Trump was elected because some people just didn't want to vote for Hillary

[dutch508]

edhopper (24,875 posts)
https://www.democraticunderground.com/100213747398

Trump was elected because some people just didn't want to vote for Hillary, or so we were told.
But now when so many people just won't vote for Trump, we are told that Biden can only win if he gives people a reason to support him, not just vote against Trump.
So which is it?

The truth is when there is an incumbent, it is always a referendum on them.

 

StevieM (9,615 posts)

1. The truth is that Hillary got swift boated.

Although nobody seems to remember it anymore, even here on DU, she had been the most popular public figure in America for years. Not just high job approval ratings--high personal favorability.

Then they swift boated the hell out of her. They capitalized on a terrorist attack. They corrupted the FBI and the State Department Inspector General's office, and especially Intelligence Community Inspector General's office. They even targeted a world-renowned charity that has saved millions of lives around the world.

Hopefully it will be harder to swift boat Biden this time around, partly because their latest round of tricks has been seen already, and it will take awhile to get the new ones up to code. But mostly because, to be perfectly blunt, he isn't a woman. Sadly, it is much easier to swift boat women.

 

Star Member Hoyt (44,106 posts)

4. Unfortunately, the swiftboating was not just GOPers. Whatever, hope it doesn't happen again.

Jeebo (719 posts)

7. She was swift-boated relentlessly for 30 years.

Starting way back when she was Arkansas first lady. One man I know told me he voted for that orange con man because "I considered the alternative". I don't understand how ANYBODY can think that arrogant liar is preferable to her, but when enough people spend decades pointing their fingers at somebody and yelling, "Whitewater!" "Ben Ghazi!" "Crooked Hillary!" "Lock her up!" eventually it builds up in the collective unconscious of the electorate. That there are so many people who distrust her so profoundly is because of long-term subliminal indoctrination. Unfortunately, it worked in 2016.

-- Ron

 

Star Member brush (29,067 posts)

2. This is a referendum on trump's record. It's not a good one...

and there's no misogynistic, I-can't-vote-for-Hillary feeling out there so Biden should do well.

Especially with 200,000 covid deaths by Nov. 3.

To paraphrase legendary boxer Joe Louis about an upcoming opponent—"He can run but he can't hide"—from those covid deaths.

soothsayer (18,622 posts)

3. Also, the idea of a female president was like masks are to maskholes.

In fact, there’s probably significant overlap in those populations.

Men with mommy issues (I think) thought Hillary sounded bossy. Being asked to cover your face feels like being punished or restricted or maybe treated like a child to some folks, who then act like defiant, bratty children.

We’re not a mature enough nation to handle a woman as president. It’s so stupid.

So... Joe doesn’t have that nonsense working against him. Plus the “idea” of a swamp-draining businessman outsider didn’t really pan out. So yeah, the incumbent thing matters.

Star Member Olafjoy (581 posts)

6. Amongst people I know there is HUGE motivation to vote against Trump

We canvassed for the midterms (2018) and an overwhelming number of people we talked to said they wanted their votes to be a referendum on Trump. Still will work very hard on GOTV but people I talk to have rage and hatred. They are very motivated (Arizona).

Awsi Dooger (13,419 posts)

9. Hillary was slightly more popular than unpopular for a long time

That was her baseline, roughly 2-5% more favorable than unfavorable. She certainly would have been elected in 2008.

Hillary's surge in popularity was during Obama's first term. I really didn't put much stock in it because I always believe in big picture and long term, not short term trivia. When there is a spike like that after a long established tendency, the likelihood is that it will recoil instead of climbing even more.

I am surprised at Hillary's sharp drop in popularity since the election defeat. Eventually it will come back upward:

https://medium.com/@PollsAndVotes/hillary-clinton-favorability-1993-2019-95ab99c35d49

On edit: not sure why that link isn't taking fully. Might have to copy and paste in a browser window. It is a Charles Franklin article

Caliman73 (6,480 posts)

10. Trump was "elected" for many reasons. One of which was definitely sentiment about Hillary.

Hillary Clinton is the politician treated most unfairly in the last 40 years. She did nothing to deserve the hatred and vitriol she had to endure from the right, and from the far left. She was a center left candidate with decent progressive policy credentials, but she was demonized as a radical leftist by the right and as a corporate moderate republican from the left. The baggage that was unfairly placed on her, which includes misogyny, made it possible for the Republicans to cheat enough to win the electoral college.

In any election you have to motivate your base and those relatively uninformed and apathetic voters to come out and vote. That doesn't mean just voting against someone, but voting for which candidate and which party are going to make your life better.

You are right that this election is a referendum on Trump and what he has done for the American people. Trump however, is a shameless liar and a cheater, and he will do whatever he can to hold on to power.

Star Member Sancho (8,013 posts)

12. It was a combination...and "not voting for a woman" was only part of the issue...

I blame the majority of the loss to election manipulation of the votes!!

At least in Florida, the GOP hacks the DREs, hides mailed ballots, hangs chads, and messes with the tabulators.

Registration is an issue, and so is access to polling places - but for 20+ years the repubs have literally altered the count in key states in different ways.

All they have to do is fix a few key votes in a few key states and they win another election.

 

[Carl]

What is the name of the alternate universe they live in?

[jukin]

The. Smartest. People. On. The. Internet.

Just ask them.

[Wineslob]

What is the name of the alternate universe they live in?

Bizarro World

[SVPete]

StevieM (9,615 posts)

1. The truth is that Hillary got swift boated.

Well, if this bogey-epithet means truths were told that Hillary did not want told, OK.

Star Member Sancho (8,013 posts)
...
At least in Florida, the GOP hacks the DREs, hides mailed ballots, hangs chads, and messes with the tabulators.

The infamous "hanging chads" were in a Dem-run county whose incompetent Dem elections supervisor failed to maintain voting machines to the point that the trays for punched out chads were full.

"Messes with" is Prog-Speak for "watching for Dem cheating".

I assume the other two claims are similarly bogus.

[USA4ME]

The funniest part to me is how Hillary has fooled these dimwits into believing she's a victim. I mean, if you're stupid enough to believe that, you're stupid enough to believe anything.

.