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Offline franksolich

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reactionary primitives discuss American Airlines
« on: February 03, 2012, 07:52:17 AM »
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x2475875

Oh my.

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DainBramaged Donating Member (1000+ posts)  Thu Feb-02-12 08:24 AM
Original message

Work all of your life, lose your pension and health benefits to cost-cutting
   
**** you American Airlines, and **** all of the golden-parachute enabled ****ing CEOs who in history, will only be remembered for destroying America not building it.

**** you Republican **** Capitalist ****s. **** you.

I wonder if anyone besides me has noticed the brain-damaged primitive's been stuck on the "****" word for quite a while now.

One wonders if it has anything to do with his problems with the Internal Revenue Service.

It couldn't happen to a nicer guy, and one hopes they get him good.

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NYC_SKP DU Moderator Donating Member (1000+ posts)  Thu Feb-02-12 09:49 AM
Response to Original message

1. If only it was just American Airlines. You know what they're doing?
   
As they chip away at what used to be seen as rock-solid fundamental values, like pensions...

...it opens the door to people thinking, "**** pensions and social security, can't trust em!".

Gimme some of that "George Bush suggested personal retirement investment stuff".

ARGH!

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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Thu Feb-02-12 10:32 AM
Response to Reply #1

3. +1 AND they are putting their money in their coffers at the same time as they undermine the systems
   
"I'm stealing your money and now I have more of your money to spend on what I want to spend it on and you do not have it.

"That proves you can't trust me, er, I mean, that proves you can't trust the system. (Yeah, the system. That's it. That's the ticket!)

"Unless, of course, it is the system that I want you to trust this week.

"And this week, the system that I want you to trust is Wall Street.

After all, what could possibly go wrong with Wall Street holding all your retirement money?"

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KoKo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Thu Feb-02-12 03:44 PM
Response to Reply #1

5. Good Points....
   
It's hard to believe that folks wouldn't see what's going on and how Wall St. Crooks caused much of what's going on...but, sometimes folks just can't connect the dots when all they watch is MSM propaganda.

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Curmudgeoness Donating Member (1000+ posts) Thu Feb-02-12 09:06 PM
Response to Reply #5
10. I have almost given up on all of humanity.
   
Not only are many people unable to connect the dots, but they cannot even think through the most fundamental issues of the day.

Sigh.

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Puglover Donating Member (1000+ posts) Thu Feb-02-12 10:17 AM
Response to Original message

2. If AA is any thing like NWA.
   
Our pensions were frozen when they declared bankrupcy but we didn't lose them. I had 28 years of pension at that time. They still fund them and I collect a pension check monthly.

As far as health benefits, I think we went from paying nothing for the plan to paying 65.00 a month or so.

NWA always had a deal that if you retired at 55 or after they covered 1/2 of your health plan up to 65. When I took the buyout I got that deal. But non union Delta doesn't offer it. Also Delta's pensions are tied to Social Security. Meaning they can take one or the other. I get both. Because of the unions. Which Delta has sucessfully busted.

The flight attendants got rid of the union by less then 200 votes. Voting was done on Deltas computer system. Of course that election was squeeky clean.

All this said I totally agree with your post.

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Puglover Donating Member (1000+ posts) Thu Feb-02-12 02:22 PM
Response to Original message

4. They just had a FA from AA on Ed.
   
It sounds as if the ****ers are going to try to take everything. Unbelievable.

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KoKo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Thu Feb-02-12 03:55 PM
Response to Reply #4

6. I have a relative who is a 20year AA employee.
   
Most folks don't realize how bad the airline industry has been screwing employees. He just got trained on a the bigger jet after having to wait for 7 years because of a complicated "flow through system" that AA had which is so complicated I still can't understand how it works. He spent six weeks away from his family last Spring to do his training in Dallas and finally got a raise after almost 10 years and now he thinks he will probably be out of work. He flies for Eagle on the Regional jets which American owns. The word is that American wants to dump Eagle and cut routes on it's AA schedule. The fate of the Eagle pilots is unknown.

People think Airline pilots make a lot of money. Some at the top do but through the years the salaries have been eroded. And the "seniority system" in the Airlines is so tight that to advance through the ranks is difficult to do. Many of the Vietnam era pilots are still flying and that leaves less room for advancement from the new hires. Plus all the layoffs and mergers of the last years means too many pilots for two few slots.

It's not the glamorous lifestyle it was in the 50's thru the early 70's. It sucks for the passengers and for the flight crew and pilots given the condition of the planes and the hub routes they have to fly.

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Puglover Donating Member (1000+ posts) Thu Feb-02-12 05:53 PM
Response to Reply #6

7. When I started for NWA in 1979 it was a great job.
   
We had like 3 VP's for the entire company. You never saw one. We owned ALL our own aircraft. We were the most cash solvent and safe airline out there. And all of the people who ran the company were airline people. They were a tough company to work for but I was thrilled to be with them. Non revving was a blast. We would go to Seoul to shop. And always get first class.

The Republic buyout was a disaster. I still swear management ****ed it all up on purpose. But after 255 went down in DTW people sorta got out of the NWA/RC feuding and things came together.

Then slimewad Al Checci did his leveraged buyout. And brought in his pencil pushers. All with a slick smile and suit and not a clue how an airline worked. And that has been the corporate climate ever since. It doesn't work. The ONLY reason Delta rolls along is simply because it is gargantuan. It's sad. I feel awfully bad for those folks. Believe me I've been through it. The horror is only beginning.

Oh and BTW when I left the company in 2009 we had 275 VP's. The place was crawling with them.

Sounds like the way government works, especially since January 20, 2009.

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KoKo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Thu Feb-02-12 07:37 PM
Response to Reply #7

9. Thanks for your post on this... When the "Bean Counters Come In" they own it and do what they want. We just are waking up to what the Corporate Control and Hedge Fund and other's take overs are doing to our American Work Force. And, they have their claws into the Union Management..but we Dems are supposed to Suck Up that All Union is good..when it's the Management that's the Evil ones!

Yet we DEMS MUST SUPPORT the MANAGEMENT! (so they can do the big deals to sell the workers out) and the UNIONS because in "some years past in the 30's" the Union Management worked for the workers. SCI-FI, ANYONE?
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Offline NHSparky

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Re: reactionary primitives discuss American Airlines
« Reply #1 on: February 03, 2012, 08:14:40 AM »
Seems to me that American was the LAST major airline post-9/11 to declare bankruptcy.  The fact they made it 10 years, especially in this O-conomy, should tell you something, DUmmies.
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Offline Skul

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Re: reactionary primitives discuss American Airlines
« Reply #2 on: February 03, 2012, 10:41:17 AM »
Quote from: NHSparky on February 03, 2012, 08:14:40 AM
Seems to me that American was the LAST major airline post-9/11 to declare bankruptcy.  The fact they made it 10 years, especially in this O-conomy, should tell you something, DUmmies.
Continental did not.
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Offline NHSparky

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Re: reactionary primitives discuss American Airlines
« Reply #3 on: February 03, 2012, 10:47:25 AM »
Quote from: Skul on February 03, 2012, 10:41:17 AM
Continental did not.

Thank you.  I stand corrected.  I was remembering what I had heard, so either they didn't include Continental as "major" or just forgot it.

However, look at it this way...(disclaimer, had to nadin it)

http://www.foxbusiness.com/travel/2011/11/29/history-us-airline-bankruptcies/

Continental did file, but back in 1990.
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Offline Skul

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Re: reactionary primitives discuss American Airlines
« Reply #4 on: February 03, 2012, 10:57:14 AM »
Quote from: NHSparky on February 03, 2012, 10:47:25 AM
Thank you.  I stand corrected.  I was remembering what I had heard, so either they didn't include Continental as "major" or just forgot it.

However, look at it this way...(disclaimer, had to nadin it)

http://www.foxbusiness.com/travel/2011/11/29/history-us-airline-bankruptcies/

Continental did file, but back in 1990.
Yup. Turned it into a success afterwards.
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Offline wasp69

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Re: reactionary primitives discuss American Airlines
« Reply #5 on: February 03, 2012, 01:07:41 PM »
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DainBramaged Donating Member (1000+ posts)  Thu Feb-02-12 08:24 AM
Original message

Work all of your life, lose your pension and health benefits to cost-cutting

Work all of your life, depend on someone else for the two most important things in your older age, win stupid prizes.

Sorry, DUmmie, my future is up to me, not a corporation.

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Puglover Donating Member (1000+ posts) Thu Feb-02-12 10:17 AM
Response to Original message

2. If AA is any thing like NWA.
   
Our pensions were frozen when they declared bankrupcy but we didn't lose them. I had 28 years of pension at that time. They still fund them and I collect a pension check monthly.

As far as health benefits, I think we went from paying nothing for the plan to paying 65.00 a month or so.

NWA always had a deal that if you retired at 55 or after they covered 1/2 of your health plan up to 65. When I took the buyout I got that deal. But non union Delta doesn't offer it. Also Delta's pensions are tied to Social Security. Meaning they can take one or the other. I get both. Because of the unions. Which Delta has sucessfully busted.

Another union scumbag stealing my tax dollars...   :whatever:

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NYC_SKP DU Moderator Donating Member (1000+ posts)  Thu Feb-02-12 09:49 AM
Response to Original message

1. If only it was just American Airlines. You know what they're doing?
   
As they chip away at what used to be seen as rock-solid fundamental values, like pensions...

Pensions are not "values", you stupid mother****er. 

Personally, I'll take "it's my responsibility" over "why did you do this to me?" any day of the week.  Less links in the chain, the stronger the chain.  Learn it, love it, live it.  It's your responsibility to set up income streams for yourself, stupid, not someone else.
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Offline NHSparky

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Re: reactionary primitives discuss American Airlines
« Reply #6 on: February 03, 2012, 01:42:15 PM »
And they wonder why union membership is at the lowest point damn near ever.

Memo to DUmmies--I'm in a union.  I do not, nor will I, rely upon them for my pension or for any sort of income in retirement.  I have my own cash balance plan, my own 401(k), a small IRA, and any equity I'll eventually build up in my home.  That's on top of whatever I get from SS, which at this point, I'm anticipating to be a big whopping ZERO.

IOW, if you fail to plan, you plan to fail. 
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Offline delilahmused

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Re: reactionary primitives discuss American Airlines
« Reply #7 on: February 03, 2012, 02:01:50 PM »
So does BrainDamaged have any real ties to AA or is this just general DUmmie "I need to be find something to be outraged about today"?

Cindie
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Offline BEG

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Re: reactionary primitives discuss American Airlines
« Reply #8 on: February 03, 2012, 02:07:06 PM »
Dainbramaged= ****ing **** ****  :panic: :panic: :panic: :panic: :panic:
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Offline franksolich

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Re: reactionary primitives discuss American Airlines
« Reply #9 on: February 03, 2012, 02:18:03 PM »
Quote from: delilahmused on February 03, 2012, 02:01:50 PM
So does BrainDamaged have any real ties to AA or is this just general DUmmie "I need to be find something to be outraged about today"?

Cindie

The latter.

I swear, a lobotomy would do him some good.
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Milo Yiannopoulos "It has been obvious since 2016 that Trump carries an anointing of some kind. My American friends, are you so blind to reason, and deaf to Heaven? Can he do all this, and cannot get a crown? This man is your King. Coronate him, and watch every devil shriek, and every demon howl."

Offline jukin

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Re: reactionary primitives discuss American Airlines
« Reply #10 on: February 03, 2012, 02:45:26 PM »
I have a very low Advantage card number and a lifetime card to the Admirals Club. If bankruptcy screws me on that I will be very pissed off.
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Offline Maxiest

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Re: reactionary primitives discuss American Airlines
« Reply #11 on: February 03, 2012, 03:09:13 PM »
Quote from: jukin on February 03, 2012, 02:45:26 PM
I have a very low Advantage card number and a lifetime card to the Admirals Club. If bankruptcy screws me on that I will be very pissed off.

****ing 1%er

 :rotf:

Anyway, I have one word for you ****ing **** brained mother****ers UNIONS
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