Poll question: What is the purpose of incarceration?

[Servonaut]

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x3559452

Man these people are freaking stupid.

hedgehog  (1000+ posts)      Thu Jul-03-08 12:39 PM
Original message
Poll question: What is the purpose of incarceration?
 Do we imprison people to punish them , rehabilitate them, protect ourselves from them, deter crime or some combination?

IMO, criminals are not deterred by prison because no one ever expects to get caught.


So, the purpose of prison is:
Poll result (39 votes) 
Punishment and deterrence  (3 votes, 8%) Vote
Rehab and societal protection  (3 votes, 8%) Vote
Punishment only  (4 votes, 10%) Vote
Societel protection only  (7 votes, 18%) Vote
Rehab only  (0 votes, 0%) Vote
Deterrence only  (0 votes, 0%) Vote
Punishment, deterrence, rehab and protection  (17 votes, 44%) Vote
Other  (5 votes, 13%) Vote

 

ixion  (1000+ posts)       Thu Jul-03-08 12:42 PM
Response to Original message
1. in 99 percent of the cases, it's money and power/control
 IMO

tridim  (1000+ posts)       Thu Jul-03-08 12:43 PM
Response to Original message
2. Depends on the crime
 In many cases (especially Cannabis related) the purpose of prison is for the prison to make a bigger profit.

qazplm (1000+ posts)      Thu Jul-03-08 12:49 PM
Response to Original message
3. I dont know about all that
 many people expect to be caught, thus why they dont do it.

The principles behind imprisonment are rehab, specific deterrence, general deterrence, punishment, and retribution or protection for society depending on what model you use.

We don't get rehab very well at all obviously

. 

NCevilDUer  (1000+ posts)      Thu Jul-03-08 01:39 PM
Response to Reply #3
12. Small point to take with that -
 those people who are deterred are not, by definition, criminals. We only incarcerate criminals (supposedly).

The deterrence factor is in knowing that there IS a consequence - whether prison or whatever - and non-criminals take that into account. Criminals do not, so it is a true statement that criminals are not deterred - because if they were deterred they would not be criminals.
 

 

WTF ? 

grasswire  (1000+ posts)      Thu Jul-03-08 12:57 PM
Response to Original message
6. follow the money
 First, you need to differentiate between violent and non-violent offenders. I think everyone agrees that the purpose of incarcerating violent offenders is to protect society. Whether the sentencing is just and/or commensurate is another topic.

There's no doubt that the purpose of incarcerating most non-violent offenders is to make money for the vendors who make custody possible, and for the state itself in some circumstances where they hire out prison labor.

The prison-industrial complex is an enormous industry. From architectural services to food services to uniform manufacturers to telecoms to all other kinds of purveyors, the profiteering off the backs of misery is rampant. The trend toward stiffer, mandatory sentencing was profit driven.

Everyone knows that African Americans are disproportionately imprisoned. It's a new kind of slavery, where money is made off holding them in custody, breaking up their families, denying them the vote, humiliating and degrading them.

But that's yet another topic.

 

More racist crap.

Gato Moteado  (1000+ posts)      Thu Jul-03-08 12:58 PM
Response to Original message
7. the purpose of incarceration is to fuel the prison industrial complex.....
 ...that said, i am certainly in favor of incarceration in many cases. anyone that has committed a violent crime against a victim or victims should be incarcerated. murderers and rapists and child molesters should be incarcerated indefinitely. anyone that commits a crime against a victim, while in possession of a weapon, should get life. i'm not in favor of this incarceration as a punishment but rather as a way to ensure that these dangerous people are kept away from endangering a free and peaceful society.

non-violent criminals, like those guilty of theft or destruction of property should not do jail time but rather should be put on work programs where their salary is garnished to pay back the victims.

victimless crimes, like prostitution and drug use, should be removed completely from the law books.

 





 

[Chris_]

Gato Moteado  (1000+ posts)      Thu Jul-03-08 12:58 PM
Response to Original message
7. the purpose of incarceration is to fuel the prison industrial complex.....
 ...that said, i am certainly in favor of incarceration in many cases. anyone that has committed a violent crime against a victim or victims should be incarcerated. murderers and rapists and child molesters should be incarcerated indefinitely. anyone that commits a crime against a victim, while in possession of a weapon, should get life. i'm not in favor of this incarceration as a punishment but rather as a way to ensure that these dangerous people are kept away from endangering a free and peaceful society.

non-violent criminals, like those guilty of theft or destruction of property should not do jail time but rather should be put on work programs where their salary is garnished to pay back the victims.

victimless crimes, like prostitution and drug use, should be removed completely from the law books.

Tell Spitzer's wife and kids that they weren't victims of his spending $86,000 on one whore.  Go ahead, I dare you.

[Bondai]

Everyone knows that African Americans are disproportionately imprisoned. It's a new kind of slavery, where money is made off holding them in custody, breaking up their families, denying them the vote, humiliating and degrading them.

Liberal playbook, page 62.Don't do the crime if you can't do the time.

[jtyangel]

Gato Moteado  (1000+ posts)      Thu Jul-03-08 12:58 PM
Response to Original message
7. the purpose of incarceration is to fuel the prison industrial complex.....
 ...that said, i am certainly in favor of incarceration in many cases. anyone that has committed a violent crime against a victim or victims should be incarcerated. murderers and rapists and child molesters should be incarcerated indefinitely. anyone that commits a crime against a victim, while in possession of a weapon, should get life. i'm not in favor of this incarceration as a punishment but rather as a way to ensure that these dangerous people are kept away from endangering a free and peaceful society.

non-violent criminals, like those guilty of theft or destruction of property should not do jail time but rather should be put on work programs where their salary is garnished to pay back the victims.

victimless crimes, like prostitution and drug use, should be removed completely from the law books.

Tell Spitzer's wife and kids that they weren't victims of his spending $86,000 on one whore.  Go ahead, I dare you.

All immoral acts, illegal or not, create victims so in a sense you are right. The point in it though is we have behavior that we characterize as criminal in this country and that behavior, when engaged in, comes with LEGAL consequences, if not moral ones. The DUmmies seek to mitigate the consequences in their defense of the underdog whether the underdog deserves their defense or not. You are arguing moral consequences as are the DUmmies. Legal consequences don't always jive with moral ones. Moral consequences are best left to, in your example, Spitzer's wife, children, and his immediate community. I can understand the emotionality with moral consequences, I however will never understand how dummies wrap themselves up in pretzels to alleviate the consequences that come from breaking a law. What is their point of doing so? They ask why people are incarcerated for certain things and I would ask them why should someone not be punished when they break the law? *shrug*

[dandi]

Everyone knows that African Americans are disproportionately imprisoned. It's a new kind of slavery, where money is made off holding them in custody, breaking up their families, denying them the vote, humiliating and degrading them.

I don't suppose the criminal acts themselves have anything to do with "breaking up their families" or being "humiliated and degraded"?

Gato Moteado  (1000+ posts)      Thu Jul-03-08 12:58 PM
Response to Original message
7. the purpose of incarceration is to fuel the prison industrial complex.....

Well now, I'm all for taking the corporate profit motive out of prison: Start making them simple affairs of brick and iron again, no a/c, no TV, no DVD libraries, no Nautilus equipment. If inmates want to "work out" they can volunteer for some kind of manual labor around the prison or on a road crew. No expensive contracting for touchy-feely motivational programs. All able-bodied inmates must work to make the prison self-sustaining, including growing and raising food. Have a simple library for those who wish to read and basic job skills classes in areas where people actually create things like carpentry, masonry, welding, upholstery, auto repair, etc. Only those with good behavior get to participate.

Yep, get rid of the "prison-industrial complex". Be careful what you wish for, DUmmies. 
 

[Lord Undies]

Everyone knows that African Americans are disproportionately imprisoned. It's a new kind of slavery, where money is made off holding them in custody, breaking up their families, denying them the vote, humiliating and degrading them.

Hmmm.  Sounds a lot like the Clarence Thomas confirmation hearings.

[Tantal]

I don't care WHY we do it.....so long as it keeps those asshats away from MY place.

[djones520]

IMO, criminals are not deterred by prison because no one ever expects to get caught.

So I bet if someone asked this guy "Why won't you rob a bank?", his first response without hesitation would be "because it's not fair for me to steal other peoples hard earned money".   

Straight bullshit.  The fear of going to jail is a huge deterrent.  I bet if we did away with our prison system, our crime rate would sky rocket ten fold.

[BlueStateSaint]

IMO, criminals are not deterred by prison because no one ever expects to get caught.

So I bet if someone asked this guy "Why won't you rob a bank?", his first response without hesitation would be "because it's not fair for me to steal other peoples hard earned money".   

Straight bullshit.  The fear of going to jail is a huge deterrent.  I bet if we did away with our prison system, our crime rate would sky rocket ten fold.

And, to go the other way, if the Heller decision had allowed all law-abiding Americans the ability to carry concealed wherever they went, the crime rate would plumment.

[Servonaut]

G_j (1000+ posts)      Thu Jul-03-08 04:21 PM
Response to Original message
15. to feed the prison industrial complex,
 incarcerate minorities, and create more criminals.

nosmokes  (1000+ posts)       Thu Jul-03-08 04:26 PM
Response to Original message
16. Other: to get working age black males out of the workforce and
 ensure that the black community as a whole doesn't become a viable and integral part of American society.

Man I hate this victimhood Crap.

I'm a minority and I've never been to prison.  In my younger days I was arrested a couple
of times, but I didn't blame anyone but myself.  I had a choice in what I was gonna do on any given
evening and a couple a times I chose poorly. But it wasn't the cops, or the Man, or racism that
put me in those situations, it was me.  You DUmbasses need to grow up.
       

[djones520]

G_j (1000+ posts)      Thu Jul-03-08 04:21 PM
Response to Original message
15. to feed the prison industrial complex,
 incarcerate minorities, and create more criminals.

nosmokes  (1000+ posts)       Thu Jul-03-08 04:26 PM
Response to Original message
16. Other: to get working age black males out of the workforce and
 ensure that the black community as a whole doesn't become a viable and integral part of American society.

Man I hate this victimhood Crap.

I'm a minority and I've never been to prison.  In my younger days I was arrested a couple
of times, but I didn't blame anyone but myself.  I had a choice in what I was gonna do on any given
evening and a couple a times I chose poorly. But it wasn't the cops, or the Man, or racism that
put me in those situations, it was me.  You DUmbasses need to grow up.
       

Shush you!  How dare you take responsibility for your actions!