Lawmaker calls unmarried teen parents 'sluts'

[DixieBelle]

I posted this on another board (non political) that I belong to. I didn't expect it to cause such an uproar!  Anyway, turns out a few people are offended that I would post something (turns out they were teen moms in their youth too). I did say that I applaude anyone who faces the consequences of pre-martial sex. Especially a teen. But come on! Can we not agree that this is a problem???

COLORADO SPRINGS — A state lawmaker used a derogatory term Wednesday to describe unmarried teen parents as sexually promiscuous and complained that society condones premarital sex.

“In my parents’ day and age, (unmarried teen parents) were sent away, they were shunned, they were called what they are,” Colorado Springs Republican Rep. Larry Liston said during a GOP legislative caucus meeting in Denver. “There was at least a sense of shame.

“There’s no sense of shame today," Liston continued, according to the The Gazette of Colorado Springs. "Society condones it. ... I think it’s wrong. They’re sluts. And I don’t mean just the women. I mean the men, too.”

Rep. Stella Garza Hicks, who was at the meeting, said Liston should apologize.

“I feel that he owes the apology somewhere, whether it’s to the same group that he spoke to before or someone else,” she told The Gazette.

Garza Hicks, R-Colorado Springs, said she was “disturbed” and “offended” by the word but didn’t confront Liston at the time because she was so surprised to hear him use it.

Liston told The Gazette later he could have chosen his words better but believes many people feel the way he does.

He said he wanted to make the point that teens who can’t afford to take care of children can have them anyway and expect the government to pay for it. He said that often traps the parents and their children in a cycle of poverty without enough education.

Lorez Meinhold of the Colorado Health Foundation said shame has been shown have little impact on values and behavior. She said state leaders should focus instead on the scarcity of programs aimed at preventing teen pregnancy.

Garza Hicks said the state needs more prevention programs through schools and community groups, but she said the public must decide whether it wants to fund them.

“Sometimes it takes just a little more information, a little more education,” Garza Hicks said. “And we must not give up on them either.”

http://www.dailycamera.com/news/2008/feb/07/lawmaker-uses-derogatory-term-describe-teen-parent/

What do you guys think? I agree with him about society changing. There is no shame in having a baby as an unmarried teen. I don't know what the answer is. But I do know he's right about the endless cycle of poverty and lack of consequences. I get really tired of seeing so many teens going down this road and shrugging their shoulders. A lot of them think it's no big deal, welfare will bail them out and they can live with family.

[Rebel Yell]

I know not ALL teen mothers are sluts, but if it walks like a duck.....

[DixieBelle]

^exactly. 

He said he wanted to make the point that teens who can’t afford to take care of children can have them anyway and expect the government to pay for it. He said that often traps the parents and their children in a cycle of poverty without enough education.

That's the money quote right there. MY tax dollars are supporting these fools and no one blinks.

[Rebel Yell]

^exactly. 

He said he wanted to make the point that teens who can’t afford to take care of children can have them anyway and expect the government to pay for it. He said that often traps the parents and their children in a cycle of poverty without enough education.

That's the money quote right there. MY tax dollars are supporting these fools and no one blinks.

I get tired of hearing the "Anyone can make a mistake" excuse.  As a general rule, even the ones that only have one child didn't get pregnant the first time she layed down.  Same for the guys.

[SilverOrchid]

I remember the first time I saw a girl my age knocked up. She dropped out and I think she was getting homeschooled. She came to school one day big as a house, the center of attention, all the girls wanted to rub her belly and whatnot. She was smiling, clearly enjoying the attention. I always wondered what happened to her.



Oh, by the way THIS WAS IN THE EIGHTH GRADE!!!!!11 I saw many girls like her all though school, many of the them good friends of mine. It was not odd to see at pregnant girl in the hallway. It was a status symbol. I think Rep. Larry Liston might have a point. Many of those girls were sluts. Some were not, they made a bad choice. They chose to have the baby and went on with their life. I knew a girl that got knocked up when she was 16, she had a baby boy and got her GED. She ended up going to night school and last I heard, she was a paralegal working her way though law school. She was not a slut. She learned from her bad choice. Some of the other girls are welfare queens and haven't a clue who is the father of their babies.


Just my 2 cents.

[DixieBelle]

^I love to see a girl turn around a bad situation. I think that's the time when us conservatives have to put our money where our mouth is so to speak. I believe in seeing a baby to term and adoption if it's not possible to raise the child. But personal responsibility isn't what it used to be. I really, really, hate the welfare queens and teens who don't give two sh*ts because they can just get on welfare.

[jtyangel]

I know not ALL teen mothers are sluts, but if it walks like a duck.....

Teenage pregnancy is a mutli-faceted issue. The cycle of irresponsibility are not solely the domain of the female teenager, lest we forget the father of these children who normally is the father of a few others as well before he even leaves his 20's. It would seem to me that both the male and female have lost respect for themselves, each other, and the importance of parenting a child and the responsibility that it is.

And then another side of the issue is male and female both depending on the government to bail out their mistakes. The young women aren't the only ones who look to welfare and food stamps and WIC, the men impregnating them count on it too so they can continue living the life of a teenage boy without consequence.

I guess what I'm saying is I think there is enough blame to go around for both. Men have more responsibility...I really believe this. They can produce at a prolific rate as compared to women so they have a responsibility to reign that in, just as women need to reign in the desires to consider who will be caring for this child.

Ultimately, I think it is youthful idealization that gets children to this point...the same thing that makes them mostly liberal and thinking they'll create world peace or end world hunger. They are naive and everything smells like roses. You pair that with programs that are taking away the consequences, at least the immediate ones, of teen birth and you have a fertile(no pun) ground for such behavior. By the time some of them mature, they are kneedeep in children and living out life in crappy low wage jobs with little time to improve the situation.

[DixieBelle]

^and blaming it all on those mean, nasty conservatives.

[jtyangel]

^and blaming it all on those mean, nasty conservatives.

Well, i don't remember having fun with them in the bedroom, so I ain't taking none of that blame


(well as much fun as you can have at the age of 16 or so)

[jtyangel]

I remember the first time I saw a girl my age knocked up. She dropped out and I think she was getting homeschooled. She came to school one day big as a house, the center of attention, all the girls wanted to rub her belly and whatnot. She was smiling, clearly enjoying the attention. I always wondered what happened to her.



Oh, by the way THIS WAS IN THE EIGHTH GRADE!!!!!11 I saw many girls like her all though school, many of the them good friends of mine. It was not odd to see at pregnant girl in the hallway. It was a status symbol. I think Rep. Larry Liston might have a point. Many of those girls were sluts. Some were not, they made a bad choice. They chose to have the baby and went on with their life. I knew a girl that got knocked up when she was 16, she had a baby boy and got her GED. She ended up going to night school and last I heard, she was a paralegal working her way though law school. She was not a slut. She learned from her bad choice. Some of the other girls are welfare queens and haven't a clue who is the father of their babies.


Just my 2 cents.

Bingo though on the point you made. I do believe some girls get to this point as an attention issue. First, from not having a father or a very good one around, they seek out male attention in innappropriate ways and then a pregnancy encourages the cycle since everyone googoos over a baby. My sil did this with my husband's niece...she was livid, at first, about the pregnancy and then she proceeds to buy gobs of baby stuff and throw her a huge shower

And I'm not touching on the male issue because I don't know from a teenage boy's perspective why they don't think through this crap. I know they are horny, but I do think taking away the consequence of working to support children has helped encourage them to act on their fantasies.

Oh one more issue...a slew of children now who are growing up who came from single parent homes...they don't know any different...we are seeing people who this was normal for and for everyone around them. Damn shame.

[Lord Undies]

Rep. Stella Garza Hicks, who was at the meeting, said Liston should apologize.

“I feel that he owes the apology somewhere, whether it’s to the same group that he spoke to before or someone else,” she told The Gazette.

Garza Hicks, R-Colorado Springs, said she was “disturbed” and “offended” by the word but didn’t confront Liston at the time because she was so surprised to hear him use it.

I think (not FEEL) that Stella Garza Hicks is the one who owes an apology.   How wacked-out does one have to be to find fault or feel insulted by what Rep. Liston said?    I'm tired of common sense being regarded as an insult. 

[DixieBelle]

I remember the first time I saw a girl my age knocked up. She dropped out and I think she was getting homeschooled. She came to school one day big as a house, the center of attention, all the girls wanted to rub her belly and whatnot. She was smiling, clearly enjoying the attention. I always wondered what happened to her.



Oh, by the way THIS WAS IN THE EIGHTH GRADE!!!!!11 I saw many girls like her all though school, many of the them good friends of mine. It was not odd to see at pregnant girl in the hallway. It was a status symbol. I think Rep. Larry Liston might have a point. Many of those girls were sluts. Some were not, they made a bad choice. They chose to have the baby and went on with their life. I knew a girl that got knocked up when she was 16, she had a baby boy and got her GED. She ended up going to night school and last I heard, she was a paralegal working her way though law school. She was not a slut. She learned from her bad choice. Some of the other girls are welfare queens and haven't a clue who is the father of their babies.


Just my 2 cents.

Bingo though on the point you made. I do believe some girls get to this point as an attention issue. First, from not having a father or a very good one around, they seek out male attention in innappropriate ways and then a pregnancy encourages the cycle since everyone googoos over a baby. My sil did this with my husband's niece...she was livid, at first, about the pregnancy and then she proceeds to buy gobs of baby stuff and throw her a huge shower

And I'm not touching on the male issue because I don't know from a teenage boy's perspective why they don't think through this crap. I know they are horny, but I do think taking away the consequence of working to support children has helped encourage them to act on their fantasies.

Oh one more issue...a slew of children now who are growing up who came from single parent homes...they don't know any different...we are seeing people who this was normal for and for everyone around them. Damn shame.

We had a family member do the same thing with their daughter. At first they wanted to kill the baby's father and make her give it up for adoption. But in the end, she ended up living with them (and giving up her college dreams) and they are helping her financially. She's now 23. *eyeroll*

[CactusCarlos]

I posted this on another board (non political) that I belong to. I didn't expect it to cause such an uproar!  Anyway, turns out a few people are offended that I would post something (turns out they were teen moms in their youth too). I did say that I applaude anyone who faces the consequences of pre-martial sex. Especially a teen. But come on! Can we not agree that this is a problem???

COLORADO SPRINGS — A state lawmaker used a derogatory term Wednesday to describe unmarried teen parents as sexually promiscuous and complained that society condones premarital sex.

“In my parents’ day and age, (unmarried teen parents) were sent away, they were shunned, they were called what they are,” Colorado Springs Republican Rep. Larry Liston said during a GOP legislative caucus meeting in Denver. “There was at least a sense of shame.

“There’s no sense of shame today," Liston continued, according to the The Gazette of Colorado Springs. "Society condones it. ... I think it’s wrong. They’re sluts. And I don’t mean just the women. I mean the men, too.”

Rep. Stella Garza Hicks, who was at the meeting, said Liston should apologize.

“I feel that he owes the apology somewhere, whether it’s to the same group that he spoke to before or someone else,” she told The Gazette.

Garza Hicks, R-Colorado Springs, said she was “disturbed” and “offended” by the word but didn’t confront Liston at the time because she was so surprised to hear him use it.

Liston told The Gazette later he could have chosen his words better but believes many people feel the way he does.

He said he wanted to make the point that teens who can’t afford to take care of children can have them anyway and expect the government to pay for it. He said that often traps the parents and their children in a cycle of poverty without enough education.

Lorez Meinhold of the Colorado Health Foundation said shame has been shown have little impact on values and behavior. She said state leaders should focus instead on the scarcity of programs aimed at preventing teen pregnancy.

Garza Hicks said the state needs more prevention programs through schools and community groups, but she said the public must decide whether it wants to fund them.

“Sometimes it takes just a little more information, a little more education,” Garza Hicks said. “And we must not give up on them either.”

http://www.dailycamera.com/news/2008/feb/07/lawmaker-uses-derogatory-term-describe-teen-parent/

What do you guys think? I agree with him about society changing. There is no shame in having a baby as an unmarried teen. I don't know what the answer is. But I do know he's right about the endless cycle of poverty and lack of consequences. I get really tired of seeing so many teens going down this road and shrugging their shoulders. A lot of them think it's no big deal, welfare will bail them out and they can live with family.

I agree with him too but we'll never go back to the days where it was shameful for an unmarried teen to have a baby.  We'll never reverse the trend to glorify premarital sex.  The best we can hope to do it teach our kids right at home and this EXPECIALLY applies to the boys.  My father encouraged me to have all the sex I could as a teen without any regard for the consequences and I paid a price for it.  I would NEVER do that to a son or daughter of mine. 

[DumbAss Tanker]

We kind of zipped right past "Not holding it against the baby" (which is entirely appropriate) to "It's not your fault, Mommy Jr."  Yes, it takes two, but there is a whole immense governmental mechanism to hold the father accountable for bringing the kid into the world for at least the next 18 years, where his rights are essentially limited to a right to keep paying money to the state on schedule if he wants to stay out of jail.  There aren't any government-imposed burdens on the mother, even to the extent of just expressing tepid disapproval of her stupid choices and its freight on everyone smarter.

[DixieBelle]

^well said! My brother has had to put with the waste of space know as his ex. A.K.A. The Womb. Ugh.

[Ptarmigan]

I remember the first time I saw a girl my age knocked up. She dropped out and I think she was getting homeschooled. She came to school one day big as a house, the center of attention, all the girls wanted to rub her belly and whatnot. She was smiling, clearly enjoying the attention. I always wondered what happened to her.



Oh, by the way THIS WAS IN THE EIGHTH GRADE!!!!!11 I saw many girls like her all though school, many of the them good friends of mine. It was not odd to see at pregnant girl in the hallway. It was a status symbol. I think Rep. Larry Liston might have a point. Many of those girls were sluts. Some were not, they made a bad choice. They chose to have the baby and went on with their life. I knew a girl that got knocked up when she was 16, she had a baby boy and got her GED. She ended up going to night school and last I heard, she was a paralegal working her way though law school. She was not a slut. She learned from her bad choice. Some of the other girls are welfare queens and haven't a clue who is the father of their babies.


Just my 2 cents.

When I was a teen, I can think of only one instance where there was teen pregnancy and they got married. I never saw him afterwards. Having a child is big responsibilities. It's not a status symbol. Well, some of those teens who got knocked up and turned their life around for the better do deserve praise though. Some of those pregnant teens that are irresonsible do deserve to be called sluts.

[jtyangel]

We kind of zipped right past "Not holding it against the baby" (which is entirely appropriate) to "It's not your fault, Mommy Jr."  Yes, it takes two, but there is a whole immense governmental mechanism to hold the father accountable for bringing the kid into the world for at least the next 18 years, where his rights are essentially limited to a right to keep paying money to the state on schedule if he wants to stay out of jail.  There aren't any government-imposed burdens on the mother, even to the extent of just expressing tepid disapproval of her stupid choices and its freight on everyone smarter.

That may be true for responsible men and fathers, DAT, but I was referring to the whole group, and there seems to be many of these anymore, of irresponsible men who have no intention of honoring their commitments. They won't be dragged into court either and face no consequences because the mother and the father both are content to suck off the gov. teet. The rules were probably intended for the latter, but put a world of hurt on the former.

[vetwife]

There are sluts at every age but I am going to say this and from personal experience.

What is the alternative...Abortion..I don't think so.....Not IMO.
I think it is admirable for a young man to marry a girl he got pregnant.  My son was a teenage father.
No accident.  They went to school together and found a law (that is changed now) but they wanted to get married.  All said no.
They found a law in Ga if a girl is pregnant..no parental consent is needed.  They got married...Very young.
Now....it happened and the girl wanted to have an abortion and he went bonkers...so they got married.  They were very young.
They did not accept one dime of government money.  He worked everyday... And not at McDonalds..But a battery yard where he
 got burned a lot...Then pured concrete.  .....I put in my name a  rental trailer and they lived together about 4 years. He paid the rent and bought the diapers.  They did pretty good.  her Mom helped..I helped.  We didn't have a whole lot so he had to work.   He had to work 12 hour shifts. Baby
turned out just fine and has two children of his own now.    Son grew up some and at twenty after the divorce met the biggest whore in
the world....she managed to get three kids taken away from her while he was hunting both his car and kids and now I have adopted the three kids.  He had a better wife at 16 than he had at 27.  He got pretty irresponsible with her .  He was more responsible as a teenager until he finally decided 20 men ...and she was still looking.  Wasn't gonna change.  .   
 He has never left his kids..none of them.....
They love him...they hate her....Shoot I even gave her a second chance till she got the eldest on drugs.  He testified against her.
His first wife..the teenage one..married twice after him...Hear she is doing fairly well. My.Son now has his own business.  His son owns a Body shop.  My son  Still not able to get
that college education because of his workload and a few health problems but has never taken one dime from the government..To this day.
As far as I know, neither did the 1st Daughter in law. 
HE is a republican through and through.  He wasn't brought up that way.  He was brought up a conservative though.  His Dad left us when he was 4 and I was a single working Mom. 
Several years ago he met another young lady in her mid twenties..he in his early thirties and she was murdered in Alabama by a crazy who also murdered her boss.  Life has not been easy in the love dept.

Still working on his education.

[Chris_]

...

I hope things work out for you and yours.  It doesn't look like life's been easy.

[DumbAss Tanker]

We kind of zipped right past "Not holding it against the baby" (which is entirely appropriate) to "It's not your fault, Mommy Jr."  Yes, it takes two, but there is a whole immense governmental mechanism to hold the father accountable for bringing the kid into the world for at least the next 18 years, where his rights are essentially limited to a right to keep paying money to the state on schedule if he wants to stay out of jail.  There aren't any government-imposed burdens on the mother, even to the extent of just expressing tepid disapproval of her stupid choices and its freight on everyone smarter.

That may be true for responsible men and fathers, DAT, but I was referring to the whole group, and there seems to be many of these anymore, of irresponsible men who have no intention of honoring their commitments. They won't be dragged into court either and face no consequences because the mother and the father both are content to suck off the gov. teet. The rules were probably intended for the latter, but put a world of hurt on the former.

If the mother is on public assistance, most states are fairly aggressive about dragging the father into court and getting an order against him even if the mother doesn't care one way or the other.  There are of course plenty of places (generally run by Dems) where they are overwhelmed and don't even try.

[Chris_]

We kind of zipped right past "Not holding it against the baby" (which is entirely appropriate) to "It's not your fault, Mommy Jr."  Yes, it takes two, but there is a whole immense governmental mechanism to hold the father accountable for bringing the kid into the world for at least the next 18 years, where his rights are essentially limited to a right to keep paying money to the state on schedule if he wants to stay out of jail.  There aren't any government-imposed burdens on the mother, even to the extent of just expressing tepid disapproval of her stupid choices and its freight on everyone smarter.

Of course this "loving mother" (slut) will not put the kid up for adoption.  And nowadays, we subsidize this behavior -- we allow grandparents to be foster parents and so pay them for ringing up the kids they should bring up since they created the slut.

You get what you subsidize.

[vetwife]

As a grandparent I have four kids and I was told because I was a grandparent, we did not qualify for foster parent subsidies.
That takes a bite out of your retirement..Trust me.
If you are a grandparent you get 150.00 to help you out.  That is it.
If you adopt a child, you get tax breaks and in special needs a small subsidy..Very small but only if the child has been in state care and
only if the children or child has special needs.  Folks who have retirement savings are raising another generation and with little help from
social services.  This is one area I AM FAMILIAR WITH.  Grandparents SHOUld be treated as foster parents and not penalized because they
are related but it doesn't work that way.  They give up their entire retirement for kids they love, not kids they have to take in to keep them safe.
If you jail the parents, you still have to feed em from tax dollars.

Freedumb you did get one thing right though...the slut won't put them up for adoption.  The state generally walks in or the responsible grandparent takes custody
and you spend thousands of dollars proving these kids should have a stable home and not be neglected, only to have a lifetime of biological parents
screaming you stole their kids while they were high, shacked up, or both, all the time neglecting things life food, nuture, and caring for their kids. 
It is about THEM getting a free hand out not the ones who actually do the caretaking.  As long as they have the kids, they have a mealticket.

[DumbAss Tanker]

You get what you subsidize.

"Build it, and they will come."