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Offline BannedFromDU

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The idiots just want to smoke dope, period. That's it.
« on: September 02, 2011, 10:54:08 AM »
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LongTomH Donating Member (1000+ posts)  Journal Click to send private message to this author Click to view this author's profile Click to add this author to your buddy list Click to add this author to your Ignore list    Thu Sep-01-11 04:43 PM
Original message
Generation Limbo: Young 20-something graduates waiting for real careers to begin
   
Edited on Thu Sep-01-11 04:43 PM by LongTomH
There's a scary article in the NY Times: Recent College Graduates Wait for Their Real Careers to Begin. The writer, Jennifer Lee, profiles several young, recent grads working way below their levels.

And so they wait: for the economy to turn, for good jobs to materialize, for their lucky break. Some do so bitterly, frustrated that their well-mapped careers have gone astray. Others do so anxiously, wondering how they are going to pay their rent, their school loans, their living expenses — sometimes resorting to once-unthinkable government handouts.

“We did everything we were supposed to,” said Stephanie Morales, 23, who graduated from Dartmouth College in 2009 with hopes of working in the arts. Instead she ended up waiting tables at a Chart House restaurant in Weehawken, N.J., earning $2.17 an hour plus tips, to pay off her student loans. “What was the point of working so hard for 22 years if there was nothing out there?” said Ms. Morales, who is now a paralegal and plans on attending law school.

Some of Ms. Morales’s classmates have found themselves on welfare. “You don’t expect someone who just spent four years in Ivy League schools to be on food stamps,” said Ms. Morales, who estimates that a half-dozen of her friends are on the Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program. A few are even helping younger graduates figure out how to apply. “We are passing on these traditions on how to work in the adult world as working poor,” Ms. Morales said.

The young lady interviewed contrasted her situation with her older sister who was able to find a well-paying job shortly after graduation.

By comparison, Ms. Klein said her classmates seemed resigned to waiting for the economic tides to turn. “Plenty of people work in bookstores and work in low-end administrative jobs, even though they have a Harvard degree,” she said. “They are thinking more in terms of creating their own kinds of life that interests them, rather than following a conventional idea of success and job security.”


Jennifer Lee relates some dismal statistics: 14% of young people who graduated from college between 2006 and 2010 are unemployed or working part-time. Quite a few more are working 'below their level' at call centers, or working as bartenders, waitresses or retail workers.

Actually, I can relate. I graduated from Oklahoma State University in 1972, during the Nixon recession. I starved for a few years.

More here: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/09/01/fashion/recent-colleg...

Toke up for full employment, mannnnnn



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ellisonz (1000+ posts) Thu Sep-01-11 05:03 PM
Response to Original message
4. Legalize marijuana.
   
This one reform alone would produce jobs, end the violent drug war, and balance budgets nationwide.


Dope has been their answer to everything since age 13. Jesus, if you want to smoke dope, smoke it and STFU while adults deal with real problems. Sheesh.

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Offline jukin

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Re: The idiots just want to smoke dope, period. That's it.
« Reply #1 on: September 02, 2011, 11:17:49 AM »
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"We did everything we were supposed to,” said Stephanie Morales, 23, who graduated from Dartmouth College in 2009 with hopes of working in the arts.

What you should have done is get a SCIENCE degree.  Yes they are much harder but you get a job out of college.  Or you could have learned a useful trade but NOOOOOOOOOOOO you went off on a five year party that cost a hundred thousand dollars to work in the ARTS.
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Offline BannedFromDU

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Re: The idiots just want to smoke dope, period. That's it.
« Reply #2 on: September 02, 2011, 11:19:38 AM »
Quote from: jukin on September 02, 2011, 11:17:49 AM
What you should have done is get a SCIENCE degree.  Yes they are much harder but you get a job out of college.  Or you could have learned a useful trade but NOOOOOOOOOOOO you went off on a five year party that cost a hundred thousand dollars to work in the ARTS.


     No shit. There should be trade schools for the arts, so college campuses can be freed of laggards and hangers-on. Dartmouth, to work ion the ARTS? Waste of mommy & daddy's money.
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Offline Chris_

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Re: The idiots just want to smoke dope, period. That's it.
« Reply #3 on: September 02, 2011, 11:33:40 AM »
Quote from: BannedFromDU on September 02, 2011, 11:19:38 AM
     No shit. There should be trade schools for the arts, so college campuses can be freed of laggards and hangers-on. Dartmouth, to work ion the ARTS? Waste of mommy & daddy's money.
I would be happy if the government refused to provide financial aid for arts degrees and focused on science and math instead.
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Offline BannedFromDU

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Re: The idiots just want to smoke dope, period. That's it.
« Reply #4 on: September 02, 2011, 11:36:01 AM »
Quote from: chris_ on September 02, 2011, 11:33:40 AM
I would be happy if the government refused to provide financial aid for arts degrees and focused on science and math instead.

     Or guaranteed student loans, so the banks would be interested in the field of study. That would cut off the supply of dollars to kids who just want to get drunk and screw instead of learn important job skills.
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Offline DumbAss Tanker

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Re: The idiots just want to smoke dope, period. That's it.
« Reply #5 on: September 02, 2011, 11:47:39 AM »
I think the Obama Presidency has done more to show the true academic worth of an Ivy League non-science education far better than any amount of cold showers and reality checks ever could.  Unfortunately it still retains the totally-nonacademic value of connection with the scions of rich and powerful families, and is thus a door-opener for old-boy networks in business, which is the only real reason to pay the astronomical sums demanded of any middle-class White male to attend them.
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Offline BannedFromDU

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Re: The idiots just want to smoke dope, period. That's it.
« Reply #6 on: September 02, 2011, 11:49:16 AM »
Quote from: DumbAss Tanker on September 02, 2011, 11:47:39 AM
I think the Obama Presidency has done more to show the true academic worth of an Ivy League non-science education far better than any amount of cold showers and reality checks ever could.  Unfortunately it still retains the totally-nonacademic value of connection with the scions of rich and powerful families, and is thus a door-opener for old-boy networks in business, which is the only real reason to pay the astronomical sums demanded of any middle-class White male to attend them.

Only if you major in business or science. The rest is just dick-jacking.
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Offline JohnnyReb

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Re: The idiots just want to smoke dope, period. That's it.
« Reply #7 on: September 02, 2011, 11:53:19 AM »
Arts Degree...Where you sling a little shit on the wall and if it sticks, you talk a bunch of shit about it and call it "ART". The monkeys at the county fair could do as well.
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Offline DumbAss Tanker

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Re: The idiots just want to smoke dope, period. That's it.
« Reply #8 on: September 02, 2011, 11:55:21 AM »
Quote from: BannedFromDU on September 02, 2011, 11:49:16 AM
Only if you major in business or science. The rest is just dick-jacking.

Well, I should have been more direct, but that's what I intended to say.  Science, worth it especially at Princeton or MIT; Business and Law, absolutely but the value is as much or more in the gold key than the substance of the curriculum and instruction.  Everything else is highly-overpriced meh.
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Offline Splashdown

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Re: The idiots just want to smoke dope, period. That's it.
« Reply #9 on: September 02, 2011, 12:12:09 PM »
I graduated from college with a BA degree. I'm a productive, working member of society. It's not just the degree that counts. It's the work ethic. When I graduated, I made hoagies for four months while putting out my resume. If I lose my job tomorrow, I'll be out looking for a job--even making hoagies--to make sure my family is taken care of.

Where is it written that a degree in ANYTHING guarantees a job? The problem is not just the choice of major. It's also the sense instilled in this generation that you DESERVE something that you need to earn, whether it is respect, a job, etc.
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Offline Karin

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Re: The idiots just want to smoke dope, period. That's it.
« Reply #10 on: September 02, 2011, 01:17:08 PM »
Someone is hawking these useless degree programs to high schoolers & their parents, and they should be strung up for it.  The problem is getting a lot of press in the conservative magazines. 

I know a girl who's majoring in "Art Therapy."  She's required to seek and find an internship.  Panicking because she can't find one, surprise.  Meanwhile, the whole thing's on student loan, which will be a killer.  They are ruthless collectors. 
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Offline Ballygrl

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Re: The idiots just want to smoke dope, period. That's it.
« Reply #11 on: September 02, 2011, 01:27:06 PM »
My Cousin is a really smart guy, he was in an Ivy League College for a couple of years, wasn't sure what he wanted to do and decided to go into the Navy, signed up for 6 years, got out of the Navy when the 6 years were up, got a job and went to school for 3 years (nights and weekends) to become an Electrician. Is it glamorous? no, but he loves his job and he makes damn good money doing it.
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Offline Carl

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Re: The idiots just want to smoke dope, period. That's it.
« Reply #12 on: September 02, 2011, 02:56:38 PM »
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“We did everything we were supposed to,” said Stephanie Morales, 23, who graduated from Dartmouth College in 2009 with hopes of working in the arts.

Get a job cleaning graffiti off the walls in an inner city.
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Offline BlueStateSaint

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Re: The idiots just want to smoke dope, period. That's it.
« Reply #13 on: September 02, 2011, 04:27:31 PM »
Quote from: Karin on September 02, 2011, 01:17:08 PM
I know a girl who's majoring in "Art Therapy."  She's required to seek and find an internship.  Panicking because she can't find one, surprise.  Meanwhile, the whole thing's on student loan, which will be a killer.  They are ruthless collectors. 

My wife has a master's in Visual Art with a concentration in Art Therapy.  Luckily, she didn't quit her other job before looking for an internship.  She's paid off most of the student loans--but she paid for the degree as she went.  Useless?  She thinks so, and I'm getting there.
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Offline Skul

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Re: The idiots just want to smoke dope, period. That's it.
« Reply #14 on: September 02, 2011, 05:02:10 PM »
A BA in anything is better than none at all.
It's seems there a some of those BA's that are quite a bit more valuable than others.
A BA in Classical Music isn't exactly in high demand.
Neither is Advanced Crayola Studies, or Fwench Literature.
A degree never guaranties you a job, it only provides a better opportunity to find one.
DUmmies, you have to start somewhere, and it"s generally at the bottom.
You work your way up, from there.
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Offline jtyangel

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Re: The idiots just want to smoke dope, period. That's it.
« Reply #15 on: September 02, 2011, 05:06:20 PM »
Hmmm...the 31 yr old cpa i work with seems to b doing quite fine for herself...im in a more specialized capicity...it's not as much fun as a hostory or arts degree but first priority is taking care of the business of providing for myself and my family...arts and sych i can do for fun and doesnt really require i have a degree to do so. If u cant make a living off of it it's a hobby and generally hobbies can be learned with ither more experienced hobbiests or self taught.
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Offline ExGeeEye

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Re: The idiots just want to smoke dope, period. That's it.
« Reply #16 on: September 03, 2011, 04:16:56 AM »
"Stephanie Morales, 23...who graduated from Dartmouth College in 2009 with hopes of working in the arts..."

Yeah, Steph, I figured out where you went wrong.  You think of the "arts" as a Profession, when it's really only a Hobby.

And yeah, I'd like to make $250K for camping, but I won't delude myself about it-- or blame society, or the Right Wing Oppression Machine, for the fact that I actually have to pay other people to let me do it.
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Re: The idiots just want to smoke dope, period. That's it.
« Reply #17 on: September 03, 2011, 09:05:51 AM »
What sort of RW FOX-a-ganda is this nonsense!

I've been reading DU for years and if it's one thing they have taught us it is: demand creates supply.

There would be plenty of $80,000/year jobs for graduates if there was enough demand to give them those jobs but obviously Bush's tax cuts allow employers to hoard that money so we need health care reform to make them give it up.

Or something.

I dunno. I'm still a little sketchy on the details.
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Offline BlueStateSaint

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Re: The idiots just want to smoke dope, period. That's it.
« Reply #18 on: September 03, 2011, 12:19:47 PM »
Quote from: ExGeeEye on September 03, 2011, 04:16:56 AM
the Right Wing Oppression Machine

That's like the Weather Machine and the Earthquake Machine, right? 

(BTW, who signed out the Weather Machine for next week?  I can't find the register! :o )
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Offline franksolich

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Re: The idiots just want to smoke dope, period. That's it.
« Reply #19 on: September 03, 2011, 12:29:51 PM »
Quote from: jukin on September 02, 2011, 11:17:49 AM
What you should have done is get a SCIENCE degree.  Yes they are much harder but you get a job out of college.  Or you could have learned a useful trade but NOOOOOOOOOOOO you went off on a five year party that cost a hundred thousand dollars to work in the ARTS.

We have that around here, all these four-year fine arts degrees flipping burgers and waiting on tables.

There ain't nothing wrong with an honest job, but there's something wrong with too many trying to break into the fine arts business.

The late television celebrity Johnny Carson was from this area, and in retirement, he gave trainloads of money to people, institutions, and foundations here, to encourage the fine arts; for about a whole generation past, about one-fourth to one-third of all high school graduates went into dance and theatre arts, motivated by his example.

This, up here on the roof of Nebraska, cattle country.

Nothing wrong with the fine arts, but really, probably only one out of a thousand makes it.
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Offline GOBUCKS

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Re: The idiots just want to smoke dope, period. That's it.
« Reply #20 on: September 03, 2011, 12:37:18 PM »
Quote from: franksolich on September 03, 2011, 12:29:51 PM
Nothing wrong with the fine arts, but really, probably only one out of a thousand makes it.
I'm sure the success rate is far less than that.
At one in a thousand, we'd be swamped with prosperous ballerinas, and oboeists, and poets, and baritones.
Which reminds me. No recent updates on Li'l Ava, the chinless 'Bama Butterball.
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Offline franksolich

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Re: The idiots just want to smoke dope, period. That's it.
« Reply #21 on: September 03, 2011, 12:40:08 PM »
Quote from: GOBUCKS on September 03, 2011, 12:37:18 PM
Which reminds me. No recent updates on Li'l Ava, the chinless 'Bama Butterball.

She'll be flipping burgers or waiting on tables down in Alabama sooner or later.
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Offline BlueStateSaint

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Re: The idiots just want to smoke dope, period. That's it.
« Reply #22 on: September 03, 2011, 12:45:06 PM »
Quote from: franksolich on September 03, 2011, 12:40:08 PM
She'll be flipping burgers or waiting on tables down in Alabama sooner or later.

Coach, she'll be starring in her first "feature film" soon--in 'butterball' porn.
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Offline GOBUCKS

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Re: The idiots just want to smoke dope, period. That's it.
« Reply #23 on: September 03, 2011, 12:54:48 PM »
Quote from: BlueStateSaint on September 03, 2011, 12:45:06 PM
Coach, she'll be starring in her first "feature film" soon--in 'butterball' porn.
Yeah, I forgot we did have that one photo update. She'll need to lose at least a hundred pounds to get back down to "butterball" status.

She's gotta be pushing 300.

In fact, if the Las Vegas Lardass loses a few more pounds, and she gains a few more...

The only reason he weighs more than Li'l Ava now is that he's about a foot taller. She's already way more of a lardass.

Poor Li'l Ava.
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Offline DumbAss Tanker

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Re: The idiots just want to smoke dope, period. That's it.
« Reply #24 on: September 03, 2011, 02:08:27 PM »
Quote from: GOBUCKS on September 03, 2011, 12:54:48 PM
Yeah, I forgot we did have that one photo update. She'll need to lose at least a hundred pounds to get back down to "butterball" status.

She's gotta be pushing 300.

In fact, if the Las Vegas Lardass loses a few more pounds, and she gains a few more...

The only reason he weighs more than Li'l Ava now is that he's about a foot taller. She's already way more of a lardass.

Poor Li'l Ava.

I wouldn't go quite that far, I don't think she's dependedent on the short bus to get around yet.

And hitting it big, or even just getting a job, in the creative arts is a matter of talent and application, with educational running third (A very distant third outside drama and music, the two fields where a prestigious degree counts a lot).  Thinking that a degree is going to make up for a shortfall in either of the two more important areas is a stupid mistake, but sounds like what may be the root of the problem in the passages quoted in the OP.
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