The Conservative Cave
Current Events => Economics => Topic started by: Chris_ on July 05, 2014, 10:15:39 PM
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Wall Street adviser: Actual unemployment is 37.2%, 'misery index' worst in 40 years
In a memo (http://www.emarotta.com/should-we-wallow-in-the-rising-stock-market/) to clients provided to Secrets, David John Marotta calculates the actual unemployment rate of those not working at a sky-high 37.2 percent, not the 6.7 percent advertised by the Fed, and the Misery Index at over 14, not the 8 claimed by the government.
“Unemployment in its truest definition, meaning the portion of people who do not have any job, is 37.2 percent. This number obviously includes some people who are not or never plan to seek employment. But it does describe how many people are not able to, do not want to or cannot find a way to work. Policies that remove the barriers to employment, thus decreasing this number, are obviously beneficial,†he and colleague Megan Russell in their new investors note from their offices in Charlottesville, Va.
They added that “officially-reported unemployment numbers decrease when enough time passes to discourage the unemployed from looking for work. A decrease is not necessarily beneficial; an increase is clearly detrimental.â€
Washington Examiner (http://washingtonexaminer.com/article/2542604)
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If a repub was in office... you would see it on the nightly news every nite.
Too bad for the dems/MSM that reality cannot be spinned no matter how they try.
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By the time Obama gets out of office my health care premiums will be higher then my take home pay and I will owe my company money and won't have any other place to find a job.
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By the time Obama leaves office, I'll be glad if I still have a job.
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"the actual unemployment rate of those not working at a sky-high 37.2 percent"
I'd say the actual unemployment rate of those not working would be 100%, yes? Anyway, that 37.2% figure is probably based on some real creative accounting methods. There's no need to cook the books. The actual unemployment rate here in Southern Colorado is close to 18%. Isn't that bad enough? The democrats won't be happy until the entire country looks like Detroit and the average American subsists on a thousand calories a day.
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"the actual unemployment rate of those not working at a sky-high 37.2 percent"
I'd say the actual unemployment rate of those not working would be 100%, yes? Anyway, that 37.2% figure is probably based on some real creative accounting methods. There's no need to cook the books.
The national employment rate is a simple calculation.
Number of Americans of all ages who are employed (including self-employed)/total population of the United States x 100 (to convert to a percentage)
The June 2014 national employment rate was 59.4%, even lower than the Labor Participation Rate (which includes people who self-describe as "actively seeking work") (Source: http://www.bls.gov/news.release/empsit.t01.htm).
100 - 59.4 = 40.6% unemployed and not seeking work - for whatever reason.
No book cooking involved.
How did you arrive at 18% for Southern Colorado?
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that 37.2% figure is probably based on some real creative accounting methods. There's no need to cook the books.
I recently read that only 62% of those eligible to work are in the workforce.
That number has declined since 2009, even though our population has grown.
I'm having trouble finding any good current numbers of just how many people are actually working.
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I recently read that only 62% of those eligible to work are in the workforce.
That number has declined since 2009, even though our population has grown.
I'm having trouble finding any good current numbers of just how many people are actually working.
Dori,
Check the link in my last post.
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The democrats won't be happy until the entire country looks like Detroit and the average American subsists on a thousand calories a day.
I am assuming from your name you did some time in the Batts. What was your class date?
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100 - 59.4 = 40.6% unemployed and not seeking work - for whatever reason.
Thanks for the link BD.
Labor defines anyone over the age of 16 who is not in an institution or nursing home as being eligible for work.
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I am assuming from your name you did some time in the Batts. What was your class date?
My class date was Lima Company Ranger, 75th Infantry, 101st Airborne Division, Vietnam 4/1970 - 7/1971.
There were no "batts" or Ranger battalions back then. There were only small Ranger companies, euphemistically known as "alphabet companies", each one attached to a major ground unit in Vietnam. Visit our web site some time: armyranger.com. My handle is "hobbit".
Getting back on topic, it's crazy to come up with an unemployment figure that includes the entire population of the US. Working people vs. nonworking people is a meaningless statistic. Are 4 and 5 year-olds counted as "unemployed" if they aren't swinging a pickaxe down in the coal mine? How about tens of millions of baby boomers who are now retired (people like me), who because we're no longer nine to fivers are considered "unemployed"? I want to see the empirical data that went into determining this astronomical unemployment figure. Consider that in 1933, the worst year of the Great Depression, unemployment reached 24%. So this Washington Examiner piece infers that the situation right now, here in 2014, is twice as bad as that during the worst year of the Great Depression?
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First off, let me begin by saying we don't really trust anyone who claims vet status right off the bat. We have had a few people claim to have served and they get caught out not knowing basic facts. We check everyone. Period. So- when someone comes on and says "I was with such and such" there is usually someone around who can do a little cross checking. Nothing personal. Keeps the riffraff out.
Second, there isn't a Ranger around who can't spout off his class number.
My class date was Lima Company Ranger, 75th Infantry, 101st Airborne Division, Vietnam 4/1970 - 7/1971.
There were no "batts" or Ranger battalions back then. There were only small Ranger companies, euphemistically known as "alphabet companies", each one attached to a major ground unit in Vietnam. Visit our web site some time: armyranger.com. My handle is "hobbit".
There were 12 classes for Ranger School in 1969. 14 in 1970.
(http://www.benning.army.mil/infantry/rtb/Graduates/images/2-70.jpg)
Interestingly enough, I have everyone's name who was in L Company from 1965 to 1971.
My name is Tom Sweetnam. My radio code name in Vietnam was "hobbit". I did one and a half tours with L Company (Ranger), 75th Infantry, 101st Airborne Division.
https://armyranger.com/bb/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=61965
S
Sachs, Richard
Sanez Jr., Lawrence
Sainsbury, Terry L.
Salazar, Frank J.
Salzberg, Harvey E. “Rabbitâ€
**Salter, James W.
**Sanchez, Charles A.
Sandana, David P.
Sandas, Eric C.
Sands, Gary I.
Sanford, Robert H.
Sasso, Dirk
**Sawtelle, Paul C.
Scanlan, Bill
Scherrer, Joe M.
Schmitt, Harold N.
**Schieb, Lawrence E.
Scott Jr., Lester L.
Scott, Royce E.
Scruggs, Harry W.
Sealy, Sampson H.
Segelstrom, Michael H.
Sellner, Donald O. “Butch Cassidyâ€
Senn, Ryan T.
Seymour, Dean
Shanley, Francis A.
Sharp, David
Sharpless, Fredrick
Shepard, David F.
Sheppard, Jimmy R.
Shifflet, Steve
Shoap, James N.
Shugaar, Eric F.
Shurden, Billy J.
Silvas, Leonard J.
Simpson, Neal E.
Sinclair, David L. “Daveâ€
Skau, David
Sloan, David E.
**Sly, Johhnie R.
Smedley, Jackie L.
Smith, Alfred E. “ALâ€
Smith, Andrew L.
Smith, Chester
Smith, David H.
Smith Jr., Doyle W.
Smith Jr., Gordon L. “Snuffyâ€
**Smith, James L.
Smith, Jim
Smith, James G.
* Smith, Lloyd L.
Smith, Nathan
Smith, Terrence W. “Fishâ€
Smith, Walter
Snyder, Robert Coleman
Soals, Thomas A. <-------- Only Thomas on the S list.
Solberg, Ronald E.
Solko, Marvin D.
Soloman, Franke J.
Somogyi, Joseph G.
Sontag, John T.
Sopko, William T.
Sours, John A.
Souza, Frank L.
Spruill,
*Stafford, Larry M.
Stafford, William L.
Stansel, Jerald D.
Stark, Craig H.
Stauffer, David
Stauffer, Joseph L.
Steijen, Charles M.
Stephenson, Hollis O.
Stephenson, Joel
Steimel, Kenn D.
Stevenson, William
Stillo, Charles E.
**Stoddard, Norman R.
Stout, Bruce S.
Stow II, 1LT Richard I.
Stowers, James D.
Strahlem, John T.
Streeter, Harris S.
Stryker, Stanley C.
**Sturgal, Thomas W.
Suchke, Robert K.
Sumpter, Wilburn R.
Suomela Jr., James B.
Suthard III, Floyd G.
Sullivan, Gene
**Sullens Jr., George B.
Surbrenant, Leo M.
**Sutton, Dennis L.
Interesting enough I don't see your name.
Although... I did find you here:
Really enjoyed your web page. I was with CO.H RANGERS 1ST.CAV.DIV. Feb.1970--Dec.1970. I wouldn't trade the experience for the world. I wish you all the best of everything in life. I am proud to have served with the RANGERS/LRRP
Tom Sweetnam - 01/08/00 03:15:44
My Email:savamutt@trailnet.com
So, which is it? H CO with the first cav, or L CO with 101st? at the same time.
Hobbit18 February 2014, 13:02
Hi everyone I'm a current airline pilot. I previously flew contract ISR. I had a chance to meet a few special ops guys while flying ISR, and it made me interested in what you do.
Is this you?
5403 US Highway 160 W
Monte Vista, CO 81144-9354
(http://www.4thdivrangers.com/images/KCOMPANY/last%20mission.jpg)
this image says 4th ID... but you claim it's you?
Greetings. I served with L Co Rangers in 70 & 71. The photo above was
taken on my last mission, in the Roung Roung Valley. I'm the tall guy
smiling. The Ranger to my left, in the field jacket, holding the thumper,
was with K Co before it disbanded in (late 70?). Anyway, a bunch of K Co
Rangers came up and gave L Co a hand after that. This Ranger was one of
them. I'm trying to ID him. This was the only mission we pulled together.
I'd sure appreciate any help. Tom Sweetnam saveamutt@trailnet.com
There are alot of posts from a Thomas Sweetnam out on the various forums.
Message Sent Monday, May 7 9:30 (Pacific Time)
From: Denver , CO , US
Area Code: 303
To: THOMAS G SWEETNAM ...
917 B ST EUREKA, CA 95501
I am looking for Thomas Sweetnam formerly of Special Forces Training Group & Helicopter Flight School 1969-1970
and alot of messages with that name in them.
Actually it came from here: 4thdivrangers 5/8/2007 11:28:03 PM
I'd found it doing an Image search and saved it on my hard drive. Just now when I found it again, it's posted on a blog with this note:
Greetings. I served with L Co Rangers in 70 & 71. The photo above was
taken on my last mission, in the Roung Roung Valley. I'm the tall guy
smiling. The Ranger to my left, in the field jacket, holding the thumper,
was with K Co before it disbanded in (late 70?). Anyway, a bunch of K Co
Rangers came up and gave L Co a hand after that. This Ranger was one of
them. I'm trying to ID him. This was the only mission we pulled together.
I'd sure appreciate any help. Tom Sweetnam saveamutt@trailnet.com
I tried sending an email but it bounced back right away saying the receipent didn't exist. I guess it's for real, very interesting magazine though.
Pinz
ETA: I followed the link on Currahee's post above here and found "Tom Sweetnam" on this Roster:
101ST Airborne Division LRRP/Ranger Members
1965-1971
1st Brigade LRRP
F-58 LRP
L Company 75th Ranger
3/506 LRRP ( March 13, 1968 – August 20, 1970)
Thanks Currahee!
But now your name isn't on there. Why isn't you name on the roster anymore, Thomas?
Of course... you know our motto and your roster number, surely.
At this point, I will ask your name and dates of service, mos and duty stations. You can PM me or list them here. I will gladly post mine in reply. Everyone here has seen them before.
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Getting back on topic, it's crazy to come up with an unemployment figure that includes the entire population of the US. Working people vs. nonworking people is a meaningless statistic.
The percentage of people who are working, vs. those who are not, may be meaningless to you, but that does not make it meaningless in an objective sense. If you don't understand the significance of the ratio of producers to non-producers, just say so.
Are 4 and 5 year-olds counted as "unemployed" if they aren't swinging a pickaxe down in the coal mine? How about tens of millions of baby boomers who are now retired (people like me), who because we're no longer nine to fivers are considered "unemployed"?
It's clear that you didn't follow the link and look at the numbers. If you did, you would see employment numbers and percentages for all citizens, all citizens over the age of 16, and all citizens over the age of 20.
I want to see the empirical data that went into determining this astronomical unemployment figure.
No, you don't. I provided the link, and you didn't read it. Your previous sentence proved that.
Consider that in 1933, the worst year of the Great Depression, unemployment reached 24%. So this Washington Examiner piece infers that the situation right now, here in 2014, is twice as bad as that during the worst year of the Great Depression?
Consider this. 59.4% of all Americans were employed last month. Subtract 59.4 from 100, and you get 40.6%. It's math so simple, even a Leftist could do it.
And- the Washington Examiner article infers nothing. It also implies nothing. You may infer what you choose from it.
You're working mighty hard to defend King Putt's fascist economy. Is that something a True American would do?
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I am assuming from your name you did some time in the Batts. What was your class date?
First off, let me begin by saying we don't really trust anyone who claims vet status right off the bat. We have had a few people claim to have served and they get caught out not knowing basic facts. We check everyone. Period. So- when someone comes on and says "I was with such and such" there is usually someone around who can do a little cross checking. Nothing personal. Keeps the riffraff out.
Second, there isn't a Ranger around who can't spout off his class number.
There were 12 classes for Ranger School in 1969. 14 in 1970.
(http://www.benning.army.mil/infantry/rtb/Graduates/images/2-70.jpg)
Interestingly enough, I have everyone's name who was in L Company from 1965 to 1971.
https://armyranger.com/bb/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=61965
Interesting enough I don't see your name.
Although... I did find you here:
So, which is it? H CO with the first cav, or L CO with 101st? at the same time.
Is this you?
5403 US Highway 160 W
Monte Vista, CO 81144-9354
(http://www.4thdivrangers.com/images/KCOMPANY/last%20mission.jpg)
this image says 4th ID... but you claim it's you?
There are alot of posts from a Thomas Sweetnam out on the various forums.
and alot of messages with that name in them.
But now your name isn't on there. Why isn't you name on the roster anymore, Thomas?
Of course... you know our motto and your roster number, surely.
At this point, I will ask your name and dates of service, mos and duty stations. You can PM me or list them here. I will gladly post mine in reply. Everyone here has seen them before.
"Soals, Thomas A. <-------- Only Thomas on the S list."
Yes, that'd be Thomas Soals, current secretary of the 75th Ranger Regiment Association, an organization that along with Billy Nix and Bob Gilbert, I founded at the 1986 75th Ranger reunion at Ft. Campbell, Kentucky.
Listen, I really deplore these vetting pissing contests, but since you're the one who initiated it here, let me just say this: L Company Ranger was arguably the most famous single combat company ever to serve in the Vietnam War. That claim isn't just borne out by the degree to which we suffered (60 KIA and more than 100 WIA -I personally was wounded 5 times, and two of the people on your list, Harry Henthorn and Larry Scheib, were teammates who died by my side), but it is also borne out by the fact that to date, at least 20 books have been published about the company (the NY publishing houses refer to Lima Company as "literary company"). You'll find me, or references to my team, or certainly references to my team's more infamous missions, in at least half of them. Now let's hear about your own combat resume.
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One more clarification, since it seems a bone of contention. The team photo you dug up and posted here was taken on the last mission I pulled with L Company. I'm the tall guy holding the CAR-15 with a banana clip. You found it on K Company's website. Pay attention to what it says there.
The reason it's posted on K Company's site is because I was trying to ID the guy standing immediately to my left. He's wearing a field jacket and holding a thumper. K Company Ranger stood down in late 1970, and about a dozen of their guys volunteered to join L Company. This was the only mission I pulled with this guy and I was trying to identify him. That's why the photo is on K Company's site.
The other two Rangers in the photo are Roy Aguero (on the far left as you face the photo) and Richard Danner on the far right. This was a radio relay mission in the Roung Roung Valley. Danner killed himself on a Harley shortly after the war. Aguero retired as a sergeant major and has a small ranch in Texas. We still communicate to this day. This is the last I have to say about any of this in a public forum. If you want to continue the conversation, you can PM me.
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I noticed you didn't answer the questions, Tom.
I haven't found any information about you that you yourself didn't put out. As for the photo I found it on the 4ID web site. Posted by you. Saying it's you. No further listings or postings except that reference that post. It's not a bone of contention. It is a matter of undocumented claims on a photo you yourself posted. When I look up Thomas Sweetnam, Vietnam, all I get is posts by you on various web sites. I did get one hit for the five wounds story, in a paper, referencing you. Again, no real conformation.
I feel your story is starting to stink, Thomas. Tomorrow I can call down to the Regiment and do a tab check. You can answer some basic questions anyone would, had they really been there, could tell you.
What was your class number. What was your mos. Your times of service.
We have played this game many times with posers, Thomas.
You might be the real deal. But I am wondering why you are balking at something and Ranger would know and give out in a heartbeat.
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Oh, Thomas...
No fair running away to Google the answer. I know you were on when I posted here and sent you a PM...
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Oh, Thomas...
No fair running away to Google the answer. I know you were on when I posted here and sent you a PM...
You wouldn't care to put some money where your big mouth is? How about $1000? We can set up an escrow account at Paypal. We each deposit $1000 into the account. I produce multiple documents, ID cards (Colorado Driver License, Department of Defense ID, VA ID, Purple Heart orders, DD 214, and a shitload more photos, as well as Ranger contacts who can verify that I am exactly who I say I am, and that my war record is as related. You spoke of "stink" in your previous post. I can smell the stink of a jealous REMF. Or is that the stink of a coward who just pooped in his panties at the idea of sticking his neck out? How about it "dutch"? Got any balls? Or are you just all gas?
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Really, Thomas? After your PM about not really being a Ranger you get all liquered up and choose to post this?
OK, dickhead.
Quote from: dutch508 on July 06, 2014, 21:46:01
So, Thomas. Like I explained we have had posers show up here. We find outof them out pretty quick because they really don't know the answers.
Trouble is there are a lot of real vets here. Me included. So we do check claims. You kind of failed the first two checks.
There isn't anything secret about a class number or mos, Thomas. It is pretty easy to check though.
Another thing, I just haven't heard of you. That's not important, of course. But... if you are as high up on the Ranger food chain as you claim... Well, you see where I am going, right?
So, who are you really. You check out I apologize on the forum and that's that. Too easy. If you fibbed a bit, we don't judge. You made a mistake. We don't ban you. We are pretty easy to get along with.
Quote from: ranger75 on July 06, 2014
"So, who are you really"
I'm beginning to wonder myself. When I put in an address change at the 75th Ranger Regiment Association recently, Tom mails me back and says "Who the hell are you!? Tom Sweetnam is dead!" They've had me listed as "deceased" on the regimental roster for several years. They thought I was some ghoul trying to use Tom Sweetnam's name...errr...that is to say my own name, to act as a poser. It's a huge problem, I know. There are probably a hundred people on this planet claiming to have served with combat Ranger companies for every person who actually did.
FYI You didn't have to go through Ranger school to serve with a Ranger company in Vietnam. If that was a qualifying criteria, there never would have been any Ranger companies in Vietnam. 90% of people who went through Ranger School who were sent to Vietnam, avoided the in-country Ranger companies like the plague. It was very dangerous duty, especially up north. The companies were composed 100% of volunteers. You could leave anytime you liked. I'd say less than 25% of all personnel who served in the alphabet companies in Vietnam were "tabbed" Rangers. No one gave a shit anyway. The alphabet Ranger scrolls we wore on our shoulders were far and away a more treasured possession than any tab from a stateside training school.
As to my absence from some of the online rosters, that's an internal dispute between myself and another L Company veteran, Randy White. I'm not going to spill our internal dirty laundry here; suffice to say that situation will be rectified very shortly. Anyway, you can believe what you want to believe. People always do. There are even people who believe our unemployment rate is 47%. That's just crazy.
So... you didn't go to Ranger School. The Ranger Association says you don't exist. AND the reason you are not on the official rolls is because someone who IS a certified member has a dispute with you?
Hmm...
Randy White who is the 2004 L Co head honcho?
L/75 – F/58 LRP – 1/101st LRRP
Randall White
N4256 Powell Lake Rd.
Wetmore, MI 49895
(906) 387-2318
Email: ranwhite@jamadots.com
But this is a classic:
NBC's Free Republic "Hate Group" Smear
9/17/2003 | Tom Sweetnam
Posted on Wednesday, September 17, 2003 5:10:38 AM by RangerHobbit
I believe the Free Republic “hate group†smear should stay focused on the real antagonists here: NBC. Debbie Reyes can shoot her mouth off all she likes in an unofficial capacity. That’s what our troops are doing in Iraq and Afghanistan: protecting the right of Debbie Reyes and all those who think like her, to shoot their mouths off even if such people are too stupid to realize that such precious freedoms come with a price tag in blood. But when her hatred carries over and takes on the stamp of her civic office, and when a major organ of propaganda gives her hatred credibility by acting as her proxy in planting the seeds of hostility toward Free Republic members as a “hate groupâ€, then the situation takes on an entirely different face.
I contacted the Fresno NBC affiliate yesterday attempting to get a statement from news director Julie Akins. I informed her that I was an assistant web host for one of the member sites of the US Army Ranger Associations web ring, and that we had 60,000 US military and civilian subscribers to our web ring, including the entire 22,000 member 101st Airborne Division currently serving in Iraq. Many are frequent Free Republic visitors and/or subscribers. These are amongst the people that Debbie Reyes and NBC would have America believe are a “hate groupâ€.
Come on... the Entire Division? Of the 101st? Is a member of the Ranger Association web-ring?
The reply is perfect:
From: "Julie Akins" JulieA@ksee.com
To: savamutt@hotmail.com
Subject: Re: Coverage of the HRC and local freedom group
Date: Tue, 16 Sep 2003 16:22:45 -0700
I received your voice mail today regarding our coverage of a story last Friday. I attempted to call you but your number would not go through.
The phone number was bogus. The e-mail bounces when people try to contact you. The Association you help found (your claim) doesn't know you...
Tom Sweetnam / 75th Ranger Regimental Association / 159 Starfish Way / Crescent City, CA 95531 / 707 465-6306 / savamutt@hotmail.com
You claim to have been wounded five times. Yet the National Purple Heart Hall of Honor has no record of you being wounded even one time.
In fact- a record search of anyone who has been awarded the Purple Heart comes up black when I look for your name- let alone five times!
I already have calls out to the Ranger Regiment to check your story.
I have also got calls out to:
Ranger Association
Sergeant-At-Arms
Aubrey Batts
(706) 366-9567
RangerHOFBatts@aol.com
South-West Ranger Association Deputy Director
Mike Schlitz
(210) 216-0772
rangerschlitz@gmail.com
AND- just because I believe in overkill:
President
Butch Nery
(706) 457-6379
butch.nery@atk.com
So, enough about you... Here's me.
(http://photos1.blogger.com/blogger/3617/760/1600/in%20the%20bird.jpg)
I was headed into Baghdad in late 2005.
(http://photos1.blogger.com/blogger/3617/760/1600/dutch.jpg)
Me doing the CAV pose. Taji Iraq 2005. Eh...
(http://photos1.blogger.com/blogger/3617/760/1600/Cpt%20Downing%20and%20Maj%20Henfer.jpg)
Me (big tall Ranger looking sum-bitch), along with (now) LTC Robert Hefner during a raid in December 2005.
(http://photos1.blogger.com/blogger/3617/760/1600/last%20patrol%20BS.jpg)
Me. After being dun-blowed-up.
I got all these phonts from my blog, BTW. See--- I got photos of me in uniform.
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-e-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xaf1/t1.0-9/318511_2348871895255_2009155659_n.jpg)
BUT- here is a photo of me at my retirement.
Enlisted on 9 June 1984.
Harmony Church A-9-2 (11C5S)
Ranger class #3-85
OCS 4-93 19Z
CGSC 2-04
fuctional area 30F
Retired 30 October 2011
So... whatcha got!?
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Interesting turn of events! I spoke with Randy White of the L Company 75th. He said he did know a Thomas Sweetnam back in Vietnam. What he didn't say was that he knew anything about any trouble between them- or why he'd be off the roster.
Randy said he thought he had the contact information for Thomas Sweetnam and would check it out and get back with me.
Like I said in my PM to you. If this turns out to be a mistake then you will get your apology.
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I just got off the phone with Aubrey Batts, the SGT at Arms for the 75th Ranger Association. He said that he didn't remember anyone named Thomas Sweetnam, but he got to the company in March of 1971 and might have not met Thomas.
Two things he did say were that he didn't remember anyone of that name forming the Association back in the first days, but Donald H. Lynch, Robert F. Gilbert, and Billy J. Nix. and-
Mr. Batts did ask me to ask you your PLT SGTs name, Thomas. That would help him figure out who you are.
We had a pretty good talk about the old days. Not that I knew Mr. Batts but old slodiers when they get together do tend to tell stories and such. Mr. Batts is a great gentleman and ask me to let him know what I found out about you. He gave me Mr. Gilbert's number. Mr. Gilbert was with the Company the same time you claim to be, Thomas and would probably know of you.
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Dutch, I've got some current 75th people I can reach out to if you need some assistance.
This poser's case sounds like something for the folks at This Ain't Hell.
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Dutch, I've got some current 75th people I can reach out to if you need some assistance.
This poser's case sounds like something for the folks at This Ain't Hell.
Yeah... that might be the way to go. He has already backed off his claim of being a Ranger- at least school trained. He was correct in that alot of the Ranger Company guys in Vietnam didn't go through the course.
So that leaves us with his claims of being in H Company and L Company.
I have one guy from L Company who says he knew a Thomas Sweetnam and one guy that doesn't. I did find one article listing that name as a surviver from a helecopter crash in 1970 that killed the two guys he claims were his buddies.
So- either we do have a veteran who is just an ass or a poser who has assumed a real vet's identity... for some reason.
Too many red flags but some truth in parts of the story. Jon might like to sink his teeth into this one.
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Did he ever claim to be a tabbed Ranger with the 75th Ranger Regiment? I'm confused. I don't doubt his service, and him calling himself a "Ranger" may be more affiliated with the unit he served in, not an actual unit in the 75th Ranger Regiment.
http://101st-airborne-ranger.com/training
In L Co 75th Infantry Rangers as in all military units, training was the most important activity we did besides actually going to the field on a live mission. Some Commanders have said, "Training is everything and everything is training." In order to be on a Ranger team, each individual had to be highly trained in his particular skills and responsibilities and the whole team of six men had to train together to know Company and Team Standard Operating Procedures (SOP's) as well as know how each other functioned under stress. The best individual training course available for RECON units was MAC-V RECONDO School at Nha Trang, RVN. RECONDO training and what went on at that school is covered in a separate section.
Every member of L Company, as a minimum, was Airborne qualified. Even though we did not use a parachute to infiltrate enemy territory, the Airborne Spirit was alive in each of us. We had each been measured when we had "stood in the door" to face our fears. We passed that test to become a member of the Airborne brotherhood. Volunteering to be a Ranger in Vietnam in the 101st Airborne Division (Airmobile), was yet another measure of courage and commitment.
101st Airborne Division Long Ranger Recon Patrol – LRRP L. Company – 75th Infantry Rangers 101st Airborne Division – Elite Ranger – LRRP The LRRP Company of the 101st Airborne Division (Airmobile) became Company L (Lima Company) of the 75th Ranger Infantry in February 1969 and remained operational in Vietnam until December 1971. Company was fully Special Forces, Recondo Trained, Operated Long Ranger Recon Patrol (LRRP). Unit had complement of between 115 and 120 operatives during it’s operation in Vietnam. Whilst at this time, the 101st Airborne Division had become a primarily Airmobile Division (Helicopter rather than parachute insertion) the LRRP unit was airborne trained and considered amongst the elite of US Army forces in Vietnam. Unit was heavily involved in Operations; Jefferson Glenn Texas Star Lam Son 719 Prior to movement to 75th Infantry fought at both Khe Sanh and Hue.
http://www.vietnamwarpatches.com/2012/04/11/ev952-patch-101st-airborne-lrrp-ranger-vietnam-war-long-range-recon/
So he wouldn't "technically" be on any roles at the 75th Ranger Regiment. I wouldn't go off half-cocked calling him a poser without his input. But that's just me.
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Great article and great find, Chris_ !
Naturally I "borrowed" it for posting at my other site.
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No, he told me he never went to Ranger school. After I told him I was calling the Regiment for a tab check. He never claimed to be outright.
Parts of the story check out, but there are a whole bunch of red flags I am trying to get answered. I talked to vets as listed above. Batts said he didn't know him, but he could check, the story of Thomas starting up the first reunion is bullshit, as per a phone call with one of the guys who did.
So, jury is still out til I hear what more he has to say and what others say too.
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Yeah... that might be the way to go. He has already backed off his claim of being a Ranger- at least school trained. He was correct in that alot of the Ranger Company guys in Vietnam didn't go through the course.
So that leaves us with his claims of being in H Company and L Company.
I have one guy from L Company who says he knew a Thomas Sweetnam and one guy that doesn't. I did find one article listing that name as a surviver from a helecopter crash in 1970 that killed the two guys he claims were his buddies.
So- either we do have a veteran who is just an ass or a poser who has assumed a real vet's identity... for some reason.
Too many red flags but some truth in parts of the story. Jon might like to sink his teeth into this one.
Read it and weep, jerkoff: http://www.aircav-condors.org/node/65
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Read it and weep, jerkoff: http://www.aircav-condors.org/node/65
I already did. I found that yesterday. In fact- you quoted me mentioning it. I found it though looking for you buddies you say that were killed. I see a name that matches what you say your name is.
However- I talked with Randy. and he says he knew you... but he didn't recall that you were having an issue with each other. He was going to try to get ahold of you and find out what the deal was. I haven't heard back from him yet. I spoke with Batts, he didn't know you but wanted to know who your platoon SGT was.
What Batts also said was he didn't know anything about you helping found the Association or the reunion in Campbell. I have a call out to Gilbert. Batts was going to get me Lynch's number to call too. He said call him and solve whatever issue you have.
So, right now I am either thinking you are just an asshole- abit one that was in Vietnam with L Co who padded his own history a bit, or a guy who assumed this online name to be cool.
Neither makes much sense to me, so I am waiting on a few more phone calls.
You got a good photo of you back in the day and from today? I am all for giving you the benfit of the doubt but too many remain right now.
Also- you are still a pilot? I read one of your posts about doing ISR runs. Where was that?
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Ranger Team Kenya
Submitted by Richard Frazee on Sun, 04/24/2011 - 22:37
An Insertion Gone Wrong
The Story of Team Kenya 25
August 29, 1970
By Randy White, With input from the L Company and 2/17 Cav personnel involved.
So... another question. Randy White wrote this and ...
Right?
Hold the phone- Literally.
Well, Thomas, It looks like I owe you a big apology. Randy just called me back. Seems I didn't talk with Randy this morning. It was someone else- his wife (thought the voice sounded high). Randy White does confirm your story. He says you are a ****ing asshole and he doesn't have anything to do you with anymore, but he met you before you all went over to Vietnam and you served in the Company until you left to PSYOPs in early 71. He said Batts did get there in March- after you left.
So- after I explained to you via PM about why we sniff out posers did you suddenly get all shithead asshole on us? All that was going to happen today was me making a few phone calls but them late last night you throw down the gauntlet.
No need to bring all this on, Thomas.
There were a few too many holes in your story and your refusal to even talk about them set off too many flags, Thomas. We have dealt with some real phonies before and they all act the same.
BUT- anyway- I am sorry we had to put you through this. It would have been easier if you had just talked to us.
Personally, being an old soldier, I'd like to hear a bit more about you and your time in country. I did a bit of the same things you did- although we had way more beach and not near as many trees as you did.
Yeah- you can tell me to go **** myself. Not like I haven't heard it before, dickhead.
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So... another question. Randy White wrote this and ...
Right?
Hold the phone- Literally.
Well, Thomas, It looks like I owe you a big apology. Randy just called me back. Seems I didn't talk with Randy this morning. It was someone else- his wife (thought the voice sounded high). Randy White does confirm your story. He says you are a ****ing asshole and he doesn't have anything to do you with anymore, but he met you before you all went over to Vietnam and you served in the Company until you left to PSYOPs in early 71. He said Batts did get there in March- after you left.
So- after I explained to you via PM about why we sniff out posers did you suddenly get all shithead asshole on us? All that was going to happen today was me making a few phone calls but them late last night you throw down the gauntlet.
No need to bring all this on, Thomas.
There were a few too many holes in your story and your refusal to even talk about them set off too many flags, Thomas. We have dealt with some real phonies before and they all act the same.
BUT- anyway- I am sorry we had to put you through this. It would have been easier if you had just talked to us.
Personally, being an old soldier, I'd like to hear a bit more about you and your time in country. I did a bit of the same things you did- although we had way more beach and not near as many trees as you did.
Yeah- you can tell me to go **** myself. Not like I haven't heard it before, dickhead.
Go back to the list where you DIDN'T find my name. Go down to the bottom of the page where it says "comments". There is no link and there is no way to contact the page's host. Nor is there an archive of past comments. Doesn't that strike you as odd? Randy stays behind a hundred sandbags attempting to avoid any criticism and comment from his L Company peers, and for good reason. I'm an asshole? Maybe so, but I'm not a world-class asshole like Randy. Mine isn't the only name he's stricken from that list. There are others. The story behind all this is long and sordid, and is something I don't care to elucidate here.
But since you're playing detective in all this, do a little homework on Randy's L Company experience. Isn't it odd that everything he writes has to do with everyone else's experiences? He never writes about himself, and nor have the 20 Lima Company vets with published books. Randy experienced ONE contact then ran like a scalded dog. He spent the rest of his tour as a PX clerk in Phu Bai. What a warrior, huh?
The Team Kenya mission was my sixth or seventh contact, I don't remember. That was in August, 1970. I was shot full of holes. The team picture you dug up was taken in February, 1971, six months later. Odd? An anomaly? No. I spent 10 weeks in hospital in Okinawa recovering from my wounds, and when I was sufficiently ambulatory, I told them I wanted to go back to the Ranger Company. I had to see two shrinks, a social worker, a colonel, then sign 15 forms, and back to Vietnam I went in November, 1970. You should have seen our CO when I walked in the door. That little shit's jaw hit his desk and his eyes were as big as saucers. He couldn't believe I came back. Nor could most of my peers.
Hazelton had had enough of the bush. After Team Kenya he stayed in the rear, working down in the TOC. Mike Knappen was still in hospital in Japan recovering from a bullet wound. Scheib and Henthorn were dead of course. I called each of their mothers from my hospital bed in Okinawa. Henthorn's mother was very sweet and caring; Scheib's mother was bitter and curt. At any rate, they both told me I was the only person from the company who'd contacted them. Our CO couldn't be bothered sending letters of condolence to the families of our KIAs, of which there were many. He was a self-centered little coward...rather like Randy.
I hated the politics of the rear, so back out to the bush I went. I pulled radio relay missions for the next three months. The photo you dug up was the last mission I pulled. We were on an abandoned firebase in the Roung Roung Valley. We'd been getting probed every night. I suffered a minor wound, an oak leaf cluster for my existing Purple Heart. I was a sergeant by then. I quit the company after that mission and like droves of other Rangers who were quitting the Company, I went down to Phu Bai to look for a job.
I had to compete for the job I wanted: PSYOPS NCOIC. There were 15 of us taking the test. I won the job. It was fascinating work, though it had its dangerous aspect. We had to fly out over the Roung Roung, A Shau, and Ho Chi Mihn Trail every day making propaganda broadcasts and dropping leaflets. We flew at 1200'. Generally the dinks left us alone. They didn't consider us a threat, though we did get shot at a few times. And that's what I did till the end of my second tour.
I accept your apology. You go a little too far though, my friend. I’m very proud of my Lima Company Ranger legacy, as are all my comrades who shared in so intense an experience.
BTW I have a photo of the Team Kenya bird. They counted over 400 bullet/frag punctures. It appeared in Newsweek in early ’71. I’m not going to post it here (Mack Davis hasn’t posted it at the Condor site either. It’s pretty gruesome.) I’ll e-mail it if you like.
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Guys, I've seen poser stories, I started USMILNET. This doesn't appear to be one. Can you please sheath your swords? Someone will wind up looking like as fool in the end. It's not worth it this time. This isn't Jesse MacBeth.
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Guys, I've seen poser stories, I started USMILNET. This doesn't appear to be one. Can you please sheath your swords? Someone will wind up looking like as fool in the end. It's not worth it this time. This isn't Jesse MacBeth.
You late. It's already cleared up.
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Thomas, I'm a ass-hole. I openly admit it. Got no problems admitting it. When I started researching you it all came up red flags, but if you noticed, I did say the jury was still out.
I am tough because I have found a vet, a real vet, can put up with it and prove himself. Those fake ones wig out and go off the deep end threatening all sorts of shit.
I admit I was in a foul mood when this all started and I went full press right off the bat. Oh well. You've seen worse.
But, now that you are here I am looking forward to your thoughts on our present situation in the middle east in comparison with Vietnam post 1975. Also you experiences both in combat and after you came home.
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Thomas, I'm a assailed. I openly admit it. Got no problems admitting it. When I started researching you it all came up red flags, but if you noticed, I did say the jury was still out.
I am tough because I have found a vet, a real vet, can put up with it and prove himself. Those fake ones wig out and go off the deep end threatening all sorts of shit.
I admit I was in a foul mood when this all started and I went full press right off the bat. Oh well. You've seen worse.
But, now that you are here I am looking forward to your thoughts on our present situation in the middle east in comparison with Vietnam post 1975. Also you experiences both in combat and after you came home.
It takes a man to write a post like this. It takes a man to admit he's wrong.
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A few more things I want to clear up, dutch, then I’ll shut the hell up:
*Stop calling me Thomas. My name is Tom.
*You contacted the National Purple Heart what? The who? I've got orders I can post, but anybody can fake those. So I'll restate a previous challenge: I'll bet you $1000 I can prove beyond a shadow of a doubt, that I was awarded two Purple Hearts...and a few other baubles besides. Want to bet?
*I've been a fixture at armyranger.com for more than a decade. Some may not like me a whole lot (yes, I know, that's hard to believe) but they sure as hell know who I am. Stop in some time. We need the traffic.
*Though we haven't communicated for a few years, I still count as a good friend, Kenn Miller. You better know who he is, Ranger. We e-mailed almost daily for 15 years. He and the other 101st LRRP/Ranger historian of note, Gary Lindner, have probably published a dozen books between them. They both know me well. They know everything about me. If you have further questions, contact them instead of idiots like Randy White. That is all.
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A few more things I want to clear up, dutch, then I’ll shut the hell up:
*Stop calling me Thomas. My name is Tom.
*You contacted the National Purple Heart what? The who? I've got orders I can post, but anybody can fake those. So I'll restate a previous challenge: I'll bet you $1000 I can prove beyond a shadow of a doubt, that I was awarded two Purple Hearts...and a few other baubles besides. Want to bet?
*I've been a fixture at armyranger.com for more than a decade. Some may not like me a whole lot (yes, I know, that's hard to believe) but they sure as hell know who I am. Stop in some time. We need the traffic.
*Though we haven't communicated for a few years, I still count as a good friend, Kenn Miller. You better know who he is, Ranger. We e-mailed almost daily for 15 years. He and the other 101st LRRP/Ranger historian of note, Gary Lindner, have probably published a dozen books between them. They both know me well. They know everything about me. If you have further questions, contact them instead of idiots like Randy White. That is all.
You just don't know when to walk away and graciously let something go do you n00b?
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You just don't know when to walk away and graciously let something go do you n00b?
I worked in PSYOPS. It was my job to drive people crazy.
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A few more things I want to clear up, dutch, then I’ll shut the hell up:
*Stop calling me Thomas. My name is Tom.
nah... I worked psyops too. I think I'll keep calling you Thomas.
*You contacted the National Purple Heart what? The who? I've got orders I can post, but anybody can fake those. So I'll restate a previous challenge: I'll bet you $1000 I can prove beyond a shadow of a doubt, that I was awarded two Purple Hearts...and a few other baubles besides. Want to bet?
Since I already said I was wrong and believed you what's the point of this? Been at the bottle? You seem to get a real tough guy stance about the time the bars close. The site I mentioned is putting together a list of all those who have been awarded various medals. It's easy to find- google Purple Heart Recipients. Although you do say you were wounded five times. The article says seven wounds- but all at once. Was that day the only time you were hit? What happened the other time?
Oh- you can fake anything now-days. The devil is in the details, though. Little things that don't quite make sense. A few are understandable but then you start to uncover more and the bullshit radar starts pinging and pretty soon, "POOF" you've uncovered another lying piece of shit poser.
*I've been a fixture at armyranger.com for more than a decade. Some may not like me a whole lot (yes, I know, that's hard to believe) but they sure as hell know who I am. Stop in some time. We need the traffic.
That's ok. I retired and left that entire life behind me for the most part. You probably know a few of the people I know too. I just don't drop names to prove how manly I am. I've found that most of the people on any of those sites have more to prove to themselves than to anyone else.
"Hi, I'm Steve! I was Force Recon Special Ops Diver from 19-odd-6 to whatever. I'm a MAN!"
No thanks.
*Though we haven't communicated for a few years, I still count as a good friend, Kenn Miller. You better know who he is, Ranger. We e-mailed almost daily for 15 years. He and the other 101st LRRP/Ranger historian of note, Gary Lindner, have probably published a dozen books between them. They both know me well. They know everything about me. If you have further questions, contact them instead of idiots like Randy White. That is all.
I met Kenn at an airsoft game once. Nice guy. He sometimes goes down to the Best Ranger Comp at Benning. I thought his books were pretty good. But then again, I have met Paul a few times too. I used to talk to COl McKight quite a bit. Oh- I know you'd know my uncle... but I don't make a habit of dropping names, Thomas. Put your dick back in your pants.
Like I said, I don't have much to do with that part of my life anymore. I still keep in contact with a few people but mostly not. I don't belong to any military forums. I don't belong to any of the veteran groups. I am happy just to forget about that 28 years, 10 months and 4 days. I have my stuff up in my office in my home and sometimes I look at it and the only thing I feel is sadness.
One thing that will bring me to the fight is liars and posers. Other than that I don't go around thumping my chest living out past 'glories'. Yeah, I did a lot of things in my time in service. I did more than most, I suppose. I was never satisfied with my career and always pushed myself to do more. In the end it cost me my health, my family, and everything I had spent my time working for.
You mentioned to me before that you thought Iraq was a complete waste of time. I happen to agree, although maybe for not the same reasons you do. I feel Afghanistan is going the same way. AND- just to piss off the DUmpmonkiez, I think it's all MIHOP.
I also believe the current state of this country, economic and otherwise is all MIHOP by this administration and the left. They are driving the country down systematically as they WANT the country taken down in the world pecking order. They truly believe that we are the worst enemy. Rather than a shining light in the world for hope they see us as the root of all darkness.
They are wrong. Totally wrong. What really brings me down is the fact I know what the only real solution is.
BUT- enough about me, Thomas.
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You mentioned to me before that you thought Iraq was a complete waste of time.
I'd love to hear Thomas' Libtard talking points on this one. :popcorn:
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I worked in PSYOPS. It was my job to drive people crazy.
I hope that was sarcasm Thomas...because that's not the job of PsyOps.
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Tell me something Thomas, does it make you feel good to come on to a new website and brag about what a hero you are? I don't know whether you are a poser or not but, if not, you certainly embellish your record to impress the rubes. You are the guy at the reunion who ends up sitting at the table alone with his wife after everyone drifts away, sick of listening to him.
Personally, you have the stink of poser to me.
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You are the guy at the reunion who ends up sitting at the table alone with his wife after everyone drifts away, sick of listening to him.
Personally, you have the stink of poser to me.
Naw... he's just an asshole is all.
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Naw... he's just an asshole is all.
I know several who were there and are still posers (see Kerry, John).
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Thomas, I'm a ass-hole. I openly admit it. Got no problems admitting it. When I started researching you it all came up red flags, but if you noticed, I did say the jury was still out.
I am tough because I have found a vet, a real vet, can put up with it and prove himself. Those fake ones wig out and go off the deep end threatening all sorts of shit.
I admit I was in a foul mood when this all started and I went full press right off the bat. Oh well. You've seen worse.
But, now that you are here I am looking forward to your thoughts on our present situation in the middle east in comparison with Vietnam post 1975. Also you experiences both in combat and after you came home. As long as your not a Balding Salt & pepper ponytail 2 time Obama voter who thinks Unions are the greatest thing since sliced bread and you think Oathkeepers/Militia have a place in American Society then your not an ass-hole
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This thread was trying to get some rest.
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"the actual unemployment rate of those not working at a sky-high 37.2 percent"
I'd say the actual unemployment rate of those not working would be 100%, yes? Anyway, that 37.2% figure is probably based on some real creative accounting methods. There's no need to cook the books. The actual unemployment rate here in Southern Colorado is close to 18%. Isn't that bad enough? The democrats won't be happy until the entire country looks like Detroit and the average American subsists on a thousand calories a day.
You aren't familiar with how employment is calculated, are you?
I assume you are 17 or 18 so we will be kind and help you out of your ignorance.
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Silly me -- I posted about the content.
I understand the rancor that surrounds stolen valor (witness the recent viral video of the guy who WAS stealing valor and pretending).
Thomas, Tom, Thom, whatever you prefer -- you should be proud of your service and a little bit of better shine that the best damn soldiers that ever served who are here did a lot of due diligence. Not a small investment of time and effort.
I assume you join all of us (no I didn't serve but I respect all of you who did) in despising stolen valorites (or whatever). When they ask for my ID when I use a credit card I thank the checker.
Forensically, I am about to perform the one thing one should never do -- ERASE all the prior statements by using terms such as "but," "however," "that being said" and the like...
But, that being however said.
YOU A FREAKING IDIOT!!! If you don't understand how employment numbers are calculated and manipulated then it is a wonder you made it this far in life!!! USE YOUR BRAIN, MAN! This is the worst employment scenario since the dustbowl of 1929!!
Learn some math and then get back to us...