Shooting At Family Research Council Office In DC

[Lacarnut]

If you look to please the most people, you will have to give up many if not all of your principles. If you have no principles, morals, ethics, it makes it a lot more simple to please a majority of people.

I am not looking at this line of thought as a popularity item. I believe what I believe regardless of whether it is popular or not. Gay marriage will never be approved by me. I have my own moral standards. Homosexuality is an abomination and you can not put lipstick on this pig.

I hope this POS gets the max. sentence.

[JohnnyReb]

It's all politics...we've gotten by without homosexual marriages for thousands of years. It's just been recently that the democrats decided that things were so bad for them that they needed to poke the hornets nest and catch a few in their big tent voter base. They'll pull a Hitler with the queers once they get their socialist utopia. How many new workers do queers produce?

[Northern_Tory]

It's all politics...we've gotten by without homosexual marriages for thousands of years. It's just been recently that the democrats decided that things were so bad for them that they needed to poke the hornets nest and catch a few in their big tent voter base. They'll pull a Hitler with the queers once they get their socialist utopia. How many new workers do queers produce?

What do you mean by "pull a Hitler with the queers"? I'd imagine that a more accepting society would improve the lives of homosexuals, as they wouldn't be so discriminated against, thus more productive in the workplace.

[obumazombie]

What do you mean by "pull a Hitler with the queers"? I'd imagine that a more accepting society would improve the lives of homosexuals, as they wouldn't be so discriminated against, thus more productive in the workplace.

You are so naive. Hitler marked the gays with the same mark as the jews. He wanted to eradicate them from his reich, just like militant islam aka the religion of peace.

[Northern_Tory]

You are so naive. Hitler marked the gays with the same mark as the jews. He wanted to eradicate them from his reich, just like militant islam aka the religion of peace.

I'm well aware of that, I thought you meant that JohnnyReb was implying that Obama would be highly authoritarian in support of gay rights, stomping out opposition by force. I'm not naive, nor am I ignorant, I just wasn't sure what he meant.

[obumazombie]

I'm well aware of that, I thought you meant that JohnnyReb was implying that Obama would be highly authoritarian in support of gay rights, stomping out opposition by force. I'm not naive, nor am I ignorant, I just wasn't sure what he meant.

I suspect you are at least somewhat on this issue.
Quote from Northern_Tory...
"I'd imagine that a more accepting society would improve the lives of homosexuals, as they wouldn't be so discriminated against, thus more productive in the workplace."
This (US) is an accepting society. From what I have seen, it is the most. Gays are not "so discriminated against". if anything they are an illegitimate affirmative action receiving group. Gays are already very productive, as they represent purchasing power out of proportion to their population.

As for JohnneyReb, I wouldn't pretend to speak for him, but if you look at how socialists have handled gays, they are used initially by the comrades as useful idiots, and then are the first to be eliminated once the commune has solidified sufficiently.

[Northern_Tory]

I suspect you are at least somewhat on this issue.
Quote from Northern_Tory...
"I'd imagine that a more accepting society would improve the lives of homosexuals, as they wouldn't be so discriminated against, thus more productive in the workplace."
This (US) is an accepting society. From what I have seen, it is the most. Gays are not "so discriminated against". if anything they are an illegitimate affirmative action receiving group. Gays are already very productive, as they represent purchasing power out of proportion to their population.

As for JohnneyReb, I wouldn't pretend to speak for him, but if you look at how socialists have handled gays, they are used initially by the comrades as useful idiots, and then are the first to be eliminated once the commune has solidified sufficiently.

I see where you're coming from, I believe the Soviet Union is a good example of that. Obama is at worst a social-democrat, I highly doubt he wants to eliminate gay people from the US.

[JohnnyReb]

Ernst Rohm and most of the SA(brownshirts) leadership were flaming homosexuals. During the 1920's until the mid 1930's, Germany was a homosexuals delight. When they were no longer useful they were killed during "The Night of the Long Knives".

...and does the folowing sound like anyone we know?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ernst_R%C3%B6hm

This group took the words "Sozialistische" and "Arbeiter" ("worker") in the party's name literally. They largely rejected capitalism (which they associated with Jews) and pushed for nationalisation of major industrial firms, expanded worker control, confiscation and redistribution of the estates of the old aristocracy and social equality. Röhm spoke of a "second revolution" against "reactionaries" (the National Socialist label for old-line conservatives),

[Eupher]

What do you mean by "pull a Hitler with the queers"? I'd imagine that a more accepting society would improve the lives of homosexuals, as they wouldn't be so discriminated against, thus more productive in the workplace.

It boils down to fascism and the methodical process by which fascists (to wit, the flavor of the Big Fascist occupying the White House at the moment) historically have handled the populace:

1.  Disarm them.
2.  Rule by diktat, thereby increasing government's power at the expense of individual freedom and liberty.
3.  Employ wealth redistribution, thereby ensuring that the fascists in control continue to get the votes from those who are getting freebies from the producers/taxpayers.
4.  Dispose of the useful idiots that have propelled the fascists into office by whatever means necessary. The powerful shall rule. The weak shall die.

[Northern_Tory]

Ernst Rohm and most of the SA(brownshirts) leadership were flaming homosexuals. During the 1920's until the mid 1930's, Germany was a homosexuals delight. When they were no longer useful they were killed during "The Night of the Long Knives".

...and does the folowing sound like anyone we know?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ernst_R%C3%B6hm

This group took the words "Sozialistische" and "Arbeiter" ("worker") in the party's name literally. They largely rejected capitalism (which they associated with Jews) and pushed for nationalisation of major industrial firms, expanded worker control, confiscation and redistribution of the estates of the old aristocracy and social equality. Röhm spoke of a "second revolution" against "reactionaries" (the National Socialist label for old-line conservatives),

The Nazi party was increadibly anti-socialist, as seen by the anti-union and anti-Communist tendencies of the party. The Nazi party isn't a very good example in regards to contemporary social democracy, which pretty much every major left wing party subscribes to has little to nothing in common with the Nazi Party when it comes to social policies. What about when it is through right-wing parties that same-sex marriage is pushed forward, as seen in Portugal and Sweden and the attempts to legalised same-sex marriage within the UK?

[Eupher]

The Nazi party was increadibly anti-socialist, as seen by the anti-union and anti-Communist tendencies of the party. The Nazi party isn't a very good example in regards to contemporary social democracy, which pretty much every major left wing party subscribes to has little to nothing in common with the Nazi Party when it comes to social policies. What about when it is through right-wing parties that same-sex marriage is pushed forward, as seen in Portugal and Sweden and the attempts to legalised same-sex marriage within the UK?

I lived in Europe almost 15 years and I can tell you the Europeans have had a lot of time to develop socialism to levels we can't even imagine.

Yet.

[obumazombie]

I lived in Europe almost 15 years and I can tell you the Europeans have had a lot of time to develop socialism to levels we can't even imagine.

Yet.

owebuma has promised that he will transform the US into a european style socialist state.

By the way, Nazi Germany had many facets of socialism, and as such is an excellent example of it, along with Russia, and communist China, among others.

[Northern_Tory]

I lived in Europe almost 15 years and I can tell you the Europeans have had a lot of time to develop socialism to levels we can't even imagine.

Yet.

Where in Europe out of interest?

European social democracy may not be economically sound, but it isn't going to call for the eradication of gays any time soon. The thing about socialism is that it is a very broad church ideologically, on one extreme you've got Orthodox Marxist who want total state control and the opposite would be social democrats who support a market based economy.

[Eupher]

Where in Europe out of interest?

European social democracy may not be economically sound, but it isn't going to call for the eradication of gays any time soon. The thing about socialism is that it is a very broad church ideologically, on one extreme you've got Orthodox Marxist who want total state control and the opposite would be social democrats who support a market based economy.

Germany, but I've traveled extensively throughout.

Inasmuch as the Germans traditionally have to form a coalition of political parties to get anything done, you're right. And on the subject of gays (which seems to be your favorite issue), even the Germans and their CDU can't get it together on that particular part of the issue except this one:

Germany has permitted civil unions between same-sex couples since 2001, but hasn't lifted its ban on gay marriage.

It's too divisive an issue, evidently. If the fudgepackers and rugmunchers are already getting their gubmint handouts, what's the problem?

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10000872396390444900304577579343144054000.html

[obumazombie]

Where in Europe out of interest?

European social democracy may not be economically sound, but it isn't going to call for the eradication of gays any time soon. The thing about socialism is that it is a very broad church ideologically, on one extreme you've got Orthodox Marxist who want total state control and the opposite would be social democrats who support a market based economy.

Social democrats don't support market based economies. They support government centered and managed economies.

[Northern_Tory]

Social democrats don't support market based economies. They support government centered and managed economies.

Yes they do, in countries with social-democratic governments, they have market economies, the government just has too much control for my liking.

@Eupher: Gays really aren't my favourite issue.

[docstew]

Yes they do, in countries with social-democratic governments, they have market economies, the government just has too much control for my liking.

@Eupher: Gays really aren't my favourite issue.

But you contradict yourself. Market economies aren't government controlled, aside from basic contract laws and the like.

[Northern_Tory]

But you contradict yourself. Market economies aren't government controlled, aside from basic contract laws and the like.

Not really, there's a difference between a free-market economy, a mixed economy and a command economy. The US would fall under free-market, whereas much of Europe would fall under the category of a mixed economy, social democrats embrace capitalism under some form, they're nothing like orthodox Marxists who want an entirely state ran economy.

[docstew]

One could argue that, as you call them, mixed economies are merely those economies that the state hasn't successfully nationalized yet.

[Northern_Tory]

One could argue that, as you call them, mixed economies are merely those economies that the state hasn't successfully nationalized yet.

I'd disagree, as social-democratic parties in Europe have for the most part steadily moved towards the political centre since the 1980's, Britain's Labour party being an example of that. Seeing as Blair didn't reverse the privatisation utilities and other previously nationalised industries.

It seems that we've gone off on a tangent.

[obumazombie]

I'd disagree, as social-democratic parties in Europe have for the most part steadily moved towards the political centre since the 1980's, Britain's Labour party being an example of that. Seeing as Blair didn't reverse the privatisation utilities and other previously nationalised industries.

It seems that we've gone off on a tangent.

That you started.

[Northern_Tory]

That you started.

I wasn't the one who used the Nazi regime as an example of socialism in government.

[Chris_]

DC shooter wanted to kill as many as possible, prosecutors say

After years of thinking it over, Floyd Corkins finally had a plan.

He'd bought a gun and learned how to use it. He'd loaded three magazines. And he had stopped by Chick-fil-A to pick up 15 sandwiches, which he planned to smear in the dying faces of staffers he expected to kill at the Family Research Council in Washington.

It would be a statement, he said, "against the people who work in that building," according to documents filed in U.S. District Court, where Corkins pleaded guilty on Wednesday to three charges related to the August shooting at the conservative policy group.

The charges carry sentences of up to 70 years in prison. However, the sentence could be shorter because Corkins has no prior criminal record.

CNN

How is this not a hate crime?  Why should he receive any leniency?

[thundley4]

CNN

How is this not a hate crime?  Why should he receive any leniency?

Some are saying that he picked this target because of the SPLC putting the group on their "Hate Group" list.

[Chris_]

Some are saying that he picked this target because of the SPLC putting the group on their "Hate Group" list.

If that's true, I hope a family member sues the SPLC out of existence.  They're nothing more than muckrakers.