The Conservative Cave
Current Events => The DUmpster => Topic started by: Freeper on August 26, 2012, 10:05:52 AM
-
renie408 (7,983 posts)
So proud of this response to a Romney supporting friend of mine....
I have a friend that I have been going back and forth about over this election for weeks on Facebook. He is my farrier and we have developed this weird thing where face to face we talk about everything under the sun BUT politics and on Facebook just about the only thing we talk about is politics. The distance of Facebook has allowed us to stay friends and business associates while arguing like crazy every day about politics.
We segued into a talk about the fall of Rome and a patriarchal society that hoards resources and strangles the lower classes. Another friend had jumped in and said, "Yep, that's pretty much what happened." To which my farrier responded "So, we just tax the rich bastards??"
Here is my response:
"Pretty much. I know that to some people it feels like that is penalizing 'them' for being successful, but that is a knee jerk, immediate reaction to something that is much more complex.
Some of the complexities involved are the fact they we cannot make an endless supply of money so that everybody can have some without reducing the worth of that money. Again, HELLO...Argentina. So, if the wealthy earn interest and dividends on their money and investments, they continue to sop up more and more of a finite resource. In any repetitive mathematical equation, you hit a tipping point. There is a parable about the Pasha of India wanting to reward the creator of the game of chess because he thought it was the most wondrous game he had ever played. He asked the man what he wanted for a reward and the man said, "My request is that you would give me one grain of rice for the first square on the board, two for the second, four for the third, and so on." The Pasha thought this sounded very modest and instantly agreed. The problem is that if you double the amount of rice for each square on the board, by time you get to the last square you have a pile of rice BIGGER THAN MT EVEREST. And the amount doesn't start to get freaky enormous or a problem until about the second half of the board. At the end of the first half of the board, you are talking about a large amount (I think I have heard it compared to several dump trucks worth). But into the second 32 doublings, that amount starts to get increasingly enormous increasingly quickly.
Same thing goes with the money that the wealthy are hoarding. They didn't start out holding 87.7% of all the wealth in the country. But since their money makes money, they have continued to get wealthier and wealthier even while we have been going downhill. And we are starting to hit the second half of the chess board. They have SO MUCH of the wealth and their wealth is earning SO MUCH of a return that every year they are soaking up an exponentially larger amount of that available resource. Bryan, if the top 20% of people were holding 87.7% of the food available and asking 80% of the people in this country to live off of 13.3% of the food, you would be the first in line with your pitchfork and torch. And we would go in there and TAKE BACK some of our food. You wouldn't sit around waiting for them to hand you the food, you wouldn't rely on them doing the right thing with the food and sharing it and you sure as hell wouldn't vote to give them MORE FOOD on the off chance that some how some of it would trickle back down to you.
The uber wealthy in this country have managed to take 2.7% MORE of the wealth in this country since 2007. While the middle class has basically fallen and can't get up, they have gotten phenomenally wealthier. Trust me, 2.7% of the wealth of this entire country is A LOT of land, money, and tangible assets. And we don't have it any more and they do. And you are waiting around for them to produce more jobs with that money so that some of it can come back to us. And while in some people's minds that makes sense, in THIRTY YEARS it has never happened. Since we have lowered what the top bracket pays in taxes, the middle class has steadily lost ground to that thin layer of upper class. There are no more jobs. There is nothing coming back to us. With our vast voting power we gave them that money thinking that they would invest it in economic growth and instead they have sat on it and allowed it to earn them interest. Which sucks up more money, which earns more interest and soon there isn't going to be enough left over to even HAVE a viable middle class.
And I don't blame them. I might do the same thing. Not because I would want to hurt the people below me, but because it is human nature to hold on to what is yours. But whether somebody runs you over by accident or on purpose, you are still dead. I think the huge thing that people have lost over the years is that the government isn't separate from us. It IS us. You have this idea that the government is some big, looming bad thing. I don't think it is. It is the tool that we have been given to insure the best lives we can have for ourselves. We cannot storm the halls of the wealthy with pitchforks and torches in this day and age. But we can use the tool the Founding Fathers gave us and take back something for ourselves. And that is why I vote the way I vote. Period. Not because I like or dislike a candidate, not because of some hot button social issue that gets my dander up...but on which candidate I think will give MY KIDS their best shot at having a decent life. Not the perfect candidate; there is no such thing. No one can satisfy everyone all of the time. But the candidate who at least recognizes that giving the wealthy more and more money isn't helping me one bit. "
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10021203360
Wow I'm speechless, this DUmmy is claiming that the founding fathers set it up so that we can simply vote to take the wealth of others to give to ourselves.
What happens when someone decides they want some of your wealth? Will you hand it over with a smile or will you fight to keep what is rightfully yours?
You may say you aren't rich, but what about someone who has much less than you have, and they decide that you can spare a few bucks so they can buy groceries? After all you don't really need a new Iphone so why should you get to keep the money for that and buy it?
These fools are so shortsighted, if they get their way and we tax the rich into poverty guess who will be the next target? That's right the middles class who will be considered the new evil rich.
renie408 (7,983 posts)
9. Sure! That's why I shared it.
I have been arguing with this guy forever and he ALWAYS has a comeback for everything. But I have been trying this approach for a day or so, culminating in that post last night. This is the first anti-GOP argument I have come up with that he is actually considering. I am not sure it will change his vote, but it has at least slowed him down and got him thinking. It avoids having to discuss whether life begins at conception, whether or not Mitt Romney is a liar or whether or not Barack Obama has done a great job in every single possible area in the past four years.
And it just strikes HOME. Hell, even RUSH LIMBAUGH had a weak moment when confronted with the most recent information about the death of the middle class!
I really think this is a good talking point that everybody can understand.
:banghead:
We are doomed as a country if people actually believe this garbage. :banghead: :banghead: :banghead:
-
not because of some hot button social issue that gets my dander up...
But the candidate who at least recognizes that giving the wealthy more and more money isn't helping me one bit.
See that ? That is where you lost the argument, primitive. I'll leave you to your own devices to figure out why.
-
Hey, 'bat, the reason why your friend "is considering" what you said is that he realizes that you just can't fix stooooopid. :thatsright:
-
If you think the capital strike of the last four years was bad wait until a second term of Wile B. 0bama, Super Economic Genius, looks like.
-
So this friend is S/H/It's farrier? Not cheap, caring for a horse.
I wonder if this is another guilty 1%er.
-
So this friend is S/H/It's farrier? Not cheap, caring for a horse.
I wonder if this is another guilty 1%er.
I see what you did there. :cheersmate:
-
So this friend is S/H/It's farrier? Not cheap, caring for a horse.
I wonder if this is another guilty 1%er.
I guess since nads (I believe it was nads) used the term dressage that horses and related stuff is the all the rage at the DUmp.
-
And it just strikes HOME. Hell, even RUSH LIMBAUGH had a weak moment when confronted with the most recent information about the death of the middle class!
:lmao:
The only weak moment Rush has ever had is when he found out he just let a DUmmie give him head! :-) O-)
-
To which my farrier responded "So, we just tax the rich bastards??"
The farrier was mocking her with that response and I doubt he bothered to read renie's class-warfare tirade that followed. I didn't.
-
The farrier was mocking her with that response and I doubt he bothered to read renie's class-warfare tirade that followed. I didn't.
They never can figure out when they are being mocked. It is pretty damn funny. :-)
-
Well, I'm certainly not a Facebook expert. Check it maybe two or three times a week.
But I'm confused. Doesn't TL/DR apply on Facebook the same as discussion boards?
-
Dummies can sure feel proud over the most inconsequential things. Too many participation trophies I guess.
-
Somewhere in this thread there is an opportunity for a banned word. Just out of my conscious reach. Maybe I will sleep on it.
-
Well, I'm certainly not a Facebook expert. Check it maybe two or three times a week.
But I'm confused. Doesn't TL/DR apply on Facebook the same as discussion boards?
Why yes. Yes it does.
-
Some of the complexities involved are the fact they we cannot make an endless supply of money so that everybody can have some without reducing the worth of that money.
Wrong!
The whole rant is built upon a false premise.
We cannot artifically create money endlessly in order to cover debt because that leads to inflation. Don't have to go to Argentina, just see what Dear Leader has done and the inflation this country has faced in certain sectors and will be facing in others based upon it.
OTOH, money that has been created as a result of market forces does not have the same effect. There is always some overall inflation in an expanding economy driven by market forces, but it's hardly noticable and the value of that money is stable.
.
-
Hey, 'bat, the reason why your friend "is considering" what you said is that he realizes that you just can't fix stooooopid. :thatsright:
I know! His friend probably just sat back with his mouth open wondering "WTF is he on?, how can someone think that way".
I recommend a good cleansing of your FB bowels if he is on your list.