DUmmies Discuss The Organic Scam

[GOBUCKS]

One of the most efficient ways to prove democratitude is to flaunt one'e willingness to pay double price for undersized, misshapen, bug-eaten produce. The "organic" business is the agricultural equivalent of the global warming scam, and it's no less of a DUmp religion:

housewolf  (1000+ posts)        Tue Apr-05-11 03:02 AM
Original message
Is organic always worth the extra price? What about raw milk?

Blah, blah, hormone, pesticide, nonsense, blah....

And worst of all organic milk (unless RAW) is still pasteurized, which destroys vital nutrients.

Are you a strict organic-only purchaser, a "I don't care whether it's organic or not" purchaser, a "I don't buy organic because it's too expensive" purchaser, or something else? I've been in the "don't buy organic" and "don't care" categories but am now trying to optimize my nutrition so I'm looking at organics more and more. Maybe I'll set up a poll on this question, 'cause I'm curious...


I'm on a couple of lists, one for blenderized diet users where most of the folks are parents of infants young children who can't swallow, and several kefir-making groups.
Blah, blah, organic nonsense blah...
Is anyone here a user of raw milk? What have your experiences been?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=236x86932
Well, pasteurization kills all those great nutrients you get from the tuberculin bacteria, I guess. And what's the deal with "young children who can't swallow"?

NashVegas  (1000+ posts)        Tue Apr-05-11 12:01 PM
Response to Original message
1. I Won't Drink Any Milk That's Not Organic
rBST matters. Antibiotics matter.

As for raw, unless you personally know a farmer or have the cow, most sellers will charge anywhere from $6-$10 per gallon where I live. No way!

I did find someone who had a direct link to an Amish farmer and was able to get raw milk for $4 a gallon, but it wasn't worth it (it was for cooking purposes).

And I hope that DUmmy NashVegas insists on drinking water straight out of the river, full of natural nutrients.

 

Warpy  (1000+ posts)        Tue Apr-05-11 02:51 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. I won't use unpasteurized milk or dairy products made from it
and that's a good thing since it's illegal in many states to sell it. I do insist on non BGH milk and prefer it from a dairy herd that hasn't been given prophylactic antibiotics because they're overcrowded.

That means I only use health food store cheese and buy health food store yogurt and sour cream from certified organic dairies. Yes, it's more expensive, but it's worth it to avoid the junk.

The more we support organic growers, the more of them there will be and the lower the prices will eventually get. We'll be better for it in the meantime and so will the planet.

I don't think these DUmbasses should be drinking any milk until they get a green light from nadinbrzhzhzhzski. They drove her away, and now they're paying the price. In no time, all the DUmmies will look like members of the Packer clan, with both eyes on the same side of their noses.

(And unless used in an astronomical sense, the word "planet" is a sure identifier of a barking moonbat.)

housewolf  (1000+ posts)        Tue Apr-05-11 04:38 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. Do you look for dairy products from pasture-fed cows?
There's organic milk from cows who have been fed pesticide-free grains (not feed that natural to cows), and then there's organic milk from cows who are fed pesticide-free grasses, sometimes referred to as pasture-fed, which is their natural feed. Does it matter to you? Can you tell a difference?

DUmmy housewolf always asks clerk Muhammed down at the 7-11 what kind of grass the cows ate before producing this gallon of milk.
 
 

housewolf  (1000+ posts)        Tue Apr-05-11 09:38 PM
Response to Reply #4
5. Oh, thanks !
I did some research and found that the pasture-grazing requirement has only been the case for about the last year when the federal requirements were changed. Prior to that, they needed to be fed organic feed (grasses and/or grains) but weren't required to be allowed "pasture privileges". Now they are by law required to pasture-graze at least 120 days/yr.

I guess it's like a full membership at the country club includes golf privileges. Previously, the cows just had social memberships.

trud  (500 posts)      Wed Apr-06-11 07:23 AM
Response to Original message
7. ingest pesticides or not, hmmm
I figure, why take a chance on my health and the planet's, and also buying organic supports people trying to improve things.

There's that word again!

randr  (1000+ posts)        Wed Apr-06-11 10:52 AM
Response to Original message
8. Buying organic is a no brainer
Food is after all a human necessity and we consume it for nutrition. The value of a product is determined by how much nutrition I get for my money. If I can buy any food product at half the price and it lacks the basic ingredients I am buying it for in the first place, I have been riped off.
Nutrition aside, it is the dependence on the petro/chemical industries that taint our food supply that we must be most concerned about. As with most things in our consumer society, the real costs are hidden and come back to bite us in the ass later.
In regard to all dairy products, the additions of hormones and antibiotics is enough to make the organic alternatives the only choice.
And I should give a shout out to the growing numbers of independent farmers and ranchers who are taking great economic risks to provide us with choices, we need to support their efforts.

Yes, DUmmy randr, for normal people the decision about the organic scam is a no-brainer.  In the meantime, you (and those kids who can't swallow} are being "riped off".

[JohnnyReb]

I was raised on raw, pasture grass feed, whole milk that "I" milked from the cow. In the spring when wild inions and the bitterweeds came out, it had a special flavor the DUmmie would have loved... ....I would have gladly given him/her my share.

[ChuckJ]

I would think that just because something is labeled "organic" doesn't mean that it is chemical free.

My thinking may be wrong, but it is as follows…

Farmer Fred is growing "organic" vegetables to sell for profit.  Since he is in a for profit business he needs to have some quantity. He will more than likely also need fertilizer. Since it is going to be "organic", chemical fertilizer is out of the question. He's in luck, however, because one very good fertilizer that IS organic is excrement. The problem is collecting enough excrement for his for profit business. Collecting excrement from free range animals would usually be too time consuming and expensive. His best bet would probably be chicken houses. A lot of excrement could be collected from one location at chicken houses and chicken excrement makes pretty good fertilizer. The problem is that the chicken house is also probably a for profit business and in order to increase profits have given the chickens that are producing the excrement some sort of chemicals. Unless the chickens have some sort of super metabolism (in which case they probably wouldn't have needed the chemicals anyway) some of the chemicals are going to pass through the chicken and exit in the excrement. In this case when you bought Farmer Fred's "organic" vegetables you would be eating vegetables grown in chemical laced chicken shit.

I guess Farmer Fred could just visit DU and collect all the bullshit that he would ever need to grow vegetables for years and years. Of course, considering the drugs the DUmmies take, the vegetables still wouldn't be chemical free and would probably give you a buzz.

One other thing, when she was a child my grandmother almost died from scarlet fever thanks to the "healthy nutrients" in unpasteurized milk.

[BEG]

I eat what ever I want, when ever I want. I'm still alive, am not over weight, look younger than my years and basically healthy.  Unless you count my stroke at age 28 and my auto immune thing, but that has to do with my DNA not because I don't eat organic at every meal.

You guys at DU are ridiculous, just eat in moderation and don't eat crappy food. I bet I will out live the majority of you anyway. Hate does ugly things to a body.

Ahhhh, it's good to be ME. 

[Ballygrl]

20/20 did a show on organic produce years ago and it was found to cause more e-coli outbreaks then regular produce, and of course the cost compared to regular produce isn't worth it.

[franksolich]

His best bet would probably be chicken houses. A lot of excrement could be collected from one location at chicken houses and chicken excrement makes pretty good fertilizer. The problem is that the chicken house is also probably a for profit business and in order to increase profits have given the chickens that are producing the excrement some sort of chemicals. Unless the chickens have some sort of super metabolism (in which case they probably wouldn't have needed the chemicals anyway) some of the chemicals are going to pass through the chicken and exit in the excrement. In this case when you bought Farmer Fred's "organic" vegetables you would be eating vegetables grown in chemical laced chicken shit.

You know, sir, that's an interesting thought, for some reason.

A couple of weeks ago, an elderly couple from town came here to harvest eight bushel-baskets of dirt from the William Rivers Pitt, for their flower and vegetable gardens.

They do this every year, but at the rate it's going, it'll be a couple of centuries before there's even a gouge in the William Rivers Pitt.

(For those who don't know, the William Rivers Pitt is a miniature Jungfrau-looking pile of antique swine excrement, about 740 cubic feet of pure stuff, dating from 1875 until June 1950, on this property.)

They had seen the report of the soil scientist from three years ago, which showed the stuff to be "layered," much as tree-rings, it actually being possible to determine the age of any particular layer (say, 1878-1879, 1904-1905, 1922-1923, and so on) not only by the dietary components archaeologized, but also by certain diseases, such as swine cholera.

At no time were any artificial chemicals detected, but there were a lot of diseases detected.

The main flora covering the William Rivers Pitt are tomatoes and catnip.

I thought perhaps this stuff might have probably been planted on the William Rivers Pitt, but the ancient elderly gentleman who grew up here told me some years ago, no.  The pigs ate a lot of tomatoes, and the tomatoes currently growing there are descendants of undigested seeds passed through the intestines of thousands of pigs for 75 years.

It's interesting, when one stops to consider what the food one eats, really is.

[franksolich]

Hate does ugly things to a body.

Bravo, madam!

[franksolich]

And I hope that DUmmy NashVegas insists on drinking water straight out of the river, full of natural nutrients.

Excellent point, sir.

[Ballygrl]

Response to Original message
7. ingest pesticides or not, hmmm
I figure, why take a chance on my health and the planet's, and also buying organic supports people trying to improve things.

http://reason.com/blog/2007/09/14/organic-farming-is-a-load-of-h

What about the alleged health dangers of synthetic pesticides?

If chemical pesticides are hazardous to health, then farm workers should be most affected. The results of a 13-year study of nearly 90,000 farmers and their families in Iowa and North Carolina — the Agricultural Health Study – suggests we really don't have much to worry about. These people were exposed to higher doses of agricultural chemicals because of their proximity to spraying, and 65 per cent of them had personally spent more than 10 years applying pesticides. If any group of people were going to show a link between pesticide use and cancer, it would be them. They didn't.

A preliminary report published in 2004 showed that, compared to the normal population, their rates of cancer were actually lower. And they did not show any increased rate of brain-damaging diseases like Parkinson's. There was one exception: prostate cancer. This seemed to be linked to farmers using a particular fungicide called methyl bromide, which is now in the process of being phased out. According to James Felton, of the Biosciences Directorate of the Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory in California, who also chairs the study, "The bottom line is the results are coming out surprisingly negative. It's telling us that most of the chemicals we use today are not causing cancer or other disease."

Health of the planet and protecting nature?

...many agricultural scientists estimate that if the world were to go completely organic, not only would the remaining forests have to be cleared to provide the organic manure needed for farming, the world's current population would likely starve

[dandi]

The only organic thing I buy is either Horizon or Stoneyfield Farms whole milk. It just tastes better than the regular to me. It tastes like I remember milk tasting when I was a kid in grammar school, and we'd get the little cube-shaped cartons of milk with the paper stopper on top at recess. It also has a much longer shelf life, for some reason.

[Evil_Conservative]

We're all going to die eventually.  I'd rather eat as much non-organic foods (save my money) and have fun with life.  I'd hate to shop in the stores looking for organic only.  There are just some things I couldn't give up.  You know certain foods are bad for you, but they taste so good.  I have a hard time saying no. 

We purchase vitamin D milk - cheapest brand available because they all taste the same. 

I've been in our organic food store to check it out when we first moved on this side of town.  I hated how small and overpriced all the fruits and vegetables were.  Rip off.  Let me eat pesticides.  They haven't killed me yet.

[GOBUCKS]

We're all going to die eventually.  I'd rather eat as much non-organic foods (save my money) and have fun with life.  I'd hate to shop in the stores looking for organic only.  There are just some things I couldn't give up.  You know certain foods are bad for you, but they taste so good.  I have a hard time saying no. 

We purchase vitamin D milk - cheapest brand available because they all taste the same. 

I've been in our organic food store to check it out when we first moved on this side of town.  I hated how small and overpriced all the fruits and vegetables were.  Rip off.  Let me eat pesticides.  They haven't killed me yet.

Unless you're worried about high salt due to problems related to blood pressure, or you're diabetic or obese, what commercial foods are bad for you? Answer: In reaasonable quantities, none. DUmmies say fast food and processed foods, and high fructose corn syrup are bad for you simply because they come from American capitalistic companies, which they hate, not because of any actual scientific reason. They and their mass media allies have repeated this over and over and over until a lot of normal people think it's true. On the other hand, if you eat like a Hampshire hog, and lead a sedentary lifestyle, all foods are bad for you.

[JohnnyReb]

Unless you're worried about high salt due to problems related to blood pressure, or you're diabetic or obese, what commercial foods are bad for you? Answer: In reaasonable quantities, none. DUmmies say fast food and processed foods, and high fructose corn syrup are bad for you simply because they come from American capitalistic companies, which they hate, not because of any actual scientific reason. They and their mass media allies have repeated this over and over and over until a lot of normal people think it's true. On the other hand, if you eat like a Hampshire hog, and lead a sedentary lifestyle, all foods are bad for you.

JohnnyRebs Beet diet for DUmies.

Pickled Beets...almost no calories, zero fats, no vitamins, 2% sodium....or something like that from memory... and a side order of French's yellow mustard...zero everything.

Eating only beets and mustard for a few months should cure all the DUmmies problems.

[diesel driver]

The DUmmies talk about antibiotics in milk.  Back when my family owned a dairy farm, there was a ZERO tolerance for antibiotics, for 2 reasons I can think of.

1.  Potential lawsuits from people who are allergic to certain antibiotics, and
2.  You can't make cheese or cottage cheese from milk with antibiotics, because it would kill the bacteria used to produce the cheese.

The withdrawal time for a cow that had received antibiotics (usually for mastitis) is 3 days for the milk, 30 for the meat.

DUmmies are wasting their time and money if they think organic anything is any better than the regular stuff.

[Ballygrl]

Unless you're worried about high salt due to problems related to blood pressure, or you're diabetic or obese, what commercial foods are bad for you? Answer: In reaasonable quantities, none. DUmmies say fast food and processed foods, and high fructose corn syrup are bad for you simply because they come from American capitalistic companies, which they hate, not because of any actual scientific reason. They and their mass media allies have repeated this over and over and over until a lot of normal people think it's true. On the other hand, if you eat like a Hampshire hog, and lead a sedentary lifestyle, all foods are bad for you.

Exactly! we like ice cream, I usually buy Weight Watchers because of the calories but Blue Bunny has boxes of little cones that are like half the calories of regular size cones so I've been buying them lately.

[Evil_Conservative]

Exactly! we like ice cream, I usually buy Weight Watchers because of the calories but Blue Bunny has boxes of little cones that are like half the calories of regular size cones so I've been buying them lately.

I had such a craving for ice cream last night.  Is the Weight Watchers ice cream good?  We try to keep ice cream out of our house because it will disappear in a day.

[Ballygrl]

I had such a craving for ice cream last night.  Is the Weight Watchers ice cream good?  We try to keep ice cream out of our house because it will disappear in a day.

It's REALLY good, it tastes just like regular ice cream but is half the calories which is why I buy it. It can be expensive so I load up on it when Shop Rite has it on sale. The Blue Bunny little cones are really good too and they were on sale this week so I picked a few of them up, the little cones are like 140 calories per cone.

[Evil_Conservative]

It's REALLY good, it tastes just like regular ice cream but is half the calories which is why I buy it. It can be expensive so I load up on it when Shop Rite has it on sale. The Blue Bunny little cones are really good too and they were on sale this week so I picked a few of them up, the little cones are like 140 calories per cone.

I have a few coupons for Weight Watchers ice cream.  We need to buy a stand alone freezer soon.  Our freezer is small and full of other things until we eat it all.  lol

[DumbAss Tanker]

I was raised on raw, pasture grass feed, whole milk that "I" milked from the cow. In the spring when wild inions and the bitterweeds came out, it had a special flavor the DUmmie would have loved... ....I would have gladly given him/her my share.

Yeah, I was mowing over a bunch of stuff this weekend at the creek end of my yard, looked like wild garlic, it smelled like an onion bomb went off.

Pasteurization, good idea.  Prophylactic antibiotics, also a good idea.  Pesticide residue and hormones, not so much but not likely to harm a normal person unless they are somehow living off of nothing but milk.

[BEG]

Exactly! we like ice cream, I usually buy Weight Watchers because of the calories but Blue Bunny has boxes of little cones that are like half the calories of regular size cones so I've been buying them lately.

One of many things I miss the most from Texas is Blue Bell ice cream. 

[Chris_]

I love the strawberry sorbetto they sell at Krogers ("Private Selection").  No fat, but it's loaded with sugar (31g compared to 20 for plain vanilla ice cream).

[Ballygrl]

I have a few coupons for Weight Watchers ice cream.  We need to buy a stand alone freezer soon.  Our freezer is small and full of other things until we eat it all.  lol

I have an extra refrigerator/freezer in the basement but I really need 1 of those stand alone freezers so I can load up when there's a sale. I look on Craigslist everyone once in a while and I just joined something called Freecycle where people give away items they don't want, so I want to look on there for a freezer.

One of many things I miss the most from Texas is Blue Bell ice cream. 

They started selling Blue Bunny here a few years ago, I really like them.

[thundley4]

I have an extra refrigerator/freezer in the basement but I really need 1 of those stand alone freezers so I can load up when there's a sale. I look on Craigslist everyone once in a while and I just joined something called Freecycle where people give away items they don't want, so I want to look on there for a freezer.

They started selling Blue Bunny here a few years ago, I really like them.

Walmart carries Blue Bunny and it's what we normally get.