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Warren DeMontague (34,690 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail IgnoreIf this group isn't a Safe Haven, as per some are currently claiming in H/M, I say it should be.What do we need to do to establish that we have as much right to establish respectful parameters for our discussion, protect our members (Cue Sterling Archer: "Phrasing!") and generally be able to keep out deliberate disruptors as any other safe haven group on DU.I'm happy to help out Jeff with the hosting if we need a 2nd or 3rd. I'd also nominate stevenleser or hifiguy, although I don't know if he posts here regularly. No one else should take their name's lack of inclusion there as a snub, just thinking off the top of my head.
WhoIsNumberNone (3,313 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore1. You're reading that thread too, huh? [reference to truemud's campfire in the meta forum]I discovered this group a few months back.It very quickly became clear to me that it's not a safe haven.It's monitored.I don't post here.
Behind the Aegis (23,744 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore2. I agree with you.There are issues which pertain to men which should be allowed to be discussed without derision. I remember when the group was proposed and the "outcry" on what this group would become. It shouldn't be allowed as a "he-man woman haters club," but given a number of topics, I don't think it has really become such a thing.
Upton (8,159 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore4. Agreed..but it would appear you're fighting an uphill battle. Though the women have five separate groups, the usual suspects (radfem Dworkinites), seem to believe we men aren't even entitled to even one.
Kaleva (7,484 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore19. Well, your post made me question my own eyes so I had to double check!And it's true that this entire group has a big target on its back. I feel that there are a few members who'd love to see this group disappear. Nothing will change that attitude but if regulars here are seen to hold all to higher standards, then the group will survive and flourish.
ElboRuum (3,807 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore12. I would have alerted......however, I don't come to this group every day. The posting frequency here seems to indicate that this is still somewhat of a nascent group.The first I heard of that thread was through the H+M thread, and while I considered the OP to be a bit over-the-top, I'd consider it within bounds for a group which has some latitude to discuss issues of this sort. The PPR for the one was very deserved, however.
ElboRuum (3,807 posts) Profile Journal Send DU Mail Ignore10. After seeing that thread in H+M...I am convinced that it in fact SHOULD BE.Sorry to anyone that this upsets, I want to discuss issues of all types relevant to me in both a broad general sense and in the many perspectives that are personally relevant to me. It is why I come to DU.I can do this with minimal interference with every perspective except one: gender. Proceeding from anything but the dogmatism of second-wave (or whatever "wave" it happens to be) feminist perspective is just an invitation for a pile-on. And I believe firmly that there is more in heaven and earth that what is in that philosophy. Bear in mind that I have no issue with any feminist individual on this board, and it is not meant as a slight to those who do embrace that philosophy, my only suggestion is that it is not the only thing or the only way, and we need a place to explore these and other things that directly or indirectly impact, negatively or positively, men's lives.Men need a place to discuss their issues with freedom from negative interloping from people who disagree that men have any relevant issues, that they need to address them or work through them, or that they should go somewhere else to do it. I know that most of the feminists who have lurked and participated in this group have done so largely productively, understanding that this is "our" place. I thank them profusely for this understanding.However, given the thread in H+M which just broad-stroked the entire group for the implication that men don't have real issues, that what issues they have are laughable and small and whinging, and that we deserve to be laughed at, I fully suspect that safe haven status is required for this group to be valuable for the purposes it's intended. Regardless of the nonsense in that thread, it is clear that some latitude be extended for the ability to discuss the issue. Several posts in that thread were thought provoking, even if the signal to noise ratio of the thread was quite low.
Safe Havens [read=gettos] patrolled by Fascist guards ready to punish the smallest infractions."You used a banned word."
