This Day in History: Atomic bomb dropped on Nagasaki

[Attero Dominatus]

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IWantAnyDem  Donating Member  (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author  Click to view this author's profile  Click to add this author to your buddy list  Click to add this author to your Ignore list      Sat Aug-09-08 07:27 AM
Original message
This Day in History: Atomic bomb dropped on Nagasaki
   
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August 9, 1945

Atomic bomb dropped on Nagasaki
On this day in 1945, a second atom bomb is dropped on Japan by the United States, at Nagasaki, resulting finally in Japan's unconditional surrender.

The devastation wrought at Hiroshima was not sufficient to convince the Japanese War Council to accept the Potsdam Conference's demand for unconditional surrender. The United States had already planned to drop their second atom bomb, nicknamed "Fat Man," on August 11 in the event of such recalcitrance, but bad weather expected for that day pushed the date up to August 9th. So at 1:56 a.m., a specially adapted B-29 bomber, called "Bock's Car," after its usual commander, Frederick Bock, took off from Tinian Island under the command of Maj. Charles W. Sweeney. Nagasaki was a shipbuilding center, the very industry intended for destruction. The bomb was dropped at 11:02 a.m., 1,650 feet above the city. The explosion unleashed the equivalent force of 22,000 tons of TNT. The hills that surrounded the city did a better job of containing the destructive force, but the number killed is estimated at anywhere between 60,000 and 80,000 (exact figures are impossible, the blast having obliterated bodies and disintegrated records).


The History Channel


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MadHound  (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author  Click to view this author's profile  Click to add this author to your buddy list  Click to add this author to your Ignore list      Sat Aug-09-08 07:34 AM
Response to Original message
1. Another black mark in US history
   
There was no need to drop the bomb either on Hiroshima or Nagasaki, Japan had been making surrender contacts for awhile. But the US wanted to demonstrate their new toy, and in case Russia wasn't paying attention the first time, we did it twice. Tens of thousands dead simply because we wanted to demonstrate our nuclear capability
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Uhh bullshit. Japan had no intention to surrender. They were even arming civilians for the expected invasion.

IWantAnyDem  Donating Member  (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author  Click to view this author's profile  Click to add this author to your buddy list  Click to add this author to your Ignore list      Sat Aug-09-08 07:35 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. Suffice it to say, I disagree.
   
Edited on Sat Aug-09-08 07:45 AM by IWantAnyDem
Given the uncertainties involved in all out war, I cannot fault Harry Truman his decision to drop the bombs. It was horrible, but I believe the blame for the bombs lies more with the military of Japan which had seized total control of that nation than with the United States.

Furthermore, the Japanese themselves were working on nuclear weapons, and you know with no doubt they would have used them. they were a lot further along than the Germans, too.
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IWantAnyDem  Donating Member  (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author  Click to view this author's profile  Click to add this author to your buddy list  Click to add this author to your Ignore list      Sat Aug-09-08 07:46 AM
Response to Reply #3
4. Sorry, I disagree completely
   
Edited on Sat Aug-09-08 07:51 AM by IWantAnyDem
"Elements of the Japanese leadership" does not constitute the position of those who held the power.

There was no choice in the matter. Truman did the right thing.

And you are doing nothing but re-writing history. The War Council was still divided on surrender even after the bombs were dropped. The matter was settled when the meperor gave the go-ahead for unconditional surrender.
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MadHound  (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author  Click to view this author's profile  Click to add this author to your buddy list  Click to add this author to your Ignore list      Sat Aug-09-08 08:00 AM
Response to Reply #4
5. Actually they were those who held power
   
Look, I really don't have the time, nor the desire to rehash this debate one more time on these boards. If you really want to know the real deal, the evidence is out there in plenty. I've done the work, spent the hours reading and researching this topic thoroughly, as have many other reputable historians. If you want a place to start your research, go to Yale and read the diaries of Henry Stimson, the Sec of War at the time.

I would also suggest reading some of Truman's diaries and other papers, FDR's work also.

If you don't care to believe myself, a historian, and the many other reputable, notable historians who agree with me, fine. I really don't care, the American people love and need their precious little myths that state this country is nothing but good. So if you wish to remain in bliss, and ignorance, that's your doing. Me, I prefer to deal with the reality based world, and in that world, yes, Japan tried to surrender time and again(with overtures coming from people in power). Yet we refused and decided to drop not one, but two genocidal weapons on a mostly civilian population.

Americans abhor the denial exhibited by Japan concerning their role in WWII, meanwhile ignoring their own role. WWII was a genocidal watershed that set the tone for the following sixty plus years, and frankly nobody's hands came out clean.
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IWantAnyDem  Donating Member  (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author  Click to view this author's profile  Click to add this author to your buddy list  Click to add this author to your Ignore list      Sat Aug-09-08 10:47 AM
Response to Reply #13
16. **** that America hating bullshit
   
Edited on Sat Aug-09-08 11:01 AM by IWantAnyDem
That's all I got to say on the subject.

You weren't there and hindsight is 50-50.

To **** with any asshole who wants to second guess Truman today.

EDITED TO ADD: Welcome to ignore. I don't listen to people who blow this sort of bullshit.
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MadHound  (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author  Click to view this author's profile  Click to add this author to your buddy list  Click to add this author to your Ignore list      Sat Aug-09-08 11:00 AM
Response to Reply #16
24. LOL, in other words the answer is "NO" you haven't done any research
   
Edited on Sat Aug-09-08 11:13 AM by MadHound
You haven't got anything to back your happy ass up with other than your high school history class bullshit propaganda. Thanks for the answer, that's sort of I suspected.

But hey, aren't you the classy one, stating that doing such historical research is "America hating" and that those who do such research are "assholes". Classy that, about as classy as John Birchers, Freepers and other such RW reactionaries who put the same sort of labels on those whose positions they disagree with. Hmmm, one can tell a lot about a person by the company they keep, perhaps you should look around.

No, I wasn't there, but I have talked with those who were, I have read the accounts of those who were in power, on both sides of the conflict. I have spent weeks tracking down bits and pieces of historical minutia in order to make a true and coherent whole. What have you done? Oh, yeah, that's right, a high school bullshit history class :eyes: Let me guess, you probably still think that Columbus discovered America and that the Native Americans were savages too :eyes:

Well friend, enjoy living in your fantasy world, myself, I prefer the reality based world. But one thing before I go(time to mow the yard), if I were you I would lay off the "American hating" label for those who disagree with you. You don't know me pal, but I guarantee you that yes, I love my country, and I have probably done more for this country than you have. We can, if you choose, have a civilized discussion and disagreement. But such childish labels as you use only shows up your ignorance and your assholish attitude.

EDITED TO ADD: LOLOLOLOLOLOL!!!! So you're putting me on ignore now, LOL. What, can't stand the truth? Can't keep up intellectually? How pathetic are you, putting me on ignore over the truth
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roody  Donating Member  (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author  Click to view this author's profile  Click to add this author to your buddy list  Click to add this author to your Ignore list      Sat Aug-09-08 10:48 AM
Response to Reply #6
18. "the right thing"
   
How could the right thing be killing tens of thousands of civilians? And contaminating the earth with radiation?
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Where is your outrage over Japan murdering Chinese, Koreans, American POWs, the Rape of Nanking etc? 

IWantAnyDem  Donating Member  (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author  Click to view this author's profile  Click to add this author to your buddy list  Click to add this author to your Ignore list      Sat Aug-09-08 10:50 AM
Response to Reply #18
20. It ended the war
   
The only other option was invasion, and I'm sorry but it was a war, they were the enemy. Nagasaki was a legitimate military target.

Truman did the right thing which makes him not only an American hero, but a WORLD hero because eh ended a ****ing World War.
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roody  Donating Member  (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author  Click to view this author's profile  Click to add this author to your buddy list  Click to add this author to your Ignore list      Sat Aug-09-08 10:51 AM
Response to Reply #12
21. I was told those lies in grade school.
   
"Lives were saved." "We had no choice." My brother just parroted them to me!!
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IWantAnyDem  Donating Member  (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author  Click to view this author's profile  Click to add this author to your buddy list  Click to add this author to your Ignore list      Sat Aug-09-08 11:13 AM
Response to Reply #22
27. BTW, pay no attention to the holier than though hindsighters
   
BEst to just put idiots like that on ignore.
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MadHound  (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author  Click to view this author's profile  Click to add this author to your buddy list  Click to add this author to your Ignore list      Sat Aug-09-08 11:15 AM
Response to Reply #27
28. Yes, we know, the truth is disturbing to people like yourself
   
But there there now, all will be better now that you can ignore the truth :eyes:
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[Carl]

More wanderings through DUmmyland revisionism where only they are smart enough to have figured out that the USA is always the evildoer.

[Uhhuh35]

Too bad the Japs didn't surrender after Hiroshima. That's why we had to nuke them ****ers twice you know.

[JohnnyReb]

True, the Japanese wanted to surrender........but only with certain conditions.

The DUmmies, like the Japs, can't understand the difference between "Conditional Surrender" and "Unconditional Surrender". The difference in this case was 2 atomic bombs.

[franksolich]

You know, a little piece of historical arcania:

Henry Stimson, secretary of war during the second world war, was the one the most squeamish about dropping the atomic bombs (a squeamishness associated with that he had in his earlier days established many sentimental ties with Japan).

Henry Stimson was a conservative Republican.

Henry Stimson had served in the cabinets of William Howard Taft and Herbert Hoover, usually as secretary of state  or attorney general.

Franklin Roosevelt had named Stimson secretary of war (and Frank Knox, another prominent conservative Republican as secretary of the Navy, that office then being a cabinet-level position too) in 1940 in an attempt to bring "unity" and bipartisanship to the inevitable war.

Henry Stimson, who opposed using the atomic bomb, was a.....conservative Republican.

Shove that up your ass and smoke it, primitives.

[Airwolf]

Yeah we used them. And as a side note to Iran. Unless you guys want to see most of your country turned into a smoking hole in the ground, you might want to remember who has enough nukes to do the job. Israel might not be able to get them to you but we do. Any ideas you may be entertaining of shipping a nuke off to OBL or Hamas should die a quick death on the vine before the need to smoke you like a ham is at hand.

[Chris_]

Today was an evenful day...

Aug 9 1945
Because of the dense cloud cover over Kokura, USAF Maj. Charles Sweeney diverts his B-29 Bock's Car to the designated secondary target, 95 miles to the south. There he drops "Fat Man" -- a 22 kiloton Atomic Bomb -- over the city of Nagasaki, population 270,000. The blast kills 24,000 immediately, but another 46,000 perish from radiation-related illnesses over the next four months.

Aug 9 1960
Harvard professor Timothy Leary consumes seven Psilocybe caerulescens mushrooms in Cuernavaca, Mexico. Five hours later, the self-described atheist experiences a "fullblown conversion experience" next to a swimming pool. It is Leary's first drug trip.

Aug 9 1969
Tate Murders by Charles Manson's followers: Frykowski - shot twice, bludgeoned 13 times, stabbed 51 times; Pregnant Sharon Tate stabbed in the neck, breast, back, womb.

Aug 9 1974
Finally bowing to pressure from Senator Barry Goldwater and RNC chairman George Bush, President Richard M. Nixon resigns from office. His successor, Gerald Ford, assures the American people that their "long national nightmare is over."

Aug 9 1995
Jerry Garcia dies of a heart attack at Serenity Knolls near Novato, California. He had checked himself into the drug rehab center a few days prior, in hopes of kicking his longstanding heroin habit.

Aug 9 1997
Officers of Brooklyn's 70th precinct sodomize 30 year old Haitian immigrant Abner Louima with a toilet plunger, then insert the feces-contaminated plunger into Louima's mouth. Later, NYPD officials try feebly to dismiss the suspect's injuries as having resulted from ordinary homosexual activity, but a medical examination proves that to be inconsistent with the evidence.

Aug 9 1999
The U.S. Government closes the Mustang Ranch, a 104 room bordello near Reno, Nevada. U.S. Customs seized the house of ill repute for tax violations, which it believed to be operated by a front corporation controlled by Joe Conforte, original owner of the property when it first opened in 1955.

I'll have to wander over to the DUmp and see if there are any pseudo-hippie shrines to ole Jerry.