The Conservative Cave
Current Events => The DUmpster => Topic started by: SSG Snuggle Bunny on June 20, 2012, 09:56:14 AM
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Atman (23,918 posts)
President tells Congress "FU." Invokes Executive Privilege re: Fast & Furious documents.
Suck it, Issa.
sadbear (1,330 posts)
3. Tough call.
While I think we should have more transparency, we still have to fight republican efforts to destroy us over everything and anything. It really pisses me off that it has to come to this.
southernyankeebelle (6,280 posts)
4. Well I agree with you however, it isn't so cut and clear. This program started under the
Bush Administration. If things in this report get out it could hurt alot of undercover people. Issa doesn't care about that. To him it's let hang the president. Find something anything to get him. Even some republicans want Issa to back off. Their hands aren't to clean either. On the other hand I do think we don't need to hurt our undercover people.
Yeah. Sure.
slackmaster (53,497 posts)
6. The term Executive Privilege has a very negative connotation for me, which I can explain visually
(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-DEYocqGpZVA/TctJ-Grcb-I/AAAAAAAAAEY/qGY6RyC3Y8s/s1600/67_richard-nixon.jpg)
uponit7771 (13,216 posts)
8. +1, on this topic though ISSA is being an asshole
There's an excuse that will hold-up in front of the electorate.
global1 (9,291 posts)
7. What Would Be Cool Is That When The Info Is Finally Made Available To Issa.....
that it implicates the Bush Administration and the Repugs. Perhaps just wishful thinking.
If there were Holder would have released it already.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002832397
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Response to Atman (Original post)
Wed Jun 20, 2012, 10:57 AM
MrDiaz (404 posts)
9. 2 questions for everyone here
1. If BUSH had did an executive order to override congress similar to this, what would be your reaction.
2. If this implicates the BUSH ADMINISTRATION why wouldn't they want to disclose the information?
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Response to Atman (Original post)
Wed Jun 20, 2012, 10:59 AM
zoechen (54 posts)
10. Definition of EXECUTIVE PRIVILEGE
: exemption from legally enforced disclosure of communications within the executive branch of government when such disclosure would adversely affect the functions and decision-making processes of the executive branch
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/executive%20privilege
The implication being that this thing goes all the way to the top.
This is not a good thing.
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Atman (23,918 posts)
President tells Congress "FU." Invokes Executive Privilege re: Fast & Furious documents.
Suck it, Issa.
EAD Champ. You were signing quite the different tune when it was Bush invoking executive privilage.
But as we all know...with Libtards like you...different president...different set of rules.
Oh and Atman...here's some more hard truth for you and the other window lickers:
It was left to Republican Senators Charles Grassley and John Cornyn to lay bare some crucial distinctions between to two ATF operations. Wide Receiver actually involved not gun-walking but controlled delivery. Unlike gun-walking, which seems (for good reason) to have been unheard of until Fast & Furious, controlled delivery is a very common law enforcement tactic. Basically, the agents know the bad guys have negotiated a deal to acquire some commodity that is either illegal itself (e.g., heroin, child porn) or illegal for them to have/use (e.g., guns, corporate secrets). The agents allow the transfer to happen under circumstances where they are in control — i.e., they are on the scene conducting surveillance of the transfer, and sometimes even participating undercover in the transfer. As soon as the transfer takes place, they can descend on the suspects, make arrests, and seize the commodity in question — all of which makes for powerful evidence of guilt.
To the contrary, Fast & Furious involved uncontrolled deliveries — of thousands of weapons. It was an utterly heedless program in which the feds allowed these guns to be sold to straw purchasers — often leaning on reluctant gun dealers to make the sales. The straw purchasers were not followed by close physical surveillance; they were freely permitted to bulk transfer the guns to, among others, Mexican drug gangs and other violent criminals — with no agents on hand to swoop in, make arrests, and grab the firearms. The inevitable result of this was that the guns have been used (and will continue to be used) in many crimes, including the murder of Brian Terry, a U.S. border patrol agent.
http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/282606/fast-furious-was-bushs-fault-andrew-c-mccarthy
Fast & Furious did not begin until 2009, months after the end of the Bush administration.
Go play in traffic you simplistic gasbag.
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Fast & Furious did not begin until 2009, months after the end of the Bush administration.
It doesn't matter when it started. To the liberals it is all Bush's fault.
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We knew Pedro was anti-American trash, but now he indirectly admits he has no problem with border patrolmen and women dying if it means covering up for his Dear Leader.
.
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Rush just brought up how can Obama do executive priviledge if the WH was not involved which is what they stated.
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global1 (9,291 posts)
7. What Would Be Cool Is That When The Info Is Finally Made Available To Issa.....
that it implicates the Bush Administration and the Repugs. Perhaps just wishful thinking.
If Bush could be implicated Holder would've released the documents.
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Just heard on Rush that Byron York just tweeted this:
Byron York â€@ByronYork
Issa: Holder now retracts claim that AG predecessor, Michael Mukasey, knew about F&F-like program.
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Just heard on Rush that Byron York just tweeted this:
DU is celebrating.
I think Obama just ****ed himself with a jackhammer.
It would be hard to believe they didn't think through the ramifications of this but with this crew it's hard to say.
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(http://i237.photobucket.com/albums/ff68/kayaktn/yorktweet1.png)
Twitter (https://twitter.com/#!/ByronYork)
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If anyones going to end up sucking anything it's Atman and his Dump buddies when Holder gets canned and Barry Big Ears gets shown the door.
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(http://i237.photobucket.com/albums/ff68/kayaktn/yorktweet1.png)
Twitter (https://twitter.com/#!/ByronYork)
:ohmy: :nelson: :popcorn: :popcorn: :popcorn:
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Orrin Hatch is calling on Holder to resign.
:popcorn:
I hope Holder gets nailed to the wall on this and the Terry family ends up owning his ass. I would sue him for every penny he has and ensure that he lives the rest of his life destitute and unemployable.
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http://weaselzippers.us/2012/06/20/today-obama-claims-executive-privilege-over-fast-and-furious-internal-deliberations-october-2011-obama-says-he-was-not-informed-of-ff/
Today: Obama Claims Executive Privilege Over Fast And Furious “Internal Deliberations†– October 2011: Obama Says He Was Not Informed of F&F…
Which begs the obvious question, how can Obama claim executive privilege of internal deliberations if he has previously claimed didn’t exist?
[youtube=425,350]193EKRSFX44[/youtube]
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I think the cheerleading threads will fall off the front page sooner rather than later. Some of the DUmmies may have realized that Obama screwed the pooch on this one.
A couple of trolls make an appearance in this thread (http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002833277) .
SoutherDem (1,247 posts)
Fast and Furious Question
First, forgive me for being so callused and heartless in the question I am about to ask.
Second, lets assume just for the sake of this question it goes all the way to the desk of President Obama.
So here is the question;
President Bush's war with Iraq which as far as I know did not find even one WMD or prove that Saddam Hussein had anything to do with 9/11 which is why we went to war cost our country over 4000 service members their lives plus the lives of over 100,000 Iraqi civilians not to mention the trillions of dollars, yet no contempt of congress or impeachment of the president. Yet, one boarder control agent dies and all hell is breaking loose. I feel for the family of that agent but why the deep concern for the one yet the total disregard of those 4000?
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13 replies Author Time Post
Fast and Furious Question (Original post)
SoutherDem 40 min ago OP
re: Fast and Furious Question
clang1 37 min ago #1
a border agent died because the ATF allowed firearms to get into the hands of drug cartels.
hahahareally 36 min ago #2
re: a border agent died because the ATF allowed firearms to get into the hands of drug cartels.
clang1 35 min ago #3
The way things are going, we will never find anything out because no one wants to be blamed.
hahahareally 28 min ago #8
The candle that burns twice as bright burns half as long.
ret5hd 32 min ago #4
re: The candle that burns twice as bright burns half as long.
clang1 30 min ago #5
re: A long time buddy. A long time. I get the games, and the players.
ret5hd 25 min ago #10
re: A long time buddy. A long time. I get the games, and the players.
clang1 22 min ago #11
re: A long time buddy. A long time. I get the games, and the players.
ret5hd 13 min ago #12
re: A long time buddy. A long time. I get the games, and the players.
clang1 10 min ago #13
In addition
rufus dog 29 min ago #6
re: It was crickets when Servicemen were electrocuted due to shoddy work by KBR.
clang1 27 min ago #9
If the gop were not so dead set on making an election isssue of it...
hrmjustin 28 min ago #7
Response to SoutherDem (Original post)Wed Jun 20, 2012, 12:46 PM
clang1 (89 posts)
1. re: Fast and Furious Question
Last edited Wed Jun 20, 2012, 12:47 PM USA/ET - Edit history (1)
I almost posted myself on this, I have the same question. People die all the time because of what these people do. I don't get the incongruity either.
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Response to SoutherDem (Original post)Wed Jun 20, 2012, 12:48 PM
hahahareally (22 posts)
2. a border agent died because the ATF allowed firearms to get into the hands of drug cartels.
I would say we need to find out why those guns were allowed to cross the border, no?
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“The President is not the Attorney General’s client; the people are.†- Barack Obama, 2005
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hrmjustin (559 posts)
7. If the gop were not so dead set on making an election isssue of it...
...then the legit questions can be asked and answered. This is a real issue and the dems on panel wanted to call the former AG, aft agents, and several other people i can not recall at this time. The gop said no, because they wanted an issue. And now the president has given them executive privilege and there goes the who melodrama.
Obama dragged this out for 2 years so tools like you could say this level of stupid shit.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002833277
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This is what happens when DUmmies put their head in the sand.
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How cute, they think they have a talking point to push on the American people.
You see, they aren't covering-up...they're protecting their field agents:
TBMASE (613 posts)
13. Why are they protecting the Bush Administration is the real question
If the documents show Bush is responsible, why are they hiding behind EP?
BlueToTheBone (1,136 posts)
15. I think it's more about
the agents in the field.
Not something * would have taken into consideration; but we do have people whose lives are on the line.
jeff47 (4,140 posts)
20. It's much more than names
Even if you redact the names, which would not be complying with the subpoena anyway, there is plenty of other information that can help you identify the agents. Such as dates, locations and tactics.
The fact that they hide "John Smith" doesn't help if they describe an agent approaching a suspect on a particular date at a particular location, and using particular tactics to earn his trust.
Redact all those, and you're now withholding the entire document.
rocktivity (33,914 posts)
21. DING DING DING! BlueToTheBone, you're our grand prize winner!
I think it's more about the agents in the field. Not something * would have taken into consideration...
As Valerie Plame can tell you.
rocktivity
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002832918
How...
...altruisitic.
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Funny, this administration doesn't seem too concerned about protecting their "field agents" in the Middle East when they made it known the US was responsible for Stuxnet.
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Obama dragged this out for 2 years so tools like you could say this level of stupid shit.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002833277
Exactly
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How cute, they think they have a talking point to push on the American people.
You see, they aren't covering-up...they're protecting their field agents:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002832918
How...
...altruisitic.
BlueToTheBone (1,136 posts)
15. I think it's more about
the agents in the field.
Not something * would have taken into consideration; but we do have people whose lives are on the line.
Obama doesn't give two shits about agents in the field. Look at the White House leaks regarding over seas operations. Obama only cares about Obama, he would surrender his wife and children if it made him look good.
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Obama doesn't give two shits about agents in the field. Look at the White House leaks regarding over seas operations. Obama only cares about Obama, he would surrender his wife and children if it made him look good.
Or, more directly: If Obama gave a shit about field agents he'd quit arming the cartels trying to kill them.
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Well, I guess that concern for agents in the field excludes Brian Terry.
Cindie
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Atman (23,918 posts)
:rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf:
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When I read DU I always give it the how-would-independents-see-this? eye. Looking at the excuses they fabricate on this I'm not seeing anything that would endure 5 seconds of scrutiny.
"This is Bush's fault!" - Not according to Holder himself
"It's sensitive info for an ongoing investigation." - except Holder said he ended it
"We have field agents to protect." - except for the ones you got killed.
"They're just out to get Obama!"" - maybe Obama should be gotten
"This is much ado about nothing." - if you ignore the hundreds of people lying dead
"RACISTS!" - just stop already
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The left is using the same tactic they tried with Solyndra, they claim that it wasn't 0bama who started it, but it was Bush. In both cases it turns out to be false. As others have stated here F and F was a different ballgame than the gunrunner operation under Bush. As for Solyndra the Bush administration ran the numbers then told them "Hell NO", 0bama comes in and says, "Hell YEAH" and it's Bush's fault. :mental:
Hey DUmmies you wanted Chimpy impeached for much less than what 0bama has done in just the past few days. You are a bunch of ****ing hypocrites.
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When I read DU I always give it the how-would-independents-see-this? eye. Looking at the excuses they fabricate on this I'm not seeing anything that would endure 5 seconds of scrutiny.
"This is Bush's fault!" - Not according to Holder himself
"It's sensitive info for an ongoing investigation." - except Holder said he ended it
"We have field agents to protect." - except for the ones you got killed.
"They're just out to get Obama!"" - maybe Obama should be gotten
"This is much ado about nothing." - if you ignore the hundreds of people lying dead
"RACISTS!" - just stop already
This is one of the reasons me as an Independent will not support a Democrat any time soon. These past couple of years have shown them to be nothing race baiting cry babies.
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Ladies and gentlemen, this was a very good day for America. A very good day. Now even the democrat propaganda machine will have to report that 0bama's regime killed hundreds of people and hid it. Me thinks that the polls are already tanking into the 30's even with =13 donk advantage. Being a nation of laws is soooooooooooooo racist.
Next will be the weekly unemployment upward revisions Thursday.