I could choke down my bread if I ground my flour from store-bought wheat, used store-bought yeast, and powered my oven with electricity from the grid.  To say nothing of store-bought salt and fluoridated, chlorinated water. The main reason our food tastes so bad is that most of us are at the mercy of Big Water. Gross!

lol