Author Topic: which one is worse?  (Read 2531 times)

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Offline franksolich

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which one is worse?
« on: April 11, 2017, 06:52:57 PM »
I'll get the professional medical opinion on this some time late tomorrow (Wednesday) afternoon, but for now, I'm curious.

Which one is the worse ordeal--having cardiac stents installed or having a cardiac valve replaced?

There's no argument about what's going to be done--the latter, as there's no need for stents, the arteries being about as wide open as the Holland Tunnel, no obstructions.  Obviously, cholesterol has never been a problem.

But from watching other people, I have an idea of what an operation for stents does.....but no idea whatsoever of what an operation for a valve does.

Opinions kindly solicited.  Thank you!

Offline FunkyZero

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Re: which one is worse?
« Reply #1 on: April 11, 2017, 07:36:20 PM »
Hi Frank,
I wish I could give you useful info, but I can't.
My mom had stint put in a few years back and really all I know about it is that it took her a while to recover... mostly she was weak and ordered to rest.
Outside of that, I know virtually nothing about it.

Offline Skul

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Re: which one is worse?
« Reply #2 on: April 11, 2017, 09:04:19 PM »
I'm guessing you're referring to the aortic valve.
Lots of info out there.
Here's one.

https://medlineplus.gov/ency/article/007407.htm
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Offline franksolich

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Re: which one is worse?
« Reply #3 on: April 12, 2017, 12:53:01 AM »
I'm guessing you're referring to the aortic valve.
Lots of info out there.
Here's one.

https://medlineplus.gov/ency/article/007407.htm

Thank you, sir; because of the linked articles, now I know what questions to ask.

However, it doesn't look good to me, what with both sorts of valve replacement surgery requiring 4-7 days in a hospital.  I'd just as soon it be done outpatient, myself back here the same day, but we all know that's not going to fly. 

I have a lifelong track-record--recorded too--of quick, almost instant, recoveries (mostly because I follow medical instructions thoroughly and diligently), but I still doubt they'd let me out of it. It's a good thing I haven't committed myself yet, this long hospital stay being a major obstacle.

I'll keep an open mind during the appointment Wednesday early afternoon, and I'm glad I got all the possible bad news up front.  It's better than getting it right then and there.


Offline Bad Dog

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Re: which one is worse?
« Reply #4 on: April 12, 2017, 01:09:31 AM »
Had a good friend who had a valve job about 20 years ago.  They used mechanical valves at the time which involved blood thinners for the rest of his life.  Pain in the ass because he had to give up woodworking.  The good news was that he said he felt 20 years younger.  Long story short, they lasted over 18 years before they had to be replaced with pig valves which are more durable.  When he complained that the earlier doctors said the valves were guaranteed for life, the surgeon said that they probably didn't expect him to live this long.

Offline franksolich

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Re: which one is worse?
« Reply #5 on: April 12, 2017, 05:39:59 AM »
Had a good friend who had a valve job about 20 years ago.  They used mechanical valves at the time which involved blood thinners for the rest of his life.  Pain in the ass because he had to give up woodworking.  The good news was that he said he felt 20 years younger.  Long story short, they lasted over 18 years before they had to be replaced with pig valves which are more durable.  When he complained that the earlier doctors said the valves were guaranteed for life, the surgeon said that they probably didn't expect him to live this long.

Thank you--and to think I almost waited until the appointment later today to get all this bad news dumped on my lap.  In which case my reaction would be less favorable than it is at present, given the abruptness of learning it.

Anyway.  I already know what's going to happen.  I don't like it, I don't want anything to do with this week-long hospital stay; I don't want to mess with it, and besides, the cats here will get all upset and bent out of shape if I'm gone that long.

I've voted straight Republican all my life, but there's still some primitivity in me.

So I'm going to bitch and moan and whine and gripe and carry on and grouse until the primitivity's excreted out of me.  After which I'm going to do as I'm told, diligently and thoroughly if not enthusiastically.

It happens every time, the effects of having been a younger child in a large family; I'm used to not getting things my way.  So even before it starts, I already know how it's going to end.

Offline FunkyZero

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Re: which one is worse?
« Reply #6 on: April 12, 2017, 06:47:42 AM »
Thank you--and to think I almost waited until the appointment later today to get all this bad news dumped on my lap.  In which case my reaction would be less favorable than it is at present, given the abruptness of learning it.

Anyway.  I already know what's going to happen.  I don't like it, I don't want anything to do with this week-long hospital stay; I don't want to mess with it, and besides, the cats here will get all upset and bent out of shape if I'm gone that long.

I've voted straight Republican all my life, but there's still some primitivity in me.

So I'm going to bitch and moan and whine and gripe and carry on and grouse until the primitivity's excreted out of me.  After which I'm going to do as I'm told, diligently and thoroughly if not enthusiastically.

It happens every time, the effects of having been a younger child in a large family; I'm used to not getting things my way.  So even before it starts, I already know how it's going to end.

Well, I predict it's going to end well, Frank.
They've gotten pretty dang good at this stuff.
I know that doesn't make it any easier to stay in the hospital for a week, nut when you look back in a year, you'll be glad you got it over with.
Best of luck to you, my friend.

Offline SVPete

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Re: which one is worse?
« Reply #7 on: April 12, 2017, 07:28:30 AM »
I had angioplasty and 2 stents installed nearly 15 years ago. Don't really remember any effects from it. My doc has kept me on an anti-platelet med, which means I bleed a little more when cut or scraped and cannot donate platelets (i.e. whole blood only).
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Offline freedumb2003b

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Re: which one is worse?
« Reply #8 on: April 12, 2017, 07:57:42 AM »
I'll get the professional medical opinion on this some time late tomorrow (Wednesday) afternoon, but for now, I'm curious.

Which one is the worse ordeal--having cardiac stents installed or having a cardiac valve replaced?

There's no argument about what's going to be done--the latter, as there's no need for stents, the arteries being about as wide open as the Holland Tunnel, no obstructions.  Obviously, cholesterol has never been a problem.

But from watching other people, I have an idea of what an operation for stents does.....but no idea whatsoever of what an operation for a valve does.

Opinions kindly solicited.  Thank you!

Stents are pretty easy to have installed and manage.  I have 4 of them.  After an initial year or so of Plavix (which makes you a hemophiliac) that is it. 

You stay awake for the entire procedure.  I was in the hospital 2 days and then out with really no restrictions.

Get the stents.
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Offline franksolich

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Re: which one is worse?
« Reply #9 on: April 12, 2017, 09:02:39 AM »
Get the stents.

Don't need stents; the arteries are wide open, no blockage, no obstructing.

I just mentioned placement of stents as compared with replacement of a mitral valve because I know what stents are (but never had one, never seen one), but had no idea as to artificial valves.

I was truly surprised about the arteries, given my age and that I'd chained-smoked for 37 years, up until two years ago.  I vaguely recalled no physician had ever, at any time, mentioned I might have a problem with high cholesterol, and on the read-outs, the numbers were always well within the healthy range (for cholesterol, both the "bad" and the "good").

But surely given all those years and other not-good things, I should have arteries with some build-up on the inside.  But nope.

I credit this to a lifetime of avoiding dining on grease, and a diet predominantly (but not exclusively, of course) dairy and eggs and white-meat poultry.  I dine on well-done beef and pork, but not fish, never fish, when eating out (fish of course is healthy, but I just don't care for it).   And lots and lots of fiber and roughage so as to roto-rooter out the digestive system.

The sheer exhaustion's due to that while the blood can flow freely, the heart can't really pump it very good.  And thus the suggestion about replacing the valve.

Offline franksolich

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Re: which one is worse?
« Reply #10 on: April 12, 2017, 06:54:24 PM »
Okay, so things happened as I thought they would.

I yelled and screamed and stormed and raged about how being away from home for "five to seven days" wouldn't work, and so I'd need to be released earlier.  I might as well have been talking to a rock.

So after I said my piece, we got down to brass tacks.  I go in for surgery at 5:15 a.m. this coming Monday, shortly after which there will be a "mitral valve replacement and myotomy."  After the surgery, it's expected I'll have to be in intensive care for a day, and then a regular hospital room for the next four to six days.

The replacement valve will be something made from a dead cow, meaning I won't have to use drugs.

Since there are no complicating factors, this apparently is going to be a quick and easy job.

But there are of course risks.  If mischance happens to me and franksolich is no longer of this time and place, I've asked the county sheriff to contact dutch508 on the other side of the Sandhills, after which it'd be nice if he'd put up an obituary.....in the restricted Sandhills forum.

Offline dutch508

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Re: which one is worse?
« Reply #11 on: April 12, 2017, 08:22:07 PM »
Quote
If mischance happens to me and franksolich is no longer of this time and place, I've asked the county sheriff to contact dutch508 on the other side of the Sandhills, after which it'd be nice if he'd put up an obituary.....in the restricted Sandhills forum.

yup.

We'll have a small wake, of course.


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Offline franksolich

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Re: which one is worse?
« Reply #12 on: April 12, 2017, 08:32:09 PM »
yup.

We'll have a small wake, of course.

Of course it's going to be okay, especially considering there's no other sorts of vulnerabilities to watch for.  Just a non-working heart valve, everything else, all parts of the body, in good working order.

It'll be nice to get my energy back.

Offline freedumb2003b

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Re: which one is worse?
« Reply #13 on: April 12, 2017, 08:42:25 PM »
yup.

We'll have a small wake, of course.

Tasteful.  Nothing melancholy or over-dramatic.
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Offline dutch508

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Re: which one is worse?
« Reply #14 on: April 12, 2017, 08:52:37 PM »
Tasteful.  Nothing melancholy or over-dramatic.

of course...

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Offline Bad Dog

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Re: which one is worse?
« Reply #15 on: April 12, 2017, 11:57:20 PM »
Frank, I didn't know they only had to replace one valve.  My friend had three replaced.  Quit bitchin about the hospital stay, this is major surgery and they want to give those stiches time to stabilize. You are lucky to be getting the newer valves, my friend made clicking noises for twenty years.

Offline franksolich

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Re: which one is worse?
« Reply #16 on: April 13, 2017, 06:30:44 AM »
Frank, I didn't know they only had to replace one valve.  My friend had three replaced.  Quit bitchin about the hospital stay, this is major surgery and they want to give those stiches time to stabilize. You are lucky to be getting the newer valves, my friend made clicking noises for twenty years.

I wasn't aware body parts that make noises were ever put into people; not the slightest idea.

I had a choice of surgeons; by oddest of coincidences, I selected the one born in the same town I'd been born, and both of us the same age, less than a year separating us.  His father knew my father way back when, and my father knew his father.

I'd selected him because he's an advocate of "minimally invasive surgery" and minimal use of pharmaceuticals; probably the second point would cost him the primitives' business.  I think medical treatment (and automotive repairs) should be like my politics, cautious and conservative.

This morning, Friday morning, I go in for some sort of "pre-admission testing" at the hospital; I have no idea what that involves, but based upon scraps and fragments of information I "got," apparently it's about anesthesia.

<<<never had problems with anesthesia because always followed orders and instructions.

<<<finds best way to avoid problems is by following orders and instructions.

Offline franksolich

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Re: which one is worse?
« Reply #17 on: April 14, 2017, 05:29:30 AM »
Well, yesterday, Thursday, I got an idea of why medical bills are so high.

(I got my days confused; I'd thought yesterday was Friday, when it was in fact Thursday.)

I'd thought a pre-operation examination would be where one is advised to not dine on anything at least twelve hours before being put under, and if an extended stay in the hospital--as this will be--one's told what personal things to bring with him.

Uh, no.  The thing lasted nearly four hours.

There was an ultra-sound done of the neck.  And then there was a test to measure the effectiveness of one's breathing.  Then there was a long interview with a registered nurse during which time one discussed one's medical history--geezuz, to think I'd taken all the time and trouble to already have carefully outlined all this, just the other day--after which x-rays were made of the chest and lungs.  And then a piss test.  And then blood samples--the fourth time the past five days--were taken. 

Of course, all this is to minimize risk, but to be honest, I'd just as soon put up with a little bit more risk than spend a whole morning on all this; I have better things to do.

It was commented I have no diet- or food-related health issues, to which I credited my attitude about food.  Unlike primitives, I don't see dining as a means of some sort of emotional or ego gratification; I see it as merely putting more gasoline into the tank of an automobile, to keep it going. 

For the life of me, I just can't fathom dining simply for some sort of "joy" of it.  And the less time one spends on it, the more time one has for more-productive endeavors.

What this also means is that the diet, the food intake, has been pretty much always the same thing the past several years, several decades; always the same, with only occasional minor deviations.

My people were from Pennsylvania, and all the older brothers and sisters born and raised in New York, while my younger brother and I were products of Nebraska.  As such, he and I grew up on a daily diet heavy in Danish tastes, as that was the predominant influence in those parts of Nebraska where we were. 

The parents and the older brothers and sisters grew up on, well, whatever people eat in Pennsylvania and New York, which obviously isn't Danish.

The other members of the family grew to be of only average heights, while he and I grew taller, and probably healthier.  This despite that I never touched dead fish; I know it's healthy and all that, but it makes me shudder.  But everything else they're all eating over in Jutland or in Copenhagen, I grew up eating, and still eat.

Well, I'm just killing time until Monday morning, when I finally go under the knife.  Unlike Bill the Bostonian Drunkard, who can't "live" without being constantly wired to various means of communication, I won't be posting on the internet from there.  And the television will remain dark.  I'm going to concentrate instead on getting better as quickly as possible, so I can return home as quickly as possible.

Offline JLO

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Re: which one is worse?
« Reply #18 on: April 15, 2017, 10:36:55 AM »
"I'm going to concentrate instead on getting better as quickly as possible, so I can return home as quickly as possible."

We'll all be thinking of you Frank.  Prayers sent for you and best wishes for a very speedy recovery!

Hurry back. 
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Offline franksolich

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Re: which one is worse?
« Reply #19 on: April 16, 2017, 07:00:21 AM »
Okay, it’s Sunday morning, and only twenty hours before I go under the knife, but as closing up things here takes a lot of time, I’ll write this now and be off.....until we all meet again, either in this life or the next.

The earliest possible release date from the hospital is this next Friday, and since I don’t bother taking the internet with me when going somewhere, unless something untoward happens, this is the last one will hear from franksolich until then. 

On the other hand, if something untoward does happen, I’m sure the sheriff here will solemnly inform dutch508, who will then inform all decent and civilized people in the Sandhills forum, which of course is closed off from lurking primitives and others with malicious natures, who wouldn’t need to know.

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

Since the operation involves some risk, I steadied my nerves for it by watching the greatest movie ever made, La Revolution francaise from 1989; this was about the twentieth time I’ve watched this particular movie, and it never gets old.
 
Of course, current events, in whch the Old Order, the Man, the Establishment, is being laboriously overturned, gives it a new meaning.  After more than forty years of running things, it’s long past time the old hippies—Democrats, liberals, primitives—went to the chopping block, having long outlived their uselessness.

Last week, when undergoing a couple of cardiological examinations (actually, there were seven, total, undergone last week)—one where something is jammed down the throat to get back behind the heart, the other a catherterization—anesthesia was given me, putting me in a slumbersome state.

During which time, according to the attending nurse, it appears I mumbled Allons enfants de la Patrie, Le jour de gloire est arrivé!, which of course is from La Marseillaise, the national anthem of France; I’d watched the six-hour series from 2002, Napoleon, the day before, which was perhaps the inspiration for that.

And so I won’t be surprised at all when going under the gas some hours hence, I’ll mumble things like Liberté d'égalité fraternité pour tous sauf a l'exception des sauvages (Liberty, equality, fraternity to all but the primitives) or Pas de travail, pas de pain; mort de parasites, la richesse de ceux qui travaillent (No work, no bread; death to parasites, all wealth only to those who toil.)

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

The only thing that bothers me is that my literary masterpiece about being an Innocent in the socialist paradises of the workers and peasants remains unfinished.  It’s about as long as War and Peace now, the idea being than an editor would cut out about 90% of it, pre-publication.

I used to write it on the internet, but abandoned that when I decided there’s a big difference between commenting on the internet, and typing something in black ink on white paper.  That happened after the heart attack two years ago, and I discarded the internet-written stuff and started anew.

I’ve been crafting a literary masterwork; it’s totally different from anything by franksolich that’s been on the internet.  On the internet, it takes me no time at all to sloppily dash off something circa 800-1000 words long; here, I’ve been lucky if I could get that much written in a whole day.

I’m pretty confident however God is going to give franksolich enough time to finish it.

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

Farewell all, until we meet again.....

I sought God, and God heard me, and delivered me from all my fears.

Offline thundley4

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Re: which one is worse?
« Reply #20 on: April 24, 2017, 10:07:54 PM »
Still no word from Frank?  :(

Offline FunkyZero

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Re: which one is worse?
« Reply #21 on: April 25, 2017, 11:42:54 PM »
Haven't heard a word...
I  think he was supposed to be home Friday if all went as planned.
Hopefully they just decided to keep him a few extra days for benign reasons.
Let us know when you you are up and around Frank, lots of people here praying for your quick recovery!

Offline dutch508

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Re: which one is worse?
« Reply #22 on: April 25, 2017, 11:48:25 PM »
Haven't heard a word...
I  think he was supposed to be home Friday if all went as planned.
Hopefully they just decided to keep him a few extra days for benign reasons.
Let us know when you you are up and around Frank, lots of people here praying for your quick recovery!

I've not gotten a phone call and if something bad would have happened I would have, so...

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