When it comes down to it, how many people want to go to war against the U.S. Gov

[dutch508]

Tom Rinaldo (22,668 posts)
https://www.democraticunderground.com/100217780981

When it comes down to it, how many people want to go to war against the U.S. Government?

Trump's big bluff is finally being called. The most potent force extremists wield is intimidation. Most people abhor violence, and go to great lengths to avoid it. Faced with a potential serious threat, appeasement is not uncommon as a response. The bigger the threat brandished, the bigger the capitulation demanded to in order to withdraw it. "The Rule of Law?" Sounds nice in the abstract, but is pressing a charge of business fraud, really worth triggering off deadly riots in our streets? Intimidation worked for Trump, until last week.

America has seen deadly riots before. Lynch mobs were common deadly riots. Cell blocks have gone up in flames in deadly prison riots. Inner cities have been convulsed by deadly riots due to racial injustice. Riots are serious. Deaths from them are serious. But even America's deadliest riots fail to equal the carnage from one days fighting in Ukraine last week. What can bring down America is not militant extremists engaging in violence. What can bring down America is our democratic institutions failing to hold.

Seriously. Literally. How many Americans are willing to engage in full scale armed combat against the U.S. Army and the National Guard?

Hundreds maybe. Possibly thousands. Sure, many more than that say they are willing to fight the government. They run around in the woods in camouflage with guns, but how many of them are actually willing to go hand to hand with the infantry?

I'm not saying all right wing extremists are cowards, but the ones who literally are suicidal pursue death by cops individually. The strategy of the extreme right has always been to light the match that somehow sparks the coming "great conflict"that will finally purify America for the Christian Nationalist Right At most they engage in sneak attacks and isolated acts of terror. But there are never plans for a coordinated armed assault on State Capitals. There are never plans to physically occupy Washington and install a new government.

They had the then President of the United States on their side, and security forces that failed to take them seriously, on January 6, 2021. The far right was counting on inside help that day, on a declaration of martial law, on the National Guard protecting them and on presidential pardons for any and all of their transgressions. They weren't up for war with the U.S. Army. They know they would be crushed if it ever came to that, and most of their supporters would dissolve back into "normal" civilian life, hoping not to come to "the attention of authorities."

If blood starts to flow the Right has already lost. When the threats they make lead to their own loss of liberty, the Right is routed. Trump is facing the consequences now of his bluff finally being called. Yes we may still face some civil unrest, but a functioning democracy can deal with that if our institutions continue to function the way they were designed.

It's not going to be a war against the government. AND, you honestly think the entire military and the various states' National Guard is going to be on your side?

Bernardo de La Paz (44,791 posts)

3. Some idiots will take action, but most magats fear a "J6 trap"

They have been lied to so much and lie to themselves, that they really think people got arrested on J6 for simple basic ordinary presence at a demonstration, peacefully protesting.

So they fear arrest at ANY simple basic protest.

But there will be idiots who will use their guns somewhere, some time, on Tuesday or after. Have courage. Be resolute.

Be confident. This is the beginning of the end of the rump.

It's the beginning of the end of the US as we have known it.

localroger (3,273 posts)

8. At J6 the hardcore were depending on the mass of dipshits to provide cover

And it largely worked. But it won't work again, because would-be dipshits now know that they could be found and prosecuted for their dipshittery. The hardcore assholes don't care about that but the dipshits do, and without the dipshits to provide a mass of people for them to blend into the hardcore assholes can't effect their strategy.

orthoclad (923 posts)

6. Wrong question

We're already seeing asymmetric aka guerilla warfare, in the form of power station attacks. And don't forget the bois in 2020 who sniped cops, trying to stir up conflict during the Floyd upheaval.

I saw a website printed in a Nazi-looking font celebrating "asymmetric warfare" after the NC power station attack. They've been practicing for years. Don't forget the plot to take out the power in a majority black city (Baltimore) a few months ago.

They won't go for confrontation unless they have overwhelming odds, as they did on J6. The odds then were a ombination of their numbers and the gelding of response - DoD nto answering the phone, Nat Guard disarmed, etc. Also don't forget that some in the Captol Police collaborated with the insurrection. I saw video of Cap cops opening barricades and waving the mob in. J6 was a one-off thing; the organizers will avoid confrontation now.

Sure... it's the right blowing up power stations, killing cops, rioting and burning down cities...

orthoclad (923 posts)

16. They also have insurrectonists holding power in Congress

and the Supreme Court to give them cover. Distract over drag shows, subpoena and harass the opposition, then the Court will free the leaders on appeal.

A large portion of the J6ers are already out of jail and being celebrities.

Star Member IbogaProject (1,699 posts)

7. Until enough inn The military switch

That is how it usually happens, I hope our military training really programs against that. Our military was instrumental is carefully deflecting the worst that could have happened J6.

that is why the leftists are pushing the woke bullshit on the military... and have been for the last twenty years.

Star Member yardwork (56,078 posts)

13. Many of us on DU remember the calls for revolution in the 1960s and 70s

It didn't happen. Even in the midst of an unpopular war with a draft, there was no revolution. Instead, Nixon resigned, Ford pardoned him, Jimmy Carter was elected and hamstrung at every turn, and the Republicans committed treason and put a puppet in the White House.

All the riots and protests led to victory by the opposing party. The American people did not join the socialist revolution. Instead, they turned more to the right. Backlash.

Now it's the Republicans who look radical. This will end one of two ways. (1) There will be a corrective turn to the left by the American people, with a repudiation of right-wing extremism, or (2) there will be a military coup directed by right-wing billionaires, loss of our democracy, and installation of an authoritarian regime that looks like Gilead in The Handmaid's Tale.

In neither case will millions of Americans fight the government.

 

[DUmpDiver]

I won't address anything in particular but I've been following The DUmp almost since it's inception and these types of posts are why it's the best humor site on The Interweb.  Yes, even funnier than The Babylon Bee.

[CollectivismMustDie]

The thing about DUmmies and leftists, is that they nearly always ask the wrong questions because, among other reasons, they fear the right answers.

The question of how many want to or how many are willing is the wrong question.

The right question is: "How many would it take?"


See: The DC snipers, DUmmies.

A couple thousand truly motivated individuals, could bring leftist America in their big cities to a screeching halt, while rural America went right on living their lives.

It only took two idiots shooting out of the hole in the trunk of a car with a poodle shooter to lock down DC to a large degree. And that wasn't even really all that creative.

If you idiot leftists would think just for a minute with moderate success, you'd realize that the reason it isn't already happening, isn't because it can't be done. It's because the will to do so isn't quite there yet. 

Laws don't prevent it. Will or lack there of prevents it.

Sooner or later, probably sooner given the degree to which you feel entitled to push people, you'll figure that out.

[Ptarmigan]

The thing about DUmmies and leftists, is that they nearly always ask the wrong questions because, among other reasons, they fear the right answers.

The question of how many want to or how many are willing is the wrong question.

The right question is: "How many would it take?"


See: The DC snipers, DUmmies.

A couple thousand truly motivated individuals, could bring leftist America in their big cities to a screeching halt, while rural America went right on living their lives.

It only took two idiots shooting out of the hole in the trunk of a car with a poodle shooter to lock down DC to a large degree. And that wasn't even really all that creative.

If you idiot leftists would think just for a minute with moderate success, you'd realize that the reason it isn't already happening, isn't because it can't be done. It's because the will to do so isn't quite there yet. 

Laws don't prevent it. Will or lack there of prevents it.

Sooner or later, probably sooner given the degree to which you feel entitled to push people, you'll figure that out.

The Boston area was put in lockdown after the Tsarnaev brothers were being pursued. Dzokhar Tsarnaev was caught after the lockdown was lifted.

[CollectivismMustDie]

The Boston area was put in lockdown after the Tsarnaev brothers were being pursued. Dzokhar Tsarnaev was caught after the lockdown was lifted.

Yup. Laws didn't stop them. All it took was will on their part to do what they did. And what they did wasn't terribly creative either.

A couple people using drones creatively could do much worse.

As is their inclination and habit, the inhabitants of skins island haven't thought this through at all.

[FlaGator]

Want to and willing to are two different questions.

[DefiantSix]

Tom Rinaldo (22,668 posts)

When it comes down to it, how many people want to go to war against the U.S. Government...

Given that one of my ancestors is great great great waaaay the hell back there Uncle George (Washington, for those of you translating for the lurking DUm'Rats from Rio Linda) and given the barely recognizable state that the Federal Government he (among others) worked to establish has devolved to...

I volunteer to hold that position, DUmshit.

I think the Constitution that my Great Great Uncle established needs to be re-enshrined at the supreme law of this land, it's dictates inviolate by politicians, bureaucrats and subordinate laws alike.

I think that the 80% of federal agencies that exist outside of the "Article I, Section 8" established boundaries of the government should be immediately defunded and disbanded, "their" buildings and properties razed to the ground and their bureaucrat employees charged, convicted and hung for treason to the Constitution, based on their actions in support of a Constitutionally prohibited infringement upon the liberties and responsibilities of the citizenry.

I think that the Congress-shits - all of them, past and present - who in defiance of their oaths of office supported, enlarged and allowed this cancer on the ass of the United States to grow, fester and profit off the backs of the citizenry at large should be tried, convicted, and hung in gibbets in disgrace from lamp posts surrounding the Capitol Mall as a warning to the next generation of frauds and con artist politicians. They can be joined by the pResidents past and present who all aided in purpetuating this abortion upon the American citizenry.

I make no bones that I hold the entirety of the federal government as presently constituted utterly and completely in contempt. Come and get me, DUmmies...