The Conservative Cave
Current Events => The DUmpster => Topic started by: zeitgeist on December 20, 2012, 12:19:38 PM
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http://upload.democraticunderground.com/117215542
There are some interesting comments in this thread.
shadowrider (4,477 posts)
Armed men guarded Media Matters boss as he took $400,000 gun control donation
The recent revelation that the head of Media Matters walked the streets of Washington with a Glock-toting personal assistant acting as a bodyguard may make it a little awkward for the group the next time it seeks a donation from a gun control advocacy group.
Media Matters reportedly took more than $400,000 from the Joyce Foundation specifically earmarked to promote a $600,000 initiative on "gun and public safety issues." At the same time, Media Matters' gun-guarded boss David Brock reportedly obsessed over his own security.
"It doesn't look good," said Fraser Seitel, president of Emerald Partners Communications and a public relations expert who authored the book "Rethinking Reputation."
"But it is a gray area in terms of public relations. Since (Media Matters) is so anti-NRA, to have their members packing heat leaves them open to criticism," he said.
--snip--
The latest revelations about Media Matters has raised questions in Washington, with some lawmakers in Congress considering opening a investigation into the group's tax-exempt status, according to reports in The Daily Caller.
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/02/16/brock-and-glock-armed-men-guarded-media-matters-boss-as-took-400000-gun-control/
Yes it's fox. Sorry about that but the info is true. I looked for, but did NOT find this on either CNN or MSNBC.
Guns for ME, not for thee...
And the ivory tower gets another stain
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Response to shadowrider (Original post)
Thu Feb 16, 2012, 05:55 PM
RayTy (12 posts)
2. I don't blame him
theres a lot of right wing nuts with guns and until we can outlaw all gunsn like other sensible countrys you cant be too careful.
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Response to RayTy (Reply #2)
Thu Feb 16, 2012, 05:58 PM
shadowrider (4,477 posts)
4. And I'd agree with that IF IF IF the anti's allowed NORMAL everyday Americans
to have the same sense of security against right wing nuts or ANYONE bent on personal harm.
Until then, Bloomy etc. have two sets of rules. One for them, one for us.
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Response to RayTy (Reply #2)
Thu Feb 16, 2012, 06:25 PM
oneshooter (5,589 posts)
13. What countries outlaw all guns?
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Response to RayTy (Reply #2)
Thu Feb 16, 2012, 06:51 PM
gejohnston (10,138 posts)
23. about the only countries that actually outlaw privately owned guns
are Jamaica, Russia, and Japan. UK, not so much. Parts of Europe has about the same percentage of gun ownership as we do.
But for the average person who lives in the sticks or crappy neighborhood the meme is "get a dog" or "dial 911". It was not that long ago Brock was one of those right wing smear artists, so he can get a dog or dial 911 that antis tell the rest of us.
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Response to RayTy (Reply #2)
Thu Feb 16, 2012, 06:52 PM
TheWraith (24,331 posts)
24. You mean "sensible countries" like Sudan, where firearms are banned?
Or "sensible countries" like Switzerland, where they entrust their citizens with 660,000 fully automatic military rifles kept in their homes, as well as almost a million civilian-owned guns?
Your perspective on other countries' gun laws--as well as our own--is lacking.
There are over 125 posts on this thread. DUmmies their knickers in a twist.
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I seem to be having some 'keyboard issues' ttfn
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I looked for, but did NOT find this on either CNN or MSNBC.
Of course not.
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When you try to explain away hypocrisy, you always end up in a twist.
In this Christmas season, I've been reading the NT. I'm struck how Jesus railed against hypocrisy quite a bit. I mean he really didn't like it. "You guys cut that out, it's assholish behavior."
Or words to that effect.
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Clames (1,583 posts)
56. You need to have a chat with my cousins...
....currently visiting from the UK. You'll be much better educated on the laws that are passed in these so-called "sensible" countries. Have a wrench in the passenger compartment of your vehicle with no immediate plans to fix anything with it? That's considered a weapon and mandatory jail time. Caught with any kind of blade (even nail clippers with that tiny blade built in) on your person in public? Jail time. Have golf clubs in your vehicle and are not in direct transport to or from a golf course? Jail time. Yeah, real sensible laws there...
Starboard Tack (7,427 posts)
105. What a total crock of shit. You just lost all credibility.
Either you or your "cousins" just made that up. Cite us one example please of all those folk jailed in the UK for nail clippers and golf clubs. Cite the law that dictates "mandatory jail time" for having a wrench in the passenger compartment of a car.
Clames (1,583 posts)
110. I don't give a single sailing...
Last edited Mon Feb 27, 2012, 09:07 PM USA/ET - Edit history (1)
...shit if you think I'm credible or not. You have never been credible in this topic. People in question here who live in that country with firsthand knowledge vs. you who doesn't even have a firm grasp of the laws in this country. Laughable you are.
Examples?
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1266170/Disabled-caravanner-prosecuted-keeping-penknife-car-use-picnics.html
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/comment/personal-view/3613174/The-policeman-found-my-penknife.-Youre-going-down-mate-he-said.html
http://www.thisisdevon.co.uk/penknife-pocket-makes-crook/story-11433734-detail/story.html
Basically people are told not to carry anything that could be even construed to be a bladed object on their person at anytime in public.
In recent years, laws criminalising knife possession in the United Kingdom have been strictly interpreted and applied by police and prosecutors to citizens and foreigners alike of all ages and backgrounds, even where the evidence supporting the crime is in doubt. This development, combined with increasingly frequent application of such laws to marginal or inadvertent offenders by the police and the public prosecutor can easily result in an arrest and a criminal charge in the event a person carrying a folding knife, scissors, plastic knife, multi-tool, or bladed object is detained and searched, and the defendant may have to wait weeks or months for a trial or other disposition of his case by the public prosecutor. HM Customs officials in the Customs Inspection unit at the Mount Pleasant Postal Depot in London, aware of the steadily narrowing interpretation of what constitutes a legal knife in England and Wales, have begun confiscating knives imported through the mails, going so far as to individually test otherwise legal locking and non-locking bladed pocket knives to see if they can be made to open their blades to the fully opened position with a practised "double-action of the wrist"; those that open fully and thus fail the 'test' are confiscated and destroyed as illegal 'gravity knives' under the Restriction of Offensive Weapons Act 1959.
This hasn't even gotten as bad as it will with the newer legislation being expanded from "bladed objects" to now include "knives, bladed/pointed articles, and offensive weapons" . That last part is blanket that covers anything that can be construed to be used offensively which is why all tools have to be secured in a toolbox and in a location out of the reach of anyone in the passenger compartment of a motor vehicle.
For all the shits I give about my credibility with you....
Starboard Tack (7,427 posts)
111. I don't think anyone has a firm grasp about the laws anywhere.
Not even lawyers and judges.
Regarding your links - you reference 2 cases and I must agree that they are outrageous examples of overstepping on the part of the police. Two incidents in 8 years, though, hardly a daily occurrence. Unfortunately, I have witnessed similar incidents in this country since 9/11. Not involving knives, but taking photos of tourist attractions which could be considered potential terrorist targets.
The laws regarding tools in cars in the UK is way over the top, but the law regarding gravity knives and blade length have been in place since 1959. I grew up under those laws and was pissed at the time that I couldn't own them, but it was a small price to pay, considering the prevalence of knife use by gangs, starting with the Teddy Boys and Spivs of the 1950's and then the Mods and Rockers of the 1960's. There is potential for violence in any society and when guns are not available, those who would commit violent acts resort to the next most effective weapon, the knife.
The problem with the cases you cited was the over zealous cops involved, who need to be disciplined and retrained. In my experience, which I admit is somewhat dated, their behavior was anomalous and nothing like I ever experienced, either as a citizen or as a cop.
I doubt if anyone ever got locked up for a nail clipper.
#1: The laws are draconian
#2: Liar! You have no proof!
#1: *proof*
#2: Judges and lawyers don't know how to properly apply the law!
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Its almost impossible to even own an airsoft or a replica of a gun in the UK and they think it's "All made up". I bet those idiots don't remember when Fat Teddy Kennedys body guards were arrested for having illeagle sub machinge guns in D.C. when they got busted either.
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KT2000 (9,356 posts)
6. not getting the inconsistency here
gun control is not about taking away everyone's gun. I thought it was about making sure there are background checks and that sort of thing. If the body guard bought the gun legally, is not insane or a convicted felon - what is the problem?
one-eyed fat man (3,201 posts)
38. In DC?????
Carrying a concealed weapon in DC is against the law except for Law Enforcement. Since when does being the 'personal assistant' for an anti-gun big shot come with a badge or a "Get Out of Jail Free" card?
Special rules for the rich and politically connected? Sounds like a 1% attitude to me.
Glaug-Eldare (716 posts)
114. Once again, shades of Ed Hale at BWI.
Ed Hale, the (white) CEO of First Mariner Bancorp in Baltimore attempted to smuggle a loaded gun onto an airliner (in his carry-on luggage), and received one year of unsupervised probation before judgment (sentencing without conviction, designed to extend lenience for low-risk offenders). He also possessed (possesses?) one of those rare personal protection handgun permits, simply because he is a wealthy and influential person. He is free as we type because he is rich and white.
On the other hand, Charles F. Williams, a (black) citizen who is not a bank executive, was arrested for possession of a handgun (in a backpack, not in his pants) while attempting to take public transportation from his girlfriend's house to his own. He could not have possibly received a handgun permit, because he hadn't been attacked multiple times, and didn't have the money to buy a legislator's help. He was convicted in Circuit Court and sentenced to three years in prison, plus three years of supervised probation on release. He is imprisoned as we type because he is neither rich nor white.
An innocent man is doing 3 years.
Good job, libtards.
grasswire (36,065 posts)
18. so FOX is teaming up with Alan Dershowitz to ruin Media Matters?
Is that the game here?
I call bogus on that story.
PavePusher (15,145 posts)
48. Is it unfactual? Cites, please. n/t
grasswire (36,065 posts)
63. you can't find corroboration but believe the story is true?
Do you have some other sourcing? FOX is the only source at this time, AFIK.
Seitel is a paid commenter for FOX.
gejohnston (10,145 posts)
64. either way
it is possible. To your point
Does ideology A make shit up about ideology B? Yes
If true, is either one going to be honest if it does not serve their purpose? No
Does anyone outside of the ideological pissing match care? No. It is not a story to anyone else. True or not, you will not see it on CNN, BBC, or anyone else.
I get that Glock is a popular make, but it is not the only one. Glock seems to be the first pistol many think of. If the article claimed it was made by someone else, it would be more probable IMHO.
where did the information come from?
grasswire (36,065 posts)
65. You are wrong.
Or too cynical to recognize the difference between truth tellers and liars. FOX is devoted to lying. Media Matters is devoted to truth. This is not an ideological pissing match.
wow. It's like an over-wrought propaganda film.
You can just hear the deep-voice narrator proclaiming the fight for truth, justice and the Anti-American way!
:rotf:
shadowrider (4,477 posts)
88. You think that's amusing
Wait till someone posts an article from fox that's PRO GUN CONTROL. Then is seems, the anti-gunners fully and honestly believe the source is reliable and trustworthy.
ellisonz (22,483 posts)
89. Do you see any of us linking to right-wing sources? n/t
beevul (6,423 posts)
98. Mhmm.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/11723536
http://www.democraticunderground.com/117212676
http://www.democraticunderground.com/117214883
Say, who posted that first one?
BURN!
ellisonz (22,483 posts)
99. I went to it from the latimes.com coverage...
...on the front-page, and besides, that's a local news affiliate. Do you understand the difference? Not the main beast. What is your opinion of Faux News? Do you think it's a generally legitimate news source? Do you regularly watch Faux News on the tube?
beevul (6,423 posts)
100. Why are you asking me?
"What is your opinion of Faux News? Do you think it's a generally legitimate news source? Do you regularly watch Faux News on the tube?"
Why are you asking me?
I didn't post those links.
You, and your antigun cohorts did.
How about you answering the questions you are asking. Or maybe posing them to others on your side of the issue who link to fox.
If fox is unacceptable, its unacceptable for everyone.
If its acceptable when you or your anti-gun buddies link to it, then its ok for everyone else too.
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Thanks for those posts Sarge. You got the best of the best. :hi5:
This laptop's keyboard seems to take a holiday from time to time. I am not sure whether it is an undocumented feature of W7 or if it is the keyboard itself or my fat fingering but every now an then things go cattiwumpus. I took the opportunity to go to the grocery for some candy making supplies in the hope that m/zeit will take pitty and make me some peanut brittle. :naughty:
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Response to shadowrider (Original post)
Thu Feb 16, 2012, 05:55 PM
RayTy (12 posts)
2. I don't blame him
theres a lot of right wing nuts with guns and until we can outlaw all gunsn like other sensible countrys you cant be too careful.
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Until you can disarm all the Obama sons out there, then law abiding people should keep their guns for their own safety.
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It's nice to see the pie-and-jam primitive, the grasswire primitive, back in her old form again.
She might, or might not, have made it into the Top DUmmies of 2012, but if I were a reasonable man, I'd look for her somewhere there.
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Leftists = Hypocrites.
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Thanks for those posts Sarge.
It was a good find. It deserved love.
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It's nice to see the pie-and-jam primitive, the grasswire primitive, back in her old form again.
She might, or might not, have made it into the Top DUmmies of 2012, but if I were a reasonable man, I'd look for her somewhere there.
You know she's opening a pie shop, right?
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=236x86326
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Free speech and simple disagreement are so foreign to group think fascists.
Under liberal leadership the freedom outlined in the first amendment will disappear one by one.
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Poor addled DUmmy grasswipe Judy Smith has a committment to pie.
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Look how obtuse they are!
Response to shadowrider (Reply #79)
Thu Feb 23, 2012, 10:31 AM
Doctor_J (25,358 posts)
84. I don't have to. Every page of every issue of every one of these rags
is dedicated to destroying the president, all liberals, and the entire Dem party. What is difficult to grasp about that? The fact that you read these things, and then post them at a site called Democratic Underground is a pathetic right-wing mole attack.
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Response to Doctor_J (Reply #84)
Thu Feb 23, 2012, 05:57 PM
shadowrider (4,477 posts)
90. The info is true.
If I posted an article from Fox stating Obama is president, would you deny it based on the source?
Response to beevul (Reply #80)
Thu Feb 23, 2012, 10:32 AM
Doctor_J (25,358 posts)
85. Nope. Back when we had unrec, I proudly unrec'd
every excerpt from every right-wing source, often without reading them. I also made sure that the OP knew why I unrec'd.
Response to Doctor_J (Reply #95)
Thu Feb 23, 2012, 08:35 PM
oneshooter (5,589 posts)
96. So if it is not printed in HuffPo it never happened. No true Scotsman, again.
That's a dangerous and stupid way to live, I think. Always with your head in the sand and not aware of the various goings-on.
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911? Right. "When seconds count, the police are only minutes away" has never been truer than it is today, as the legions of 911 horror stories attest.
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911? Right. "When seconds count, the police are only minutes away" has never been truer than it is today, as the legions of 911 horror stories attest.
They will respond with Benghazi-like alacrity.
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They will respond with Benghazi-like alacrity.
I trust our police chief and sheriff.
The guys in Benghazi were depending on the jug-eared muslim and the Hildabeast.
They only needed help to arrive within hours from when it was requested.
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I trust our police chief and sheriff.
The guys in Benghazi were depending on the jug-eared muslim and the Hildabeast.
They only needed help to arrive within hours from when it was requested.
I use to trust the chief and sheriff, not so much anymore.
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Response to RayTy (Reply #2)
Thu Feb 16, 2012, 05:58 PM
shadowrider (4,477 posts)
4. And I'd agree with that IF IF IF the anti's allowed NORMAL everyday Americans
to have the same sense of security against right wing nuts or ANYONE bent on personal harm.
Until then, Bloomy etc. have two sets of rules. One for them, one for us.
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And you gun control nuts at the dump are just now figuring out that your heroes live by a different set of rules? Stupid dummies. But we are the ones that can't think for ourselves and are controlled by Rush Limbaugh. :mental:
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Gun control doesn't work .Just check out Afghanistan. Everyone and his brother has a gun and most of them are AK-47's of one kind or another. They also have a long history of making their own guns out of whatever is available like railroad rails melted down for the steel. They may not be high quality but they work well enough for them and that's all that matters . Also you don't need much to make a zip gun either. If your intent is to kill someone and make it hard for the cops to catch you then a zip gun is the easiest way of doing it. Not that criminals would follow new gun laws any more then they follow them now but you DUmp monkeys keep living in fantasy land where taking guns away from those that don't commit crimes and see what happenes when the Government no longer fears it's people
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Gun control doesn't work .Just check out Afghanistan. Everyone and his brother has a gun and most of them are AK-47's of one kind or another. They also have a long history of making their own guns out of whatever is available like railroad rails melted down for the steel. They may not be high quality but they work well enough for them and that's all that matters. Also you don't need much to make a zip gun either. If your intent is to kill someone and make it hard for the cops to catch you then a zip gun is the easiest way of doing it. Not that criminals would follow new gun laws any more then they follow them now but you DUmp monkeys keep living in fantasy land where taking guns away from those that don't commit crimes and see what happenes when the Government no longer fears it's people.
Funny you should say that, AW . . .
http://www.michaelzwilliamson.com/politics-The%20Steampunk%20AK47.html
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911? Right. "When seconds count, the police are only minutes away" has never been truer than it is today, as the legions of 911 horror stories attest.
I live on the outskirts of a small town. On 3 separate occasions, there have been traffic accidents along the road that borders my property. All 3 times the police were called, the best response time was 15 minutes.
All of the police headquarters (state, county, local) are less than 5 miles from my house, one less than 3.
I won't dial "911" if someone is on my property or in my house uninvited. I'll dial "9mm" first, "911" after the smoke clears. Protecting myself, my family, and my property is MY responsibility, not the police's, not the politicians', and for DAMN SURE, not some drug swilling, semi-literate, pseudo-educated, brain dead DUmmie, who wouldn't know how to pour piss out of a boot if the directions were written on the heal!
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I live on the outskirts of a small town. On 3 separate occasions, there have been traffic accidents along the road that borders my property. All 3 times the police were called, the best response time was 15 minutes.
All of the police headquarters (state, county, local) are less than 5 miles from my house, one less than 3.
I won't dial "911" if someone is on my property or in my house uninvited. I'll dial "9mm" first, "911" after the smoke clears. Protecting myself, my family, and my property is MY responsibility, not the police's, not the politicians', and for DAMN SURE, not some drug swilling, semi-literate, pseudo-educated, brain dead DUmmie, who wouldn't know how to pour piss out of a boot if the directions were written on the heal!
Where I live, it's half an hour even if they want to come and move out smartly. I therefore don't count on them being able to do anything productive for me if there ever is an emergency need for deadly force.
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I'm amazed just how thin the police are spread in this town. 50 cops (75 PD employees) in a town of 30K, spread out over an area of about 50 square miles. Now split the shifts up, etc., and you're looking at MAYBE 6-8 cops actually on the street at any given time.
And there are people who actually believe the PD will be there lickety-split if they're threatened.
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Funny you should say that, AW . . .
http://www.michaelzwilliamson.com/politics-The%20Steampunk%20AK47.html
Interesting. In the movie "The Leaugue of Extrodinary Men" they used AK's for the bad guys guns.
(http://spaceart.de/produkte/die_liga_der_aussergewoehnlichen_gentlemen_phantom_rifle_log003-a.jpg)
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I'm amazed just how thin the police are spread in this town. 50 cops (75 PD employees) in a town of 30K, spread out over an area of about 50 square miles. Now split the shifts up, etc., and you're looking at MAYBE 6-8 cops actually on the street at any given time.
And there are people who actually believe the PD will be there lickety-split if they're threatened.
The number of cops you need on the street is in direct proportion to the number of 0bama's sons you have in town.
In New Hampshire, I'd say a half dozen cops is enough for any town in the state.
Montana would probably get by okay with a half dozen cops in the whole state.
You can't afford to routinely budget for the one in a million chance of a lunatic on the loose.
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911? Right. "When seconds count, the police are only minutes away" has never been truer than it is today, as the legions of 911 horror stories attest.
In Newton, when a man/woman/policeman with a weapon was needed, the police were only 9 minutes and 26 innocent lives away.
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In Newton, when a man/woman/policeman with a weapon was needed, the police were only 9 minutes and 26 innocent lives away.
And that beat the shit out of the response in Columbine, where the cops just surrounded the place and hunkered down for a few hours so all the wounded could bleed to death.
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And that beat the shit out of the response in Columbine, where the cops just surrounded the place and hunkered down for a few hours so all the wounded could bleed to death.
I always considered that cowardice in uniform. I cannot respect police to refuse to serve and protect.
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I always considered that cowardice in uniform. I cannot respect police to refuse to serve and protect.
I've wondered how high up those orders came from.
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These DUmmies need to get a grip. The self described Anti-Gun Jewish folk on the Island boggle my mind the most. It's like they have a gas chamber mentality and can't remember the last 100 years of world history.
This one's for you ellisonz, swinging from your dear Leader's crank hoping for him to smite your enemies. Just remember, you're on the menu just like the rest of us.
First, they came for the gun owners and I said nothing.
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isn't pot illegal? all the good it does............
jctejas federal crime i believe...........
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I always considered that cowardice in uniform. I cannot respect police to refuse to serve and protect.
It's my understanding that was SOP at the time. At the expense of sounding Nadin-esque, I cannot imagine a SWAT team making an entry into an active shooter area without a word from higher.
I think of it more as dereliction of duty than cowardice on the part of whoever enforced that policy.
isn't pot illegal? all the good it does............
jctejas federal crime i believe...........
So are straw purchases and gun smuggling but it turns out the feds were the ones committing the crimes.
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So are straw purchases and gun smuggling but it turns out the feds were the ones committing the crimes.
If civilians do it, that is a crime. If the government does it, that is policy.
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And that beat the shit out of the response in Columbine, where the cops just surrounded the place and hunkered down for a few hours so all the wounded could bleed to death.
I agree.
The Columbine cops took cover and waited for the shooters to run out of ammunition.
Mind-boggling cowardice.
Normally, disgraceful law enforcement is limited to federal operations, i.e., Ruby Ridge and Waco.
This, for a change, was local.
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Response to RayTy (Reply #2)
Thu Feb 16, 2012, 05:58 PM
shadowrider (4,477 posts)
4. And I'd agree with that IF IF IF the anti's allowed NORMAL everyday Americans
to have the same sense of security against right wing nuts or ANYONE bent on personal harm.
Until then, Bloomy etc. have two sets of rules. One for them, one for us
Funny you should mention that... :rotf: :rotf:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/crime-scene/post/dc-police-to-investigate-tv-show-incident/2012/12/26/c4ede51a-4f2e-11e2-950a-7863a013264b_blog.html
The D.C. police confirmed reports Wednesday that they are looking into an incident in which David Gregory, the host of the television show “Meet the Press,†displayed what he described as a high-capacity ammunition magazine.
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Funny you should mention that... :rotf: :rotf:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/crime-scene/post/dc-police-to-investigate-tv-show-incident/2012/12/26/c4ede51a-4f2e-11e2-950a-7863a013264b_blog.html
And yet to this day he isn't in a jail house or even been charged. They are "Investigating" it. Whats to investigate? He's on video holding a magazine that has been declared illeagle to own or posses and if it was anyone else they would have been in front of the judge by Monday morning.