primitives picking at acorns

[franksolich]

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x6584808

Oh my.

sabrina 1 (1000+ posts)        Sat Sep-19-09 06:03 AM
Original message
 
My Experience With Acorn 

http://www.boomantribune.com/story/2009/9/18/124152/140

When I started working for ACORN in 2004, I was one of only four white people employed in their North Philadelphia office. The office was in a very run-down tenement on North Broad Street, abutted by an abandoned lot on one side and a black baptist church on the other. The furniture could only described as ratty and unsuitable for anyone's home. Most of the day-to-day work going on was in counseling. The main area of counseling was for people who had been suckered into predatory mortgages that they quickly discovered they couldn't afford. Every day desperate people filed into the office begging for help in avoiding foreclosure.

snip

I don't think it's possible for most white, suburban people to really understand the culture that ACORN operates in. Just the idea that freshly released felons might be some of the most valuable role models in a neighborhood is too foreign for a lot of people to relate to. These kids didn't have prior job experience. They didn't have other jobs in retail or a union available to them. There were no local banks or available credit. Most of them had no picture ID, and even fewer had a government ID. Just getting their paperwork in order so that I could hire them was a nightmare. When their paychecks were late (as they often were), their heat got shut off.

snip

If you walk into this scene out of the lily-white suburbs, you're likely to be shocked at first by what you see. Things are turned upside down. The role models are felons, the clean kids are working the black market. But, spend some time there and you'll quickly adapt and begin to see how there is dignity and fight and pride and ambition and resourcefulness and tremendous faith that sustains these communities in the face of enormous odds. Anyone who had ever seen what I have seen would never, ever, cut off all funding for ACORN or use them as a symbol of black dependency and corruption.

Come down out of your Ivory Towers and stop trying to cover your ass. Most of us got into politics to help people. ACORN is doing that every day as well as they know how.

- - - - -

What a crime it is to try to shut down this organization. And how sad that so few of our Democratic Majority stood up against this vicious attack on the poor. And what exactly was the motivation of the so-called 'citizen journalists'? It's possible they may have violated the law while engaged in their 'sting'. Democrats, instead of jumping on board with the Minority Party who are still managing to control Congress, should have called for an investigation of the organization who is behind this witch-hunt. I really want to belong to a party that stands up for the things they claim to stand for.

woo me with science  (1000+ posts)      Sat Sep-19-09 06:45 AM
Response to Original message
 
1. Yes, they reach into the neighborhoods that desperately need help. 

When organizations reach out into places so desperate that the role models are felons, that is all the more reason for them to have strong structures in place to ensure that laws *are* followed and corruption does not infect their daily practices. Support for rank corruption as serious as child trafficking should not occur on a systemic basis in ANY government-funded organization.

When anyone can walk into *multiple* ACORN offices and obtain disgusting footage this easily, an investigation is warranted to determine why.

sabrina 1 (1000+ posts)        Sat Sep-19-09 07:05 AM
Response to Reply #1
 
3. Except that according to Acorn we did NOT see video of the offices they walked into and were thrown out of. That is the problem. Also, at least one of those who was video-taped, possibly illegally, see my post below, said the video was edited. A claim verified to some extent by the State Attorney's office.

The story these told to him, was that they wanted to help these mythical girls. He suggested, according to him, that they call the FBI. Their reply was 'No, calling the FBI would be bad' He repeated 'calling the FBI would be bad', and that's what they left on tape, editing out what he suggested.

The fraud appears to be with the 'pimp' and the 'prostitute' if it's true that they WERE thrown out of other offices, and that the story they told was not what it appears to be, at least on one of the tapes. Hopefully they will be sued by the workers, as is being reported, and prosecuted by the State Attorney. Then maybe both sides of the story can be heard, rather than the extreme right's and Fox News' version of it, which we all know is self-serving to say the least.

woo me with science  (1000+ posts)      Sat Sep-19-09 07:23 AM
Response to Reply #3
 
4. I see no "except that" here. 

Sure, ACORN can sue if they feel they have basis to do so. But there is certainly enough disturbing footage in these *multiple* videos, one person's claims notwithstanding, to warrant a full investigation of ACORN's business practices.

Air it all. My quarrel is not with those at ACORN who think they have a basis to sue. It is with those who keep wanting us to move along because there is nothing to see here.

iamalevi2 (135 posts)      Sat Sep-19-09 07:29 AM
Response to Reply #3
 
5. Legal

You've got to be kidding. They have Acorn rep's on tape giving advice about helping to "cover up" illegal activity involving under age girls, and you're more concerned that the tape is legal? Even is one tape is edited, there are four more, and there is no evidence that Acorn threw them out anywhere else or we would have seen it. The real tragedy here is that we have on organization that betrayed the people they originally were formed to help. Open your eyes!

sabrina 1 (1000+ posts)        Sat Sep-19-09 07:37 AM
Response to Reply #5
 
6. Yes, actually. If there is a law in place, which there is

are you saying that it should not be abided by? And that as always seems to be the case when it comes to the right. Just ignore the law-breakers while going after ACORN. But even assuming the tapes were NOT edited, as they are accused of being, two employees out of one of the largest community service groups in the country, were stupidly trapped into 'giving advice' about a situation which may not be the one presented in the edited tape. Should that shut down an entire organization? Would the military be shut down because a few of its members committed crimes?

It's not difficult to get enough footage of people talking, and then edit it to look like something else altogether. And hat has been alleged. But before there was even an attempt to do an investigation, and despite the denials by those on tape, there was simply no due process and you, and others mainly on Fox and rightwing blogs, are willing to take it all on face value.

I want the tapes confiscated, as they should be, and those who broke the law, prosecuted, on both sides if laws were broken. But an organization is not responsible for wrong-doing by employees until they learn about it. ACORN has fired them.

goddess40  (1000+ posts)      Sat Sep-19-09 09:07 AM
Response to Reply #5
 
9. Where is your brain

If they had taped themselves getting kicked out of any of the offices do you think they would have shown those tapes? I'd like to see the editing, too. A lot can be faked with tapes and I think these tapes were accepted without full investigation by someone other than FAUX.

sabrina 1 (1000+ posts)        Sat Sep-19-09 06:58 AM
Response to Original message
 
2. Baltimore State Attorney's office may prosecute O'Keefe and Giles, the 'pimp' and the 'prostitute'. I found this on a right-wing blog and, they are sending out word to their followers to contact the State Attorney and 'let them know what you think of this'

I think we ought to call and encourage them to investigate this. The statement refers to the fact that the video may have been tampered with. A prosecution would force these two to hand over the video for investigation. That corresponds with what at least one of the worker's claimed.
 
after which various citations, not worth putting into the boat and bringing here

The primitive the bitter old Vermontese cali primitive doesn't like:

Hannah Bell  (1000+ posts)        Sat Sep-19-09 08:13 AM
Response to Reply #2
 
7. kick & call: produce the tapes for independent examination.

drm604  (1000+ posts)        Sat Sep-19-09 08:58 AM
Response to Original message
 
8. Please see mzmolly's excellent thread on the latest ACORN sting video.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

It's heavily edited and at least one statement by the ACORN gentlemen is cut off in midsentence.

If you listen carefully it sounds like they may have been asking for help in saving girls from prostitution rather than trying to prostitute them - at one point they state that they want to get to them before they "bond with the pimp" - but it's been edited to sound ambiguous. At another point the ACORN rep suggests that district attorneys should be involved. O'Keefe says that that's not a good idea and the rep's response is cutoff in mid sentence to make it sound like he may be agreeing with O'Keefe.

The man has now been fired by ACORN. I personally think he may have a defamation case against O'Keefe and others.

Oh dear.

[The Village Idiot]

That man basically offered to help move the girls over the border.

He now claims to barely understand english but he has a LAW DEGREE???


BTW- The two investigators say they were not thrown out of any offices, they have many more tapes

[BlueStateSaint]

BTW- The two investigators say they were not thrown out of any offices, they have many more tapes

Supposedly, 40 more hours' worth.

[ATTC]

"The main area of counseling was for people who had been suckered into predatory mortgages that they quickly discovered they couldn't afford."

So, they got suckered into predatory mortgages that ACORN fought for when they barged into banks demanding loans to unqualified people...?

Case and point, ACORN is the problem.

[Karin]

Such squibble squabbling over the acorn mess.

Up above is my friend from Moonbattery, ATTC.  It stands for American To The Core.  Hi!  A young conservative, like Celtic Rose.  Hope for America yet. 

[franksolich]

So, they got suckered into predatory mortgages that ACORN fought for when they barged into banks demanding loans to unqualified people...?

Case and point, ACORN is the problem.

Welcome to CU.  Happy to see you here. 

Sit back, relax, kick off the shoes, and get comfortable.

[GOBUCKS]

So, they got suckered into predatory mortgages that ACORN fought for when they barged into banks demanding loans to unqualified people...?
Case and point, ACORN is the problem.

I think nearly everyone can remember the democrat outrage over "redlining".
Now we've learned those guys with the red pens knew what they were doing.

[diesel driver]

I have it on good authority that the atty gen for Maryland is a moron.  This from my stepson who lives in that, as he puts it, "shithole state"....

Another point brought up by Rush last week is that ACORN currently has no charter to operate in the state of Maryland.  It was pulled in 2006 or 2007....

NOTHING that O'Keefe did was illegal, in fact, he told ACORN and their minions to bring it.  He's open to a knock down drag out fight with them

[ATTC]

Karin,

I've been a long-time reader but not much of a poster here.  The conversations here are a bit less heated but I do enjoy reading from the DUmp without having to bathe my computer.

Oh yeah, HERRO!

... and to clarify on Karin's point about me being a young conservative.  I'm 22, rooted deeply in conservatism since I started following politics in middle school, college graduate (computer science), and thank everyone here for posting DU threads (risking your computer's safety).

[Chris_]

What a crime it is to try to shut down this organization. And how sad that so few of our Democratic Majority stood up against this vicious attack on the poor.

It's not an attack on the poor you moronic idiot. It's an attack against a corrupt
organization that is simply an arm of the Democrat machine.

Moron.

[Flame]

So, they got suckered into predatory mortgages that ACORN fought for when they barged into banks demanding loans to unqualified people...?

Case and point, ACORN is the problem.

Welcome to the Cave!   

[crockspot]

I have it on good authority that the atty gen for Maryland is a moron.  This from my stepson who lives in that, as he puts it, "shithole state"....

Another point brought up by Rush last week is that ACORN currently has no charter to operate in the state of Maryland.  It was pulled in 2006 or 2007....

NOTHING that O'Keefe did was illegal, in fact, he told ACORN and their minions to bring it.  He's open to a knock down drag out fight with them

They wont sue, it's just bluster. The discovery process that O'Keefe would drag them through would sink them faster than these tapes.

[The Village Idiot]

Hello ATTC, if you like writing science fiction, you can join a couple of us amateurs at http://libertyfic.proboards.com . Its a pretty lonely site.