Primitive has some Tough Questions

[Karin]

This isn't particularly entertaining, but it is telling; so I brought it over for a look-see. 

Mon Nov 19, 2012, 05:42 PM
argiel1234 (390 posts)

Question about the ACA

Would people who qualify for Medicaid, but their state refuses to expand it; would they still be required to buy private insurance?

I cant afford up to 8% of my income. Im under the poverty level right now and I could never find 8% of my meager pay to buy private insurance. I will also not be able to pay the tax (up to 2.5% eventually). I would literally have to cut out my transportation costs, and/or food or a utility bill every month to cover the difference.

This has been bothering me for some time now as I realize many states will simply refuse to expand their Medicaid programs.

Somebody tries to blow sunshine up her ass, but she keeps asking questions.

argiel1234 (390 posts)
2. thanks, but this doesnt answer my question

Medicaid is administered through the states and many(mine included) will not expand Medicaid even if we are eligible. Will we still be forced to buy insurance or pay the penalty even though we qualify for medicaid but wont receive it due to states refusing to expand the program?

argiel1234 (390 posts)
6. that doesnt answer if we will be required to pay the tax/fine/whatever people call it.

Ultimately it will be 2.5% of peoples income.

I dont see anything addressed in there for people who qualify for Medicaid but their state refuses to expand it.

Would we be exempt from both the requirement to buy private insurance AND the tax? Since we qualify for Medicaid, why should we be forced to pay the tax is states refuse to expand?

Also its what is actually what is happening. Many states are refusing to expand the Medicaid program outright

Same guy continues to spin at her...

argiel1234 (390 posts)
9. my income is 10,800 roughly, that puts me in the category of poverty

but still required to buy insurance or pay the tax, even though Im eligible for Medicaid

Im seeing a huge hole in this law thats going to ensnare millions of people who are eligible for medicaid but states refuse to enroll them. They would still be required to buy insurance(up to 8% of their income) or pay 2.5% tax and STILL not have insurance.

PoliticAverse (4,394 posts)
8. Since the op is below the federal poverty level the op's premium won't be subsidized.

The ACA intended such people would be covered by Medicaid but since the Supreme Court overturned
the all-or-nothing requirement for states to participate in the ACA Medicaid expansion people below the FPL
will simply be left without any coverage 

What a fabulous law!

Response to riderinthestorm (Reply #10)
Mon Nov 19, 2012, 06:37 PM
argiel1234 (390 posts)
13. thank you for the response

say someone makes $15,000 a year, which by any measure is close to poverty. They are going to be required by law to either pay 2.5% of their income in a new tax and STILL not have health insurance, OR pay up to 8% of their income to buy private insurance with high co-pays and high deductibles that they might not even be able to afford to use.

Im sorry but this is beginning to anger me.

argiel1234 (390 posts)
22. yes that is the whole point. Thank you for clarifying this

Im now upset about this as this law was not thought out very well at all, especially considering leaving it up to governors and the SC was always going to play out.


This WILL anger many millions of people who live paycheck to paycheck and will either be hit with a new 2.5% regressive tax increase or pay for garbage insurance.
 

argiel1234 (390 posts)
12. ...
Someone making 12k a year does not have 2.5% or 8% of their income to piss away.

This law needs to be amended or many millions are going to be very very angry when they realize how ****ed they are.

DUmp Link

And in the inimitable words of Wasp,

 

[Bad Dog]

These ungrateful schlubs need to realize Obumbles "cares" about them.  That's all they should ever need.

[jukin]

This got me to thinking how smart it is to refuse the cACA insurance exchanges. It will force millions of leftist parasites (BIRM) to flee states where hard working and prosperous Americans are thriving to the blue state hell holes that are going bankrupt.

This whole Cloward-Piven thing just might backfire on the leftist looters and moochers.

[JohnnyReb]

I heard a "News Teaser" for the local 5 o'clock TV news.......N.C. nursing homes are about to throw all the Medicaid patients out due to cuts in what Obama is paying to keep them......or something like that.....I wasn't home to see the TV news at 5.

[franksolich]

I heard a "News Teaser" for the local 5 o'clock TV news.......N.C. nursing homes are about to throw all the Medicaid patients out due to cuts in what Obama is paying to keep them......or something like that.....I wasn't home to see the TV news at 5.

If by chance you get more info on that, please put it in wasp69's excellent "you own it" thread here, because I suspect this is going to be a big issue.  Like around after the new year.

[Freeper]

If only someone would have warned them about this.... Oh wait we did.

[formerlurker]

Expanding Medicaid = more people on welfare = super-super-majority in Congress.

It's the progressive way kids.

[Delmar]

 

[Rebel]

argiel1234 (390 posts)

13. thank you for the response

say someone makes $15,000 a year, which by any measure is close to poverty. They are going to be required by law to either pay 2.5% of their income in a new tax and STILL not have health insurance, OR pay up to 8% of their income to buy private insurance with high co-pays and high deductibles that they might not even be able to afford to use.

Im sorry but this is beginning to anger me.

I guess your politicians should have read the damn bill before they passed it then. DUmbass. We warned you clowns.

[Texacon]

I guess your politicians should have read the damn bill before they passed it then. DUmbass. We warned you clowns.

In defense of the politicians ... they couldn't do that.  I heard somewhere, I can't remember where, that they have to PASS bills before they are allowed to read them and find out what's in them.  

I know it sounds insane but there it is from a credible source.  I can't remember who said it but I'll bet Nadine could tell you if you asked her.  She probably did a story on it.

KC

[Gina]

These ungrateful schlubs need to realize Obumbles "cares" about them.  That's all they should ever need.

Wait til the WON doesn't take care of the fiscal cliff and those that usually get money back at tax time will owe $1400-$1500.  That should be interesting.

[Undies]

Anyone making $10,000 - $15,000 a year is NOT going to pay a damn dime to the federal government in taxes or penalties or whatever.  If fact, those folks will make money on the deal.  The DUmmie OP is pissing air about nothing.

[Karin]

But nobody knows, Undies, exactly how this is supposed to work without the exchanges or expansions in Medicaid. 

Look at our dumb electorate.  This is too complicated for the people who wrote the damn thing.  As it is, when it first passed, people were showing up at doctors offices wanting freeeeeeee healthcare on immediate demand. 

[wasp69]

argiel1234 (390 posts)

I cant afford up to 8% of my income. Im under the poverty level right now and I could never find 8% of my meager pay to buy private insurance. I will also not be able to pay the tax (up to 2.5% eventually). I would literally have to cut out my transportation costs, and/or food or a utility bill every month to cover the difference.

This has been bothering me for some time now

Ultimately it will be 2.5% of peoples income.

I dont see anything addressed in there for people who qualify for Medicaid but their state refuses to expand it.

Would we be exempt from both the requirement to buy private insurance AND the tax?

Im seeing a huge hole in this law thats going to ensnare millions of people who are eligible for medicaid but states refuse to enroll them. They would still be required to buy insurance(up to 8% of their income) or pay 2.5% tax and STILL not have insurance.

PoliticAverse (4,394 posts)
8. Since the op is below the federal poverty level the op's premium won't be subsidized.

The ACA intended such people would be covered by Medicaid but since the Supreme Court overturned the all-or-nothing requirement for states to participate in the ACA Medicaid expansion people below the FPL will simply be left without any coverage 

say someone makes $15,000 a year, which by any measure is close to poverty. They are going to be required by law to either pay 2.5% of their income in a new tax and STILL not have health insurance, OR pay up to 8% of their income to buy private insurance with high co-pays and high deductibles that they might not even be able to afford to use.

Im sorry but this is beginning to anger me.

Im now upset about this as this law was not thought out very well at all, especially considering leaving it up to governors and the SC was always going to play out.

This WILL anger many millions of people who live paycheck to paycheck and will either be hit with a new 2.5% regressive tax increase or pay for garbage insurance.
 
Someone making 12k a year does not have 2.5% or 8% of their income to piss away.

This law needs to be amended or many millions are going to be very very angry when they realize how ****ed they are.

This, my friends, is why I was not angry at Chief Justice John Roberts.  Better to have the very leeches that begged for this crap to scream for it to be gotten rid of than be used as a propaganda piece for all eternity. 

Roberts understood the obamacare law very well and (I believe) set it up so that Congress holds the key to its survival or death.  He knows what is coming and knows the moochtards will be the ones screaming the loudest for it to be "fixed".  Putting it back in the hands of Congress allows the Republican controlled House to offer the bullet to the democrats to kill the broken legged horse. 

Interesting, isn't it?  Obama, the master 8D chess player, has set himself up for a smothered mate.  What better way for a legacy to be written - have the egomaniac sign the document that overturns his own crowing achievement.

We here at the Cave know that people are going to have to suffer some real pain before they wake up.  The pain is coming, it is coming and those who wanted it are going to beg for it to be taken away.

[wasp69]

And in the inimitable words of Wasp,

 

Posted a quick blurb and link back here to your thread.   

[Carl]

But nobody knows, Undies, exactly how this is supposed to work without the exchanges or expansions in Medicaid. 

Look at our dumb electorate.  This is too complicated for the people who wrote the damn thing.  As it is, when it first passed, people were showing up at doctors offices wanting freeeeeeee healthcare on immediate demand. 

I suspect it will be like the EIC,you will get some form of monetary support from the gov regardless of taxes not owed to buy a private policy.
There are a million devils in that detail though.

How to ensure insurance not dope is purchased,what is the price person A pays as opposed to person B due to locality,what is the coverage etc?

This is a nightmare beyond description and just like what is shaping up for our economy not in the least bit an accident IMO.
They want people crushed to their knees and desperate so the hoped response is to make government the sole provider in their lives.

[SSG Snuggle Bunny]

We here at the Cave know that people are going to have to suffer some real pain before they wake up.  The pain is coming, it is coming and those who wanted it are going to beg for it to be taken away.

The only people who truly crave freedom are slaves. They will run, in the dead of night without promise of shelter, clothing or even their next meal.

So be it.

[dixierose]

I currently pay 17.00 or so per week for insurance thru Waffle House. There is a notice posted that starting January 1st, 2014 that insurance plan will no longer be offered because it will be illegal (as a low payment option) under Obamacare. If we want to continue getting insurance thru WH, we have to buy a more expensive policy. If we don't do that, we can pay the fine or use an "exchange". The state of GA has declined to set up an exchange. So WTH am I supposed to do? How the HELL is Obamacare helping ME? I don't understand why some people think this is the "best thing EVER". It sucks...

[Bad Dog]

I currently pay 17.00 or so per week for insurance thru Waffle House. There is a notice posted that starting January 1st, 2014 that insurance plan will no longer be offered because it will be illegal (as a low payment option) under Obamacare. If we want to continue getting insurance thru WH, we have to buy a more expensive policy. If we don't do that, we can pay the fine or use an "exchange". The state of GA has declined to set up an exchange. So WTH am I supposed to do? How the HELL is Obamacare helping ME? I don't understand why some people think this is the "best thing EVER". It sucks...

You are unfortunately what San Frn Nan referred to as a "freeloader".  You must by the more expensive policy so the insurance company can subsidize the unemployed 'victims" of the Republicn economy.

[Freeper]

You are unfortunately what San Frn Nan referred to as a "freeloader".  You must by the more expensive policy so the insurance company can subsidize the unemployed 'victims" of the Republicn economy.

Am I evil for hoping that Nancy gets so plastered that she passes out and chokes on her own vomit?

[Undies]

Am I evil for hoping that Nancy gets so plastered that she passes out and chokes on her own vomit?

Then she would be a legend like Jimi Hendrix.

[dandi]

Am I evil for hoping that Nancy gets so plastered that she passes out and chokes on her own vomit?

More likely she'll get so much Botox shot into her head it freezes her gag reflex and the same thing happens.

[Duke Nukum]

This law needs to be amended or many millions are going to be very very angry when they realize how ****ed they are.

DUmmie Angienumbers, we warned you nearly three years ago. You failed to listen. You will always fail to listen. You are a DUmmie.

F' you all.

0wn it!

[Freeper]

DUmmie Angienumbers, we warned you nearly three years ago. You failed to listen. You will always fail to listen. You are a DUmmie.

F' you all.

0wn it!

That's what gets me, they howled just as loud as we did over 0bamacare, for different reasons, yet during the election it was all of a sudden the best thing ever.
 

[Karin]

Yes, and they were such sheep about it, too.  I think it was a marketing decision.  Paint Obamacare with sunshine and roses, be proud of it, and see how many people buy that.

Here is another related thread. 

Tue Nov 20, 2012, 11:10 PM
 Flying Squirrel (407 posts)

I went to the walk-in clinic with chest pain yesterday
When they found out I was uninsured, they agreed to check me out - but I had to make a $108 down payment. Who knows how much the entire visit will cost. So basically, I had a choice: Go to the ER, where there would be no down payment but the cost of the visit would probably be much higher, or pay a $108 down payment to get checked out at the clinic.

I paid the $108.

Can't wait for Obamacare to catch up to me... or better still, the public option.

It's not free, you idiot.  And there is no public option. 

flamingdem (20,890 posts)
1. I agree and really want to know the details

because I'm not sure that I can celebrate yet, I'm hoping to reduce my premiums mostly, and my deductible is ridiculous.

Later on, a reply:

Response to Flying Squirrel (Original post)
Wed Nov 21, 2012, 08:23 AM
bvar22 (27,797 posts)
23. What exactly do you expect ObamaCare to do for you?

"There will be four different categories of plans available on the exchange: bronze, silver, gold and platinum (as well as a catastrophic plan available mostly to young adults). The benefits of the four plan types will be similar; all will cover a package of comprehensive “essential health benefits” yet to be determined by the secretary of Health and Human Services. What will vary is a family’s cost-sharing responsibility for each of the plan types. Someone in a bronze plan can expect it to cover 60 percent of average medical costs in the plan, for example, while someone in a silver plan can expect 70 percent of plan costs to be covered, and so on."

http://prescriptions.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/06/08/why-would-i-sign-up-for-a-bronze-plan/




"For a bronze plan, the insurance would cover 60 percent of all health care costs for an average person. Enrollees, on average, would be responsible for paying 40 percent of the costs."

http://101.communitycatalyst.org/aca_provisions/coverage_tiers



If I am hospitalized for a heart attack,
it won't really matter if I have to pay 40% or 100%, the outcome is the same.
They will STILL take everything I own and have worked for my whole life.

bvar22 (27,797 posts)
30. You are fortunate in that you have access to and can afford a HSA in addition to Health Insurance.

Millions can not, especially the unemployed over 50.
Mandated "Bronze" Insurance won't really help them either,
though many don't realize that in addition to the cost of their premiums and deductibles,
they will also be responsible for 40% of the actual Medical Costs.

My Wife & I (over 55, self-unemployed, no insurance, but own property and have some assets) are positioned to benefit from the Medicaid Expansion since the means testing portion is supposed to be dropped,
but the Medicaid Expansion is under attack.
The Supreme Court has Struck Down the original Mandatory State Participation, and changed it to Optional State Participation.
I have a creepy feeling Means Testing for eligibility will also be resurrected before 2014,
and returned to If you own anything you don't qualify.

I don't think that 2014 will go over well,
especially when those millions (40 - 70 Million projected uninsured by 2014) try to convert their "ObamaCare" "Bronze" Insurance into actual Health Care.

There are going to be a bunch of angry Americans, and ALL the Republicans have to do is say,
"Yep! We voted against it."  

DUmp Link