The Conservative Cave
Current Events => General Discussion => Topic started by: Freeper on November 08, 2012, 07:28:56 AM
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It has been on the back burner because of the election, but I am sure we all know about the debt ceiling nonsense that is coming up.
What I want the Republicans to do is draft a budget take it to Harry Reid and tell them that is the debt ceiling deal. Tell them that they will shut down the government if no budget is passed. Seriously what does the GOP have to lose if the government were to be shut down anyway?
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I think they gave it away too easily before when they gave Obama enough money to get past the election.
Screw this continuing resolution BS. Demand a budget or shut it down.
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I'm afraid given what Boehner is saying today...he's not only going to let the Dems do what they want in regards to the debt ceiling and the budget...but he's going to thank them and not even get kissed.
I have no problem with them shutting down the Government...they have nothing to lose and Obama has nothing to gain from it.
But looking at who we've got at the top of the food chain in the House...I'm not optimistic it will happen.
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I'm torn on this. The conservative in me says hell no and to call their bluff and the mom in me says that it's time for them to learn the results of cause and effect.
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If it were up to me, I'd give them what they want. Want a debt ceiling increase? Fine, how about 5 gazillion dollars. Hell, why have one at all. Borrow it all. Who cares? Obviously not the American electorate. Let Bernake print all the money he wants. Sequestration? Hey, Obama, you signed it. Let it come.
If they want to live in Obamatopia, let them have it. Let them see exactly what their policies will bring. The quicker the better.
Let it burn.
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How long did it take Rome to recover?
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I'm afraid given what Boehner is saying today...he's not only going to let the Dems do what they want in regards to the debt ceiling and the budget...but he's going to thank them and not even get kissed.
I have no problem with them shutting down the Government...they have nothing to lose and Obama has nothing to gain from it.
But looking at who we've got at the top of the food chain in the House...I'm not optimistic it will happen.
He said something about wanting 0bama to come lead them. Game over folks. We lose.
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I am a conservative or to put it in terms of the constitution and Originalist. The last two elections really aggravated me. I knew we were in trouble when the Washington Repubs gave us two moderates, McCain and Romney. This whole situation has annoyed me to the point where I down loaded a voter registration form today. I'm changing my party affiliation from Republican to Conservative.
the Republicans are a lost party with no direction right now. They are too easily influenced. What is the old saying?They are reactive rather than proactive which in turn creates the see saw or flip flop mentality we saw in the Romney campaign this election cycle.
I am still going to fight to try and keep this country as a Constiutional Republic regardless of how socialistic it wants to become. Our form of government envisioned by the founding fathers is too important to let one man wreck it..........
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I am a conservative or to put it in terms of the constitution and Originalist. The last two elections really aggravated me. I knew we were in trouble when the Washington Repubs gave us two moderates, McCain and Romney. This whole situation has annoyed me to the point where I down loaded a voter registration form today. I'm changing my party affiliation from Republican to Conservative.
the Republicans are a lost party with no direction right now. They are too easily influenced. What is the old saying?They are reactive rather than proactive which in turn creates the see saw or flip flop mentality we saw in the Romney campaign this election cycle.
I am still going to fight to try and keep this country as a Constiutional Republic regardless of how socialistic it wants to become. Our form of government envisioned by the founding fathers is too important to let one man wreck it..........
It's not just the Washington GOP that gave us Romney and McCain, the liberal media drove them to victory in their own way. They were supported by the media, and their more conservative opponents were attacked relentlessly.
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That's why I say we can bitch and moan about it, or help bring about change. Find every way actively to get involved.
And screw the MSM....we have better vehicles for getting our voices out. I will say this until I am blue in the face. Get out and get active.
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I'm afraid given what Boehner is saying today...he's not only going to let the Dems do what they want in regards to the debt ceiling and the budget...but he's going to thank them and not even get kissed.
I have no problem with them shutting down the Government...they have nothing to lose and Obama has nothing to gain from it.
But looking at who we've got at the top of the food chain in the House...I'm not optimistic it will happen.
After Obama's reelection speech about working together I think Boehner saw an opportunity to showcase early on whether Obama is for real or full of beans and going to do things his way.
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After Obama's reelection speech about working together I think Boehner saw an opportunity to showcase early on whether Obama is for real or full of beans and going to do things his way.
I actually think you may be onto something. It's a "put up, or shut up" moment.
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I actually think you may be onto something. It's a "put up, or shut up" moment.
That's the way I see it. The house being under Republican control is going to get the blame on most things eventually so give the ball to the President and see what he does. besides it really doesn't matter one iota what the house does as long as they keep getting waylaid by the Senate which the Dems control and the VP through the majority lead can push legislation.
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I'm torn on this. The conservative in me says hell no and to call their bluff and the mom in me says that it's time for them to learn the results of cause and effect.
They won't put two and two together even after ten years of disaster. They'll continue to blame others for their policy failures. That is typical historically speaking. I think the Republicans in the house need to dig in and fight to the last man. In two years we'll get more conservatives in and we wont make thhe same mistakes twice. Our next presidential candidate will be a rockstar.
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After Obama's reelection speech about working together I think Boehner saw an opportunity to showcase early on whether Obama is for real or full of beans and going to do things his way.
I think Boehner and the gang are about to fold like a house of cards.
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I think Boehner and the gang are about to fold like a house of cards.
^^THIS^^
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I think Boehner and the gang are about to fold like a house of cards.
I think they are all running scared because they are buying the media meme now that the GOP platform scares people.
The problem is the MSM, and as Jason already stated, the MSM is the archaic way of reaching people. The GOP needs better marketing - fresh young 21st century ideas of getting their message straight to the people and just avoiding the MSM altogether.
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If it were up to me, I'd give them what they want. Want a debt ceiling increase? Fine, how about 5 gazillion dollars. Hell, why have one at all. Borrow it all. Who cares? Obviously not the American electorate. Let Bernake print all the money he wants. Sequestration? Hey, Obama, you signed it. Let it come.
If they want to live in Obamatopia, let them have it. Let them see exactly what their policies will bring. The quicker the better.
Let it burn.
^^This^^
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I think they are all running scared because they are buying the media meme now that the GOP platform scares people.
The squishy spined old guard has always been this way. Which is why they need to be fired.
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^^This^^
Exactly. I think I'll survive this, but, as I've said, let the takers eat that shit sandwich.
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Exactly. I think I'll survive this, but, as I've said, let the takers eat that shit sandwich.
I think I'll be okay too, but for sure I don't plan on buying anything for the next four years, other than what I absolutely need. When I was younger, I spent many a lean year pinching pennies and haven't forgotten how.
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The squishy spined old guard has always been this way. Which is why they need to be fired upon.
fixt. :II:
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If it were up to me, I'd give them what they want. Want a debt ceiling increase? Fine, how about 5 gazillion dollars. Hell, why have one at all. Borrow it all. Who cares? Obviously not the American electorate. Let Bernake print all the money he wants. Sequestration? Hey, Obama, you signed it. Let it come.
If they want to live in Obamatopia, let them have it. Let them see exactly what their policies will bring. The quicker the better.
Let it burn.
I have to agree with you. The country is now currently center-left and it is going to have to get much worse before they have a change of heart. :cheersmate:
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Kristol: Yup, Time to Raise Taxes on Rich People
By Eliana Johnson
November 11, 2012 12:42 P.M.
Time to raise taxes on the rich. That’s according to Bill Kristol. On today’s Fox News Sunday panel, the Weekly Standard editor argued that the Republican Party should not “fall on its sword to defend a bunch of millionaires, half of whom voted Democratic and have of whom live in Hollywood and are hostile to Republican principles
http://www.nationalreview.com/corner
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Let them raise taxes....won't stop the Thelma and Louise express
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‘A VALLEY FORGE MOMENT FOR CONSERVATIVES’ (http://www.humanevents.com/2012/11/15/a-valley-forge-moment-for-conservatives/)
By:Sen. Tom Coburn
11/15/2012 09:45 AM
For us, this is a Valley Forge moment. This is a time for leadership that calls on us to re-enlist in the struggle to preserve freedom, and a leadership that drills us in the principles that made us great.
To get back on track I would suggest we focus on a few simple points: truth, oversight, action and accountability.
One of the lessons from last Tuesday is that we’ve failed to tell the American people – particularly young voters – the truth about where we are.
The truth is, on our present course, the average young person in this country is going to inherit a lower standard of living than their parents. That is unacceptable.
America is already bankrupt. We may not believe it. We may not yet feel its full effects. But we are effectively bankrupt. Our debt, which is 103 percent of our GDP, now exceeds the size of our entire economy.
The crisis is imminent. Today, we’re on the cusp of another downgrade. If interest rates go up one point, we add at least another $113 billion to our deficit every year. If rates return to historic averages, we’ll add about $640 billion to our deficit every year – which is more than our defense budget.
In two years, the Social Security disability trust fund goes bankrupt. In five years, Medicare Part A – the hospital insurance trust fund – may be bankrupt. And in ten years the costs of entitlements and interest on the debt alone will consume all available tax revenues. That means our entire military and discretionary budget will be financed entirely on borrowed – or printed – money.
The truth is we’ll never get to the point of running DOD on money borrowed from China and elsewhere. Eventually, the rest of the world will decide we can’t pay what we owe and they’ll stop lending us money. As I describe in my book, The Debt Bomb, that’s when the party is over.
That isn’t just my opinion. In 2011 Federal Reserve Ben Bernanke told Congress that these unsustainable spending levels can’t continue “because creditors would never be willing to lend to a government whose debt, relative to national income, is rising without limit.â€
Here’s why this is important in the context of what happened last Tuesday.
We’ve heard a lot of talk about the left’s so-called demographic advantage and the president’s electoral firewall, and whether that firewall will hold in future elections. Let me tell you some good news. Those of us who believe in the Constitution and limited government have a much more potent firewall working in our favor: it is a mathematical and budgetary firewall. It is a firewall that tells us – in very stark terms – that we can’t afford the status quo. We don’t have the money. Sooner rather than later, the other side will have to accept reforms that are a lot closer to our principles than theirs.
The demographic advantage – at least among younger voters – is a bubble of inflated expectations that can’t be met. Where the left sees a demographic advantage I see a generation of Americans about to be drowned in debt. When that happens, our solutions will be like an ark in the storm.
Hopefully we won’t have to live through such a crisis. If we tell the truth effectively we may not have to.
So, our first task is to tell the truth. The second is oversight, which has to happen before you set priorities and get spending under control.
Oversight isn’t very popular in Washington because politicians on both sides prefer to create new programs instead of looking at whether the programs we’ve already created are working. But, I believe, oversight resonates with families because that’s how they live their lives every day. In the real world, people look their budgets and make choices. In Washington, we make excuses, and defer choices to future generations.
Oversight is about methodically and relentlessly building the case for limited government. And it’s about recognizing that big changes often happen in small steps. That’s why I release reports on all areas of the government. In my latest annual Wastebook report we found federal funding from everything from robotic squirrels to climate change musicals to caviar promotion.
Here are a few more. You can’t make this stuff up. We found:
• $27 million for Moroccan pottery classes
• $505,000 for the promotion of specialty shampoo and other beauty products for cats and dogs
• $1.3 million in corporate welfare for the world’s largest snack food producer, PepsiCo Inc.
• $350,000 for a government-funded study on how golfers might benefit from using their imagination to envision the hole to be bigger than it actually is. Really? Maybe we should have studied how to help politicians imagine a smaller hole in the budget.
The list goes on and on. And I’m adding to the list tomorrow when I’ll release a report that details more than $60 billion in non-defense spending at the Pentagon.
The point of these reports is to help the public have an understanding of government that reflects reality. And the reality is we could reduce the size of government by one-third today and no one outside of Washington would be able to tell the difference.
Oversight, again, isn’t just the responsibility of those of us in elected office. It’s the media’s responsibility as well. Many of you in this room are doing that and I salute you.
So, task number two is oversight. The last two – action and accountability – go together.
Perhaps the greatest problem I’ve seen in the Republican Party since being elected in the Class of 1994 is the gap between our words and actions. We have two forms of conservatism in Washington. One is cheap or complacent conservatism; the other is costly or courageous conservatism. One is common, the other is rare.
Cheap or complacent conservatism is the conservatism of rhetoric, pledges and pandering. Costly and courageous conservatism is a conservatism of action, solutions and sacrifice. Cheap conservatism looks for scapegoats to compensate for its failure to communicate and implement a limited government agenda. Costly conservatism is brimming with optimism and compelling solutions. Cheap conservatism treats particular areas of the budget as sacred based on political expediency. Costly conservatism treats every tax dollar as sacred based on the principles of liberty and self-government.
Whether we have cheap or costly conservatism really is up to all of us in this room, particularly those of you who are leaders in the media and interest groups. My challenge to you is don’t elevate the politicians who tell you what you want to hear; elevate the leaders who are willing to take us where we need to go.
Let me make a final point about accountability. Many want to blame our setbacks in the Senate, in particular, on the Tea Party. I agree we need to do a much, much better job of candidate recruitment. But the problem in Republican politics isn’t the challengers: it’s the incumbents: it’s the career politicians who say they are for limited government and lower taxes but make decisions that give us bigger government and higher taxes.
Voters will forgive us for trying and failing, but they won’t – nor should they – forgive us for not trying. If we align our actions with our words and primary ourselves with term limits we’ll create the kind of leadership America needs.
I agree in general with Sen. Coburn's remarks but I have yet to hear a valid argument to the Federal govt's constitutional authority to set term limits to state elected officials.