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dsc (37,140 posts) Sun Sep 16, 2012, 01:27 PMI cried at church todayAt church today we had a sermon I had been looking forward too about King David's love life. It was a great sermon centered on the scene in the Bible where Saul loses it with Jonathan over his covenant with David. After the sermon we have a prayer where people in the congregation state their concerns and blessings at a microphone. This older lesbian took the microphone and started telling the story of a 20 year old cousin. The cousin had reached out to her because she wanted advice on living her life openly. She then told her parents she was gay and was rejected, just as the older woman had decades ago, and took an overdose of pills and is now in a coma. The lady who told the story is banned from seeing the younger woman. What I had hoped would be a coming out story turned into a horribly sad story of attempted suicide brought on by religiously inspired hatred. So I cried at church today.I also thought of this thread I posted last night.http://www.democraticunderground.com/10021352109In the thread I posit the notion that Ambassador Stevens might be gay and all hell broke loose. I was accused of defaming him with gayness compared to alcoholism and cheating on women. Now in the case Stevens we have an unmarried male who has not been associated with any woman romantically. If he were gay he would have not been harming any woman via lying or living a sham marriage. He wouldn't have been having affairs behind people's back. In short he would have been a pretty typical gay male living his life. Yet merely stating that this hero might be gay was considered defamation like calling him a two timer.If a liberal website considers gayness akin to drunkeness or being a sleezy operator why wouldn't we expect conservative pentacostals to reject their children?So yes I cried at church today.
Tigress DEM (5,982 posts) Sun Sep 16, 2012, 01:32 PM1. (((DSC)))It's a complex world.
RobertEarl (1,151 posts) Sun Sep 16, 2012, 02:17 PM17. It is complexAnd when sex becomes the current issue - watch out!Everybody does it but few want to discuss it.In fact, free-speech about sex is the most regulated speech there is. Eh?
Vinnie From Indy (8,223 posts) Sun Sep 16, 2012, 01:38 PM2. What motivated you to offer that Stevens might be gay?Do you run everyone through your gay/not gay matrix and offer your verdict to the public?
dsc (37,140 posts) Sun Sep 16, 2012, 01:44 PM3. I explained in the linked thread which you clearly didn't bother to read.
Vinnie From Indy (8,223 posts) Sun Sep 16, 2012, 01:53 PM6. I did read itYou offer that you were doing some "research" into whether Stevens might be gay. Since you do not mention what research you actually did beyond stereotyping a single middle aged man I am left to wonder why you posted your post last night and then rehashed it again today.In short, your "speculation" based on nothing more than stereotypical nonsense is, I believe, demeaning and actually hurts the cause of gay rights.
RebelOne (24,593 posts) Sun Sep 16, 2012, 02:08 PM13. Who cares? The man is dead.
joeybee12 (38,694 posts) Sun Sep 16, 2012, 01:44 PM4. And this is the sort of sh*t that makes DU unbearable at times...Shame on you.
Vinnie From Indy (8,223 posts) Sun Sep 16, 2012, 01:55 PM7. Right back at you!Fact free one liner replies do sometimes make DU unbearable.Cheers!
joeybee12 (38,694 posts) Sun Sep 16, 2012, 02:08 PM12. If I wrote what I really think of what you spewed, I'd get banned...So rethink what you wrote and try to learn something.
RobertEarl (1,151 posts) Sun Sep 16, 2012, 02:14 PM16. Limting your free speech?Is that a good thing to have to do? To let others decide what words of yours are to be displayed?
renie408 (8,291 posts) Sun Sep 16, 2012, 02:19 PM19. You mean like banning him if he actually said what he thinks?
RobertEarl (1,151 posts) Sun Sep 16, 2012, 02:29 PM24. Banning?Some folks just can't express themselves while constraining to the mores of their listeners.It all comes down to self-control, doesn't it?
joeybee12 (38,694 posts) Sun Sep 16, 2012, 02:32 PM27. You're new so I assume that while you appear to be wanting to pick a fight...It's just your curiosity...people get banned for all sorts of things some might consider mild
Lex (30,450 posts) Sun Sep 16, 2012, 01:45 PM5. What difference does it make to ask the question? What if he had wondered if he were from Cleveland?It's not a slur.
hlthe2b (43,882 posts) Sun Sep 16, 2012, 02:07 PM11. dsc... I am touched by your story you related. But, I can well imagine why some reacted poorly to speculation that the ambassador was gay and I do not believe that reaction has anything to do with thinking being gay is "wrong" or something that should bring shame.I think most feel it is no more our business than would be our wondering how much money he made, details of his health, or anything else that is uniquely personal.I suspect others may also be wondering if you were about to tie his sad death to some kind of LGBT-hate motivation on the part of the attackers. That, alone would have particularly disturbed me, since that would have been a level of speculation that could only inflame further.I think you are drawing very wrong conclusions from your experience with your thread.
joeybee12 (38,694 posts) Sun Sep 16, 2012, 02:31 PM25. I don't think so...the OP started out innocently enough...But the viciousness with which he was attacked for saying he was wrong was over the top.
Auntie Bush (13,469 posts) Sun Sep 16, 2012, 01:56 PM8. Being gay is still looked down upon by many ignorant or ill informed people andI think it was unnecessary to rat out Stevens while he was being buried. If he was gay..it was obviously his choice NOT to make it public.Sorry, but it was not your prerogative to 'out him' or make people wonder. But, I'm sorry you are crying! Things don't always work out like we'd like them to and I'm sure your motive were pure.
dtom67 (167 posts) Sun Sep 16, 2012, 02:06 PM10. You are quite right....most of us here ( and I include myself ) would not consider ourselves to be anti-gay or bigots of any kind. However, we all have that primitive fear of "those who are not like Us ", and it does have some effect. For example, if we see a skit on TV where an actor is acting like a stereotypical homosexual character ( Charles Nelson Riley or Paul Lind ) , we laugh even though nothing funny has been said. If we hear " gay|" joke , we laugh.If you put me ( a middle-aged, middle-class white male { who does not make 250k/year}) in a room with 100 young black men who speak like stereotypical " gangsta's ", I would be uncomfortable. If you put me in a room with 100 young black men who were wearing Izod sweaters and talking like college students, I would feel less so.I think it is perfectly natural to be uncomfortable around those that are different from ones' self; The best we can do is to acknowledge that the fear is not an excuse to treat our brothers and sisters with anything but respect. And to make sure the next generation improves on this idea...
southernyankeebelle (7,389 posts) Sun Sep 16, 2012, 02:10 PM15. You know what bothers me? I have no problems letting people live their own lives. After all we all have but one life and we should be entitled to happiness. It shouldn't matter who you love. But just because a person never married doesn't make them gay. I have a sister who nevered married. She never married because she hasn't found the right person for her. She came close once but it ended because she was in her early 20s and she wasn't ready yet. She said when she married it would be for life and wouldn't settle for what she saw in some of the cases that came into her office. She is now 64 and she said she will never marry. She said she has no regrets that she is lucky that she has lots of nieces and nephews. She is happy. Remember not all people want to marry.
MineralMan (46,653 posts) Sun Sep 16, 2012, 02:22 PM21. But you're opposed to breastfeeding in public, as I remember from a number of threads. So, I'm having a small problem with your "letting people live their own lives" statement.I'm not surprised that a person who is gay would look to see if this ambassador might be gay. I can't see any problem with doing that research. No problem with it at all. It doesn't matter to me if he was gay, but I can see how it would be of interest to the LGBT community. Can't you?
ibegurpard (10,737 posts) Sun Sep 16, 2012, 02:32 PM26. you weren't accused of defaming himyou were accusing of outing a dead man who can't speak for himself...a despicable practice that should only be used on hypocritical closet cases who actively work against equality for gays and lesbians.Your doubling-down and play for sympathy here is offensive to me.We have plenty of courageous openly gay men and women who are making positive change all around us...let's celebrate them instead of trying to hitch our wagon to someone who may not have even been one of us shall we?/unrec
You couldn't make up comedy scenes this good.
that gives me an idea, DU: The movie
"Sodomy Gone A Rear" The raw hard story of love and lust gone wrong at the DUmp?
