Author Topic: DUmpmonkiez realize they are lost: So Where Do We Go from Here?  (Read 131 times)

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Offline dutch508

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DUmpmonkiez realize they are lost: So Where Do We Go from Here?
« on: November 26, 2019, 07:22:19 PM »
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Star Member MineralMan (125,369 posts)
https://www.democraticunderground.com/100212727803

The Senate is Not Going to Convict Trump, So Where Do We Go from Here?
I'm convinced at this point that an impeachment trial in the Senate will not remove Trump from office. So, how can we parlay the information from the hearings and information that is still being exposed to win the 2020 election? That, in my opinion, is the real question we should be examining.

We are not going to change the minds of Trump's right-wing base voters. There is no chance of that, i think. So, to win the White House and regain control of the Senate, we need to start thinking strategically about how to use the negative information about Trump and his cohort to energize other voters, both Democrats and Independents and, especially, people who don't normally show up at the polling places in November.

We need to keep the negative information flowing, with new information being revealed from now right through to next November. To that end, I think we should rethink hurrying the impeachment hearings and the issuance of articles of impeachment. Hearings do get the public's attention, so we probably need more of them as new information becomes available.

I think articles of impeachment should be passed in the House, but perhaps not until Spring of 2020. In the meantime, by keeping new information that emerges in the public eye through continued hearings, etc., we can reinforce the negative view of Trump, leading up to election season.

Combining that with a highly-organized national GOTV effort, I think it will be possible to flood the polling places with anti-Trump voters, which will also work toward a Democratic Senate majority.

I do not believe we are going to succeed in ousting Donald Trump prior to the 2020 election. We can definitely impeach him, but we will lose in the Senate, I believe. So, let's keep the negative energy coming out and influencing voters.

That's my opinion, as of today. It might change if some explosive information emerges, though.
15

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beachbumbob (2,433 posts)

1. Conviction not important. It's exposing the collaborators with Putin

And hammer it home   

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Star Member SWBTATTReg (8,335 posts)

27. I agree. There is nothing like a nice hot fire, to cook meat. Sear it good at first, and then ...

let it cook slowly over reduced flames.

In short (and I think Nancy Pelosi has got things under control w/ this process too), keep the negative information coming in (and there will be, with the whole mess that rump is involved with), and don't let the Senate get control of this process yet, not until the House is good and ready.

After all, w/ Moscow Mitch and the plans I've heard, the republican-controlled Senate is going to try and make a mockery out of the whole impeachment process. Don't allow them this opportunity, or at least, try to control the process somewhat. Be sure to hammer (impeachment in the Senate) the same points that the republicans have been trying to use in the House hearings (that they have had no say, no witnesses, etc. in the process, which is incorrect, they're just trying to muddle the waters).

Perhaps w/ the Supreme court justice presiding over the process (Roberts), there might be some control of the process, but who knows?

 :whatever:

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OliverQ (2,395 posts)

14. Conviction is important, because not being convicted means

he gets to cheat in 2020 again with zero consequences. That means the 2020 results may not be legitimate.

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NewJeffCT (54,385 posts)

21. What will happen in the Senate

is that we'll be forced to endure Hunter & Joe Biden being called as witnesses, Andrea or Alexandra Chalupa (forget which one), Peter Strozk, Lisa Page, Jim Comey, Jimmy Hoffa, Mary Jo Kopechne and others as well.

In the Senate Trial of Bill Clinton, Monica Lewinsky and Vernon Jordan had to give depositions - so, I have no doubt that whoever is the "House Manager" on the GOP side (Jim Jordan?) will call as many people as possible to blow up the trial

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DENVERPOPS (715 posts)

36. The first step

The first step should be holding a very early Democrat primary, and then everyone getting 100% behind that candidate including the losing candidates. (None of that Bernie stuff he pulled in 2016 of not immediately getting behind Hillary. He isn't even a Democrat for goodness sakes) Hell, even after a couple of "shouldn't have ever run" Dem candidates drop out (finally), several new ego manaical ones jump in. The Republicans are loving that we are running around, the Dem candidates verbally destroying each other on stage in front of national audiences, and no organized leadership in sight to step up at the DNC and go to work on what is truly important.......

Ps: us here in Colorado should't talk, we are sitting on one of the major, all time "shouldn't have ever run" candidates that refuses to drop out even though he is probably at <1% in the polls.......Hell, Mr. Bennett, even Hickenlooper smelled the roses and dropped out of the race to run against the Republican Senator.......

Not that it matters in reality.....If you thought the 2000, 2004, and 2016 Presidential elections were rigged, you ain't seen nothin' yet.
The Republicans are one millimeter away from their lifetime wet dream of a Fascist Tyranny, and if you think they won't get much uglier, again you ain't seen nothin' yet. Katie Bar the Door........

WASF

 :whatever:

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dalton99a (42,593 posts)

9. Impeach. Win. Evict. Indict.

Impeach in April 2020. Win in November 2020. Evict in January 2021. Indict in February 2021.

 :mental:

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Star Member MineralMan (125,369 posts)

11. There you go.

If he is out of the White House in January of 2021, he won't get pardoned by Pence. He will be indictable. Nail his hide to the side of the barn!

 :yawn:

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Star Member CrispyQ (27,059 posts)

17. There are other committees investigating Trump.



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After Mueller, what House panels are investigating Trump? Aljazeera

Although Mueller found no evidence of collusion, Trump still faces sweeping investigations by several House panels.

by William Roberts
25 Mar 2019

snip...

"We are going to move forward with our investigations of obstruction of justice, abuses of power, corruption, to defend the rule of law which is our job," House Judiciary Committee Chairman Jerrold Nadler told reporters in New York. "It's a broader mandate than the special prosecutor had."

The five House committees investigating Trump are led by an ensemble cast of very experienced Democrat legislators. Four of the five committee chairmen have served in Congress since the 1990s and witnessed the Republican impeachment of former President Bill Clinton.


The article lists each of the five committees & what they are investigating.

Hearings need to drag out so next summer's vacation reading is a long, long list of Trump's crimes. People need to be outraged come November. I believe if the dems move to quickly people who are not as involved in politics will forget how damning last week's testimony was. Plus the Con will then have months to claim/lie that he was once again exonerated. We are not out of danger until this man is out of office & he knows the shit storm waiting for him, legally, so it could get really interesting. And not in a good way.

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Johonny (16,289 posts)

19. I think they'd be foolish to send it to the senate at this point.

There are so many open holes left to fill. They should demand records of Trump's calls to Saudi Arabia and Russia. They should get Guilian's patsy in to talk. Then start demanding and possibly arresting when they no show all the presidents men. They should grill Nunes. They should bring in more experts showing COWSTRIKE is a Russian talking point, and unpatriotic to be spreading as a fact. The case they have is strong, but there's no reason to waste it. Not when every day they can bury Trump deeper and deeper into the doo-doo. Make Mitch and Co worry about the trail well into March or April. Oh, and make Roberts keep having to explain why he won't let the tax returns become seen by Congress. Hold Robert's in contempt eventually. Drag them all in Trump's poo. Make them all stick it.

I wouldn't send it to the senate until after the first few Primary states. By then most of the senators that would be needed for the trial will likely be out of the race. Meanwhile, these impeachment hearings allow next election to become the real trial. The more disgusted people are with Trump, the more they'll want change. It's our fellow Americans that are the real jury. Give them all the facts. Bury Trump in it. It's clear people testifying to his evil deeds grinds him where it hurts. Keep hurting him.

And for the love of God, the DNC should have an impeachment ad during the Super Bowl...

Trump saying, I want corruption always, should do nicely.

 :mental:

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Proud Liberal Dem (18,847 posts)

20. Agreed with all of this

Plus, we need to keep pointing out that:

1.) The Senate is Republican-controlled and consists of people whom have ALREADY declared that they don't even care what evidence is presented. And others are flat out repeating/promoting Russian disinformation about Ukraine.
2.) Trump is essentially tainting the "jury pool" by schmoozing Republican Senators prior to the trial and/or twisting their arms.

An "acquittal" by a highly partisan and complicit Republican-controlled Senate should be viewed as and pointed out as a meaningless partisan sham. Which is why we need to make the case in the House as airtight and strong as possible, so that an outright Senate acquittal looks even more suspect and inappropriate.

 :whatever:

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McKim (1,162 posts)

38. Are You Better Off????

Are you better off than you were four years ago? This famous Reagan line could work well for Dems this year! Most MAGAS have failed to ask themselves this question, they are so distracted by the Trump Regime Circus!

 :rotf:

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BamaRefugee (1,406 posts)

31. Move on to the next set of crimes, impeach again. Rinse and repeat endlessly until the stain is gone

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The Liberal Lion (1,412 posts)

33. With all due respect

I'm pretty sure America already knows just how rotten to the core the Republican party is currently and just what an absolute POS trump is. The problem here is that it has been normalized. The country right now is in a feeding frenzy on fear. The left is fearful of continued right wing hegemony, the right is fearful of some kind of amorphous illusion of the left. The left should, in any other reality, not at all be worrying about it's chances to defeat and obliterate this current iteration of the right, yet we do. Why? Is our message not positive enough? Does not our message herald a new era of prosperity, abundance and peace for all? Is this not what people really want? Do people really want to live in constant fear?

Our candidates need to break out of this cycle of fear. We should not be selling hope. We should not be selling milquetoast. We should not be selling authoritarianism lite. We should be selling true progress. We should be selling a new era of peace, prosperity and abundance for all. And we should be selling it unapologetically.

Are our candidates, any of them, doing this? If so we have no need to worry and most certainly have no need to sink to the level of depravity that trump and the republicans only feed from.

With this I most respectfully disagree with the proposed strategy.


exactly how are you going to do that? reversing all of Trump's policies?  :lmao:

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Star Member DinahMoeHum (18,461 posts)

39. DESTROY THE G.O.P. at the polls November 2020

at EVERY level, not just the Senate.

Send the message that their obstinacy will carry an extremely high price for them.

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Aussie105 (736 posts)

43. Good points about the current situation:

1. It's making Trump feel very uncomfortable.
His feeling that 'it's easy' to subvert Democracy for his own gains must have faded by now.
The stream of Trump close enablers now serving jail time must be adding to this.

2. Even if he survives the move to impeach him, he is less likely to win a second term.

3. The American public - those that are watching - have been alerted to:

a. External influences in their elections.

b. How a snake oil salesman can get into the highest office in the land, and stuff things up.
The cry of 'Never Again!' might be appropriate here, eyes wide open this time! (Bloomberg needs to be aware of this.)

c. The importance of voting. 100 million people out there - go vote next time!

d. How propaganda is interwoven into their lives, and the need to protect themselves from it. (HINT: turn off Fox, critically examine MSM bias. Bothsiderisms, whataboutism, false equivalence etc, it's all out there.)

 :mental:
The torch of moral clarity since 12/18/07

2016 DOTY: 06 Omaha Steve - Is dying for ****'s face! How could you not vote for him, you heartless bastards!?!

Offline landofconfusion80

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Re: DUmpmonkiez realize they are lost: So Where Do We Go from Here?
« Reply #1 on: November 26, 2019, 07:43:45 PM »
Maybe run a campaign on fiscal sanity, strong family values and strong national defense... bwhahahaha
One Who Grows (244 posts)
20. absolute bullshit. the cave is unspeakably vile.

I don't know how any of you can live with yourselves.

:)

Offline Ptarmigan

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Re: DUmpmonkiez realize they are lost: So Where Do We Go from Here?
« Reply #2 on: November 26, 2019, 07:56:43 PM »
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Star Member MineralMan (125,369 posts)
https://www.democraticunderground.com/100212727803

The Senate is Not Going to Convict Trump, So Where Do We Go from Here?
I'm convinced at this point that an impeachment trial in the Senate will not remove Trump from office. So, how can we parlay the information from the hearings and information that is still being exposed to win the 2020 election? That, in my opinion, is the real question we should be examining.

We are not going to change the minds of Trump's right-wing base voters. There is no chance of that, i think. So, to win the White House and regain control of the Senate, we need to start thinking strategically about how to use the negative information about Trump and his cohort to energize other voters, both Democrats and Independents and, especially, people who don't normally show up at the polling places in November.

We need to keep the negative information flowing, with new information being revealed from now right through to next November. To that end, I think we should rethink hurrying the impeachment hearings and the issuance of articles of impeachment. Hearings do get the public's attention, so we probably need more of them as new information becomes available.

I think articles of impeachment should be passed in the House, but perhaps not until Spring of 2020. In the meantime, by keeping new information that emerges in the public eye through continued hearings, etc., we can reinforce the negative view of Trump, leading up to election season.

Combining that with a highly-organized national GOTV effort, I think it will be possible to flood the polling places with anti-Trump voters, which will also work toward a Democratic Senate majority.

I do not believe we are going to succeed in ousting Donald Trump prior to the 2020 election. We can definitely impeach him, but we will lose in the Senate, I believe. So, let's keep the negative energy coming out and influencing voters.

That's my opinion, as of today. It might change if some explosive information emerges, though.
15

Ho-hum. What impeachment?
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Offline Ralph Wiggum

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Re: DUmpmonkiez realize they are lost: So Where Do We Go from Here?
« Reply #3 on: November 26, 2019, 09:11:49 PM »
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We need to keep the negative information flowing, with new information being revealed from now right through to next November.

As if you human turds haven't been flooding the TV and internet with unhinged hatred of President Trump since November 8th, 2016?
Voted hottest "chick" at CU - My hotness transcends gender


Offline USA4ME

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Re: DUmpmonkiez realize they are lost: So Where Do We Go from Here?
« Reply #4 on: November 26, 2019, 11:46:15 PM »
There are so many contradictions in their viewpoints there's not enough time to properly point them all out or reply.

As best I can tell, they were convinced that these House hearings were going to cause everyone to see things the same way they do, which was never going to be the case because their worldview is built upon lies. Now that it didn't turn out as they had hoped, they're really lost as to what to do.

Pelosi tried to keep the kooks from taking over, but she couldn't, or wouldn't, and now she's stuck with them and their desire for blood. She probably knows she needs to find a way out of an impeachment vote, but it's too late. And an impeachment vote that's less than 230+ votes for and not bi-partisan exposes the whole excerise as a sham, and she knows it even if the loony base doesn't.

Drag out the impeachment inquiry? How is this going to appeal to average voters? Either you have the goods to go forward or you don't. No ones interested in hearing about this for months on end. Drip, drip, drip just isn't going to work. Besides, the longer it takes to go to the Senate, the less confidence it would appear the Democrats have in their "evidence". Now that is something people will notice.

Listen liberals, the average citizen doesn't have the patience or desire to hold on to hatred as long as you do. It's part of your makeup, so you naturally believe that everyone is like you. But they're not. You're a bunch of whackos. You're nothing like decent and civilized people.

.

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