Should same-sex marriage be legal?

[Rebel]

Oh, it was a dude strip club?

I strongly rescind my request.

[debk]

Oh, it was a dude strip club?

I strongly rescind my request.

 

Strip club was women....Teasers.

801 Bourban Bar is a predominantly gay bar, with a drag show upstairs.

Garden of Eden is the top floor of The Bull and Whistle....it's a clothing optional for patrons.

All are on Duval.

I thought you had been to Key West.

[rubliw]

I don't believe gays have a "right" to marry. I don't believe straight people have a "right" to marry. I also don't believe a government has a "right" to recognize a marriage. Marriage is a union between two people. That's it. The government has no business getting involved, and there's no reason it has to be defined as a "right".

Well, truth be told, I do believe gov't is in the business of promoting stable households that provide, among other things, easy transfer of wealth and many of the other sorts of things that we traditionally give to married couples.   I'm all for detaching that sort of thing from the term "marriage", and essentially getting gov't out of the marriage business, and into the "civil union, or whatever" business.  Many people in this thread have echoed similar sentiments, and I am encouraged by that.  We probably have some common ground there, despite out disagreements.  

But, the pragmatist in me, doesnt ever see gov't getting out of the marriage business - so the next best thing in my book is extending gov't marriage rights (or privileges, if you want to call them that) to those who, by all accounts, really should have them, including homosexual couples.

[Rebel]

The FairTax would alleviate the need for all that at the federal level.

[seahorse513]

What happened in the past has nothing to do with the present. These parades aren't about rights.

You are so right about that one rebel.....

Though this not about homosexuality, but we have topless parades, where women form a  group and parade around topless in some of our major cities. This is legal in Maine btw..
.......or women who take off half of their shirts to nurse their babies in public....

They do it for attention..............

[Boudicca]

The FairTax would alleviate the need for all that at the federal level.

I would love to have a simple VAT tax, end of story.  That way, as I purchase a product or service, I know up front how much I'm getting screwed for, instead of this insiduous drip, drip, drip of hidden taxation.

[ChristianMIller]

Well, truth be told, I do believe gov't is in the business of promoting stable households that provide

In your opinion, what does the federal government do to promote "stable households"?

[SSG Snuggle Bunny]

Well, truth be told, I do believe gov't is in the business of promoting stable households that provide, among other things, easy transfer of wealth and many of the other sorts of things that we traditionally give to married couples.

Tell us what you think about welfare, Head Start, public housing, subsidized home heating, subsidized child care, etc.

Don't liberal transfer trillions of dollars in wealth in the name of promoting family stability?

[ChristianMIller]

Tell us what you think about welfare, Head Start, public housing, subsidized home heating, subsidized child care, etc.

The money that the federal government hands out should be based on need and not based on whether a couple has a marriage license.

[rubliw]

In your opinion, what does the federal government do to promote "stable households"?

Well, at least one thing they do is require states to recognize legal marriages between heterosexual couples.

[ChristianMIller]

Well, at least one thing they [federal government] do is require states to recognize legal marriages between heterosexual couples.

How does this recognition contribute to "stable households"?

[WinOne4TheGipper]

Hi conservativecave,

I'm testing out my new site rgument.com with a really controversial topic: "Same-sex marriages shouldn't be allowed". I've posted here as well as a popular LGBT forum in the hopes of finding people on both sides of the divide. Please help me build a list of the best arguments on either side of this fascinating debate. Thanks!

P.S. If you have any suggestions as to the functionality of the site I'd love to hear them.

What you're talking about is an impossibility anyway.  Marriage is a committed relationship between two individuals of the opposite gender.  You can't legalize a contradiction.

[Rebel]

Many people in this thread have echoed similar sentiments, and I am encouraged by that.  We probably have some common ground there, despite out disagreements.  

Seriously, this has me puzzled. What did you expect? Everyone at a conservative site to say all gay people should have their heads on pikes? We're not liberals talking about "Reichthuglicans", as those idiots like to say. "Most" people don't have a problem with gay people. They have a problem with what the agenda-driven gay groups show us to be the gay lifestyle and how it's supposed to be normal. You want to show it as somehow normal, show a show on my buddy Ken and Joe. Scratch that, after 20 years they fight more than any couple I've ever seen.

I have another question, why do you guys support liberal groups who support Muslims and not Jews? Israel doesn't hang gay people for being gay. Homosexuality is not compatible with the Islamic faith. It's not with the Christian faith either, but we aren't beheading gay people. Islam was born of the sword. Christianity was not. You don't see the problem there?

As for me, I know 3 gay people. One is a retired USAF MSG and now a teacher, one of the 300 Master Certified teachers in GA, and the couple, one was in the AF and the other was a Navy Corpsman who is a Desert Storm veteran. All three are conservative. "My" opinion is that we shouldn't ostracize gay people because many of the ones that DO vote Democrat ONLY do it for one issue. Gay rights. Well, I'm a FairTax supporter. That would get rid of a lot of it. As for visitation rights to hospitals, you're right. It's f'ed up. Should something happen to Joe, damn right Ken, his partner of 20 years, should be able to visit him.

[Rebel]

....and that's just my opinion, not the opinion of Conservative Cave, it's affiliates, or any of it's members.



Camichiwa.

[IassaFTots]

Seriously, this has me puzzled. What did you expect? Everyone at a conservative site to say all gay people should have their heads on pikes? We're not liberals talking about "Reichthuglicans", as those idiots like to say. "Most" people don't have a problem with gay people. They have a problem with what the agenda-driven gay groups show us to be the gay lifestyle and how it's supposed to be normal. You want to show it as somehow normal, show a show on my buddy Ken and Joe. Scratch that, after 20 years they fight more than any couple I've ever seen.

I have another question, why do you guys support liberal groups who support Muslims and not Jews? Israel doesn't hang gay people for being gay. Homosexuality is not compatible with the Islamic faith. It's not with the Christian faith either, but we aren't beheading gay people. Islam was born of the sword. Christianity was not. You don't see the problem there?

As for me, I know 3 gay people. One is a retired USAF MSG and now a teacher, one of the 300 Master Certified teachers in GA, and the couple, one was in the AF and the other was a Navy Corpsman who is a Desert Storm veteran. All three are conservative. "My" opinion is that we shouldn't ostracize gay people because many of the ones that DO vote Democrat ONLY do it for one issue. Gay rights. Well, I'm a FairTax supporter. That would get rid of a lot of it. As for visitation rights to hospitals, you're right. It's f'ed up. Should something happen to Joe, damn right Ken, his partner of 20 years, should be able to visit him.

I wish I could give you a super high five, because a regular one just isn't enough to do.   

[Ree]

I say the government needs to get out of the marriage business altogether. It's none of their concern.

I agree...everyone gets a civil union and leave marriage to the churches and who they want to marry

[debk]

As for visitation rights to hospitals, you're right. It's f'ed up. Should something happen to Joe, damn right Ken, his partner of 20 years, should be able to visit him.

It's just as f'ed up for straight couples who aren't married...regardless of how long they have been together.

If I didn't have a medical power of attorney for M...I would not have been the one making decisions 5 years ago when he was hospitalized. I got the MPOA before he went into the hospital. I was the one making all of the decisions. No one else.


Really pissed off his daughter. 


On the other hand...he's alive.
He's healthy.
And he's sober.
5 years ago last Friday.

Obviously... I made the right decisions.
For him.
For me.
For my children. 

maybe not for his children. 

[Rebel]

Scratch that, I know 4 gay people personally. The 2nd in charge at my company is a lesbian (If you guys would see her, you'd understand). "Pete" is also, and I don't know if this properly describes her expertise as she advises the Pentagon and the NSA, an "SME" in COMSEC. She was a drill sergeant a year before I was even born. She's a retired US Army CW3. She used to be a staunch Democrat and liberal, but has stated she's becoming more and more fiscally conservative with age. She's still socially liberal, but that's no threat to me as it means nothing to my wallet or life.

Anyway, heading to my gay conservative friends' house. OH MY! I'm a conservative! How the hell can this be! I'm supposed to want them all burned at the stake!  


I hang out with conservatives. Black, white, yellow, gay, straight, doesn't f'n matter to me. I cannot, however, hang out with liberals, though Ken does tend to get into the conspiracies about mass coffins in storage during the Clinton Admin alot.

[ChristianMIller]

I agree...everyone gets a civil union and leave marriage to the churches and who they want to marry

The government needs to get out of the civil union business as well. There is no reason couples with marriage licenses or civil unions should get more benefits and money from the government than single people or couples without marriage licenses/civil unions.

[Ballygrl]

I have no problem with civil unions, I have a problem with the term marriage though, but that might be because marriage has always been between a man and a woman. I do think gay people who are in long-term relationships need some type of protection.

[ChristianMIller]

I have no problem with civil unions, I have a problem with the term marriage though, but that might be because marriage has always been between a man and a woman. I do think gay people who are in long-term relationships need some type of protection.

What kind of special "protection" do you think that heterosexual couples need that single people do not need?

[Ballygrl]

What kind of special "protection" do you think that heterosexual couples need that single people do not need?

?

Umm, legal marriage pretty much protects heterosexual couples, so if gay people can't marry and are in a long-term relationship they need some type of protection in reference to assets, visitation if their partner is in the Hospital etc. that's why I don't have a problem with civil unions.

[Ballygrl]

The government needs to get out of the civil union business as well. There is no reason couples with marriage licenses or civil unions should get more benefits and money from the government than single people or couples without marriage licenses/civil unions.

Oh, that's why you asked me that question. Well the same can kind of be said for me, hubby and I don't have kids, why should such a huge part of my property taxes go towards schools I don't use? and if we had kids I'd send them to Catholic School anyway and essentially would have to pay twice for schooling. And because I don't have kids I'm not getting any tax credits like Parents do.

There's always something out there for people to gripe about LOL.

[ChristianMIller]

?

Umm, legal marriage pretty much protects heterosexual couples, so if gay people can't marry and are in a long-term relationship they need some type of protection in reference to assets, visitation if their partner is in the Hospital etc. that's why I don't have a problem with civil unions.

How do you think assets are protected? A patient (married or single) in a hospital is likely to want someone come to visit. I suggest that every patient be allowed to designate permitted visitors. Martial or civil union status should not be a criteria. Equality for all people.

[Rebel]

How do you think assets are protected? A patient (married or single) in a hospital is likely to want someone come to visit. I suggest that every patient be allowed to designate permitted visitors. Martial or civil union status should not be a criteria. Equality for all people.

I'm down, but if your ass is in a car crash and, after arriving, induced into a coma so it can help you heal, um, do you think you're gonna have the time to wake up in enough time to start designating?