Can America confront Russia on Georgia?

[dutch508]

I am starting to think that NNNOLHI is georgian.

NNN0LHI  (1000+ posts)      Sun Aug-10-08 01:14 PM
Original message http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x3770817
Can America confront Russia on Georgia? 
 Advertisements [?]http://www.indiadaily.com/editorial/19883.asp

Russia is determined to reclaim its lost ground at the end of the cold war. Russia is also determined to use oil as the spearhead of a new and stubborn superpower. The conflict in Georgia is symbolic and a direct challenge to America and in particular to Bush Administration including Dick Cheney.

It was interesting to see Putin and Bush sitting next to each in Beijing Olympics and chatting with each other as Georgian militia battled powerful Russian Army and Air Force. Russian Military action is not against Georgia. It is against United States of America as Georgia is the new obedient political and strategic satellite of America. snip

Putin wants American money. Madvadev wants AMerica to understand that Russian territories is not Iraq or Afghanistan. Instigating former Soviet Republics will create chaos and war. At the same time, US should not have expecred a cake walk like Iraq and Afghanistan in meddling with powerbase of a formere superpower rich in oil, gas and minerals.

Does America have the will and resource to fight a real powerful enemy? Georgia needs American military to defend itself agaisnt Russia. Russia perhaps wants AMerica to intervene so that thet can teach Americans a lesson in their own backyard.
 

Of course not, says the DUmp. Russia would kick our ass...

amandabeech (1000+ posts)      Sun Aug-10-08 01:17 PM
Response to Original message
2. Neither the will nor the resouces.
 Right now, we have nothing to spare.

Gearing up to fight the Russians in Georgia would involve a draft, which would kick up extreme protest, and could not be done for at least a couple of years, notwithstanding that the idea is just a bad one overall.

We'll just have to look like the fair-weather friends that we sometimes are.

Somhow, I thought the DUmpmonkeys were for a war against Russia. Would they not then enlist to fight it? All very confusing.

TomClash  (1000+ posts)       Sun Aug-10-08 01:30 PM
Response to Reply #2
8. Not 100% sure that's true
 A few weeks ago we had the better part of a battalion in Georgia "training."

Not all the 101st and 82d BCTs are in Iraq or Afghanistan right now.

You never know what's up with this Administration - especially where energy is so directly involved.

 Now, remember we have troops in Georgia already. One wonders if the DUmp knows what a battalion is.

amandabeech (1000+ posts)      Sun Aug-10-08 02:16 PM
Response to Reply #8
14. I guess my question is whether we can go against Russia if it commits
 substantially all of its military.

I don't think that a battalion would do it altogether.

I'm waiting to see what Turkey and Azerbaijan will do if this thing doesn't stop soon.

I agree with you on oil, though. I think that a big part of this is about the pipelines, which also interest Azerbaijan and Turkey. If the Russians took Georgia, my guess is that not much oil would flow through the BTC pipeline and that would deprive Turkey and Azer. of some nice revenue.

My guess is amanda doesn't know what a battalion is.

faygokid  (1000+ posts)       Sun Aug-10-08 01:20 PM
Response to Original message
4. Distraction aimed at bogging down Russia while we attack Iran? 
 What's with these rumors of an "armada" moving to the Persian Gulf?

What's Cheney really up to here?

yes, that's right, folks. We tricked Russia into attacking Georgia, just so we could invade Iran.

amandabeech (1000+ posts)      Sun Aug-10-08 02:30 PM
Response to Reply #4
17. It has been reported, primarily by Kuwaiti papers, I think, that four carrier battle groups
 and two amphibious assault battle groups will reconnoiter off Iran. I imagine that the rendezvous will occur in the Gulf of Oman, though. The Persian Gulf would be a shooting gallery in a war.

It is unclear whether the armada will stay together, however. Usually, a carrier will stay on duty 6-8 months, then be relieved by another carrier. The first carrier stays at the duty station until the other carrier has arrived and is ready to take over.

Undoubtedly, it is an intimidation tactic against Iran.

I am not ready to call Georgia or the U.S. the attacker in the S. Ossetia mess until I know more about what had been happening in the months leading up to the shooting. Sometimes these things build up with each side goading the other on. IMHO, this may be one of them.

You are of course aware that Georgia is a major oil and gas pipeline transit state. If Russia gets ahold of the pipelines there, it will control the sale of all Caspian and Central Asian oil and gas to the west. There is some railroad transit of oil to the east, and a pipeline is under construction to China, but it won't be done any time soon. If Russia controls the oil and gas, it controls its former fellow Soviet Republics.

 

Someone has been watching "Midway".

IndianaGreen  (1000+ posts)       Sun Aug-10-08 02:48 PM
Response to Original message
21. Sounds like another anti-Emmanuel Goldstein crusade is in the making!
 Emmanuel Goldstein is a key character in George Orwell's novel Nineteen Eighty-Four.

<snip>

Goldstein is always the subject of the "Two Minutes Hate," a daily, 2-minute period beginning at 11:00 AM at which some image of Goldstein is shown on the telescreen (a one-channel television with surveillance devices in it that can not be turned off). It is thought that the opposition to Big Brother—namely, Goldstein—was simply a construction, which ensured that support and devotion towards Big Brother was continuous.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emmanuel_Goldstein

 
So, are you saying that there is no war in iraq? Or Georgia? otherwise I don't get your drift.

[franksolich]

Hmmm.

IndianaGreen  (1000+ posts)       Sun Aug-10-08 02:48 PM
Response to Original message

21. Sounds like another anti-Emmanuel Goldstein crusade is in the making!

Emmanuel Goldstein is a key character in George Orwell's novel Nineteen Eighty-Four.

Goldstein is always the subject of the "Two Minutes Hate," a daily, 2-minute period beginning at 11:00 AM at which some image of Goldstein is shown on the telescreen (a one-channel television with surveillance devices in it that can not be turned off). It is thought that the opposition to Big Brother—namely, Goldstein—was simply a construction, which ensured that support and devotion towards Big Brother was continuous.

This is somewhat a little bit off topic, but perhaps the primitives on Skins's island use George Bush as their own "Emmanuel Goldstein," during their daily 24 hours of Hate?

[dutch508]

Hmmm.

IndianaGreen  (1000+ posts)       Sun Aug-10-08 02:48 PM
Response to Original message

21. Sounds like another anti-Emmanuel Goldstein crusade is in the making!

Emmanuel Goldstein is a key character in George Orwell's novel Nineteen Eighty-Four.

Goldstein is always the subject of the "Two Minutes Hate," a daily, 2-minute period beginning at 11:00 AM at which some image of Goldstein is shown on the telescreen (a one-channel television with surveillance devices in it that can not be turned off). It is thought that the opposition to Big Brother—namely, Goldstein—was simply a construction, which ensured that support and devotion towards Big Brother was continuous.

This is somewhat a little bit off topic, but perhaps the primitives on Skins's island use George Bush as their own "Emmanuel Goldstein," during their daily 24 hours of Hate?

No, Frank. I think you may be on to something. But that is pretty deep thinking for a hivemind, Doubt they see it.

[LC EFA]

Threads like this make me wonder.

How can a group of people who, (with a few exceptions) haven't served in any form of military unit, or any high level civilian job directly related to the military, profess to be such experts on the disposition, abilities and tactics of any military situation that appears on their screen.

[BlueStateSaint]

Threads like this make me wonder.

How can a group of people who, (with a few exceptions) haven't served in any form of military unit, or any high level civilian job directly related to the military, profess to be such experts on the disposition, abilities and tactics of any military situation that appears on their screen.

They start with the assumption (we know what happens when one assumes) that any possible opponent's military is invincible, and ours is a bunch of ne'er-do-wells who couldn't fight their way out of a wet paper bag.  Even though they've been proven wrong again and again and again (and will be so proven wrong again and again), they still cling to this assumption--at which point it becomes a dark fantasy of theirs.

[Bondai]

We(the US) control the air, if this is agreed upon fine, if not I can show countless examples. If you control the air you control the war. If we go head to head with the Russians they lose, our technology far outstrips anything that have....bring in the Raptors...

[BannedFromDU]

We(the US) control the air, if this is agreed upon fine, if not I can show countless examples. If you control the air you control the war. If we go head to head with the Russians they lose, our technology far outstrips anything that have....bring in the Raptors...

     This is true, but Georgia is small potatoes compared to Iran. No one has yet mentioned that this might be happening NOW because Putin has tacit approval to move in, whereas under (shudder) a possible Obama The Divine administration, we might lend aid. Obama might look at Georgia as a way for him to flex nuts without dealing with Iran, and it would get the liberal seal of approval because, as I have said many times before, Russians look white. Liberals only approve of wars against white-looking people.

     Not that I approve of Russia's little expedition, but business is business.

     

[dutch508]

Well, I don't like the Russians any. but I ike the Georgians even less.

I got rubles on the ruskies.

[Vagabond]

South Ossetia is blocked from North Ossetia and Russia by a mountain range that has exactly one passable road.  With a tunnel.

The biggest help we could do is cut South Ossetia off from the North, something that is well within our ability to do.  Once you cut a modern army off in the field, it's just a matter of time before they run out of fuel.  Tanks are pretty much useless without fuel.  Ask the Germans around Bastogne in 1944 about that.

[Freeper]

My guess is amanda doesn't know what a battalion is.

She prolly thinks battalion is that oil and vinegar salad dressing. 

[Chris_]

If only Georgia had the money to rent the services of the SubhumanTiTty this all would be over quickly.

[Airwolf]

With only one usable raod into Georgia for tanks and heavy armor all the Georgain army has to do is make it within range of their artilley and aircraft and close that road with mines so deep it would take the Russians weeks to clear them out.

[BlueStateSaint]

If only Georgia had the money to rent the services of the SubhumanTiTty this all would be over quickly.

Chuck, I think you're onto something!

[ScubaGuy]

Threads like this make me wonder.

How can a group of people who, (with a few exceptions) haven't served in any form of military unit, or any high level civilian job directly related to the military, profess to be such experts on the disposition, abilities and tactics of any military situation that appears on their screen.

Well DUH!

They listen to Err America and Mike Malloy.  They read Huffington Post, DUMB (Democrat Underground Message Board), Talking Points Memo, Common Dreams and KOS.  What else is there to know?  You actually think service in the military or having a job related to the military would make anyone know more than that?

They learned how to 'read between the lines', 'connect the dots' and they can read body language, physical and mental health just by looking at a few still images.  What can military experience actually teach them?  They're brilliant, ask any one of them, they know everything.

 

[BlueStateSaint]

Threads like this make me wonder.

How can a group of people who, (with a few exceptions) haven't served in any form of military unit, or any high level civilian job directly related to the military, profess to be such experts on the disposition, abilities and tactics of any military situation that appears on their screen.

Well DUH!

They listen to Err America and Mike Malloy.  They read Huffington Post, DUMB (Democrat Underground Message Board), Talking Points Memo, Common Dreams and KOS.  What else is there to know?  You actually think service in the military or having a job related to the military would make anyone know more than that?

They learned how to 'read between the lines', 'connect the dots' and they can read body language, physical and mental health just by looking at a few still images.  What can military experience actually teach them?  They're brilliant, ask any one of them, they know everything.

 

Don't forget their spirit guides' influence!