Teachers: The new target.

[thundley4]

somone (1000+ posts)           Mon Jan-31-11 09:07 PM
Original message
GOP Governors Take Aim at Teacher Tenure (NYT)
   
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/02/01/us/01tenure.html

G.O.P. Governors Take Aim at Teacher Tenure
By TRIP GABRIEL and SAM DILLON

Channeling a national anxiety over poor student performance, many governors are taking aim at a bedrock tradition of public schools: teacher tenure. The momentum began over a year ago with President Obama’s call to measure and reward effective teaching, a challenge he repeated in last week’s State of the Union address.

Now several Republican governors have concluded that removing ineffective teachers requires undoing the century-old protections of tenure. Governors in Florida, Idaho, Indiana, Nevada and New Jersey have called for the elimination or dismantling of tenure. As state legislatures convene this winter, anti-tenure bills are being written in those states and others. Their chances of passing have risen because of crushing state budget deficits that have put teachers’ unions on the defensive.

“It’s practically impossible to remove an underperforming teacher under the system we have now,” said Gov. Brian Sandoval of Nevada, lamenting that his state has the lowest high school graduation rate in the nation. Eliminating tenure, Mr. Sandoval said, would allow school districts to dismiss teachers based on competence, not seniority, in the event of layoffs.

Politics also play a role. “These new Republican governors are all trying to outreform one another,” said Michael Petrilli, an education official under President George W. Bush. In New York City, Mayor Michael R. Bloomberg has campaigned aggressively for the state to end “last in, first out” protections for teachers. Warning that thousands of young educators face layoffs, Mr. Bloomberg is demanding that Gov. Andrew M. Cuomo scrap the seniority law if the budget he will unveil Tuesday includes state cuts to education...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x317890

davidinalameda   (1000+ posts)           Mon Jan-31-11 09:13 PM
Response to Original message
1. it is difficult to remove a bad teacher
   
that's one of the biggest complaints about teachers' unions

something needs to be done to make it easier to fire bad teachers

ALERT !!!!!

dsc   (1000+ posts)             Mon Jan-31-11 09:15 PM
Response to Reply #1
4. that is total nonsense
   
In my school alone, we have had 3 teachers removed in the first semester. I don't think any of them deserved it BTW but in any case it belies the notion it is that hard to get rid of teachers.

But, did they have tenure?

davidinalameda   (1000+ posts)           Mon Jan-31-11 09:22 PM
Response to Reply #4
8. bullshit
   
three teachers in one schools is not a trend when you have schools systems across the country having teachers removed from the classroom yet still pulling in paychecks waiting for their hearings or whatever

ALERT !!! ALERT !!!

dsc   (1000+ posts)             Mon Jan-31-11 09:24 PM
Response to Reply #8
9. so you think that teachers should just be able to be up and fired
   
with no hearing whatsoever. So say Billy gets and F, a well earned F, cries to his parent who calls the school and says Mr. Smith called my boy a (fill in the blank). Teacher should be fired, no investigation, no nothing. Good luck staffing classrooms.

Strawman argument.

dsc   (1000+ posts)             Mon Jan-31-11 09:14 PM
Response to Original message
2. without tenure you will never have a teacher buck a principal
   
If a principal doesn't want a GSA in her school, there won't be one. If a principal wants the quarterback to get an A even if he did no work, he will get one. If a principal doesn't want the bio teacher to teach evolution, she won't. That is what a world without tenure will look like. Plus, the layoffs will magically occur among the oldest, and thus most expensive, teachers.

Since when do principles fire teachers?

brooklynite   (1000+ posts)           Mon Jan-31-11 09:16 PM
Response to Original message
5. I'm not a supporter of tenure...
   
I've worked in the public sector for 27 years, and have never had job protection. I've been promoted seven times based on my abilities. Some people in my organization have been promoted faster; others have done exactly their job, no more, and have pretty much remained where they were for 20 years. If you've got a good argument for tenure and seniority, I'd love to hear it because nobody's given me a convincing one.

That's a good argument against unions in general.

[jukin]

Not only have we had great a technology revolution that made every industry but education. Not only do we spend almost ten times more in inflation adjusted dollars but we have received absolutely NO improvement in the last fifty years in test scores. But gosh darn it the kids have great self-esteam, think big government is the answer, and that the USA is the root of all evil in the world.

[AllosaursRus]

Until DOE is completely removed from the taxpayers dime, we're not goin' to see improvement, period!

Schools and School districts are competing for Uncle Sam's dollar, not on how well they educate!The only way to turn it around is drop the DOE!

What sense does it make for the states to send money to DC via our taxes only to turn right around and send it back via the DOE???? None! Let the states collect the revenue and spend it within their cities and counties! Stream line the thing so parents are once again in charge! I have a helluva lot more clout down at the County Commissioners office than I do in that bureaucratic cesspool in DC!

[JohnnyReb]

I'm kinda gonna highjack the thread a sec.

Son was scolded yesterday by his European History teacher. He had "Socialism is evil and politicians are.....(something)" scribbled on the front of his notebook. A girl in the class asked him what was wrong with socialism and why did he hate it so much. He was explaining it to her when the teacher got involved and told him to remove it because it might offend some people.

  You should have heard the vulgarity I told him to write on the notebook and check it with his teacher to see if she approved.

 

OH!... and one other thing. Saw several pregnant girls and one in particular, a very pregnant one. I told son that when I went to school they wouldn't have been allowed to attend school. Also told him only 2 girls got pregnant that I knew of in my entire 12 year school time. He tells me, "She's always pregnant. That's the forth one she's working on."

....and the DUmmies say we need more sex education in the schools. They may be right...some don't seem to know what causes stomach swelling.

[SSG Snuggle Bunny]

madfloridian, dsc and p2blk are fightiing losing battles over there.

They report EVERY teacher story in the US, no matter how obscure and are so obnoxious to even the most innocent questions they alienate the very audience they are attempting to attention-whore from. Even people who support unions by rote are sick of their shit.

We are watching the death knell of public unions in microcosm.

[formerlurker]

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x317890

Since when do principles fire teachers?
.

Exactly.  Another testament to how hard it is to get rid of a teacher.  The superintendent has to fire a teacher, after many levels of disciplinary action/appeals.

It is near impossible to fire a teacher with tenure/professional status.

[VivisMom]

Son was scolded yesterday by his European History teacher. He had "Socialism is evil and politicians are.....(something)" scribbled on the front of his notebook. A girl in the class asked him what was wrong with socialism and why did he hate it so much. He was explaining it to her when the teacher got involved and told him to remove it because it might offend some people.

That's the problem...it was the social studies teacher! Teachers are always more inclined to be liberal, but the social studies teachers are almost guaranteed to be moonbats. (I should know, I was the lone conservative in my department.)

I hope you told him to 1) not remove it and 2) demand the teacher point out to him where it says in the school code of conduct that he may not decorate his notebook in any manner he chooses. Frankly, that's a pretty petty thing for the teacher to zero in on.

[njpines]

That's the problem...it was the social studies teacher! Teachers are always more inclined to be liberal, but the social studies teachers are almost guaranteed to be moonbats. (I should know, I was the lone conservative in my department.)

Pam/Greenbriar/demtenjeep is a social(ism) studies teacher . . . 'nuff said!

[Karin]

JohnnyReb, not a hijack, thanks for the story.  I would have gone f***in ballistic on that teacher.  But then again, I think socialism is a dirty word.  Silly me. 

Sgt Bunny, I liked your post.