Warning: 9/11 troofers wonder about Obama.

[dutch508]

  dredged from the dungeon of the 9/11...

dailykoff  (1000+ posts)       Wed Jul-16-08 02:18 AM
Original message http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=125x215886
Poll question: If Obama is elected in November, what do you think he will do about 911?
 Until last week, I was pretty optimistic that Obama would at least put the neocon trolls on the defensive, if not actually into prison. But after his FISA flip-flop, I'm beginning to wonder if Obama will turn out to be a Clinton-style DINO. Toward the end of his 2006 book "The Audacity of Hope," Obama discusses /911 and its effects, but he keeps it pretty mainstream as far as who did it:

Now chaos had come to our doorstep. As a consequence, we would have to act differently, understand the world differently. (p. 292)

However, he also shows a clear understanding of what /911 was all about politically:

The PR strategy worked; by the fall of 2002, a majority of Americans were convinced that Saddam Hussein possessed weapons of mass destruction, and at least 66 percent believed (falsely ) that the Iraqi leader had been personally involved in the 9/11 attacks. (p. 293)

Does Obama even know that the whole thing was a scam? That I can't decide. I hope to hell he does, and for a long time I assumed he did, but after last week Pelosi impersonation, I'm not so sure. I'm starting to suspect that he's either hopelessly clueless or hopelessly corrupt.

What do you think?
Poll result (6 votes) 

• Obama will surprise us all by relentlessly getting to the bottom of 9/11.  (0 votes, 0%) Vote
  Obama will reluctantly open another investigation which will be revealing, but no will lead to no high-level indictments.  (0 votes, 0%) Vote
  Obama will block any effort to re-investigate 9/11, much as Clinton swept BCCI under the carpet.  (5 votes, 83%) Vote
  I don't think Obama will win in November.  (0 votes, 0%) Vote
  Other.  (1 votes, 17%) Vote

 

AZCat  (1000+ posts)      Wed Jul-16-08 02:44 AM
Response to Reply #2
3. You're assuming it was only Bush and his buddies who were responsible.
 If the setup for 9/11 was truly as complex as some of the theories would seem, then it would have to include others besides Bush and his band of cronies. Uncovering this potential viper's nest would not be in the best interests of any congress critter, IMO (at least if they valued their seats on various committees). Much better to go after the other guys on the typical, "safe" issues.

it was the lizard shapeshifters...

Bassman66 (828 posts)      Wed Jul-16-08 03:09 AM
Response to Original message
7. Is Obama like Kennedy?
 Will he stand up to the military-industrial complex?

I think he'll bomb Iran as a distraction.

sniffing glue leads to brain damage.

Diane_nyc (456 posts)       Wed Jul-16-08 08:57 AM
Response to Original message
11. This discussion is a trap - perhaps unintentionally so, but let's not fall into it, please. 
 Remember, folks, this is DU. We're not supposed to speak ill of Obama here.

Politicians, in general, do what they are pressured to do, if there's enough pressure from any given direction. Remember, the Jersey Girls managed to pressure even Bush to consent to an investigation, albeit a limited and compromised one.

So the question we should be asking is how we can build an effective grassroots movement to call for government accountability regarding 9/11.

Various huge roadblocks have been put up in our way. How can we deal with them?

  burn burn burn!!!

dailykoff  (1000+ posts)       Wed Jul-16-08 10:55 AM
Response to Reply #11
12. Um, honest discussion of Democrats is not a "trap," it's the raison d'etre 
 of this website, which is not your personal propaganda organ, as much as you might like it to be.
 

FREEDOM OF SPEACH!!!

Diane_nyc (456 posts)       Wed Jul-16-08 11:44 AM
Response to Reply #12
13. My concern re: discussion about Obama 
 Edited on Wed Jul-16-08 12:29 PM by Diane_nyc
From the main rules page:


2. Who We Are: Democratic Underground is an online community for Democrats and other progressives. Members are expected to be generally supportive of progressive ideals, and to support Democratic candidates for political office.


From the more detailed rules page:


You are not permitted to use this message board to work for the defeat of the Democratic Party nominee for any political office.


Admittedly I'm relatively new here, but it seems to me that the above rules imply, at the very least, that any criticisms of Obama are required to be presented in a very careful and restrained manner. Furthermore, it seems to me that the above rules imply that some kinds of "honest discussion" that might have been appropriate a few months ago, before Obama became the nominee, may no longer be appropriate now.

The issue here has nothing to do with my "personal propaganda." My concern is that this thread could easily be used, by some people, to provoke other people into dissing Obama and thereby getting the latter people kicked off of DU. I've seen various people (mainly official-story defenders) trying to do this sort of thing in other threads.

My point here is not to accuse you personally of anything. I'm just pointing out how this thread could be used by some people.

(Edited to remove a possibly inflammatory remark.)

Irony?...nah...

[PatriotGame]

Poll result (6 votes) 

Obama will surprise us all by relentlessly getting to the bottom of 9/11.  (0 votes, 0%) Vote
Obama will reluctantly open another investigation which will be revealing, but no will lead to no high-level indictments.  (0 votes, 0%) Vote
Obama will block any effort to re-investigate 9/11, much as Clinton swept BCCI under the carpet.  (5 votes, 83%) Vote
I don't think Obama will win in November.  (0 votes, 0%) Vote
Other.  (1 votes, 17%) Vote

Pre-election DUmmy doom and gloom!
Gotta love it!

[DumbAss Tanker]

Since they are delusional paranoids, it is inevitable that they will eventually come to suspect anyone who comes to their attention on either side of the aisle of being somehow complicit in The Plot.

 

[Carl]

I can`t imagine or even guess at the number of people and the bureaucratic jumble it would require for even half of what the primitives beliefs to have been pulled off by the US government.
How many memos and authorizations would it take to get a person into the building to plant the explosive charges they all believe in alone?

All this and no leaks over the course of months of preparation?

You just can`t be that irrational and deluded unless insane.

[djones520]

I can`t imagine or even guess at the number of people and the bureaucratic jumble it would require for even half of what the primitives beliefs to have been pulled off by the US government.
How many memos and authorizations would it take to get a person into the building to plant the explosive charges they all believe in alone?

All this and no leaks over the course of months of preparation?

You just can`t be that irrational and deluded unless insane.

Tell me about it.  I know people who where at the Pentagon when it was hit.  They where NOT the type of people who would keep that secret.  You gotta be real damn naive to believe that thousands of military personnel would keep a secret like that for 7 years, when you can't keep people shut up about failing spy satellites.

[jukin]

To think that they say smoking pot makes you paranoid.

[Chris_]

Obama will block any effort to re-investigate 9/11, much as Clinton swept BCCI under the carpet

Quoth the raving, evermore

[docstew]

I can`t imagine or even guess at the number of people and the bureaucratic jumble it would require for even half of what the primitives beliefs to have been pulled off by the US government.
How many memos and authorizations would it take to get a person into the building to plant the explosive charges they all believe in alone?

All this and no leaks over the course of months of preparation?

You just can`t be that irrational and deluded unless insane.

Tell me about it.  I know people who where at the Pentagon when it was hit.  They where NOT the type of people who would keep that secret.  You gotta be real damn naive to believe that thousands of military personnel would keep a secret like that for 7 years, when you can't keep people shut up about failing spy satellites.

especially when every article written about the military nowadays has the following phrase somewhere in it: "on conditions of anonymity because they were not authorized to release the information."

as many people as that "conspiracy" would have involved, it would have leaked long before anything was accomplished.  military leaders are still setting forth the secrecy around operation overlord as a master stroke, and that only worked because up til about 5 days before the execution of it, the only ones who knew what was going on were the planners.

and another thing, are we to believe that "the incompetent" GWB got that plan completed and executed in less than 9 months?  the same guy they accuse of being too stupid to breathe?

[Carl]

I can`t imagine or even guess at the number of people and the bureaucratic jumble it would require for even half of what the primitives beliefs to have been pulled off by the US government.
How many memos and authorizations would it take to get a person into the building to plant the explosive charges they all believe in alone?

All this and no leaks over the course of months of preparation?

You just can`t be that irrational and deluded unless insane.

Tell me about it.  I know people who where at the Pentagon when it was hit.  They where NOT the type of people who would keep that secret.  You gotta be real damn naive to believe that thousands of military personnel would keep a secret like that for 7 years, when you can't keep people shut up about failing spy satellites.

especially when every article written about the military nowadays has the following phrase somewhere in it: "on conditions of anonymity because they were not authorized to release the information."

as many people as that "conspiracy" would have involved, it would have leaked long before anything was accomplished.  military leaders are still setting forth the secrecy around operation overlord as a master stroke, and that only worked because up til about 5 days before the execution of it, the only ones who knew what was going on were the planners.

and another thing, are we to believe that "the incompetent" GWB got that plan completed and executed in less than 9 months?  the same guy they accuse of being too stupid to breathe?

Some say the plane into the Pentagon was actually a missile (not sure how they reconcile that with the fact of a lost plane) others say flight 93 was shot down,and then complain that the order to shoot down wasn`t given in time or complain that it was horrible when President Bush did authorize it.

All the stuff about the towers being a controlled demolition which a few simple google searches...
http://www.howstuffworks.com/building-implosion.htm
reveals what a complicated and impossible to hide project that would be.

Yet somehow they can still believe that it was a conspiracy.

These fools live in a TV world of McGivers and The A-Team with a Jack Bauer and cigarette smoking man around every corner.......

and they think they should be in control of policy and government,that is what is really scary because some politicians will try to appease them at our expense and peril.