http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x3720109Oh my.
I wandered over to this bonfire, hoping to see the subway cat illuminating the primitives, but alas no subway cat.
HEyHEY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Journal Sat Aug-02-08 01:43 PM
Original message
So, this crazy murder in Canada is really showcasing ignorance toward the mentally ill
The guy that did it is likely mentally ill. I'm not sure, but I'm assuming schizophrenia (Though they are rarely violent). And all I hear is people saying, "They should de-decapitated HIM" and "We need the death penalty back" (Yeah, cause there's been a rash of random decapitations and we need a deterrence!)
But, even if you try to bring up this guy is mentally ill, people actually have the ****ing sand to say, "That's no excuse." It's like, "Uh, no ****face, that's probably the ONLY excuse in the world that is acceptable." I'm mentally ill myself, (OCD) and though I'm very well these days, I do know what it's like to not be in control of your brain. You literally AREN'T in control. Not that I am comparable to schizophrenics.... but I'm sure it's miles past the bizarre and painful experience of a full out OCD fit
Now, I feel genuinely terrible for the completely Innocent, and I'm told exceptional, young man this happened to.
However, I also felt very bad watching the footage of the guy who did it being taken into court. He looked afraid, confused and alone. He may be in some kind of extended psychotic episode and not even know what's going on. And when he comes around and realizes what he's done it will destroy him.
And to hear people talk about killing him and not even trying to understand that he may have literally not even had control of his body is sickening and hateful. In fact, I consider it hate speech.
I dunno. Some people just don't deserve to live. Period. Put them out of their misery.
The obligatory mandatory Obamaite primitive boilerplate comment:
yardwork Donating Member (1000+ posts) Sat Aug-02-08 01:44 PM
Response to Original message
1. Meanwhile, the various crazed racist killers down here get little attention.
It's gonna backfire, and big.
Sit back, watch, and wait, and see if I'm not right.
sfexpat2000 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Sat Aug-02-08 01:48 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. Those crimes often get disappeared, don't they?
I was reading The Race Beat last night, and read about the murders of three black leaders that got reported as car accidents or worse, the reporting was about whether one voting rights activist had registered people fraudulently and not about his murder.
HEyHEY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Sat Aug-02-08 01:57 PM
Response to Reply #3
13. Wow, I feel much better about my country now
Any race-based killing up here is a MAJOR issue and news story that sparks debate about new legislation and such. But Canada has some serious hate laws.
Warpy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Sat Aug-02-08 01:50 PM
Response to Original message
7. Right, no way was this a premeditated action by a sane man
The perpetrator needs to be off the streets, but that's a public health and safety issue, not a punitive one. An institution for the criminally insane should be his destination, not being warehoused in a prison.
sfexpat2000 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Sat Aug-02-08 01:58 PM
Response to Reply #9
14. Our prisons ARE where we put the mentally ill.
It's much, much easier to get into a jail than to get into a hospital.
GreenPartyVoter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Sat Aug-02-08 01:54 PM
Response to Original message
10. I have someone in my family who refuses to believe that I am biplor. He's a "bootstrapper" and just doesn't get that my brain has chemical issues and therefore not all of my behavior is based on flaws in my character.
One suspects most of them are, though.
tsegat01 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Sat Aug-02-08 03:28 PM
Response to Reply #29
30. What a better world it would be
if people learned empathy and compassion from an early age.
One assumes that would include children learning about the horrors, the violence, of infanticide.
tannybogus Donating Member (167 posts) Sat Aug-02-08 02:02 PM
Response to Original message
17. I always cringe when I hear that some was depressed, mentally ill, etc when something bad happens. A lot of people always lump all mental problems together and assume everyone who has any issues will "go off their nut." I never hid the fact I suffered from depression, and at one job I had, the manager wouldn't talk to me unless her office door was open. An assistant manager told me it was because she was afraid I'd do something. Yeah, like curl up in a ball and not move for days.
Tigress DEM (1000+ posts) Sat Aug-02-08 02:29 PM
Response to Original message
22. Still if people with mental illness could get the help they need.. this stuff wouldn't happen.
I wonder how many times this guy or people close to him have tried to get him help? When schizophrenia does not respond to medication it is hell on earth. I'm aware of 2 who've suicided and 1 who recovered, but I believe he did not have the paranoia or hallucinations, just the split.
In the US Reagan booted most of the patients out of mental institutions and put them back on the street. Then he cut funding and closed places because no one was there, so obviously they were not needed.
The current administration have been planning for 30 years to throw the US into a tizzy. Ignoring mental health issues so they can blame people that lose it may not be "part of their plan" but if they can't get them to follow the lemming philosphy and they march off the cliff not realizing it is against their best interest to do so, they will take it. It's part of the "everyone on their own-survival of the fittest" mentality.
Some days I wonder who really is sane any more?
The usual lie perpetrated by the primitives.
The mentally-ill were "mainstreamed" during the administration of the Incompetent One 1977-1981, not during the administration that followed it.
And just after franksolich wrote the above, the below popped up:
bamalib Donating Member (1000+ posts) Sat Aug-02-08 05:09 PM
Response to Reply #22
51. It wasn't Reagan, it was the ACLU
And it wasn't the 1980s it was the 1960s. The ACLU filed suit after suit in the states saying that mentally ill could not be held in institutions against their will. The states saw a good thing because they could save money and so they didn't fight the suits and turned the mentally ill out onto the streets.
Granted, it started with the ACLU and during the 1960s, but "mainstreaming" came into full flower 1977-1981.
8_year_nightmare Donating Member (1000+ posts) Sat Aug-02-08 02:34 PM
Response to Original message
25. Thank you, HH. What we need is more focus on HELPING the mentally ill!
Like you, I'm assuming the guy was schizophrenic. The guy was among people he didn't know, & I think when he saw the poor guy sleeping with his head phones on, there were thoughts that this guy was "the enemy", possibly "hearing messages" from "them" to do harm to him.
I don't know what it's going to take for these people to get the proper help. I'm thinking the worst, that it will never happen. This world has become too self-centered, selfish, judgmental of what they don't have to experience themselves, & downright cruel.
I dunno.
The taxpayers of Nebraska paid nearly a million dollars in two years for state-of-the-art, Park Avenue or Beverly Hills, psychiatric care for some kid here, to keep him from hurting himself or other people.
And then he went to a shopping mall and hurt himself and other people anyway.
Some people should just be put down.
Most of the primitive comments offer sympathy for the killer. Naturally. Provoking this reaction:
Crisco Donating Member (1000+ posts) Sat Aug-02-08 04:14 PM
Response to Original message
36. Can We PLEASE NOT DE-STIGMATIZE CUTTING OFF SOMEONE'S FREAKIN HEAD?
Mentally ill = kleptomania, substance abuse, Turret's, etc. Stuff that's annoying to society, but generally not dangerous.
Criminally insane = something you'd see in a horror movie.
HEyHEY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Sat Aug-02-08 04:50 PM
Response to Reply #36
42. We're not de-stigmatizing anything
Mentally ill = cutting off someone's head. Criminally insane is very much a disparaging remark.
Crisco Donating Member (1000+ posts) Sat Aug-02-08 04:54 PM
Response to Reply #42
44. Aw, Come On
Criminal insanity is exactly what it is, HH.
Some things ought to be disparaged and the only thing more mind-boggling than this act, the stuff of which 1700s folk songs are made of, is the idea that we should be more sensitive towards those who cut off someone's freaking head!
HEyHEY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Sat Aug-02-08 04:57 PM
Response to Reply #44
46. It's just different degrees of mental illness
If this guy was a schizophrenic and had no idea what was happening, then I'd say it's mentally ill. Criminally insane implies he knew.
alphafemale Donating Member (1000+ posts) Sat Aug-02-08 05:23 PM
Response to Original message
55. I can't imagine what the family expecting to see their beautiful young son is going through now, I really don't give a damn if the guy that brutally murdered him was "troubled."
It's way too late for that now.
Lock that freak up for life.
He lost his right to wander...forever.
You disagree?
Fine.
Hire him to babysit your kids.
Make sure he has a knife.
IWantAnyDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Sat Aug-02-08 05:29 PM
Response to Original message
59. Sorry, I support the death penalty and anybody who murders anybody else is mentally ill, in my opinion. It's no excuse.
Murderers do not deserve their own life, period.
