Author Topic: Kentuck's faulty memories (to the tune of moonbats, all alone with the moonbats)  (Read 1089 times)

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Offline zeitgeist

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Ever see a kid trying to be cute?

How about Kentuck trying to seem intelligent, deep even?

This is a small but toasty bonfire at moment so I dragged the entire thing back over. 
 


http://upload.democraticunderground.com/1002917813

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kentuck (62,151 posts)
 
Where is my memory faulty?

 As I recall, in January 2001, when George W Bush was sworn into office, we had a balanced budget and we had no deficit. No deficit at all. In fact, we had a surplus. And we were expected to pay off the entire national debt by 2011. Last year.
 
But, as I recall, Bush said that was the people's money, not the government's money. So he gave it all away, mostly to his wealthy buddies. Even Greenspan said a surplus was maybe not good for our long range economy.
 
So they spent all the surplus and the future surplus and still spent another $5.5 trillion on top of that. After they drove us deeply into debt, a terrible catastrophe struck us. The housing bubble burst. The banks were near collapse. They had to be saved. Bush and Paulson were in a panic and came out and said that we needed $700 billion by the next Friday in order to save the entire frigging capitalist system. This was in the last 3 or 4 months of the Bush Administration.
 
Enter Barack Obama. He was handed a deficit of $1.2 trillion dollars the minute he stepped thru the door. The Stock market dropping like a rock. People losing their life savings. Banks refusing to lend, even after they got the handout from the government, us. And on top of all that, we were losing 750,000 jobs per month!
 
And now, these weasly Republican amnesiacs criticize Obama and the Democrats for not creating more jobs and not bringing the deficit down quicker. The economy should be doing much better, they say. And they want to return us to those same policies and good old days of supply side economics. Is America insane? Where is my memory wrong?




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The Magistrate (78,028 posts)

1. Nowhere, Sir: You Are Quite Accurate, And Many Americans Have Come Un-Moored From Reality


"Republicans are people, too --- mean, ignorant selfish, and deluded people."
 

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Response to kentuck (Original post)

Sun Jul 8, 2012, 04:36 PM

 spanone (64,816 posts)

2. your memory is intact. i have no idea how they are getting away with this.


that this election is remotely close is mind-boggling.

they have erased the george w. bu$h* years completely from the dialogue. it's ****ing impressive.
 

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Response to kentuck (Original post)

Sun Jul 8, 2012, 04:44 PM

 RKP5637 (19,814 posts)

3. You, as always, are quite correct! What I see is the democrats seem to

have difficulty framing arguments in their favor.

I don't know where the problem lies, maybe republican negative messaging just sticks better, but somehow democrats, at least IMO, do not frame arguments and wins so they stick in the minds of the populace. Well, and for some of the populace it just never will.
 
It well might be that the majority of radio/tv/religion seems so damn negative IMO. Maybe good things just do not stand a chance of standing up to the 7x24 negativity.
 


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Response to kentuck (Original post)

Sun Jul 8, 2012, 04:48 PM

 sad sally (2,252 posts)

4. Everything you're remembering is correct, and am guessing I'll be criticized for bringing up

Robert Reich's comments a couple of days ago:

"In Ohio yesterday, Obama reiterated that he had inherited the worst economy since the Great Depression. That's true. But the excuse is wearing thin. It's his economy now, and most voters don't care what he inherited."
 
As Will Rogers said, "The short memories of Americans are what keeps our politicians in office."
 
The majority of people seem to respond to what their life is like today - yesterday and tomorrow be damned.
 

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Response to kentuck (Original post)

Sun Jul 8, 2012, 04:55 PM

 Spitfire of ATJ (703 posts)

5. Rule #1 with Conservatives: Never admit you are wrong


They say their policies WILL work. It's just that they've never EVER had them put in place yet mostly due to Democrats but also because of Rinos in their own party.
 
So to save America ALL vestiges of Liberal and Progressive policies MUST be purged.
 
This is why they don't like Romney. He's only PRETENDING to be a Conservative. They want a cross between Rush, Hannity and Glen Beck with a dash of Palin's folksiness but not her gender. Then they want to see that "Great Man" in their mind do what they would do. Stand before a joint session of congress and read off a list of names of traitors to America and those members will be taken out one at a time to be publicly executed by firing squad.
 
Anything short of that is a disappointment.
 

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Response to kentuck (Original post)

Sun Jul 8, 2012, 05:02 PM

 Tennessee Gal (4,764 posts)

6. You are entirely accurate and correct!


Perhaps I am wrong, but it is my opinion that a nation in debt does not have a surplus or extra tax income. Whatever "surplus" there is should always be applied to the national debt, thus reducing interest on the debt. Had that been the path followed, this nation would be a lot better off right now.
 
Perhaps too simplistic, but that is the way I see it.
 

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Response to kentuck (Original post)

Sun Jul 8, 2012, 05:06 PM

 Booster (9,148 posts)

7. I don't understand why NOBODY (either side) ever complained about the following:

What baffles me is that the day before 9/11, the Pentagon "lost" 2.3 trillion (TRILLION) dollars; just can't account for it. Then between 2004 & 2007 the Pentagon can't account for 9.1 billion (BILLION) that was to be used to rebuild Iraq, and nobody batted an eye. Politicians said it wasn't watched closely and was "pilfered" from wherever they were holding the cash - CASH. How long would it take someone to notice that 9.1 BILLION DOLLARS WAS MISSING??????????????????? The attitude was "shit happens", yet they get their panties in a wad when health care is mentioned. Anybody but me have a problem with this? It seems to me that if you add these 2 losses together, it would probably equal the surplus that was left to Bush.
 

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Response to Booster (Reply #7)

Sun Jul 8, 2012, 05:12 PM

 kentuck (62,151 posts)

8. I remember the $9 billion that was lost in Iraq but...

..I don't recall the $2.3 trillion lost by the Pentagon?

In Iraq, they shipped the money there on pallets, in the belly of the c-130's. So they "lost" a few pallets...
 
And what happened to that ranch Bush bought down in Paraquay??



Now that this is posted outside the doors of the asylum would anyone here care to explain to Kentuck where he is wrong??


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Offline Crazy Horse

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I see nothing wrong in his op.  Maybe you could enlighten us as to what is wrong.
You got off your ass, now get your wife off her back.

Offline JohnnyReb

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I see nothing wrong in his op.  Maybe you could enlighten us as to what is wrong.

It's all over my head...BUT...I read that the Clinton balanced budget and surplus was all obtained by using kindergarden accounting principles and crayons. Save a few billion here and add it in there as income....count it twice thereby doubling the effect.

...and most everyone has bought the Clinton Kool-aid.
“The American people will never knowingly adopt socialism. But, under the name of ‘liberalism’, they will adopt every fragment of the socialist program, until one day America will be a socialist nation, without knowing how it happened.” - Norman Thomas, U.S. Socialist Party presidential candidate 1940, 1944 and 1948

"America is like a healthy body and its resistance is threefold: its patriotism, its morality, and its spiritual life. If we can undermine these three areas, America will collapse from within."  Stalin

Offline zeitgeist

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I see nothing wrong in his op.  Maybe you could enlighten us as to what is wrong.

How about we start with this analysis from The Economist:

http://www.economist.com/blogs/democracyinamerica/2011/07/deficits

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There never was a surplus

Jul 27th 2011, 13:59 by M.S.

..

YESTERDAY the White House published a chart that explains how we got from the Clinton administration projection that the government would pay off its entire debt and then build up $2.3 trillion in savings by 2011, to the $10.4 trillion in debt we actually wound up with. Of that $12.7 trillion shift, the Bush tax cuts account for $3 trillion. James Fallows explains: "As the figures demonstrated, the Bush-era tax cuts, extended last year under Obama, were the biggest single policy source of deficit increase over the past ten years. Therefore you can be for reducing deficits, or you can be for preserving the tax cuts, but you cannot rationally be for both."
{snip}




Then maybe take a look at this link:

http://www.craigsteiner.us/articles/16/

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The Myth of the Clinton Surplus    October 31st, 2007

The government can have a surplus even if it has trillions in debt, but it cannot have a surplus if that debt increased every year. This article is about surplus/deficit, not the debt. However, it analyzes the debt to prove there wasn't a surplus under Clinton.

For those that want a more detailed explanation of why a claimed $236 billion surplus resulted in the national debt increasing by $18 billion, please read this follow-up article.



Time and time again, anyone reading the mainstream news or reading articles on the Internet will read the claim that President Clinton not only balanced the budget, but had a surplus. This is then used as an argument to further highlight the fiscal irresponsibility of the federal government under the Bush administration.

The claim is generally made that Clinton had a surplus of $69 billion in FY1998, $123 billion in FY1999 and $230 billion in FY2000 . In that same link, Clinton claimed that the national debt had been reduced by $360 billion in the last three years, presumably FY1998, FY1999, and FY2000--though, interestingly, $360 billion is not the sum of the alleged surpluses of the three years in question ($69B + $123B + $230B = $422B, not $360B).

While not defending the increase of the federal debt under President Bush, it's curious to see Clinton's record promoted as having generated a surplus. It never happened. There was never a surplus and the facts support that position. In fact, far from a $360 billion reduction in the national debt in FY1998-FY2000, there was an increase of $281 billion.

Verifying this is as simple as accessing the U.S. Treasury (see note about this link below) website where the national debt is updated daily and a history of the debt since January 1993 can be obtained. Considering the government's fiscal year ends on the last day of September each year, and considering Clinton's budget proposal in 1993 took effect in October 1993 and concluded September 1994 (FY1994), here's the national debt at the end of each year of Clinton Budgets:
{snip}


Of course there was also the cost resulting from 9/11

I like this link to the NY Times for the graphics:

http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2011/09/08/us/sept-11-reckoning/cost-graphic.html

Of course Kentuck would probably call the expense of war unnecessary.


Then too one has to realize what happened in 2006 when the Democratix took over.  I seem to note an absence of that in Kentuck's post along with the constant talking down of the economy by folk like Chuck U Shumer D NY who may actually have fired the first round in what was to be a bank run on INDY MAC.

http://www.housingwire.com/news/indymac-mini-bank-run-thanks-schumer

 :popcorn:
« Last Edit: July 08, 2012, 05:43:23 PM by zeitgeist »
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Offline Crazy Horse

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Sorry there was a surplus destroyed by the tea party type of folks. If the federal reserve was gone we would be doing better. Hopefully at the convention we will get the nominee
You got off your ass, now get your wife off her back.

Offline zeitgeist

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Sorry there was a surplus destroyed by the tea party type of folks. If the federal reserve was gone we would be doing better. Hopefully at the convention we will get the nominee

Interesting position.  Would you care to explain and document how you arrive at it?


http://meetthefacts.com/2010/07/22/fact-check-sen-bob-menendez-national-debt-increased-72-percent-during-the-bush-admin-there-was-a-1-5-trillion-budget-deficit-at-the-end-of-his-term/

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The following is a fact-check from the July 18, 2010 episode of Meet the Press.
 





SEN. BOB MENENDEZ (D-NJ)
 
1) Over the course of the Bush[43] administration there was a 72% increase in the national debt, from $5.7 trillion to $9.8 trillion – MOSTLY TRUE
 
2) At the end of the Bush [43] administration, the U.S. had a $1.5 trillion budget deficit - TRUE
 

SEN. MENENDEZ: And it’s not just talking about President Bush, it’s the policies that they espouse that are in essence Bush’s policies. Those led us to a 72 percent increase in the debt from $5.7 trillion to $9.8 trillion when Bush left. It led us to a massive elimination of the surplus that Bill Clinton gave George Bush, and he had a $1.5 trillion deficit when he left office
 
1) According to the Treasury Department, when George W. Bush took office in 2001 the national debt was $5.73 trillion and when Bush left office in 2009, the national debt had increased to $10.63 trillion. That’s a 85% increase of $4.9 trillion. Sen. Menendez is off by 13%, but he is correct in the underlying message that the national debt did significantly increase under George W. Bush. Thus, we rate Sen. Menendez’s statement MOSTLY TRUE.
 
2) According to the Congressional Budget Office, under former president Bill Clinton there was a budget surplus in 1999 ($1.9 billion) and in 2000 ($86.4 billion). But the surpluses in 1999 and 2000 were not enough to eliminate the national debt. When the federal government spends more money than it takes in, that’s a deficit. When the government takes in more money than it spends, that’s a surplus (Treasury Department budget FAQs). Though former president Bill Clinton had two consecutive surplus years, the U.S. national debt actually increased $400 billion over his term (1992 to 2000).
 
When former president Bill Clinton left office in 2000 there was a $86.4 billion surplus. When former president George W. Bush left office in 2008 there was a $1.5 trillion budget deficit. Because Sen. Menendez was correct in stating that there was a $1.5 trillion budget deficit when George W. Bush left office and the budget surplus that Bill Clinton left from his presidency had turned into a deficit, we rate Sen. Menendez’s statement TRUE.
 



Special thanks to crowd-sourcer Shelley for assisting with this fact-check.

And how about a trip to the remember when lounge with this moldy oldie (all the Andy threads got me melencolic)

http://articles.cnn.com/2001-04-10/politics/bush.budget.01_1_bush-budget-education-budget-spending-priorities?_s=PM:ALLPOLITICS

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Democrats: Bush budget 'dead before arrival'
 April 10, 2001


Congressional Democrats are already predicting the demise of President Bush's first federal budget proposal, saying his $1.96 trillion request for fiscal 2002 will scare off enough moderate Republicans to make it a legislative failure.

The White House sent the budget to Congress Monday in the form of bound, multi-volume copies.

Some Democrats predicted the president's drive to cut many popular environmental and health programs would cause angst for some GOP members of Congress worried about their next election.

"This may be the first budget in history that wasn't just dead on arrival -- it was dead before arrival," said Senate Minority Leader Tom Daschle, D-South Dakota, after he had had some time to digest the budget's contents.

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Offline Crazy Horse

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Again, take out boosh and we would be sitting very well. He caused all of this due to his wars for oil.
You got off your ass, now get your wife off her back.

Offline zeitgeist

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Again, take out boosh and we would be sitting very well. He caused all of this due to his wars for oil.

Well of course how silly of me not to see that.


http://nooilforpacifists.blogspot.com/2010/03/iraq-war-spending-isnt-issue.html


I have to leave for a spell (I am turning my neighbor into a Ronulan or Socialist I forget).  :whatever:  You will have to entertain yourself while I am gone. :cheersmate:
« Last Edit: July 08, 2012, 07:11:43 PM by zeitgeist »
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Offline USA4ME

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Quote from:
Spitfire of ATJ

5. Rule #1 with Conservatives: Never admit you are wrong

They say their policies WILL work. It's just that they've never EVER had them put in place yet mostly due to Democrats but also because of Rinos in their own party.

I see some primitive listens to what Rush Limbaugh has said for the past 24 years about Democrats and liberals.

.
Because third world peasant labor is a good thing.

Offline Freeper

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Again, take out boosh and we would be sitting very well. He caused all of this due to his wars for oil.

Yep it's all that evil Bush's fault, he screwed up so bad that not even the bestest preezy ever couldn't fix it in 4 years.  :mental:
I may not lock my doors while sitting at a red light and a black man is near, but I sure as hell grab on tight to my wallet when any democrats are close by.

Offline Crazy Horse

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Yep it's all that evil Bush's fault, he screwed up so bad that not even the bestest preezy ever couldn't fix it in 4 years.  :mental:

Quit being some damn racist
You got off your ass, now get your wife off her back.

Offline Bad Dog

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Quit being some damn racist

If you say this sort of thing without a sarc icon, people might think you are an asshole. You are not an asshole are you?

 :???:

Offline Freeper

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If you say this sort of thing without a sarc icon, people might think you are an asshole. You are not an asshole are you?

 :???:

Yes he is an asshole, and he was being sarcastic.  :tongue:

I may not lock my doors while sitting at a red light and a black man is near, but I sure as hell grab on tight to my wallet when any democrats are close by.

Offline JohnnyReb

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Yep it's all that evil Bush's fault, he screwed up so bad that not even the bestest preezy ever couldn't fix it in 4 years.  :mental:

Oh, I think RR could....he fixed Jimmahs mess in 2.

“The American people will never knowingly adopt socialism. But, under the name of ‘liberalism’, they will adopt every fragment of the socialist program, until one day America will be a socialist nation, without knowing how it happened.” - Norman Thomas, U.S. Socialist Party presidential candidate 1940, 1944 and 1948

"America is like a healthy body and its resistance is threefold: its patriotism, its morality, and its spiritual life. If we can undermine these three areas, America will collapse from within."  Stalin

Offline Freeper

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Oh, I think RR could....he fixed Jimmahs mess in 2.

No, it was Carter who fixed it, Reagan ruined the country.
I may not lock my doors while sitting at a red light and a black man is near, but I sure as hell grab on tight to my wallet when any democrats are close by.

Offline Chris_

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No, it was Carter who fixed it, Reagan ruined the country.


Recovery Summer!

Oh, wait... that was two years ago.  What is it this year?
If you want to worship an orange pile of garbage with a reckless disregard for everything, get on down to Arbys & try our loaded curly fries.

Offline Freeper

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Recovery Summer!

Oh, wait... that was two years ago.  What is it this year?

It's all Bush's fault!!!!!!11111
I may not lock my doors while sitting at a red light and a black man is near, but I sure as hell grab on tight to my wallet when any democrats are close by.

Offline JohnnyReb

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No, it was Carter who fixed it, Reagan ruined the country.

Well excuuuuse me.

 :lmao: :lmao: :lmao:


“The American people will never knowingly adopt socialism. But, under the name of ‘liberalism’, they will adopt every fragment of the socialist program, until one day America will be a socialist nation, without knowing how it happened.” - Norman Thomas, U.S. Socialist Party presidential candidate 1940, 1944 and 1948

"America is like a healthy body and its resistance is threefold: its patriotism, its morality, and its spiritual life. If we can undermine these three areas, America will collapse from within."  Stalin

Offline Freeper

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Well excuuuuse me.

 :lmao: :lmao: :lmao:

I know all the DUmmy talking points.
I may not lock my doors while sitting at a red light and a black man is near, but I sure as hell grab on tight to my wallet when any democrats are close by.

Offline Crazy Horse

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If you say this sort of thing without a sarc icon, people might think you are an asshole. You are not an asshole are you?

 :???:

I'm an asshole, and as Freeper said I was being sarcastic.
You got off your ass, now get your wife off her back.

Offline Bad Dog

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I'm an asshole, and as Freeper said I was being sarcastic.

Check.