Detroit's Collapse Reveals the Awful Dystopia

[zeitgeist]

I am a bit pressed for time but this thread and Cali' post deserve recognition.

http://upload.democraticunderground.com/10023301360#post1


I will leave the original OP at the link and just throw out Cali's response for all to see.     

cali (83,734 posts)

1. I don't believe that automation was a trick industrial capitalism played on AAs
 

That's just a by-product of industrial capitalism wherein people (workers, whatever their ethnicity) are simply unimportant and profit is all.

I'm not sure how much you can extrapolate from Detroit's dire straits: Other cities are still growing- if not "booming". The rust belt may not be unique but it's not wholly representative either.

The author doesn't actually explain how Detroit is a harbinger of things to come, but beyond that his solution is so laughably unrealistic that I was taken aback:

It seems to me that we need to abandon capitalism as production becomes detached from human labor. I think all robot labor should be nationalized and put in the public sector, and all citizens should receive a basic stipend from it. Then, if robots make an automobile, the profits will not go solely to a corporation that owns the robots, but rather to all the citizens. It wouldn’t be practical anyway for the robots to be making things for unemployed, penniless humans. Perhaps we need a 21st century version of ‘from all according to their abilities, to all according to their needs.’

Yeah, that's about as possible as my being elected President. It's irritating to see such pie in the sky "solutions" to real problems and the author compounds that by dissing the modest solutions (or not mentioning them) that are extant, albeit in embryonic form, in Detroit now.

The bottom line is that this is a ridiculous article that doesn't take into account any number of factors:

With robot labor, cheap wind and solar power, and a shrinking global population, post-2050 human beings could have universally high standards of living. They could put their energies into software creation, biotech, and artistic creativity, which are all sustainable. The stipend generated by robot labor would be a basic income for everyone, but they’d all be free to see if they could generate further income from entrepreneurship or creativity. And that everyone had a basic level of income would ensure that there were buyers for the extra goods or services. This future will depend on something like robot communalism, and an abandonment of racism, so that all members of the commune are equal and integrated into new, sustainable urban spaces.

That's just bullshit: It doesn't take into account human nature, history, global warming- to name a few. It's utopian dreaming and that has NEVER worked.

I expect more and smarter from Juan Cole.
 

I want my pony. Wa, wa, wa.   DUmmies don't know Capitalism from Cronyism nor excrement from shineola.

[Delmar]

Response to cali (Reply #4)Sat Jul 20, 2013, 08:35 AM
reformist2 (4,668 posts)
6. Actually, he's on the right track. A smaller and smaller fraction of adults will find employment


as we go forward, thanks to technology and globalism. This new "information economy" that Gingrich and others dreamed about, where everyone will be happily earning their livings by doing computer-y types of things, is not panning out.

Sharing the wealth seems like a perfectly reasonable idea to me.

Otherwise, if you're dumber than a robot you will starve.

[Skul]

Oh my, what a nice self-serving little communist. 
Up yours, cali. 

[Freeper]

Sharing the wealth seems like a perfectly reasonable idea to me.

You go first then. Share your wealth.

[jukin]

It's utopian dreaming and that has NEVER worked.

No, the Utopian dream of a Socialism that has never worked and Detroit is just the latest example. Detroit had the most magicalness of union domination of industry, total democrat control of the city government, and blacks exclusively at the helm of the city democrat party. This is what is happening at the federal level and I expect the same result.

[USA4ME]

... robot communalism...

Sounds kinky. 

.

[diesel driver]

What would cali and the DUmmies do when the robots unionize and refuse to work for the "stipend generated by their labor"?     

BTW, cali, solar and wind power is neither plentiful or cheap.  Gas, oil, and coal are.   

[obumazombie]

50 years of trying liberal socialist progressive policies to wreck Detroit, and what do libs think is the solution ? More of the same.

[98ZJUSMC]

http://www.mackinac.org/article.aspx?ID=10743

Imagine a city where all the major economic planks of the statist or “progressive” platform have been enacted:

•A “living wage” ordinance, far above the federal minimum wage, for all public employees and private contractors.
•A school system that spends significantly more per pupil than the national average.
•A powerful school employee union that militantly defends the exceptional pay, benefits and job security it has won for its members.
•A powerful government employee union that does the same for its members.
•A tax system that aggressively redistributes income from businesses and the wealthy to the poor and to government bureaucracies.

Would this be a shining city on a hill, exciting the admiration of all? We don’t have to guess, because there is such a city right here in our state: Detroit

Detroit has been dubbed “the most liberal city in America” and each of these “progressive” policies is alive and well there. How have they worked out?

In 1950, Detroit was the wealthiest city in America on a per capita income basis. Today, the Census Bureau reports that it is the nation’s 2nd poorest major city, just “edging out” Cleveland.

Suck on it, (D)Ummies and



Robots aren't going to change shit, asshat.

[miskie]

Sounds kinky. 

.

You best not be one of 'dem robosexuals !

[zeitgeist]

http://www.mackinac.org/article.aspx?ID=10743

Suck on it, (D)Ummies and



Robots aren't going to change shit, asshat.

I ran across another DUmp screed where a Dummy, Fargo Kid, IIRC was going on about what killed the Motor City.  White flight.  That's right, white flight.  Apparently Detroit's middle class refused to shoulder the 'white man's burden'  or something like that.  DU ~ home of the subtle bigotry of low expectations; Where the uneducated and unaware meet to back slap and perpetuate the myth among themselves that they are the best and brightest of their generation.  Sadly, if Detroit is any example, they may just be right,  they may be the very best rotten apples in the barrel.  Time will tell if contagion will ensue from the fall of Detroit.  Public pension fund problems have been looming just below the surface for years.  The tsunami is coming soon to a Union Hall near you.  It will not be pretty.  The glow bull warming crowd need to investigate the 'sustainability' of public pensions, that will really give them something to worry about going forward. 

As an aside, I would note many liberals seem to believe that they will be able to live off the largess of the inheritance from mom and dad, thanks to Obama Care and social insurance.  But with housing prices at record lows, and mom and pop's medical expenses at record highs that 'cushion' has largely been eroded.  They who have 'banked' on the mom and pop payday are in for a rude awakening.  I know quite a few that thought they didn't need to save and invest, that they would be able to 'write the great American Novel' while sipping Margaritas on the Keys after they sold off mom and pops assets. Guess what it doesn't always work out like that.  Obama care will let me quit my job and go do my thing.  is a recurring theme many DUmmies seem to believe.  Their business plan is like that of the 'pie lady', they believe the world will beat a path to their door, their novel, art, or, knitting project will put them on easy street.   

[SSG Snuggle Bunny]

So robots do all the work while we sit around trading woven basks for bead art.

[obumazombie]

So robots do all the work while we sit around trading woven basks for bead art.

Don't knock it. $24 of that kind of trinkets bought Manhattan !

[GCBill]

I ran across another DUmp screed where a Dummy, Fargo Kid, IIRC was going on about what killed the Motor City.  White flight.  That's right, white flight.  Apparently Detroit's middle class refused to shoulder the 'white man's burden'  or something like that.  DU ~ home of the subtle bigotry of low expectations; Where the uneducated and unaware meet to back slap and perpetuate the myth among themselves that they are the best and brightest of their generation.  Sadly, if Detroit is any example, they may just be right,  they may be the very best rotten apples in the barrel.  Time will tell if contagion will ensue from the fall of Detroit.  Public pension fund problems have been looming just below the surface for years.  The tsunami is coming soon to a Union Hall near you.  It will not be pretty.  The glow bull warming crowd need to investigate the 'sustainability' of public pensions, that will really give them something to worry about going forward. 

White people leaving Detroit (white flight) was horrible racism. Shame on them.

White people moving to Detroit (gentrification) is horrible racism. Shame on them.

And all those white volunteers going to Blightmoor and cleaning up the garbage and weeds? WTF is wrong with them? If Detroit isn't full of decay and abandoned buildings, how are the peepoles going to be able to afford to live there?