The Conservative Cave
Current Events => The DUmpster => Topic started by: franksolich on August 12, 2012, 05:01:12 PM
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http://www.democraticunderground.com/11142756
Oh my.
Bonobo (17,676 posts)
People who cry at movies are not "real men"?
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=1090551
Sometimes much can be gleaned from a single sentence. It can reveal the true mindset that lurks beneath all the poses.
This Group addresses in many ways what it means to be a man.
Some have attacked its existence, claiming that "real men" don't need to whine.
Implications that there is an element of woman hating or mother-seeking or inability to fight or make love.
All point to one thing. A deep-set insecurity about one's own manhood based on a false view of what it means to be a man.
And so, I leave you with these questions.
Did you ever cry during a movie and do you feel, like the OP linked above, that it undermines your manhood?
Or is actually this clinging to worn out ideas of manliness that is a central cause for some of the problems that exist for men, and indeed for women as we try to achieve a better balance and learn from each other?
radicalliberal (56 posts)
1. I first saw The Diary of Anne Frank on TV during the spring of my sophomore year ...
... in high school. The ending did bring tears to my eyes, and I felt embarrassed by my reaction (maybe even ashamed of it) because I had been conditioned to believe that guys should never cry for any reason.
Decades later I was chatting with my personal trainer at the local health club during one of my workout sessions. He's one of the most muscular guys I've ever met. I told him about my reaction to the ending of that movie. His reaction? Well, he said, "Everybody cries. That was something to cry about because it really happened."
I dunno. I have a problem with this.
When I was in the socialist paradises of the workers and peasants, I was once invited to a "private viewing" of the boot-legged Schindler's List; this was in the mid-1990s.
Movies aren't my thing, I get nothing out of them.
Anyway, I was freaked out by the reactions of the small audience near the end of the film; they cried.
I privately thought, "Whoa.
"There's miles and miles of old black-and-white film showing real people going to real deaths--and here people are bawling about fictitious people fictitiously suffering?
"What is it about people that imaginary things grab their heart-strings, but real things don't?"
Bah, humbug.
Broderick (4,568 posts)
7. I could never be accused of not being a man, and I can not be accused of not being manly
But, definitely I have a problem with movies. I can well up and it is uncomfortable. Anything to do with death, love, children, animals, pain and suffering and journeys into the abyss of the mind brings it.
I would say I was conditioned to think it was a bad thing when I was much younger and growing up. Now I don't give a ****. I do avoid watching any movies that might bring it on with male friends. Too many other things to do anyway, and my impatience to sit for 2 hours makes watching a movie hard to do anyway. Some men hold that notion that it is wrong, but those types probably aren't my friends to begin with.
I notice I am much more affected by movies than any woman I have ever been with. Some movies I can say that make me cry are movies like Jacob's Ladder, 50 first dates, the Green Mile, Dead Man Walking, Million Dollar Baby, Marley and me, Big Fish, The Truman Show, The Pursuit of Happiness, and many of the usual suspects like The Notebook, Steel Magnolias, ET, Dead Poets Society, Shawshank Redemption, What Dreams May Come, The Sixth Sense, American Beauty, When Harry met Sally, Patch Adams, etc etc etc.
The two hardest movies for me to watch and I love to watch them are Jacob's Ladder and Big Fish. Both of those absolutely kill me. The journey of death and life I guess, and fear of death has nothing to do with being manly, but with general acceptance and mortality.
MicaelS (3,799 posts)
9. Hell, I cry at movies all the time...
And I'm a middle aged white man. Happy, sad, nothing turns on the waterworks for me like a good film. Not a bit ashamed to admit it.
I think trumad just hates men.
ProudToBeBlueInRhody (7,782 posts)
10. Wait, did I miss something?
Is this all in response to a "trumad bit"?
**** that noise.
MicaelS (3,799 posts)
11. Yup....
trumad
White Pastie Faced Doughboys who think they are tough guys...
I see it all the time... Ink some Tats, throw on a bandana, maybe some leather... carry a piece...
but underneath--- one empty insecure soul who balls like a baby at the end of Ghost.
ProudToBeBlueInRhody (7,782 posts)
15. Oh, I saw that
Not as silly as I imagined....but I'm doubting he sees it "all the time".
Besides, who's he writing it for? The white supremacists lurkers here?
opiate69 (5,595 posts)
12. He truly is a Prince of Projection....
and as for the crying issue, I find myself tearing up during all the tear-jerker moments on shows like Hells Kitchen (when they bring in the contestants families for example) and a shit ton of other times... moreso since my singer/best friend died 3 years ago (the last time I completely fell apart with sadness and openly bawled like the proverbial baby)
Warren DeMontague (37,840 posts)
17. Maybe he just hates dic....tionaries.
^^in case one didn't get the drift of the above exchange, the truemud primitive, the pasty-faced limpid wimpy primitive, is one of the biggest bullies on Skins's island.
Denninmi (2,992 posts)
16. Dude, I would blubber like a baby at the right scene.
And I wouldn't be the least bit ashamed of it.
And I would go see a rom-com film like 'Pretty Woman' any time over a dumb bang-bang shoot em up Rambo type movie.
Yeah, I've had issues at times in my life, when OTHER people have decided I wasn't "manly" enough. Like my late father, who pretty much told me so because I wasn't interested in HIS particular vision of masculinity, which was going out into the fields and streams and blowing away Bambi. I would rather stay at home and cook and garden and putter with things like making birdhouses. And I wasn't really what you would call a metrosexual, but there was a time in my life when I was more concerned about clothes and image etc. than I am now that I'm older, and he didn't approve of that either.
I still don't do the things that many men are into and are considered uber-masculine. I'm not an athlete, and I'm not a sports fan, either. I don't hunt or fish. I don't womanize, or get into bikes or cars or anything like that. And I'm not the least bit ashamed of it. And frankly, I think I would make an awesome husband to any woman and awesome father in a lot of ways, well, other than the dirt-poor part
I think real masculinity isn't macho garbage, it's being a good, decent human being who treats others with respect.
Edited to add - I read the linked thread and the OP. I don't remember tearing up at the ending of Ghost, but I'm pretty sure I had a really hard time during Schindler's List.
It's a pretty big campfire; if one has the time, I suggest one get out the boat and row over to Skins's island to see it in its entirety.
As mentioned earlier, franksolich doesn't do movies, but will admit to crying at sad endings of books.
The worst time was after reading the death-bed scene in a biography of Henry R. Luce; I was despondent for days.
Really.
And the death-bed scene of Douglas MacArthur affected me the same way, although not quite as much.
It was very sad, these people had to die.
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My husband never cries at movies, me? I'm a blubbering idiot LOL.
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I don't "cry" as in "boo-hoo", but I am not completely without heart. I can muster a tear sometimes.
(Yes, Frank, it is silly to get so emotionally involved in an acted-out story, but sometimes it's just the human thing to do.)
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I don't "cry" as in "boo-hoo", but I am not completely without heart. I can muster a tear sometimes.
(Yes, Frank, it is silly to get so emotionally involved in an acted-out story, but sometimes it's just the human thing to do.)
Any movie where the main character loses their lifelong friend, if it's a dog, gets to me. People, not so much.
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(Yes, Frank, it is silly to get so emotionally involved in an acted-out story, but sometimes it's just the human thing to do.)
Well now, I'm not passing judgement upon those who do.
It's just that with so much real tragedy and suffering, I don't understand it.
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Well, I can't speak for movies, but I ALWAYS get a lump in my throat and moisture in my eyes every time the "Star Spangled Banner" is played, and those magnificent jets fly over!
GOX BLESS AMERICA! :usflag:
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Well, I can't speak for movies, but I ALWAYS get a lump in my throat and moisture in my eyes every time the "Star Spangled Banner" is played, and those magnificent jets fly over!
GOX BLESS AMERICA! :usflag:
Well, that too, yes.
But that's real.
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Well now, I'm not passing judgement upon those who do.
It's just that with so much real tragedy and suffering, I don't understand it.
Frank, after my heart attacks and heart surgery, my hormones went haywire. I cried at least once a day for any or no reason.
I mention this because folks have different hormonal reactions to situations. For instance, I didn't cry when my dad died, but I did when my dog died.
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The last time I cried at a movie was "The Champ".
I was six.
DUmmie lurkers, make sure "he" sees this:
Broderick, you're not a man, nor are you manly. Nothing about being a lib is manly.
I could go on and on about losing manliness in America. Started with the Frankfurt School.
I smoke cigars, I shoot guns. I wet shave. I dress like a man, act like a "traditional" man.
I am married, and I am so manly, my sperm slammed into my wife's egg like the supercollider and split it clean in half. They had no choice but to grow into boys.
And I am secure in my manliness.
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The last time I cried at a movie was "The Champ".
I was six.
DUmmie lurkers, make sure "he" sees this:
Broderick, you're not a man, nor are you manly. Nothing about being a lib is manly.
I could go on and on about losing manliness in America. Started with the Frankfurt School.
I smoke cigars, I shoot guns. I wet shave. I dress like a man, act like a "traditional" man.
I am married, and I am so manly, my sperm slammed into my wife's egg like the supercollider and split it clean in half. They had no choice but to grow into boys.
And I am secure in my manliness.
So manly he was born without nipples. :-)
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I don't "cry" as in "boo-hoo", but I am not completely without heart. I can muster a tear sometimes.
(Yes, Frank, it is silly to get so emotionally involved in an acted-out story, but sometimes it's just the human thing to do.)
My husband does too from time to time. He got a bit teary eyed watching Schindler's List and The Pianist (they stick out in my mind the most). I'm sure there are other movies that have done the same as well.
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The last time I cried at a movie was "The Champ".
I was six.
DUmmie lurkers, make sure "he" sees this:
Broderick, you're not a man, nor are you manly. Nothing about being a lib is manly.
I could go on and on about losing manliness in America. Started with the Frankfurt School.
I smoke cigars, I shoot guns. I wet shave. I dress like a man, act like a "traditional" man.
I am married, and I am so manly, my sperm slammed into my wife's egg like the supercollider and split it clean in half. They had no choice but to grow into boys.
And I am secure in my manliness.
LOL :rotf:
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My husband does too from time to time. He got a bit teary eyed watching Schindler's List and The Pianist (they stick out in my mind the most). I'm sure there are other movies that have done the same as well.
I remember the first time I was "Overboard". I teared-up when the kids were chasing the limo screaming, "Moms don't leave!" :-)
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For Greater Glory had me crying.
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I remember the first time I was "Overboard". I teared-up when the kids were chasing the limo screaming, "Moms don't leave!" :-)
Ha ha, I did too. I cry pretty easy.
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The final scenes of Ben Hur get me everytime. Did the first time I saw it ...what... maybe 50 years ago now.
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The final scenes of Ben Hur get me everytime. Did the first time I saw it ...what... maybe 50 years ago now.
I don't remember it. I haven't seen that movie since I was a kid.
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Mrley and me.
I have to watch gladiator ans the patriot afterwards.
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Well, I can't speak for movies, but I ALWAYS get a lump in my throat and moisture in my eyes every time the "Star Spangled Banner" is played, and those magnificent jets fly over!
GOX BLESS AMERICA! :usflag:
The 'missing man formation' flyover is quite moving.
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Taking Chance had both DH and I tearing up throughout the movie.
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No comment from the Omaha Weeper?
He claims to sob every time another DUmpmonkey spins a sad bouncy tale.
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Well now, I'm not passing judgement upon those who do.
It's just that with so much real tragedy and suffering, I don't understand it.
The thing about a well done movie is that it makes you care about the people in it and you start to "know" them like a real person on a sub conscious level.
People see real footage of death and suffering and most of them will feel bad but they will not get worked up to the point of tears very often because they don't know them at all. That is actually a good thing or we would be reduced to tears every time we turned on the 6 o'clock news. Not a healthy thing.
Being deaf you have to concentrate on reading the closed captions and trying to watch what is going on at the same time so you are not able to just let the movie take you out of yourself. Unlike a book where you are able to just let your self go into it since you are not distracted by trying to observe two things at once. At least that is what I think is going on there, I could be wrong.
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Any movie where the main character loses their lifelong friend, if it's a dog, gets to me. People, not so much.
Yep.
People? Don't give a crap.
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When Harry met Sally, Patch Adams
:rotf: Broderick cried over those?? Pathetic.
As for Dennimi, no wonder I always considered that DUmmie a female.
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Yeah, I cry at chick flicks all the time, specially when Expendables 2 is playing in the next theater over.
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Yeah, I cry at chick flicks all the time, specially when Expendables 2 is playing in the next theater over.
QFT.
Can't wait for E2.
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I admit to crying at movies sometimes, not for movies I see in the theaters very often (Though a couple recent exceptions were the scene in 'Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows: Part 2' when Harry sees Snape's memories in the Pensieve which had a moment that brought me to tears, and Rue's death in the 'Hunger Games' movie got one or two tears from me), but at times from films I watch at home (i.e. I have no problem admitting that the scene in 'Bride of Frankenstein' in which the creature befriends the old blind man has made me cry, mainly for the part when the blind man's praying over the creature). It doesn't mean you're a wuss, it means you have a strong sense of empathy, even if it's just for fictional characters.
For Frank's point about how people cry at fictional incidents in movies, but don't cry over real- life atrocities, a few possible reasons:
1. People often either aren't aware of such things that go on in real life, or at least don't realize quite how bad/ severe they are.
2. A good film causes people to learn about the characters, and become emotionally connected to them. Thus, though it's not real, the audience feels more sadness over the death of a beloved character they feel they've gotten to know than they do over the real- life deaths of people that they don't know.
3. Going along with the previous point, people see the deaths of characters in movies they watch; They do not see the deaths of real people overseas, they merely read or watch secondhand news stories about what happened.
4. Again going along with the second point, there's an old saying that I'm almost certainly going to butcher, "One death is a tragedy; A million deaths is a statistic." It's the same reason why more people got worked up over the lone shooting of Trayvon Martin (Justified though the shooting obviously was) than over the countless people who've been killed by gang violence.
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Armageddon gets me every time. Every dang time. :bawl:
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Yep.
People? Don't give a crap.
Yep, there is a youtube out there with a bunch of the classics, Old Yella, Where the Red Fern Grows, etc. I would make Bohner look like a stoic watching most of those. :whistling:
[youtube=425,350]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eBOaN0KJ9xI[/youtube]
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I think the movie that I cried at the most was The Passion of the Christ. I was literally sobbing during his scouring scene.
Another movie that I remember brought me to tears was A Time to Kill.
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I think the movie that I cried at the most was The Passion of the Christ. I was literally sobbing during his scouring scene.
Another movie that I remember brought me to tears was A Time to Kill.
Me too
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I will admit to getting a little misty in the key scenes of We Were Soldiers, Blackhawk Down, Braveheart, Gettysburg and Glory.
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I don't "cry" as in "boo-hoo", but I am not completely without heart. I can muster a tear sometimes.
(Yes, Frank, it is silly to get so emotionally involved in an acted-out story, but sometimes it's just the human thing to do.)
I'm with you.
I've been known to drop a tear or two in movies such as when the flag is raised on "Sands of Iwo Jima" or "The Patriot". They are usually preceded by chills.
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:rotf: Broderick cried over those?? Pathetic.
As for Dennimi, no wonder I always considered that DUmmie a female.
I did too, for the longest time.
And in my speculation, I probably misled others.
But damn, he writes as if a grasswire-aged older woman, although less addled than the pie-and-jam primitive.
It was a great shock to me, when I sought to mentor him in writing, to learn he's actually a middle-aged male.
Excresence happens.
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Being deaf you have to concentrate on reading the closed captions and trying to watch what is going on at the same time so you are not able to just let the movie take you out of yourself. Unlike a book where you are able to just let your self go into it since you are not distracted by trying to observe two things at once. At least that is what I think is going on there, I could be wrong.
Overall, correct, although I'd substitute "watching what is going on and trying to figure out what's going on, at the same time," as I don't mess with closed captioning. (For reasons mentioned in a thread in the "Mind Numbing Stupidity" forum here, the thead about Mike Mellow or Mark Malloy or whatever his name is; I'm convinced Vlada Mitty writes the captions.)
I dunno how many movies I've watched from start-to-finish in my entire life; perhaps slightly only more than what I have fingers. There's only three which I considered remarkable (although I was watching them under special circumstances, not as part of an audience in a theater).
Lawrence of Arabia has to be the greatest movie ever made. Ingmar Bergman's black-and-white classic The Seventh Seal is perhaps the most realistic movie ever made. And then there was Shirley Booth and Anthony Quinn in Hot Spell, another black-and-white from the 1940s.
"Hot Spell" is a great movie for deaf people to watch; the body languages of Booth and Quinn were so expressive one didn't have to "hear" anything to know what was going on. Damn, they were good.
I guess I can allege I saw Star Wars and some Steve Martin comedy from the early 1980s in their entirety too, but I was young and drunk and stoned. All I "retain" of Star Wars was that bar-room scene with all those weird beasts and savages in it, which probably had something to do with my later perception of the primitives on Skins's island.
But generally, when it comes to the cinema scene, franksolich is w-a-a-a-a-y off-stage.
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I remember the first time I was "Overboard". I teared-up when the kids were chasing the limo screaming, "Moms don't leave!" :-)
For me it was at the ending.
My 'emotions' were also stirred at bit at the beginning when she was in her sinsuit...I mean...swimsuit.
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For me it was at the ending.
My 'emotions' were also stirred at bit at the beginning when she was in her sinsuit...I mean...swimsuit.
Yes, every guy wanted to lick the strawberry.
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Overall, correct, although I'd substitute "watching what is going on and trying to figure out what's going on, at the same time," as I don't mess with closed captioning. (For reasons mentioned in a thread in the "Mind Numbing Stupidity" forum here, the thead about Mike Mellow or Mark Malloy or whatever his name is; I'm convinced Vlada Mitty writes the captions.)
I dunno how many movies I've watched from start-to-finish in my entire life; perhaps slightly only more than what I have fingers. There's only three which I considered remarkable (although I was watching them under special circumstances, not as part of an audience in a theater).
Lawrence of Arabia has to be the greatest movie ever made. Ingmar Bergman's black-and-white classic The Seventh Seal is perhaps the most realistic movie ever made. And then there was Shirley Booth and Anthony Quinn in Hot Spell, another black-and-white from the 1940s.
"Hot Spell" is a great movie for deaf people to watch; the body languages of Booth and Quinn were so expressive one didn't have to "hear" anything to know what was going on. Damn, they were good.
I guess I can allege I saw Star Wars and some Steve Martin comedy from the early 1980s in their entirety too, but I was young and drunk and stoned. All I "retain" of Star Wars was that bar-room scene with all those weird beasts and savages in it, which probably had something to do with my later perception of the primitives on Skins's island.
But generally, when it comes to the cinema scene, franksolich is w-a-a-a-a-y off-stage.
Have you tried to watch The Passion of the Christ? The actors speak in Aramaic (IIRC) and there are subtitles.
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Have you tried to watch The Passion of the Christ? The actors speak in Aramaic (IIRC) and there are subtitles.
Never saw it. Read the book. :naughty:
I tend to avoid movies with subtitles for the reasons I stated before like the distraction, having to keep up with who said what and so forth. I would turn on the closed captioning on the TV from time to time because my brother is deaf and try to enjoy a show with just that. And like Frank said in MNS, they can be a little wonky.
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I think the movie that I cried at the most was The Passion of the Christ. I was literally sobbing during his scouring scene.
Another movie that I remember brought me to tears was A Time to Kill.
Have you seen For Greater Glory? If the scourging scene in The Passion of the Christ made you sob, imagine about the same kind of torture inflicted on a little boy. That had my eyes watering.
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Two recent subtitled movies that I thought were excellent: "The Artist" and "Letters From Iwo Jima".
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Have you seen For Greater Glory? If the scourging scene in The Passion of the Christ made you sob, imagine about the same kind of torture inflicted on a little boy. That had my eyes watering.
I don't remember hearing about that movie. I just checked it out in IMDB, and I'll add it to my Netflix queue.
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I don't remember hearing about that movie. I just checked it out in IMDB, and I'll add it to my Netflix queue.
After reading your post I visited IMDB to check out the listing and I started crying just from watching the trailer.
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I usually get choked up once or twice a year and it usually happens on Memorial Day or Veterans Day.
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Brian's Song is on netflix--the original and the remake. I've only seen the original, it's a tear-jerker.
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I usually get choked up once or twice a year and it usually happens on Memorial Day or Veterans Day.
Not from a movie but the one that I will always remember was my very first funeral with the Patriot Guard. The hearse comes in followed by the family of the fallen soldier. I was standing at the entrance of the funeral home. Behind me were over 100 other PGR members, all holding 5 X 7 American flags.
We stood there throughout the service. When it ended, the soldiers father wanted to tell each and every PGR how grateful he was. He shook every persons hand all while bawling like a newborn.
Grief and appreciation make for a strong emotional display.
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Brian's Song is on netflix--the original and the remake. I've only seen the original, it's a tear-jerker.
Someone did a remake of Brian's Song? Why? ::)
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Arrogance. Vanity. Greed.
Why "Charlie & the Chocolate Factory" when "Willy Wonka" exists, for example.
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Shrug.
I don't watch movies. Waste of valuable fishin' , drinkin' and shootin' time.