The Conservative Cave
Current Events => The DUmpster => Topic started by: SSG Snuggle Bunny on June 04, 2013, 09:11:33 AM
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marmar (61,067 posts)
Cooperative Economics: Replacing a Capitalism in Collapse
Cooperative Economics: Replacing a Capitalism in Collapse
Sunday, 02 June 2013 09:40
By Carl Gibson, Occupy.com | Op-Ed
I live in a co-op house with 30 other people
Sounds dreamy.
in Madison, Wisconsin. While we pay rent to the nonprofit organization that manages Madison’s co-op properties, our only landlords are each other. We have weekly meetings to discuss house business and make decisions in a democratic process, using a consensus model. We agree to not buy any food or products for the house that come from detestable companies like Monsanto, Koch Industries and Tyson, and get most of the ingredients for house meals from the farmer’s market and a local food co-op. We all actively take part in our own residence by making sure things are kept (relatively) clean, problems are solved quickly, and the house remains a thriving community.
As 30 people all living in one big house, sharing expenses, growing our own food in rooftop gardens and recycling/composting as much we can, our environmental footprints are much smaller as a whole. Also, I only pay $500 a month in rent, utilities, washer/dryer, internet, and even food. And this is in a house within walking distance of the downtown area, right on the lakefront.
This made me wonder - why did I ever allow myself to live alone with no community and pay a landlord who doesn't make decisions with tenants in a democratic process? And why did I do it considering that form of living cost twice as much as my current housing situation? It's just one example of cooperative economics replacing the outdated corporate capitalist model.
We’re witnessing capitalism’s death throes right now. The stock market surges to new highs on a regular basis, corporate profits soar every quarter, and taxes on corporations as a percentage of GDP are lower than they’ve ever been in decades. Despite all the success of corporations, they’re actually squeezing more productivity out of their workers by laying off their coworkers. .....................(more)
The complete piece is at: http://truth-out.org/opinion/item/16718-cooperative-economics-replacing-a-capitalism-in-collapse
zipplewrath (8,978 posts)
5. Too much work
This will be an unattractive model to most people. Most people basically are lazy and won't want to do so much individual work to be in cooperatives.
Self Reliance: It's for the lazy
Anyone who has been involved in a cooperative knows that there are folks ready, willing, and able to cooperate. But there are those that will seek the benefits and avoid the responsibilities. Those people are toxic to cooperatives. In the end there will always be a "market" for people who don't want to be in cooperatives.
Even today, HOA's are a love/hate relationship with some people wanting them, some buyers avoiding them, and some in the "don't care that much one way or another" category.
The history of cooperatives isn't great. They pop up regularly, under a variety of names including "communes" and "Kibbutz". Right now you'll find Co-op grocery stores, and even REI borders on the Co-op model. They exist, and work for a minority. But I'm dubious they'l ever constitute a majority of most markets. Just as people pay to have their lawns mown, their pools cleaned, and their houses cleaned, many people will just find it easier to pay someone to do what they could otherwise do for themselves.
el_bryanto (3,776 posts)
6. There have been a few of these the last few days (well two at least)
I can certainly see the appeal, but I'm not sure how it works in a macro economic level. Is this community self sustaining? Or how would it actually work without capitalism to provide things like clothing, food, and the like?
Also how does this society handle people who are different or who don't fit the norms of society? I mean I do OK socially but i'm not the best at it; my dollars probably buy me a certain amount of tolerance. In this society how would a individualistic jerk like me (or worse than me) do?
Why is it your dirty hippy communes can exist within a larger society that is a free market but you dirty hippies with your communes would never permit a free market?
That alone tells me which system is superior.
Nay (5,759 posts)
7. I always liked this idea in theory, but after having lived in one sort of co-op house and also
having had regular roommates, I do have to say that lots of people are unsuited to such living arrangements. I was floored by roommates who: trashed the commons area; borrowed stuff and 'forgot' to give it back; made noise while people were studying or sleeping; etc.
The co-op house I briefly lived in had one guy whose personality was so overwhelming that he actually ran the place. The other boarders theoretically had a say in things, but there was a lot of 'playing favorites' going on, and if you raised certain points, the cliques that had formed could shut you down no matter how sensible your point was. I got out right away, seeing that as pretty unlivable.
In my case, even if a co-op house stayed very democratic and rational (as the one in the OP has), I would reconsider it if I truly needed to have people around for some reason. But, as a serious introvert, I find constant human contact (even of the nice or benign variety) very tiring and irritating. I'm sure that if I were in such a house I would be in an 'out' of the clique situation most of the time, even if I scrupulously did all my required duties. And frankly, I'm too old to put up with that shit anymore, and I had to do enough of that social gameplaying at work all those years for me to want to do it in my own house, too, for the rest of my life.
But I can see some of my gregarious friends truly enjoying the friendships and finding it fun and fulfilling as a way of life. Personally, I get tired just thinking about it.
So you hooked-up with a bunch of
people philosophically opposed to
idea of working hard to advance
themselves...
(http://images.sodahead.com/polls/001633451/4049913077_willy_wonka_wilder_answer_1_xlarge.jpeg)
Only to find out they selfishly exploited
other people to support their needs and
desires.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022943796
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Wonder if they have rape free bedrooms in that house.
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I get the feeling this topic didn't work out the way the marmar primitive intended. Even his own fellow idiots are aware how some pull their weight and others don't. Yet for some reason they want to impose this "all for one and one for all" nonsense on the country as a whole, mainly because they want to be the ones who sit around and let everyone else do the work. Funny thing is they either apparently don't believe we see them for who and what they are, or maybe they do and just don't care.
.
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I live in a co-op house with 30 other people
The term "barracks", comes to mind. :lmao:
in Madison, Wisconsin. While we pay rent to the nonprofit organization that manages Madison’s co-op properties, our only landlords are each other. We have weekly meetings to discuss house business and make decisions in a democratic process :bs:, using a consensus model. We agree to not buy any food or products for the house that come from detestable companies like Monsanto, Koch Industries and Tyson, and get most of the ingredients for house meals from the farmer’s market and a local food co-op. We all actively take part in our own residence by making sure things are kept (relatively) clean, problems are solved quickly, and the house remains a thriving community.
Does it have a rape-free zone? :???:
Dagnabit, Freeper beat me to it.
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So, what happens when someone would like more that the others are willing to give? Say a nice I-Phone?
It NEVER works DUmbasses.
:fuelfire:
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We have weekly meetings to discuss house business and make decisions in a democratic process
No you don't.
Anyone who doesn't conform to the rigors of your society is ostracized and punished.
Yours is a forced society that does not allow competing models.
Free markets thrive on competition.
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30 people in one house? Sounds like 'Lord of the Flies'.
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30 people in one house? Sounds like 'Lord of the Flies'.
Or one of the 'barracks' at Auschwitz.
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Once upon a time, there was a Hive.
This Hive was different from most hives. It was not filled with hard working bees who made honey. It was filled with lazy stoner bees who wanted to live off the hard work of everyone else.
All of the lazy stoner bees in the Hive were yellow with black stripes.
(http://i1299.photobucket.com/albums/ag72/conscave/kids-save-bees-TP-lg_zpsf9d1e7c9.jpg)
One day, one of the little stoner bees was sitting around living the Brewer and Shipley life (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ejvcd-JeVCQ), and sucking the orange out of a pile of Cheetos.
(http://i1299.photobucket.com/albums/ag72/conscave/bee_zps5db893db.jpg)
The little stoner bee looked down at his belly and said, "Hey, I'm black with yellow stripes! I must be some kind of individualistic jerk!"
(http://i1299.photobucket.com/albums/ag72/conscave/bees2_zpsd9b531d4.jpg)
Let's play "Find the Individualistic Jerk!"
But the Beekeeper was listening. So the Beekeeper said, "Naw, cuz. You're the same as the rest, your mind just ain't right. Smoke another bowl (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qlmo9yeBZVU), and you'll be buzzin' again, soon enough."
And so the Beekeeper filled the Hive with the Smoke of Laziness,...
(http://i1299.photobucket.com/albums/ag72/conscave/img_keeping01_zps4ed9355c.jpg)
And everything was copacetic for the lazy stoner bees in the Hive, once again.
(http://i1299.photobucket.com/albums/ag72/conscave/kids-save-bees-TP-lg_zpsf9d1e7c9.jpg)
The End.
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Sounds dreadful. I'd rather live in a kibbutz.
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Sounds dreadful. I'd rather live in a kibbutz.
Yeah, hot Israeli women!
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Sounds like a good place for the big guy to stay, if someone will comp him a couple of good aisle seats the next Nebraska-Wisconsin game.
Anyone?
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30 people in one house? Sounds like 'Lord of the Flies'.
And they are paying $500 a month for the "privilege" of living there and having the community dictate their buying habits.
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I bet the neighbors love them.
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I bet the neighbors love them.
30 people under one roof. Sounds like they live in a farrowing shed.
(http://www.geneu.de/files/referenzen/sauen/abferkelstall-genue-boden/dsc01515.jpg)
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30 people under one roof. Sounds like they live in a farrowing shed.
(http://www.geneu.de/files/referenzen/sauen/abferkelstall-genue-boden/dsc01515.jpg)
Nope. I'm pretty sure the farrowing shed is cleaner and smells better than any building with 30 DUmmies in it. Probably more brains there, too.
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As 30 people all living in one big house, sharing expenses, growing our own food in rooftop gardens and recycling/composting as much we can, our environmental footprints are much smaller as a whole. Also, I only pay $500 a month in rent, utilities, washer/dryer, internet, and even food. And this is in a house within walking distance of the downtown area, right on the lakefront.
Listen stupe, I pay less than that in my own, free and clear BTW, home.
Ohhhh. Did I mention I have my own lakefront, too? Best thing? I don't have 29 other hippes stealing my shit and don't tell me that doesn't happen, you lying POS.
zipplewrath (8,978 posts)
5. Too much work
This will be an unattractive model to most people. Most people basically are lazy and won't want to do so much individual work to be in cooperatives.
Wrong. Most people don't want to watch lazy freeloaders leech off of the providers.
Sound familiar?
This is what happens to every communal experience. Every. One. My neighbor can vouch for that. He weaves some pretty good tales of those experiences and they all end up the same.
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Nope. I'm pretty sure the farrowing shed is cleaner and smells better than any building with 30 DUmmies in it. Probably more brains there, too.
:rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf:
Guaranteed!
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We agree to not buy any food or products for the house that come from detestable companies like Monsanto, Koch Industries and Tyson, and get most of the ingredients for house meals from the farmer’s market and a local food co-op.
Last time I checked, Monsanto made herbicides and pesticides, not food. They make it EASIER to grow MORE food, but they don't MAKE food.
I also bet there isn't a farmer at that farmer's market that doesn't use some sort of pesticide, regardless of any posted "organically grown" signs.
As for Koch Industries, what is it with DUmbasses and toilet paper? :confused:
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Last time I checked, Monsanto made herbicides and pesticides, not food. They make it EASIER to grow MORE food, but they don't MAKE food.
I also bet there isn't a farmer at that farmer's market that doesn't use some sort of pesticide, regardless of any posted "organically grown" signs.
As for Koch Industries, what is it with DUmbasses and toilet paper? :confused:
(http://junkfoodnews.net/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/FRITO-LAY-NATURAL-CHEETOS.jpg)
DUmmy says, "Thank Gaea for organic free-range Cheetos!"
If Koch Industries bought Frito-Lay, the DUmmies would commit mass suicide.
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If Koch Industries bought Frito-Lay, the DUmmies would commit mass suicide.
Ohpleaseohpleaseohpleaseohpleaseohpleaseohplease! O-)
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(http://junkfoodnews.net/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/FRITO-LAY-NATURAL-CHEETOS.jpg)
DUmmy says, "Thank Gaea for organic free-range Cheetos!"
If Koch Industries bought Frito-Lay, the DUmmies would commit mass suicide.
Anyone have the Koch brother's address? I think I might be sending them an e-mail suggesting they do just that.
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Anyone have the Koch brother's address? I think I might be sending them an e-mail suggesting they do just that.
Koch Industries, Inc.
P.O. Box 2256
Wichita, KS 67201-2256
info@kochind.com
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Koch Industries, Inc.
P.O. Box 2256
Wichita, KS 67201-2256
info@kochind.com
Ask and ye shall receive! :yahoo: O-) :fuelfire:
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I read the OP... made me think of a prison farm.
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$500/month to live with 30 people?
It's an Op-ed from an Occupier. Some capitalist probably set up a few nice tents and is making a killing off these imbeciles at 500/pop.
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$500/month to live with 30 people?
It's an Op-ed from an Occupier. Some capitalist probably set up a few nice tents and is making a killing off these imbeciles at 500/pop.
Not only that but assuming all of them pay the same then the "non profit" is raking in 15,000/month and providing nothing but a roof.
Fool and money.
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The thought of 30 hippies sharing a house makes me want to :puke: what with the smell of over-capacity bathrooms, pot, cigarettes and whatever pets (or just rodents) are there.
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Not only that but assuming all of them pay the same then the "non profit" is raking in 15,000/month and providing nothing but a roof.
Fool and money.
I wouldn't care if it was the fools and their own money. Somehow you just know government money is involved.
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We have weekly meetings to discuss house business and make decisions in a democratic process, using a consensus model. We agree to not buy any food or products for the house that come from detestable companies like Monsanto, Koch Industries and Tyson, and get most of the ingredients for house meals from the farmer’s market and a local food co-op.
Sounds delightful. Do these meetings also involve self-denunciations for counterrevolutionary thoughts?
Hey DUmmie, I live on a hundred-acre farm that I have fully paid off, as are all my vehicles and farm and shop machinery. The only utility bill I have is couple of hundred bucks a month for electricity and a couple of tanks of propane through the winter, and I can buy about any damn' thing I want to eat and don't have to worry about shiftless hippies stealing it while I'm asleep.
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Lots of up and down twinkle votes to be sure.
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(http://i1052.photobucket.com/albums/s450/DUDUmmies/BL41VqJCEAEb1SJ.jpg) (http://s1052.photobucket.com/user/DUDUmmies/media/BL41VqJCEAEb1SJ.jpg.html)
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I also bet there isn't a farmer at that farmer's market that doesn't use some sort of pesticide, regardless of any posted "organically grown" signs.
It's really silly and naive to believe otherwise.
At market, the term "organic" means: "This stuff is undersized and damaged by bugs, but if you're dumb enough I'll let you have it for double the normal price."
Amazingly, they find customers.
There is a true saying, "No one ever went broke underestimating the intelligence of the public."