Author Topic: A MUST READ: Why Socialism Always Results in Tyrannical Rule  (Read 17382 times)

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Offline Odin's Hand

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Re: Why Socialism Always Results in Tyrannical Rule
« Reply #25 on: February 18, 2011, 08:35:15 AM »
So the times ****ed up. That's doesn't nullify justification for there existence.

Can you give me a link for that though? I can't find one that talks about the times. It will be useful when arguing against wikileaks in the general sense.

They, didn't just "**** up". They are responsible for doing Al-Qaeda's leg work for them, stole an arrow from the U.S. DoD's quiver and are collaterally resposible for subsequent deaths resulting from the absence that this program could've been employed for in the quicker destruction of Al-Qaeda's operational ability.
« Last Edit: February 18, 2011, 09:04:29 AM by Odin's Hand »
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Offline Carl

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Re: A MUST READ: Why Socialism Always Results in Tyrannical Rule
« Reply #26 on: February 18, 2011, 08:36:58 AM »
We can kind of split hairs wordsmithing definitions to the point of a haze that no one understands.

To me Communisim is inevitably failing socialism being inflicted on the people via the barrel of a gun to the personal gain of a few and the misery of all the rest.

Offline Rebel

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Re: Why Socialism Always Results in Tyrannical Rule
« Reply #27 on: February 18, 2011, 08:36:58 AM »
So the times ****ed up. That's doesn't nullify justification for there existence.

Can you give me a link for that though? I can't find one that talks about the times.

 It will be useful when arguing against wikileaks in the general sense.

First off, it's "their" not "there". Secondly, only an idiot cites Wikipedia. While helpful as a repository, there are links at the bottom of the page to verify claims that should be cited. Lastly, the NY Times is the most left-wing biased MAJOR newsprint in the nation. They spin shit ALL the time.

NAMBLA is a left-wing organization.

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There's a reason why patriotism is considered a conservative value. Watch a Tea Party rally and you'll see people proudly raising the American flag and showing pride in U.S. heroes such as Thomas Jefferson. Watch an OWS rally and you'll see people burning the American flag while showing pride in communist heroes such as Che Guevera. --Bob, from some news site




Offline Bertram

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Re: Why Socialism Always Results in Tyrannical Rule
« Reply #28 on: February 18, 2011, 08:40:56 AM »
By the ordering of the terms you're under the false impression that Socialism is a governmental model. Again, wrong.
I didn't say socialism was a government model. Or if I did, I did not intend to. If I implied it, it was unintentional.

Communism is an economic system which, in Marxist Theory may be a form of Government. But in reality it has always under a totalitarian government. If you can find an example to the contrary I am interested.

This is why arguing about isms is annoying. It's all theory, and often reality contradicts the definitional theory. But still. Nazi's weren't socialist. National Socialist yes, but that's a fascist ideology/party. And socialism in itself does not reflect the article the OP posted. Marxist Socialism can lead to communism and a totalitarian government that reflects it, but not in and of itself.

Offline Rebel

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Re: Why Socialism Always Results in Tyrannical Rule
« Reply #29 on: February 18, 2011, 08:43:48 AM »
I didn't say socialism was a government model. Or if I did, I did not intend to. If I implied it, it was unintentional.

Communism is an economic system which, in Marxist Theory may be a form of Government. But in reality it has always under a totalitarian government. If you can find an example to the contrary I am interested.

This is why arguing about isms is annoying. It's all theory, and often reality contradicts the definitional theory. But still. Nazi's weren't socialist. National Socialist yes, but that's a fascist ideology/party. And socialism in itself does not reflect the article the OP posted. Marxist Socialism can lead to communism and a totalitarian government that reflects it, but not in and of itself.

How about you explain the differences between Socialism as an economic model and Communism as an economic model.

This should be interesting. I promise you, I won't buy it, but it'll be interesting nonetheless.  :whatever:
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There's a reason why patriotism is considered a conservative value. Watch a Tea Party rally and you'll see people proudly raising the American flag and showing pride in U.S. heroes such as Thomas Jefferson. Watch an OWS rally and you'll see people burning the American flag while showing pride in communist heroes such as Che Guevera. --Bob, from some news site




Offline Bertram

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Re: Why Socialism Always Results in Tyrannical Rule
« Reply #30 on: February 18, 2011, 08:50:01 AM »
First off, it's "their" not "there". Secondly, only an idiot cites Wikipedia. While helpful as a repository, there are links at the bottom of the page to verify claims that should be cited. Lastly, the NY Times is the most left-wing biased MAJOR newsprint in the nation. They spin shit ALL the time.



I didn't cite Wikipedia. And back in MY day, you could site Wikipedia, but that's anther story for another day.
Also, misuse of there/their/they're is acceptable as this is an informal grapholect. So correction of grammar is unnecessary. Not to mention it takes away from your substantive matter.

But you brought up an interesting idea. Whether it's objective or not is subjective. Subjective enough that it might not be worth discussing whether or not it is.

Offline Bertram

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Re: Why Socialism Always Results in Tyrannical Rule
« Reply #31 on: February 18, 2011, 08:51:37 AM »
How about you explain the differences between Socialism as an economic model and Communism as an economic model.

This should be interesting. I promise you, I won't buy it, but it'll be interesting nonetheless.  :whatever:

I haven't taken Political Philosophy yet so I don't feel confident enough to explain it.

Offline JohnnyReb

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Re: Why Socialism Always Results in Tyrannical Rule
« Reply #32 on: February 18, 2011, 08:54:53 AM »
I haven't taken Political Philosophy yet so I don't feel confident enough to explain it.

Is Bill Ayers taking time off?
“The American people will never knowingly adopt socialism. But, under the name of ‘liberalism’, they will adopt every fragment of the socialist program, until one day America will be a socialist nation, without knowing how it happened.” - Norman Thomas, U.S. Socialist Party presidential candidate 1940, 1944 and 1948

"America is like a healthy body and its resistance is threefold: its patriotism, its morality, and its spiritual life. If we can undermine these three areas, America will collapse from within."  Stalin

Offline Rebel

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Re: Why Socialism Always Results in Tyrannical Rule
« Reply #33 on: February 18, 2011, 09:08:17 AM »
I didn't cite Wikipedia. And back in MY day, you could site Wikipedia, but that's anther story for another day.
Also, misuse of there/their/they're is acceptable as this is an informal grapholect. So correction of grammar is unnecessary. Not to mention it takes away from your substantive matter.

But you brought up an interesting idea. Whether it's objective or not is subjective. Subjective enough that it might not be worth discussing whether or not it is.

When was "back in your day"? 2007? As for defending the misuse of their, they're, and there, just damn. Acceptable? What school do you attend?
NAMBLA is a left-wing organization.

Quote
There's a reason why patriotism is considered a conservative value. Watch a Tea Party rally and you'll see people proudly raising the American flag and showing pride in U.S. heroes such as Thomas Jefferson. Watch an OWS rally and you'll see people burning the American flag while showing pride in communist heroes such as Che Guevera. --Bob, from some news site




Offline Bertram

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Re: Why Socialism Always Results in Tyrannical Rule
« Reply #34 on: February 18, 2011, 09:12:19 AM »
"Cite" not "site". ....and when was "back in your day"? 2007? As for defending the misuse of their, they're, and there, just damn. Acceptable? What school do you attend?

It's my sleep deprivation that's leading to my errors. I attend Cape Cod Community Lollege.
As far a community colleges go, it's on the better side. We get all the professors that used to teach at other institutions that then came to the Cape to retire, then decided that without spreading their knowledge their lives were meaningless.

Offline JohnnyReb

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Re: Why Socialism Always Results in Tyrannical Rule
« Reply #35 on: February 18, 2011, 09:17:41 AM »
It's my sleep deprivation that's leading to my errors. I attend Cape Cod Community Lollege.
As far a community colleges go, it's on the better side. We get all the professors that used to teach at other institutions that then came to the Cape to retire, then decided that without spreading their knowledge their lives were meaningless.

You mean...discovered they couldn't afford to retire in the socialist hell hole they had helped to create.
“The American people will never knowingly adopt socialism. But, under the name of ‘liberalism’, they will adopt every fragment of the socialist program, until one day America will be a socialist nation, without knowing how it happened.” - Norman Thomas, U.S. Socialist Party presidential candidate 1940, 1944 and 1948

"America is like a healthy body and its resistance is threefold: its patriotism, its morality, and its spiritual life. If we can undermine these three areas, America will collapse from within."  Stalin

Offline Bertram

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Re: Why Socialism Always Results in Tyrannical Rule
« Reply #36 on: February 18, 2011, 09:21:56 AM »
You mean...discovered they couldn't afford to retire in the socialist hell hole they had helped to create.

So education is bad?
What?

Offline JohnnyReb

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Re: Why Socialism Always Results in Tyrannical Rule
« Reply #37 on: February 18, 2011, 09:30:05 AM »
So education is bad?
What?

NO. The dumbasses voted for a lot of socialist programs in that area. That in turn drove up prices and property taxes to a point that their retirement income won't support them in that area. We get a lot of those idiots moving in down south here because they can no longer afford to live up there. ...and GAWDDAMMIT, they want to repeat the same DAMN mistakes here. 
“The American people will never knowingly adopt socialism. But, under the name of ‘liberalism’, they will adopt every fragment of the socialist program, until one day America will be a socialist nation, without knowing how it happened.” - Norman Thomas, U.S. Socialist Party presidential candidate 1940, 1944 and 1948

"America is like a healthy body and its resistance is threefold: its patriotism, its morality, and its spiritual life. If we can undermine these three areas, America will collapse from within."  Stalin

Offline Rebel

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Re: Why Socialism Always Results in Tyrannical Rule
« Reply #38 on: February 18, 2011, 09:36:31 AM »
NO. The dumbasses voted for a lot of socialist programs in that area. That in turn drove up prices and property taxes to a point that their retirement income won't support them in that area. We get a lot of those idiots moving in down south here because they can no longer afford to live up there. ...and GAWDDAMMIT, they want to repeat the same DAMN mistakes here.  

Ask the Coloradans. Ask people in Wet Washington what happened when they were "Californicated". Liberals fled California due to the policies they helped create and then went somewhere else to do the same shit. Liberals think all failed policies didn't work because "they" didn't do'em right. They're obtuse to the fact that they're failed due to their very nature of existing. They're trying something now that even William Bradford determined wouldn't/couldn't work.
NAMBLA is a left-wing organization.

Quote
There's a reason why patriotism is considered a conservative value. Watch a Tea Party rally and you'll see people proudly raising the American flag and showing pride in U.S. heroes such as Thomas Jefferson. Watch an OWS rally and you'll see people burning the American flag while showing pride in communist heroes such as Che Guevera. --Bob, from some news site




Offline Bertram

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Re: Why Socialism Always Results in Tyrannical Rule
« Reply #39 on: February 18, 2011, 09:38:22 AM »
NO. The dumbasses voted for a lot of socialist programs in that area. That in turn drove up prices and property taxes to a point that their retirement income won't support them in that area. We get a lot of those idiots moving in down south here because they can no longer afford to live up there. ...and GAWDDAMMIT, they want to repeat the same DAMN mistakes here. 

Yeah... Our taxes are pretty high.

Offline JohnnyReb

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Re: Why Socialism Always Results in Tyrannical Rule
« Reply #40 on: February 18, 2011, 09:48:17 AM »
Yeah... Our taxes are pretty high.

Ergo the high cost of socialism.
“The American people will never knowingly adopt socialism. But, under the name of ‘liberalism’, they will adopt every fragment of the socialist program, until one day America will be a socialist nation, without knowing how it happened.” - Norman Thomas, U.S. Socialist Party presidential candidate 1940, 1944 and 1948

"America is like a healthy body and its resistance is threefold: its patriotism, its morality, and its spiritual life. If we can undermine these three areas, America will collapse from within."  Stalin

Offline Eupher

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Re: Why Socialism Always Results in Tyrannical Rule
« Reply #41 on: February 18, 2011, 04:03:04 PM »

Socialism to wikileaks in one transition. Awesome.

~rest of drivel snipped due to Bert's failure to stay on topic.

Nobody said a thing about wikileaks until you started yapping about it. Wake up, Bert. We're talking the NY Slimes, not Assange.

Quote
And as for objective news media, there's no argument that objective news media is bad. And a tip: Your argument stemmed directly from an analogy without any positive matter to enforce it. At least, the analogy was far too unrelated to your point.

Anyways, isn't it the medias responsibility to point out when our government is involved in questionable practices?

WTF are you talking about? Since when is OBJECTIVE news media "bad?"

You are in no position to give me a "tip" on anything, Bert. It didn't take long for my bullshit detector to detect bullshit. Once you put the crack pipe down and sober up, you'll realize just how much of a dumbass you're appearing to be.

And when the NY Slimes and the LA Slimes start determining what "questionable practices" are, we're all in trouble -- which is exactly my point. Both newspapers are overwhelmingly liberal in scope and flavor and their editorial process is therefore tainted in that direction.

And btw - classified information is just that - classified.

When you sober up, tell me how long you've worked in or for the government and when that approximates my time in that regard, we can talk further. Until then, pound sand up your ass, Bert buddy.

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Offline Eupher

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Re: Why Socialism Always Results in Tyrannical Rule
« Reply #42 on: February 18, 2011, 04:05:56 PM »
I believe Eupher was refering to the leaks the New York Times was solely responsible for on the Treasury Dept. monitoring of Al-Qaeda's international money transfers that had led to the capture of wanted Al-Qaeda planner and financier Hambali. You might want to educate yourself on that incident a bit further before coming up with a rebuttal.

Thanks, Odin,  but the NY Slimes is responsible for a shitload of leaks -- not just those you cited. But those will do for our illustration with our latest dumbass.

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Offline Eupher

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Re: Why Socialism Always Results in Tyrannical Rule
« Reply #43 on: February 18, 2011, 04:06:57 PM »
So the times ****ed up. That's doesn't nullify justification for there existence.

Can you give me a link for that though? I can't find one that talks about the times. It will be useful when arguing against wikileaks in the general sense.

Keep looking, Bert buddy. I'm not going to do your research for you.

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Offline Eupher

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Re: Why Socialism Always Results in Tyrannical Rule
« Reply #44 on: February 18, 2011, 04:10:55 PM »
It's my sleep deprivation that's leading to my errors. I attend Cape Cod Community Lollege.
As far a community colleges go, it's on the better side. We get all the professors that used to teach at other institutions that then came to the Cape to retire, then decided that without spreading their knowledge their lives were meaningless.

Nappy time for the youngster. And those "professors" that you're citing? They're all liberal moonbats feeding their bullshit straight down your gullet. You might want to belch before you continue - otherwise you'll explode from the gas.

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Offline CG6468

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Re: A MUST READ: Why Socialism Always Results in Tyrannical Rule
« Reply #45 on: February 18, 2011, 07:38:44 PM »
It appears that someone needs to spend more time learning spelling and grammar so an intelligent statement can be posted. No one "sites" anything here; some may "cite" things, however.

Now where is that "IGNORE" button?
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Offline Bertram

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Re: A MUST READ: Why Socialism Always Results in Tyrannical Rule
« Reply #46 on: February 20, 2011, 03:13:55 PM »
As for Wikileaks relationship with the times. I don't like this one bit.
The reason the Washington Post didn't get to put out the cables, and the Times did is because the Post printed something about Jillian that Wikileaks didn't like....
Obviously the Times does not want to be in that position, so it's being held hostage, so to speak, into printing only good thinks about Mr. Assange.
Shaddy....

Offline FreeBorn

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Re: Why Socialism Always Results in Tyrannical Rule
« Reply #47 on: February 20, 2011, 06:25:39 PM »
Ergo the high cost of socialism.
:thatsright: A flock of missed epiphanies wantonly winging about this thread in abundance :huh?:


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Offline Hella Jeff

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Re: A MUST READ: Why Socialism Always Results in Tyrannical Rule
« Reply #48 on: June 10, 2011, 03:40:43 PM »
Quote
The basic tenants of socialism are:
1. Seduce the populace into accepting the government as the arbitrator of all problems; government from cradle-to-grave
2. Begin delivering on those services to make the citizens dependent
3. Take away the citizens' guns
4. Increase taxes on all services while destroying any free market alternative services
5. Blame the chosen scapegoat for the inability to meet demand for services
6. Have the centralized national police force round up any dissidents

You know there are enough things wrong with socialism that you dont need to make up stuff to discredit it. None of these things except mabye 4 have much to do with socialism. I dont even know how you got 3.
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Offline Wineslob

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Re: A MUST READ: Why Socialism Always Results in Tyrannical Rule
« Reply #49 on: June 10, 2011, 04:03:14 PM »
You know there are enough things wrong with socialism that you dont need to make up stuff to discredit it. None of these things except mabye 4 have much to do with socialism. I dont even know how you got 3.


Point out where ANY of the tenants are wrong, and why.
“The national budget must be balanced. The public debt must be reduced; the arrogance of the authorities must be moderated and controlled. Payments to foreign governments must be reduced, if the nation doesn't want to go bankrupt. People must again learn to work, instead of living on public assistance.”

        -- Marcus Tullius Cicero, 55 BC (106-43 BC)

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